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VoirDire
Sweden1923 Posts
Anything related to diablo goes: Skills, classes, items, places, monsters.
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VoirDire
Sweden1923 Posts
1. Monks heals do not scale well with level. What good is a 6000-7000 heal on 15s cool down when inferno characters have 50k hp? I think they should be based on a percentage of HP like all other skills. 2. Melee characters doesn't seem as viable as ranged characters for several reasons: a) Most elite mobs modifiers are designed to be difficult for melee characters. Molten/Arcane enchanted/Frozen/Fire chains/Plagued/Desecrator/Vampiric. The only real danger for ranged chars are vortex and mortar. b) Ranged characters can kite and thereby focus on damage and kill much faster. c) In the later stages of inferno, every character gets one-shotted from elites, no matter how much hp they have. They do 50k damage per hit even with stacked resist gear and armor. Ranged characters have at least cc skills to keep them from being hit. 3. A wizard with 0 vitality + life regen items/ galvanizing armor + force armor is the best boss/elites tank in the game, even in full dmg gear. Force armor rune on arcane armor makes it so that any hit that would kill the wizard takes him to 35% hp. Combined with galvanizing armor and life regen items he will regen back to full hp in a second. The only weakness is DoT. Too see it in action, check this vid and keep an eye on Faelara: + Show Spoiler + 4. Monks also have 1 broken build: The combination of fists of thunder: quickening rune, Mantra of healing with Boon of Protection, Sweeping Wind + Transcendence passive. Here is how it works: The quickening rune makes it so that 15 spirit is generated on critical hits. The sweeping wind attacks every enemy withing 12 yards, critting about 1-3 times per second generating massive spirit to the monk. Mantra of healing with boon of protection creates a shield for 2 seconds which absorbs 15% of all damage, as well as gives him 1240 life regen for 3 seconds. Transcendence additionally gives the monk 62 life per spirit spent. Mantra of healing costs 50 spirit so that's 3100 life. Combined monk can stand in the middle of any pack of mobs that doesn't 1-2 shot him and just spam-click Mantra of healing and be virtually invulnerable. I expect that more than half of all monks in inferno uses this build (including myself). 5. Witch doctor summons. They are pointless in inferno from what I can see, they can't even survive 1 hit from a normal mob in inferno even if you use all the summon passives. | ||
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trinxified
Canada7774 Posts
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adwodon
United Kingdom592 Posts
That being said there are some ridiculous things like Wiz tanking which make no sense at all, surely that should've been picked up during testing. Who knows, apparently all classes can solo inferno so presumably with good enough gear melee characters won't suck and summons are actually tanky. While it's good to start a civil discussion on the topic I think we will have a better feel for things in about a month or so when people have geared up better and have significantly better gems. Also anyone know why Blizz decided to remove add sockets?! EDIT: Nevermind, found a blue post explaining - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/5149145075 Pretty poor reason if you ask me, once you hit Hell you aren't getting new items all that often and it seems to me that adding 1 socket to an item for a decent chunk of gold (obviously) would be a good way to add customization by allowing more gem slots and also adding more things to spend money on, adding longevity. | ||
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Zozo
Brazil2579 Posts
I'm not saying barbs should be able to tank mobs at will if that is the design, but other classes shouldn't be able to even take a single hit. They need to make armor better and change one overpower rune to guarantee block for the next 2-4 seconds (-4000 dmg per hit when they strike you for 20k wouldn't be game breaking, and the uptime would not be 100% before 50% crit or something). | ||
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NotSorry
United States6722 Posts
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LaNague
Germany9118 Posts
On May 22 2012 04:29 NotSorry wrote: As a DH I can't take even a single hit, I have to kill everything from either a full screen or during my ss + prep spam thats my experience too, i tried to be a bit tanky in Act1 to not rely on perma smokescreen, but in act 2 i got 1-shot by a simple white green bat, he did 38k damage trough over 50% armor. So when you get 1 shot with a tanky build, might as well go full dps and spam smokescreen invulnerability. Its nice that they wanted to make inferno difficult, but i dont like this direction, i find it very frustrating. | ||
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ForDarkness
Australia63 Posts
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Sindriss
Denmark263 Posts
I play a barb myself, so is biased, but I just think that there should be more ranged orientated abilities on mobs, so that they do not have such an easier time due to kiting. This would probably at least help to equalize the wide gab between ranged and melee that currently exists. | ||
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musai
Canada552 Posts
Only Wizards abusing the 35% bug or DH spamming smoke screen can do anything in the later acts, wonder why those haven't been fixed yet but the monk raid bubble was fixed. It's nice they tried to make inferno difficult, but having mobs that simply 1 shot you with regular melee isn't the way to go. | ||
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King_
Brazil7 Posts
Another thing that bother´s me is the fact that after AII in Hell, you MUST go tank on mobs and FULL dps on bosses. In my opinion, the game was designed in a way that you could have freedom to choose your build as you like, for any situation. The game is forcing you to go in a especific way. You cant got 2H barb in Hell and Inferno, you just cant, you must go 1H and Shield and in Bosses 2 1H, this make the game much more straitfoward! If its gona be this way, let us choose our stats again! After a month, if there will be no changes, all barbs will be exactly the same during mob fights and bosses fights! At last, most classes have some kind of CC imunity, Monks and DHs can easily break a freezing, stun or slow movement, but Barbs must activate a 2min CD to free themselves. To a melee character this is unthinkable! When i see the ice spikes, i immediately start to kite the mobs, but then, im taking severe dmg from the elite ones and NOT doing ANY dps, if i get frozen, its GG for me, certain death! Ignore Pain should make barb imunity from these kind of CCs or at least make him break it, like wow trinket. | ||
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Cool Cat
United States1644 Posts
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Terranist
United States2496 Posts
On May 22 2012 20:59 musai wrote: Inferno is complete shit, melee is useless after act 2, they're pretty bad in act 2 already. The mobs hit so hard that even white mobs in act 4 will 1 shot a geared tank. All melee is good for is buffing / ressing. I'm kind of sad they fixed the chest farming in act 2 so quickly, would have been nice to get some easy gear before progressing into inferno. Only Wizards abusing the 35% bug or DH spamming smoke screen can do anything in the later acts, wonder why those haven't been fixed yet but the monk raid bubble was fixed. It's nice they tried to make inferno difficult, but having mobs that simply 1 shot you with regular melee isn't the way to go. explain how a wizard spell functioning exactly as they intended it to becomes a bug. inferno is supposed to be difficult. if player conquer inferno with gear that isn't even a week old, what does that tell you about long term playability of a pvm only game? | ||
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Caphe
Vietnam10817 Posts
Maybe the only balance issue is the effort you need to put into a Barb vs a Wizard in order to beat Inferno. If you chose a difficult road, man up and go on  . | ||
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unkkz
Norway2196 Posts
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Tobberoth
Sweden6375 Posts
On May 22 2012 21:41 Caphe wrote: I am a Barb and I know Wizard abuse the shit out of the current situation but thats not completely about balance, thats bad game design or even that is intended. Who know? Maybe the only balance issue is the effort you need to put into a Barb vs a Wizard in order to beat Inferno. If you chose a difficult road, man up and go on . I'd say it's more a question of viability. We all know that there are "broken" wizard builds which allow tanking of act 4 rares, which are the hardest enemies in the game, no doubt, if you play the game legit, the wizard will always be oneshot without a doubt, and has nothing like the kiting ability of a DH. It's not about being harder or easier, it's about one way working and the other being impossibe. So the question is, of course, is it actually possible for a barbarian to solo inferno? If act 2 enemies 2shot barbarians with full act 1 inferno armor, how can they ever get to the point where they beat diablo? Blizzard making a difficult game is a nice thing, them making an impossible game is not so nice. | ||
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Heh_
Singapore2712 Posts
On May 22 2012 21:47 unkkz wrote: People "playing melee" seem to forget about Extra fast, Walling, Jailing, Extra HP. Those affixed coupled with other things makes kiting hard/frustrating/impossible. An extra fast mob just walks right over an 80% snare like its nothing. You forgot teleport/fire chains/electrified =D | ||
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nomsayin
United States124 Posts
First, dodge and armor both have diminishing returns, and Barbarians have tons of armor boosts but they are overkill, and the skills offer no help with dodge. Second, there's also no skills to help get high resistances, which are essential for fighting off elemental damage in hell. On the other hand, Monks get dodge from their primary attribute, dexterity, and a good armor rating that naturally comes with high level gear. They have passive which matches their resistances to all types of damage (including physical) to their single highest resistance. To top it off, they have multiple active healing and passive healing skills, a resistance boosting passive, and even a god mode skill, which makes you temporarily invincible and escapes from all stuns. It's simply very difficult to die as a monk, and if you do he might still live to fight another day (http://us.battle.net/d3/en/class/monk/passive/near-death-experience). You can see how this makes the Monk much stronger than the Barbarian later in the game. Especially considering that I play hard core, there is no reason for me to play a squishy Barbarian who can't solo trashmobs in hell when I can lead a group or solo with a Monk. For these reasons, I've given up on my barb until other players make it through hell and start selling gear in the AH. I started a Monk and I'll continue playing that. TLDR: Monks are very strong in late difficulties, while Barbarians can't even tank trashmobs. | ||
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aksfjh
United States4853 Posts
On May 22 2012 21:51 Tobberoth wrote: I'd say it's more a question of viability. We all know that there are "broken" wizard builds which allow tanking of act 4 rares, which are the hardest enemies in the game, no doubt, if you play the game legit, the wizard will always be oneshot without a doubt, and has nothing like the kiting ability of a DH. It's not about being harder or easier, it's about one way working and the other being impossibe. So the question is, of course, is it actually possible for a barbarian to solo inferno? If act 2 enemies 2shot barbarians with full act 1 inferno armor, how can they ever get to the point where they beat diablo? Blizzard making a difficult game is a nice thing, them making an impossible game is not so nice. It's more of the fact that making a game that is impossible for some is not so nice. It'd be fine if Wizards had to deal with the same level of frustration, but they don't. What's more, they do so through an ability that essentially got left out of the very, very standard survivability clause of "can only happen once every X seconds." | ||
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Alpino
Brazil4390 Posts
On May 22 2012 21:51 Tobberoth wrote: I'd say it's more a question of viability. We all know that there are "broken" wizard builds which allow tanking of act 4 rares, which are the hardest enemies in the game, no doubt, if you play the game legit, the wizard will always be oneshot without a doubt, and has nothing like the kiting ability of a DH. It's not about being harder or easier, it's about one way working and the other being impossibe. So the question is, of course, is it actually possible for a barbarian to solo inferno? If act 2 enemies 2shot barbarians with full act 1 inferno armor, how can they ever get to the point where they beat diablo? Blizzard making a difficult game is a nice thing, them making an impossible game is not so nice. Farming with friends for later acts diffuclties and coming back to get some revenge? Not the best design unfortunately..blizz didn't gave Inferno a lot of thought. They should have told us "it's not supposed to be soloable, you need some kind of team coordination. And you need some luck to not get impossible rares". Did they say something along these lines? Maybe we should have listened their months to beat bet and shouldn't have had expectations of having a chance in the first week. + Show Spoiler + barb needs some buff though and wiz some tweaking, like Smoke Screen maybe needs some kind of cooldown to even things out, and I know nothing about WD, are they faring well? | ||
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