EPTBC and RoL: Salem Mafia
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
Anyone care to enlighten me what the person I replaced have been doing all game? I've been reading through the thread beforehand and I have to say that this game is hilarious with the amount of roleclaims in here (Half the players have roleclaimed I think). And it was pretty obvious at that point that Jimbo and youngminii were scum. The question is as to who else could possible be scum. | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
On December 06 2010 03:22 jcarlsoniv wrote: Does anyone else find the extremely blatant bandwagon of youngminii a bit odd? I mean, I understand the reasoning behind why the mafia wouldn't want to come to his defense at all, because he is obviously going to be lynched. It just seems to easy. He does seem to be scum though, so there's no reason not to vote for him I guess. Yes, it is a bit odd, but the same thing happened with Jimbosilvers. So it is a bit WIFOM to use that as a reason as to why youngminii could be innocent. I will post my analysis on my two suspects:Radfield and youngminii soon after this post. | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
On November 17 2010 21:19 youngminii wrote: i feel retarded after what happened in protect yo village In protect yo village, youngminii and DrH tried to get each other lynched. In the end, they were both town, youngminii was lynched but youngminii was hunter and killed DrH. He seems to be using that as his excuse as to not contributing at all, because he might get an innocent townie killed again. It is still better to talk than not to talk at all under any circumstances, so I find it suspicious of him trying to give an excuse to not contributing. On November 26 2010 20:31 youngminii wrote: wifom can be so much simpler than that think about this statement: i am not a witch Tries to explain what WIFOM is. He tries to appear as though he is contributing to town. On November 28 2010 08:36 youngminii wrote: hi Useless post. On November 28 2010 08:50 youngminii wrote: lol DrH, role fishing like that in a learning game, not a very cool move. Out of Kenpachi and BB who seem to be the lynch candidates (besides me kinda) I'd have to go for Kenpachi. I don't really want to vote for any of them but Kenpachi's cluelessness/reluctance to defend himself is more worrying than the reasons against BB. Sorry  Votes for kenpachi. This could really go either way as it seems that everyone was voting for kenpachi at the time. He was among one of the people that didn't change his vote though from kenpachi along with ghrur. On November 30 2010 18:50 youngminii wrote: Just so everyone knows in case DrH turns up as scum or something and tries to do something sneaky (which I doubt will happen anyway), I roleclaimed to him. Obviously I'm not going to say what my role is but chyeah there you go. I believe that being transparent about most things is better than keeping everything in secret PM networks and all that crap. Right now I get the feeling that Kenpachi is indeed scum, and given BB's death last night and all the suspicion around Kenpachi, some/most of the scum have gone and decided to bus him. I mean, hell, he has a LOT of votes on him without any counter target, which means the mafia have given up on him. I don't like the abstain votes so I guess we'll have to keep an eye on them in the future. Hmm, he says that he roleclaimed to DrH. He could actually be vet trying to soak up hits in this situation by claiming that he has a role publicly. But he could also be trying to appear as vet to get DrH's trust. This is a bit of WIFOM so I don't really know what to make of this but this shows the possibility that he is not lying about his roleclaim. Still veteran is the easiest role for godfather to fake. On December 02 2010 17:35 youngminii wrote: lol wow how the hell did our healers die On December 02 2010 17:37 youngminii wrote: wait wait wait drh knows 2 healers 2 healers die drh does not have an appropriate excuse drh dies why is this not happening As soon as two medics die, he instantly puts the blame on DoctorH. Perfect opportunity for scum to blame DoctorH On December 02 2010 23:07 youngminii wrote: I honestly think everyone that's going against Radfield should read the above post, twice, and reconsider your decision. Defends Radfield, the second person I'm suspicious of. On December 04 2010 23:30 youngminii wrote: This game is fucking horrible, DrH has the entire town on his leash. When the flying fuck did you ask me to claim DT. I go and claim in the thread that I roleclaimed to you, which is MORE than enough to cast suspicious light on me for preparation of the late game. Then you go on like a chimpanzee and say to the entire thread "GUYS, MEDICS, YOU NEED TO PROTECT YOUNGMINII" Are you serious? For one thing, that's wasting a medic save. For another, that's making scum veer away from me, I'm protected so why would they hit me? This thinly veiled crap of yours makes no sense whatsoever. In fact, it might have made the tiniest bit of sense if you had planned that for the late game but then you go and reveal my roleclaim to the entire town. Can you guys seriously not see how corrupt this 'town leader' is? What's wrong with 2 bodyguards in a THIRTY person game? I'm sure there are fishier roleclaims, but the mafia can handle all the other blue roles, the bodyguards must be dealt with via town to maximise mafia KP. Don't tell me you guys can't see this. I urge you, vig, kill this scum. No hard feelings DrH. Sounds like a desperate attempt to save himself and put the suspicion on DoctorH, the one trying to push for his lynch. On to Radfield then: On November 26 2010 23:29 Radfield wrote: Lets hope they did a better job of balancing than that  I think 6 mafia in a 30 player game is pretty standard (at least, 4 in a 20 player game is fairly standard). A likely KP of 3 to start with(normal formula is mafia #/2 rounded up). Add in a miller and a traitor, and we're probably looking at between 5 and 7 blue roles. As far as what those blue roles may be, I don't know, and it doesn't matter all that much. We get what we get.Town circles are tricky, and should always be conducted on a need to know basis. We have both a miller and godfather, which severely slows down a potential Town Circle. If you're a dt, no one needs to know you're a dt until you find a red, and at that point you can go through an intermediary (someone you've already checked, who is likely[though not certainly] town aligned) and get them to speak up in the thread. The identity of the dt is biggest secret that needs to be kept. Once the godfather goes down, the town circle will become immensely powerful. Keep in mind though, that the ONLY way to catch the godfather is through post analysis, and that as long as the gf is alive, the town circle is flawed. Hence, we need to focus on post analysis first, and town circles second. I don't think there are any (good) hard and fast rules for dealing with roleclaiming in thread. Each needs to be dealt with on a case by case basis. If someone roleclaims out of the blue, that needs to be dealt with very differently then someone roleclaiming on death row. We don't necessarily need to worry about the medics and dt's just yet. The mafia have all day to choose who will be the godfather, so offering the dt options at this point is somewhat useless. Doctors go with their gut or anyone they think is particularly valuable. The role that really needs to be discussed is the Paranoid Villager(vigilante). Do NOT fire until there is good reason to do so. A well timed vig shot can be very, very useful as the game progresses, because it can give the town what amounts to a double lynch. eg. you have 2 lynch candidates on day 3, instead of overly worrying about who to kill, you simply lynch one and vig the other during the night. This saves both a lynch, and a potential dt check. As far as Vet and Mad Hatter, there are lots of options for sneaky plays to draw hits, but you don't necessarily need to get carried away. Reasoned discussion and good posting is normally enough to get shot. Says that roleclaims should be handled in a case by case basis.He gives suggestion as to what blue roles should do. That sounds very protown, but he is really just repeating the basics of this game. In his next post, he clarifies witch KP. Then he goes on to say that no one should be claiming their roles at this point of the game. Now next part is the interesting part: On November 27 2010 12:33 Radfield wrote: You aren't coming out directly and saying it, but you're certainly insinuating it. He tries to imply that DoctorH wants people to roleclaim to him, when he tries to give a few ideas for possible town circle. This is kind of understandable though as DoctorH was trying to imply that if there is going to be a town circle, he is the best coordinator which he has proven to be. Also, your story doesn't match up: No mention of Shutting up etc + Show Spoiler + Original Message From DoctorHelvetica: i know why would you roleclaim to me so suddenly? i wasn't even going to ask, although I guess I can give you advice. Medic is a pretty easy role I think, just go after vets/anyone who roleclaims an important role like DT unless you're really suspicious. it's a role i always wish i would get but I never do. I think its playstyle suits me actually. ----------------------------------------- Original Message From SOMEBODY thats not even a role. ----------------------------------------- Original Message From DoctorHelvetica: cool i got dracula ----------------------------------------- Original Message From PLAYERDUDEGUY I got medic. ----------------------------------------- Original Message From DoctorHelvetica: whats up buttercup I realize this isn't much, but come on... you only told us 1 single detail about your PM conversation, but then when you show us the convo it's not there? What are we really supposed to think?? Care to explain? This is kind of suspicious as he tries to paint DoctorH red for leaving out some details of his pm. He just seems to be grasping at straws here and trying to make DrH look red. On November 27 2010 21:38 Radfield wrote: OK, we're running out of time here. There's absolutely no reason that people should be able to coast through Day 1. Voting Pandain until he posts some content, then moving down the list of people who i know should be posting more content. If Day 1 becomes about pressure votes, so be it. We can't analyse posts if there are none.... 5. Scaramanga 6. Kenpachi 7. Amber[light 11. youngminii 15. deconduo He then tries to put pressure on inactives. Understandable as inactives don't do anything to contribute to town. He then makes a post on how DoctorH should not be made a center piece of the town circle. That is understandable as he is not confirmed townie at that point of the game, but he certainly seems to be trying hard to paint DoctorH red. Next post, he explains how it is suspicious how brownbear suddenly started getting votes after suspicion was thrown on kenpachi. That is nothing suspicious as town was suspicious of kenpachi for the same reason but then he says this: Seems to me that Kenpachi should almost certainly be checked or lynched, as his alignment gives us some quality info. Assuming he flips red, that gives us EsbenPM, Southrawrea, Aeres and ghrur as the final votes coming down the wire. Aeres with the all important switched vote becomes highly suspicious(yes he voted for KP earlier, but it was just a placeholder). The other BB voters are Pandain, DrH and Jimboslivers. If he flips green, it's a dead end since both would be townies and the mafia would likely be split between them. Lynching for information? I'm sorry but that is very scummy to me. On November 30 2010 22:30 Radfield wrote: OK, this day is in danger of becoming a total waste. Yes, if Kenpachi flips red, that's fantastic and we lynch Aeres next due to the vote flip-flop(unless someone has a convincing argument against). If Kenpachi flips blue(as he's claiming) not only do we lose a blue, but we lose an entire day to inactivity. + Show Spoiler + On November 29 2010 11:10 Amber[LighT] wrote: This I received from Ghrur... I don't know if he was trying to keep me away from others, but he did provide a "list" he was suspicious of: Thanks for not killing me though, Ghrur. ^____^ Assuming Amber is telling the truth, ghrur called out 5 players towards the end of the night: Barunder ---> died that night, why bother to put him on the list if he ghrur knows he is about to die? Protactinium---> heaps a bit of extra suspicion on top Node ---> adds in that he is 'quiet' KtheZ--->nothing Youngminii--->adds in that he is 'quiet' This gives all of these players at least an ounce of credibility, but not much more than that yet. It's pretty standard that mafia generally stick 1 or 2 fellow mafia in lists like this. Dr H, you seem almost surely town at this point, as you continue to brazenly spotlight yourself. In fact, it seems to me like you are screaming out to be hit right now, which makes me hope you are a vet/hatter. Looking at what you've said so far, presumably you have a hatter+ Show Spoiler + "The second mad hatter should claim to me. It's possible there are three mad hatters in this game, but it seems unlikely" "A town circle is growing" After all the attacks on DoctorH, he admits that he is a townie at this point of the game. I know that opinions can change, but that just seems to be rather convenient as it would be useless for him to try and attack DoctorH at this point as town already believes that he is probably town-aligned. So after all his attacks on DrH, he just backs off when he know that he's not getting anymore. Anyways, the kenpachi lynch is a done deal, as it should be. The potential gain from his lynch far outweighs any potential loss. That being said, lets take the time now to discuss where we go after the lynch. No reason to waste the rest of the day. Also:+ Show Spoiler + On November 30 2010 15:30 annul wrote: tbh this game is prematurely fucked for the town due to a DT suiciding so like i really have stopped paying much attention since then if im still alive later on in the game im sure i will pay more attention to the stuff (and, specifically, look at individual posts of the ones still alive), but in the meanwhile ill give cursory skims and vote my gut and/or what people i think are town are voting. for some reason i just do not "feel" this game =( id almost say "go and kill me" but i mean you really are better off just finding scum, not lynching a townie for not caring so much on day 2 not that i think i am in any danger whatsoever, mind you Scumhunting made easy?.... or just a really bad townie Tries to paint annul red for not caring too much about the game which is understandable, but it could also be an easy bandwagon for mafia just like Aeres in insane He continues on the attacks against annul after this post. On December 03 2010 03:26 Radfield wrote: Whether we agree or disagree as to what your posts were insuating Dr H, the fact stands that you received many Day 1 roleclaims(which i would contend is because you were "soft-asking" for them). That was exactly what I was opposing, and surely you agree that it was sound advice I was giving. It's beside the point though. I don't suspect you, and even if I did I agree with Pandain that we're in too deep. Also, guilty as charged on the PM front. I have played 2 prior games(not including Callers unbalanced Rotk game) with PMs and they have been far and away my worst games. Both games I was buffaloed by Mafia, and both games I was a detriment to the town. I am not nearly as strong at PM games, which is partly why I don't play them. Players have different strengths. Tries to excuse his bad play As far as i can tell, there was no bandwagon on Annul other than the one i tried to start. Between Pandains post and mine, there was very little talk at all about him. Given the fact that you keep defending him, without a lot of reasoning in my eyes, I am willing to drop Annul. You have the role-claims, and you have the town-circle, so it would be silly to push against you. For all I know i'm trying to lynch the dt... Again drops his attack when he noticed that no one was listening to him As far as other targets, I still have yet to read your analysis of JS. Other players are as follows: Townies: Pandain, Dr H, Southrawrea Likely have roles: Youngminii, Artanis, Most scummy: Node(why is he not on your short list), Kavdragon, glasse, esben Currently Aeres does not strike me as mafia, but i will look again at his posts. Protact seems as likely to be modkilled as mafia. If he hangs around with his current level of activity, popping on to vote and nothing else, he should be eventually lynched. No rush here though. Kavdragon makes it on the list by virtue of this PM I received: I need to go back to work, but will post much more later. Mafia-hunting takes time, and we still have plenty for this day. Will be on tonight. Radfield seems to play the mafia aggressor where he constantly attacks someone and then backs off when no one is listening to him. In conclusion, I think both youngminii and radfield are witches. But if youngminii is a witch is most likely the godfather, so he should be killed off first. Also, does anyone know if youngminii was told of who the other roles are by DoctorH? | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
It depends on how much confidence MH has on his targets. Does MH still have two bombs right now, and if so, how confident is he? Because if he only has 1 bomb, I think our chances are pretty much the same eitherway, and would rather scumhunt. | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
 I don't like the odds of lynching correctly 4 times in a row. I think that this is probably our best chance of winning. | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
On December 07 2010 14:07 KtheZ wrote: I'm saying that IF and only IF we get to the point with like 1 or 2 mafia left, and an also dwindled number of townies, that the hatter's bombs may do more harm than good. MH is a townie KP, why would we want to get rid of his bombs? On December 07 2010 14:46 Eiii wrote: I should have phrased that better-- we don't have ENOUGH good leads. Radfield seems to be the lynch candidate for the moment, but I don't want to risk losing just for an advantage by guessing who another mafia is. At this point, if I were mafia I'd be laying as low as possible to avoid suspicion. Obviously, if they can keep attention away from themselves they've got this in the bag. We *have* to lynch 4 times in a row or we lose. If we act greedy and go for two kills now and miss even one, we lose. I think the safer thing to do is just lynch Radfield for the time being-- if by pouring over people's posts and such we find another sure mafia candidate we should go for the MH plan again, but everyone should know that if a SINGLE bomb target isn't mafia town LOSES INSTANTLY. It's the same situation eitherway. If a SINGLE lynch isn't mafia town LOSES INSTANTLY. If we go for the lynch option and manages to lynch a mafia today, all it would take is for mafia to convince 1 person to vote with them and town loses. But if we kill the MH, mafia have no chance at all of trying to convince people who town should kill. | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
But since town completely forgot about Southrawrea, I just went for the easy win. | ||
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Nemesis
Canada2568 Posts
On December 08 2010 10:27 kitaman27 wrote: Lets all just agree to blame that n00b artanis for checking him in the first place. South's "hey look guys. I have a role, check me please" is what made me trust him as a vet, guess it had an alternate motive. We were only 10 minutes away from lynching Nemesis(protactinium). I'm going to have to go back and check how they dodged that bullet. 10 minutes from lynching me? I don't remember ever having a single vote on me :X | ||
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