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Since there seems to be a high amount of genuine concern for the famine and diseases in Africa, I thought it would be a wise idea to give those concerned a place to discuss the afflictions affecting Africa, as well as a thread to possibly enlighten any unknowing TLers on the state of Africa as a continent.
I did do a search, and while there was a thread discussing the drought, and another discussing famine in Ethiopia, there was no thread that discussed the situation in Africa as a whole.
If you have anything to contribute, or feel I skipped over something, please PM it to me and I'll add it to the OP.
Sources:
+ Show Spoiler +
![[image loading]](http://www.countdown.org/end/pix/famine_2.jpg)
Famine in Africa:
The UN declared last week that famine conditions exist in two regions of southern Somalia, putting more than 3 million Somalis there at risk of starvation. The UN also declared an emergency humanitarian crisis throughout the Horn of Africa, as thousands of Somalis leave their homes every day in search of food either in the capital, Mogadishu, or across the border in Kenya and Ethiopia.
With East Africa facing its worst drought in 60 years, affecting more than 11 million people, the United Nations has declared a famine in the region for the first time in a generation. Overcrowded refugee camps in Kenya and Ethiopia are receiving some 3,000 new refugees every day, as families flee from famine-stricken and war-torn areas. The meager food and water that used to support millions in the Horn of Africa is disappearing rapidly, and families strong enough to flee for survival must travel up to a hundred miles, often on foot, hoping to make it to a refugee center, seeking food and aid. Many do not survive the trip. Officials warn that 800,000 children could die of malnutrition across the East African nations of Somalia, Ethiopia, Eritrea, and Kenya. Aid agencies are frustrated by many crippling situations: the slow response of Western governments, local governments and terrorist groups blocking access, terrorist and bandit attacks, and anti-terrorism laws that restrict who the aid groups can deal with -- not to mention the massive scale of the current crisis.
Disease in Africa:
![[image loading]](http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb66/POPACACA/pov11.jpg)
Children have lost their parents. Parents have lost their children and the poor grandparents have lost their sons and daughters to war, poverty and to the deadly HIV/AIDS. Grandparents love and protect their grandchildren but grandparents do not have the strength to clear thick bushes and make new farms so with the parents gone (dead), the grandparents with their grandchildren are left with nothing but extreme poverty and hunger.
The number of orphans and street children continue to rise in Africa. orphans
In addition to war, HIV and famine, malaria continues to kill children in record numbers especially in Sub-Saharan Africa. Meanwhile a mosquito net costs less than $1. The problem is worse in the villages and small towns where there are no hospitals nor clinics to help the sick. Malaria death toll rises extremely high especially in the rainy season which is the breeding period for mosquitoes.
"As a consequence of the AIDS epidemic in Sub-Saharan Africa," one report stated, "it is estimated that more than 18 million people have died to date, of which over 3 million were children. Additionally, more than 25 million adults are currently infected which will result in the continued increase in the number of orphaned children. To date, more than 15 million children have already been orphaned as a result of the epidemic. Another 1 million children are currently infected with the disease."
"As a consequence of the AIDS epidemic in Sub-Saharan Africa," one report stated, "it is estimated that more than 18 million people have died to date, of which over 3 million were children. Additionally, more than 25 million adults are currently infected which will result in the continued increase in the number of orphaned children. To date, more than 15 million children have already been orphaned as a result of the epidemic. Another 1 million children are currently infected with the disease."
Wars in Africa:
![[image loading]](http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_ySCIT3KO9Zc/STxfZzw4r0I/AAAAAAAAONM/huHPk-Iir_4/s400/congo_war_12.jpg)
There are currently fifteen African countries involved in war, or are experiencing post-war conflict and tension. In West Africa, the countries include Cote d'Ivoire, Guinea, Liberia, Nigeria, Sierra Leone, and Togo. In East Africa, the countries include Eritrea, Ethiopia, Somalia, Sudan, Uganda. In Central Africa, the countries include Burundi, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Rwanda. In North Africa, the country is Algeria and in South Africa, the countries include Angola and Zimbabwe.
At the base of these wars is the rich natural resources each of these poor countries hold of timber, oil or diamonds, compounded in many cases by the foreign extractive industries presence, their opaque, unreported payments to the governments and the governments' opaque, unreported use of the money to create and fund wars. The wars serve the purpose of creating a distraction, as the countries and their fleeing, displaced citizens are robbed of their countries' natural resources, easily converted to cash, for the personal use and fortunes of ruling parties. Tribal conflict is deliberately antagonized, so it can be blamed for the conflict.
The abundant supply small arms, ammunition, light weapons and explosives circulating in some African states since the end of the cold war, has made easy the escalation of tensions between groups in disagreement. Bloody massacres and massive human displacement become quick problem solutions when black market gun running is rampant.
![[image loading]](http://www.marcgunther.com/wp-content/uploads/0314-01.jpg)
Please feel free to discuss the situation in Africa, but remember to keep it civil.
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I think "Africa" is way too broad for an omnibus thread. Lots of places, lots of problems.
Hell, look how big the Libya thread is on its own!
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We shouldn't need to help, people should (re)produce according to their resources. This applies throughout the world not only in africa. “Beggars should be abolished entirely! Verily, it is annoying to give to them and it is annoying not to give to them” - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Distribution of birth control is one way to combat these problems. It's already been done to combat AIDS in certain countries.
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On September 07 2011 06:03 AudionovA wrote:
We shouldn't need to help, people should (re)produce according to their resources. This applies throughout the world not only in africa. “Beggars should be abolished entirely! Verily, it is annoying to give to them and it is annoying not to give to them” - Friedrich Nietzsche
You're either grossly misinformed, not thinking this through, or just a moron. The population in those countries has to grow so fast and people HAVE to try to have so many kids because there is an extremely high chance that their children will die due to disease or starvation.
Once they have resources, sanitation, and a 1st world country environment, they will realize that they do not need to have so many kids because the kids they have are living through childhood.
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Just my personal observation but for over 30 years since I have been aware of whats going on in Africa they have had the same problems over and over and nothing has changed in that entire time frame.
I still see all the same charities asking for money, sponsoring children, send food etc. and for all the trillions of dollars sent over there its no better off today then 30 years ago.
This is exactly like the war on drugs. If the people you are trying to help don't/won't make the effort to change or better themselves, no amount of money or assistance you throw at it will change the situation.
I wish them well in the recent famine and genocides.. but seen and heard it all before, tragic as it is... they will get through it just as they have in the past and will again in the future, just as their history has proven.
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On September 07 2011 06:07 Voltaire wrote:
Distribution of birth control is one way to combat these problems. It's already been done to combat AIDS in certain countries.
Distribution IS the problem. Supplies, relief and aid can't get where they need to go because of all of the ongoing wars and poor infrastructure.
Africa is in a terrible state mostly caused by Western involvement in one way or another. Yet I still feel worse when I see animal-abuse advertisements come on TV.
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The "how can we help" section is when I stopped taking the OP seriously.
This is always how things were in most of the uncivilised world there, with just a handful of notable exceptions like the former Ethiopian Empire or Songhai.
The first mistake white men made was intervening and bringing them inventions they couldn't handle -> population boom. The next mistake would be helping them sustain it lol. Our responsibility now lies in preserving the environment and biodiversity of Africa, not throwing money into that bottomless well called "aid".
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On September 07 2011 06:09 Kinetik_Inferno wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2011 06:03 AudionovA wrote:
We shouldn't need to help, people should (re)produce according to their resources. This applies throughout the world not only in africa. “Beggars should be abolished entirely! Verily, it is annoying to give to them and it is annoying not to give to them” - Friedrich Nietzsche You're either grossly misinformed, not thinking this through, or just a moron. The population in those countries has to grow so fast and people HAVE to try to have so many kids because there is an extremely high chance that their children will die due to disease or starvation. Once they have resources, sanitation, and a 1st world country environment, they will realize that they do not need to have so many kids because the kids they have are living through childhood.
From an objective standpoint, what you say is completely true. Contrawise, subjectively its a greivence toward values concerning human life. What im saying is, humans care about other humans, now nobody will argue that alot of them die, but everyone will say that death via pestilence and starvation puts a human through much more suffering then justifiable. This thread wouldn't have been created if everyone was ok with mass reproduction leading to mass death as necessary in that country.
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Its controlling population, people are going to fucking die, and people just need to accept the fact that people are going to die. not EVERYONE can fucking live, we would run out of f00d
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It is really a shame what has happened to Africa. There was a time when it was the most advanced continent by far. Shaka Zulu basically invented the army and organized warfare. Mali would trade gold for salt. Timbuktu and Alexandria offered doctorate level education when the rest of the world was barely able to maintain apprenticeships (basically vocational training). Unfortunately the rest of the world was able to exploit these resources and manpower, mostly by turning African tribes against each other. Once these tribal grudges run their course, I think the African countries will retake their place in the first world. Until then I don't think there is much we can do to help. In fact, by broadcasting these pictures of poverty, we are helping to spread the idea that Africa is a worthless and destitute place. It may be better to focus on the bright side of Africa and build up places that are not being racked by tribal warfare.
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I don't get why these threads keep popping up. Just because it's "worse" in africa than usual , i guess... I suppose i am a bit jaded to this kind of thing now tho. Swedish media keeps shoving it in your face, day after day after day. It's like this down there all the time people. Only difference this time is that someone bothered to look for it. Time and time again charitys are exposed, that they are stealing money and no actual help gets down there. If you genuinely want to help the people of Africa, don't send money, send clothes, food, school supplies or anything that you can spare for that matter.
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On September 07 2011 06:33 Interloper wrote:
If you genuinely want to help the people of Africa, don't send money, send clothes, food, school supplies or anything that you can spare for that matter.
IMO your donations are better placed if you send them to the honest but impoverished people in your own country then. Africa is no longer anyone's colony, as you have pointed out much of the charity marketing for Africa is just scam, it's not worth the effort helping them like that.
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On September 07 2011 06:33 Interloper wrote:
I don't get why these threads keep popping up. Just because it's "worse" in africa than usual , i guess... I suppose i am a bit jaded to this kind of thing now tho. Swedish media keeps shoving it in your face, day after day after day. It's like this down there all the time people. Only difference this time is that someone bothered to look for it. Time and time again charitys are exposed, that they are stealing money and and no actual help gets down there. If you genuinely want to help the people of Africa, don't send money, send clothes, food, school supplies or anything that you can spare for that matter.
The people who actually know about this constantly tell people exactly the opposite. Send money, not clothes and food. Transporting your can of food from you to Africa is expensive. It's usually cheaper to buy it there. And it's good for the local economy. And it's much more flexible for the charity. And they can store it and use it where it's best.
Yes, some charities are run badly, but there are plenty of big, global, respectable charities. They have their abuses and their overhead, but no organization is perfect and a lot of overhead is really necessary. Giving them money definitely results in substantial good being done.
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On September 07 2011 06:47 aristarchus wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2011 06:33 Interloper wrote:
I don't get why these threads keep popping up. Just because it's "worse" in africa than usual , i guess... I suppose i am a bit jaded to this kind of thing now tho. Swedish media keeps shoving it in your face, day after day after day. It's like this down there all the time people. Only difference this time is that someone bothered to look for it. Time and time again charitys are exposed, that they are stealing money and and no actual help gets down there. If you genuinely want to help the people of Africa, don't send money, send clothes, food, school supplies or anything that you can spare for that matter. The people who actually know about this constantly tell people exactly the opposite. Send money, not clothes and food. Transporting your can of food from you to Africa is expensive. It's usually cheaper to buy it there. And it's good for the local economy. And it's much more flexible for the charity. And they can store it and use it where it's best. Yes, some charities are run badly, but there are plenty of big, global, respectable charities. They have their abuses and their overhead, but no organization is perfect and a lot of overhead is really necessary. Giving them money definitely results in substantial good being done.
Well, when i was in school and we put together a care package once a year to send to our "Sister-school" (don't know if there is another word for it in english) in Tanzania we worked up the cash to pay for that package to get there. I see the issues with sending food because it's hard to keep fresh and so on, but sending school supplies can't go wrong. Money has the possibility to. I don't know, i'm not that educated in this subject, but i just don't trust any charity no matter how big.
Edit:
tl;dr
This man can explain my views on charitys in a more funny way i guess...
![[image loading]](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXpUwBJ2SS8)
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On September 07 2011 06:25 Hypertension wrote:
It is really a shame what has happened to Africa. There was a time when it was the most advanced continent by far. Shaka Zulu basically invented the army and organized warfare. Mali would trade gold for salt. Timbuktu and Alexandria offered doctorate level education when the rest of the world was barely able to maintain apprenticeships (basically vocational training). Unfortunately the rest of the world was able to exploit these resources and manpower, mostly by turning African tribes against each other. Once these tribal grudges run their course, I think the African countries will retake their place in the first world. Until then I don't think there is much we can do to help. In fact, by broadcasting these pictures of poverty, we are helping to spread the idea that Africa is a worthless and destitute place. It may be better to focus on the bright side of Africa and build up places that are not being racked by tribal warfare.
Sumerians developed army and organized warfare more than 4000 years before Shaka was born. Timbuktu has seen better years, but it was never close to Chinese, Arabian, Italian, Byzantine, Spanish and many other cities. Alexandria and North Africa belongs more into Mediterranean area and is quite distinct from Subsaharan Africa.
As for OP, problems of Subsaharan Africa are extremely complex and I have no idea what can be done to solve them, but I am definitely for some help to be present as it is morally wrong not to help people in need when we can. Europeans, North Americans and Arabs are also partially responsible for the state of current Africa, so that should also motivate "us" to help.
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I find this thread insulting. How can you talk down to us Africans as if you're better than us? Our local media has pointed out how we're better off than first world countries. Continue with your ignorance if you must I guess. We don't have 10 children because we expect them to die as infants. We bring these children into the world as our pension plans. You may have your fancy 401K's or "annuities", but we have our families to take care of us in our old age. While your children will one day abandon you at a nursing home with abusive staff, I will be taken care of by my loving family in my eldest son's guest room. Viva Africa!
Source: http://www.hayibo.com/britain-more-violent-than-sa-stat-vindicates-burning-of-dockets/
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On September 07 2011 07:09 Lucidity wrote:I find this thread insulting. How can you talk down to us Africans as if you're better than us? Our local media has pointed out how we're better off than first world countries. Continue with your ignorance if you must I guess. We don't have 10 children because we expect them to die as infants. We bring these children into the world as our pension plans. You may have your fancy 401K's or "annuities", but we have our families to take care of us in our old age. While your children will one day abandon you at a nursing home with abusive staff, I will be taken care of by my loving family in my eldest son's guest room. Viva Africa! Source: http://www.hayibo.com/britain-more-violent-than-sa-stat-vindicates-burning-of-dockets/
Yup, media never lies. your logic is infallible.
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On September 07 2011 07:09 Lucidity wrote:I find this thread insulting. How can you talk down to us Africans as if you're better than us? Our local media has pointed out how we're better off than first world countries. Continue with your ignorance if you must I guess. We don't have 10 children because we expect them to die as infants. We bring these children into the world as our pension plans. You may have your fancy 401K's or "annuities", but we have our families to take care of us in our old age. While your children will one day abandon you at a nursing home with abusive staff, I will be taken care of by my loving family in my eldest son's guest room. Viva Africa! Source: http://www.hayibo.com/britain-more-violent-than-sa-stat-vindicates-burning-of-dockets/
I'm not sure if you're trolling or what.. but did you actually read that article.. it's like a troll article.
Ndebele explained that murder and rape were not considered violent crimes in South Africa.
“And rape, well, if you’re asking us to classify rape as violent crime then you’re also asking us to consider women to be people, and that’s a bit of a stretch.”
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On September 07 2011 07:16 Gatsbi wrote:Show nested quote +On September 07 2011 07:09 Lucidity wrote:I find this thread insulting. How can you talk down to us Africans as if you're better than us? Our local media has pointed out how we're better off than first world countries. Continue with your ignorance if you must I guess. We don't have 10 children because we expect them to die as infants. We bring these children into the world as our pension plans. You may have your fancy 401K's or "annuities", but we have our families to take care of us in our old age. While your children will one day abandon you at a nursing home with abusive staff, I will be taken care of by my loving family in my eldest son's guest room. Viva Africa! Source: http://www.hayibo.com/britain-more-violent-than-sa-stat-vindicates-burning-of-dockets/ I'm not sure if you're trolling or what.. but did you actually read that article.. it's like a troll article. Show nested quote +Ndebele explained that murder and rape were not considered violent crimes in South Africa. Show nested quote +“And rape, well, if you’re asking us to classify rape as violent crime then you’re also asking us to consider women to be people, and that’s a bit of a stretch.”
Guys, he obviously read the article ...
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EPT
