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http://www.gosugamers.net/starcraft2/news/14646-heart-of-the-swarm-to-have-separate-ladder
Posted by Roy "Phantom" Kwan
In an interview with games.on.net, Dustin Browder has revealed that Heart of the Swarm expansion will have its own ladder for any player upgrading to the expansion.
As with its previous RTS titles, Blizzard's StarCraft 2 will have ladders created for each of its expansions. Dustin Browder recently told games.on.net that as with previous RTS expansions, a new ladder will be created for the Heart of the Swarm. Although there will be a separate ladder for HotS, players will still be able to play the Wings of Liberty ladder without having, 'to deal with new units or balance problems or anything like that,' said Browder.
This will most likely mean that at the end of StarCraft 2's final expansion, there will be a total of three separate ladders for the game. Legacy of the Void is the second expansion for StarCraft 2, there is currently very little information on this expansion.
Dustin also stated that there are plans to release a bunch of new maps for the multiplayer experience that will address a lot of issues that fans have raised with the current map pool. These maps, he said, will hopefully be added within the next few weeks.
Other topics the interview touched on were on StarCraft 2 mod maps. Browder elaborated on the origins of the maps Aiur Chef and StarJeweled. Blizzard DotA was also discussed. 'We’re definitely trying to streamline it, but we’re also definitely trying to make it as competitive, or even more competitive,' says Dustin Browder.
mod edit: don't link poll images directly, they expire
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=191526
Here's a poll from a previous post on how the ladder will be set up.
Personally I'm fine with separate ladders since it gives players the choice to play competitively on either game. Having one global aggregated ladder would be a much needed feature. What're your thoughts on this?
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motbob
United States12546 Posts
I vow to someday be #1 on the WoL ladder... even if it LotV gets released and I'm the only competent player left!
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It definitely makes the most sense, much more than having one ladder for both games anyway. I'm sure it will be as much of a ghost town as the RoC ladder or whatever. But I mean that makes sense.
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On February 18 2011 12:54 tsuxiit wrote:
It definitely makes the most sense, much more than having one ladder for both games anyway. I'm sure it will be as much of a ghost town as the RoC ladder or whatever. But I mean that makes sense.
Definitely. I don't see how it is possible to combine both ladders when you have new units/mechanics/maps involved.
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why wouldn't there be?
unless they don't plan on adding any new units...
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I was curious how they were going to go about doing this, and i was hoping they wouldn't be creating a new ladder system. Though my only concern is, what does this mean exactly? If people on different ladders aren't able to play directly against eachother, then this will likely cut into the number of active people on each ladder and cut into wait times for games.
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Hasn't it always been like this for Blizzard RTS? Not really surprising.
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On February 18 2011 12:58 Spacekyod wrote:
I was curious how they were going to go about doing this, and i was hoping they wouldn't be creating a new ladder system. Though my only concern is, what does this mean exactly? If people on different ladders aren't able to play directly against eachother, then this will likely cut into the number of active people on each ladder and cut into wait times for games.
It will cut into the WoL ladder for sure, but since most people will be buying HotS, the difference there is negligible.
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Dustin also stated that there are plans to release a bunch of new maps for the multiplayer experience that will address a lot of issues that fans have raised with the current map pool. These maps, he said, will hopefully be added within the next few weeks.
Please be GSL maps.
Multiple ladders make sense, but they are kind of redundant. Not going to be a ton of people playing on them knowing the older versions aren't going to be very balanced.
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On February 18 2011 12:57 chonkyfire wrote:
why wouldn't there be?
unless they don't plan on adding any new units...
Well why wouldn't there be chat channels or LAN or clan support on release of Bnet 2.0........ oh wait.....
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What they should do is run the WOL ladder for a few months after HOTS, after which it is shut down.
Also provide a VERY cheap digital "upgrade" for anyone with WOL to get into the HOTs ladder. Bascilly just the units, and not the campaign/any other fearutres. Bare minimum for multiplayer I say.
3 separate ladders is a sure way to completely split the community completely. I can understand most people will jump to the expansions, but suddenly a bunch of people are going to be playing on a "dead" ladder ebcause WOL is all they got.
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On February 18 2011 13:04 Stiver wrote:
What they should do is run the WOL ladder for a few months after HOTS, after which it is shut down.
Also provide a VERY cheap digital "upgrade" for anyone with WOL to get into the HOTs ladder. Bascilly just the units, and not the campaign/any other fearutres. Bare minimum for multiplayer I say.
3 separate ladders is a sure way to completely split the community completely. I can understand most people will jump to the expansions, but suddenly a bunch of people are going to be playing on a "dead" ladder ebcause WOL is all they got.
basically a DLC with new ladder? it might work.
we will have to see how it pans out. we cannot predict the future
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I don't see a problem with this. I don't think WoL should be left to dry without a live ladder once Hots comes out and I don't think they should be combined.
When the protoss expansion comes out I think blizz has the resources to keep 3 separate ladders without much trouble.
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Sounds like a reasonable solution for the ladder. Almost every RTS in existence has a separate ladder for their expansions, so it's entirely reasonable for SC2 and its expansions to have them too.
Also, I don't think it should be too much of a problem for Blizzard to keep the entire WoL ladder open after releasing their expansions. The vast majority of serious ladder players will probably switch over to the expansions' ladders, and it would be unfair to kill the WoL ladder when there will probably be a small minority of people who will continue to play it for whatever reason (such as being unable to purchase HoTS for some reason). The community split caused by separate ladders would be quite negligible.
Anyways, it's also interesting to hear Browder talk about adding new multiplayer maps. Hopefully, Blizzard will present to us another set of maps besides the ones in the PTR, although the new Lost Temple looks quite good.
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Does this sound any different than how Warcraft 3 and it's Expansion was?
What's going to be interesting is how Esports will shift. Will it be entirely on-board with HOTS or will it consider both WOL and HOTS?
Balance changes too, would be interesting. If Protoss just has a more advantage on WOL than on HOTS, etc. etc.
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On February 18 2011 12:59 LoLAdriankat wrote:
Hasn't it always been like this for Blizzard RTS? Not really surprising.
Ya, exactly. This was expected.
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Although there will be a separate ladder for HotS, players will still be able to play the Wings of Liberty ladder without having, 'to deal with new units or balance problems or anything like that,' said Browder.
Interestsing statement. When HotS releases, the new units will affect the old units, which may have to be adjusted in response. This may actually mean that unit stats may be different between both ladders (like siege tank damage, just to name something random). Currently this is already the case between single and multiplayer.
This would also imply that WoL will eventually be "perfectly" balanced without the need for expansion units. Blizzard may be getting busy with balancing, if they have to balance two (or even three) different ladders... I wonder how that will work out. Perhaps they will just stop balancing the WoL ladder when HotS is released..
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Blizzard said we wouldn't need to buy all 3 games to play multi-player. Guess Activision got in the way of that.
Way to keep your promises, Blizzard...
I would buy HoTS anyway, since I main zerg. But I'm not sure I want LotV, since I really dislike playing protoss. The problem is that if I want to keep playing ladder with any meaningful amount of people and stuff.
I accept this if even people who DIDN'T buy the expansion can still ladder there.
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I don't even understand how else they could have possibly done this. I mean, assuming that the expansions affect the multiplayer game (new units, upgrades, buildings, whatever), then obviously both players have to be on the same version, so when you click play you'd have to pick which version you wanted to play. That means you have essentially two different games. How would you not have them on separate ladders? Would people with the expansion have to keep up with the expansion-free strategies to stay high in the ladder? It just doesn't make any sense.
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Historically, it hasn't been the case that the release of new ladders(or areas, in the case of WoW) has significantly cut into the playing population. WoW has actually gotten pretty expensive and their battle chest system is pretty bad(it never includes the most recent expansion) but I imagine some time after LoV is released the package you will be able to buy will include both expansions.
But yes, historically, people have just bought the expansion and moved on. I remember playing a little bit of Vanilla hardcore D2(by choice) a couple years after the release of LoD and there being a fun little 10 person community. They all owned LoD they just wanted to play with the smaller community.
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On February 18 2011 13:26 Jotoco wrote:
Blizzard said we wouldn't need to buy all 3 games to play multi-player. Guess Activision got in the way of that.
Way to keep your promises, Blizzard...
Yeah, how dare they keep the exact same system from every other game with expansions they've ever released.
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