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Active: 695 users

PvT - Hallucinate vs PDD, Terran Raven pushes

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Stationary
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden22 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-21 21:31:36
November 21 2010 21:31 GMT
#1
A very common build in TvP is for the terran to go marine / banshee / raven, or marine / raven / tank, or a similar composition, building only 1 or 2 ravens for a key Point Defense Drone or two, this build pretty much effectively counters the popular 1gate expand build of Protoss. But did you know Hallucinations drain energy on PDD?



Hallucinate a few phoenixes, drain that energy, and hopefully your stalkers wont be completely useless.

Has anyone tried this in a real game? How did it go?

phil.ipp
Profile Joined May 2010
Austria1067 Posts
November 21 2010 21:34 GMT
#2
i didnt know, good find !
ci_esteban
Profile Joined April 2010
United States217 Posts
November 21 2010 21:34 GMT
#3
Wow, that's an awesome trick and something pretty practical given that hallucination has lots of other uses as well.
Wolf
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Korea (South)3290 Posts
November 21 2010 21:37 GMT
#4
Interesting idea. I just might try it.
Commentatorhttp://twitter.com/proxywolf
TL+ Member
Barca
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States418 Posts
November 21 2010 21:42 GMT
#5
Good idea, but keep in mind that Raven's use the PDD, and if hallucinations are around units that can 'detect', the AI sees that they're not real and ignores them. Dunno about the PDD AI though, so I'd say test again but keep those Ravens nearby to see if it still works.
- I hate threads that end with "Thoughts?" -
-{Cake}-
Profile Joined October 2010
United States217 Posts
November 21 2010 21:42 GMT
#6
Good find, I like this, definitely keeping it in mind
GWash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States153 Posts
November 21 2010 21:46 GMT
#7
Looks pretty legit actually. If you scout >1 raven it would definitly be worth it to get 3 sentries and hallucinate.Would hallucinating stalkers possible be better? You get 2 of them
Aquafresh
Profile Joined May 2007
United States824 Posts
November 21 2010 21:53 GMT
#8
On November 22 2010 06:46 GWash wrote:
Looks pretty legit actually. If you scout >1 raven it would definitly be worth it to get 3 sentries and hallucinate.Would hallucinating stalkers possible be better? You get 2 of them


No Phoenix fire two projectiles, and at a much faster rate, you will waste more PDD shots quickly with Phoenix. Plus they fly so they can get a really good angle on a PDD and maybe draw some marine fire if you're lucky. I've been trying to use hallucination to counter PDD with mixed results since I saw that liquipedia article months ago that mentioned fake units still wasted shots.
Oathmaster
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada81 Posts
November 21 2010 21:54 GMT
#9
On November 22 2010 06:46 GWash wrote:
Looks pretty legit actually. If you scout >1 raven it would definitly be worth it to get 3 sentries and hallucinate.Would hallucinating stalkers possible be better? You get 2 of them


Would be about even since phoenix do 2 shots, but would hide your hallucinated units better so he doesn't know what just hit him
Altsa
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Finland990 Posts
November 21 2010 21:58 GMT
#10
^ I think hallusinating phoenix instead of stalkers is better, as they wont block your ground forces and also absorb potential viking damage.
AoD
jmack
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada285 Posts
November 21 2010 21:59 GMT
#11
Does anyone know if the PD will not absorb the shots if the raven is within sight?

Meaning if the hallucinations are exposed as hallucinations does the PDD energy still get used? Or would you need to shoot the raven down first ( damn near impossible in range of the pdd lol )
" (THEY DID IT THEY DID IT FXO DID IT!!! OMG John Lennon Toto destroyer LOLOLOLOLOL) " - Korean Reaction to QXC all killing team IM and destroying safe bets everywhere.
MrCon
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
France29748 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-21 22:03:11
November 21 2010 22:02 GMT
#12
If you add 6 stalkers (3 use of hallu) you will have at least 10 so you will deplete the PDD in less than 2 rounds of fire. Then the stalkers have the advantage of tanking, even if the T knows they're hallu he can't exactly focus fire the real stalkers one by one. So I think hallu-stalkers are better imo.
Zozo
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Brazil2579 Posts
November 21 2010 22:11 GMT
#13
This is so obvious, yet, brilliant. And as people mentioned, they are also great to tank the vikings.
EGM guides me
freetgy
Profile Joined November 2010
1720 Posts
November 21 2010 22:13 GMT
#14
~~ Raven has detector so Hallucinations are useless in the fight.
T0fuuu
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Australia2275 Posts
November 21 2010 22:14 GMT
#15
Isnt the raven a DETECTOR though? So wont terran units know they are hallucinations and wont shoot them?
MayorITC
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Korea (South)798 Posts
November 21 2010 22:16 GMT
#16
If you have enough sentries to hallucinate units, you're better off focus firing the PDD with the sentries and using the energy for Guardian Shield and Forcefields.
GWash
Profile Joined May 2010
United States153 Posts
November 21 2010 22:17 GMT
#17
On November 22 2010 07:14 T0fuuu wrote:
Isnt the raven a DETECTOR though? So wont terran units know they are hallucinations and wont shoot them?

That isn't the point. The idea is that point defence drone will waste energy blocking hallu shots. Nobody has confirmed that PDDs will waste energy if the ravens detect the hallucenations.
gnutz
Profile Joined November 2010
Germany666 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-21 22:22:05
November 21 2010 22:18 GMT
#18
wow, i actually think it could change the matchup.

whats the matter with the detector? you only need the hallucinations to shoot the pdds, not to distract the terran. hallucinations dont disappear if they get detected ?

it could mean you dont need a stargate and real phoenixes to deal with these pushes anymore, just research hallucination.

i just hope its not a bug and blizzard will fix it.
Reason.SC2
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada1047 Posts
November 21 2010 22:21 GMT
#19
thing is if you have a bunch of sentries sitting around then you can just focus fire down the point defense drones since the sentry attack isn't affected by PDD.

That doesn't mean using hallucinations isn't useful but I mean why not just use the energy for guardian shield and forcefields and focus down the PDD instead. I suppose if the PDD is placed in such a way that you can't focus it down without losing all your sentries then hallucinations is the only way to nullify it.
sleepingdog
Profile Joined August 2008
Austria6145 Posts
November 21 2010 22:22 GMT
#20
On November 22 2010 07:18 gnutz wrote:
wow, i actually think it could change the matchup.


Highly doubtful since this has been known for...well, I think the first time I read about this here was two months ago

To cut the long story short: not worth it - it's not about hallucination, it's about sentries and their energy. You need to first tech hallucination, second build many sentries early enough to build up energy and third use the sentry-energy only for hallucinating stuff and not for forcefields/guardian shield.
"You see....YOU SEE..." © 2010 Sen
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