• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 01:53
CET 07:53
KST 15:53
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - Playoffs Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups C & D Preview0RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners12Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10
Community News
[BSL21] Ro.16 Group Stage (C->B->A->D)1Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win2RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket13Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge2[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation14
StarCraft 2
General
When will we find out if there are more tournament Weekly Cups (Nov 17-23): Solar, MaxPax, Clem win SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA Weekly Cups (Nov 10-16): Reynor, Solar lead Zerg surge RSL Season 3: RO16 results & RO8 bracket
Tourneys
Tenacious Turtle Tussle RSL Revival: Season 3 $5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest
Strategy
Ride the Waves in Surf City: Why Surfing Lessons H
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 501 Price of Progress Mutation # 500 Fright night Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death
Brood War
General
Which season is the best in ASL? FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle soO on: FanTaSy's Potential Return to StarCraft Data analysis on 70 million replays 2v2 maps which are SC2 style with teams together?
Tourneys
[BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group B - Sun 21:00 CET [BSL21] GosuLeague T1 Ro16 - Tue & Thu 22:00 CET [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL21] RO16 Tie Breaker - Group A - Sat 21:00 CET
Strategy
Game Theory for Starcraft How to stay on top of macro? Current Meta PvZ map balance
Other Games
General Games
The Perfect Game Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Health Impact of Joining…
TrAiDoS
Dyadica Evangelium — Chapt…
Hildegard
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2739 users

Kingdom talks about Bisu's Slump

Forum Index > BW General
Post a Reply
1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 Next All
MrHoon *
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
10183 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-28 17:48:58
March 28 2010 09:49 GMT
#1
So I just finished watching this show called "뒷담화" and it's a show of Kim Carrier, Um Jae Kyung, Nal_rA and Kingdom talking about the current issues and buzz of the esports scene. This came up last week but I just finished watching it now and I just heard a very interesting segment of the show; it was Kingdom talking about Bisu. The show itself is 30 minutes long and there are more interesting parts but this was something I think everyone should atleast read once. Very interesting and I'll get more done later~
Have fun

+ Show Spoiler +
Kim Carrier : I've been doing this show over 3 seasons and I think it's been a while since we had so much to eat like today.

Um-Jae-Kyung : So the big topic of today is that during the RO36 OSL, two of the TaekBangLeeSsang; Bisu and Jaedong has dropped out from the league. And another thing that became an issue was the Bisu was sent on a paid vacation by SKT since he dropped.

rA : A paid vacation?

Kim Carrier : Yep a paid vacation. Anyways if we compare the Bisu of 2010 to the Bisu of 2009, it's almost shocking to see how much of a difference there is between the two. At 2009 Bisu was tearing up not only individual leagues but proleague too. As of now, he looks like just another “Protoss.”

Kingdom : When Bisu transferred to SKT that was around the same time I started coaching for SKT. But even during my early coaching career Bisu's performance in proleague wasn't that good either. Whenever we would send bisu off to play he would always lose and mess-up during the games... I guess we could say his current state was somewhat similar to the state he was in 2 years ago. And when this was happening 2 years ago, Park Young Woon (Head coach of SKT) said “let's give him some time.” However the deal was even though he was on break, Bisu would have come with us to every live game and watch his teammates play. The reason for this was that if Bisu wasn't on the proleague benches, the opposing teams won't sacrifice more practice time for Bisu.
At 2008, SKT blocked the journalists from making an article about Bisu's “vacation”. But this time, Bisu's vacation article was released. When I first saw the article the first thing I thought to myself was “Wow this might be beyond repair for Bisu.”

Kim Carrier : The thing is Kingdom worked with Bisu side by side for a long time so he can make these exact judgments. But from a spectator's standpoint, we don't see Bisu's smooth and brilliant plays anymore. If we watch his recent games and his older games, everything he does now is looks so predictable and bland. Not to mention Bisu's greatest strength; his ability to Multi-task seems to have faded away into the darkness. His plays are too rough and... I guess blocky.

Kingdom : Bisu started playing incredibly standard and predictable around an year ago if I recall correctly.
As the coach for both Best and Bisu if I compare the two together, Bisu was not that good at making Build Orders at all. In fact, Best was a much better at making new strategies and build orders for his games. Best was very good at making transitioning build orders and new and exciting build orders to throw off his opponents. But on the other hand Bisu had a really hard time changing his strategies and trying out new things. What Bisu was good at doing was copying and modifying builds Stork and Kal used previously to win games and making it better.

Kim Carrier : Wow actually come to think of it I think you're totally right on this one. The thing is, Stork is an absolutely brilliant build order maker. The builds and strategies he prepares for his opponents are jaw-dropping. But when we look at Bisu we don't see any of that. Bisu's greatest strength always was and always will be his unparallelled ability to multitask.

Kingdom : I agree!

Kim Carrier : If we look at Bisu's prime so to speak, it was the time when a player with great multitasking ability could do incredibly well. However if we look at our current era of starcraft, multitasking will only get you so far. And now Bisu's multitasking turned into a 'standard' in starcraft.

Kingdom : I agree. If we look back Bisu's games almost every build he used was “the safest and the best.” Many people ask “How can someone be so good when they only play standard”. Bisu practices for a very long time. For a while, he defined the phrase “Sleep and Practice” in the SKT house. And to preserve time so he could practice more, he started reviewing over his strategies during the game not outside the game. While most players review over their strategies and build orders after watching VODs or Replays, Bisu did this during his game. Because of his natural talent to multitask everything, his hand movement and screen transitioning speed was so fast. It was jaw-dropping to watch him play.
And this was why he was so good at PvZ! Because Zerg players had no idea how to catch up to Bisu. The Zerg players couldn't react as much and they couldn't figure out what was going on.
But at the same time, this was why Bisu's PvT was always lacking compared to his other two Match Ups. The thing is a Terran player could defend what they had at a small ground. However a Zerg player has to defend their bases over long long distances. Because of this, the common Zerg player didn't have the concentration and speed to defend everything. That is why a Bisu styled harass was so good; because he can attack 3 difference places at once with the Zerg player having a hard to defending even one. And that is the reason why I found Bisu's PvT lacking compared to his PvZ, because he couldn't do his style of play on terrans.

Kim Carrier : This OSL Bisu dropped his games against Go.Go. And last time, Bisu dropped because of Go.Go. And let's be totally honest, Go.Go's TvP is horrendous. Even if we exclude the data his TvP is known to be pretty bad. And when Bisu lost, it got me thinking; did Bisu get overconfident when he played against Go.Go?

Kingdom : Go.Go said it during his winner's interview that “Whenever Bisu plays against a player who is a lot worse than he is, he starts to play incredibly safe. And since there is a huge difference between us I decided to gamble with all my build orders.” So yes, I do believe Bisu tends to underestimate his opponents time to time. I mean if we look at Bisu's early proleague performance this season, he started losing to all these new guys. And if we look at all of these games, Bisu played almost too safely. New Players on the otherhand, will always play risky for they really want to win a game and they really want to make a name for themselves.

rA : You know... Go.Go's TvP is actually really really good.

Kim Carrier : ?

Um-Jae-Kyung : ?

Kingdom : ?

Kim Carrier : Are you saying this because he practiced with you for your revenge match?

Um-Jae-Kyung : No no, I mean Go.Go's TvP could have improved a lot over time. We are wrong to judge

Everyone bursts out laughing

Kingdom : To sum things up, I believe one of the core reasons for Bisu's slump comes from his ridiculously safe and predictable plays he's been doing.





OGN VOD Source
dats racist
kOre
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Canada3642 Posts
March 28 2010 09:52 GMT
#2
I hope he comes back to tear it up after his vacation. As a serious Bisu fan it makes me happy when he does really well (also a serious NaDa and sAviOr fan).
http://www.starcraftmecca.net - Founder
Hirmu
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Finland850 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-28 09:56:31
March 28 2010 09:55 GMT
#3
Haha so good ending!
Thanks for this, awesome.
I hope bisu will come and destroy!
soudo
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
603 Posts
March 28 2010 09:57 GMT
#4
Oh wow, a MrHoon translation? Very nice. I thought he just drew funny pictures!
writer22816
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States5775 Posts
March 28 2010 09:59 GMT
#5
Nice translation! And lol @ Nal_rA
8/4/12 never forget, never forgive.
Licmyobelisk
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
Philippines3682 Posts
March 28 2010 10:02 GMT
#6
thanks mr. hoon! hope that bisu gets back his smooth moves ^_^
I don't think I've ever wished my opponent good luck prior to a game. When I play, I play to win. I hope every opponent I ever have is cursed with fucking terrible luck. I hope they're stuck playing underneath a stepladder with a black cat in attendance a
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17731 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-28 10:08:28
March 28 2010 10:05 GMT
#7
nvm haha i need some sleep.
Hallucinating.
+ Show Spoiler +
Kingdom : Bisu started playing incredibly standard and predictable around an year ago if I recall correctly.
As the coach for both Best and Bisu if I compare the two together, Bisu was not that good at making Build Orders at all. In fact, Best was a much better player and making new strategies and build orders for his games. Best was very good at making transitioning build orders and new and exciting build orders to throw off his opponents. But on the other hand Bisu had a really hard time changing his strategies and trying out new things. What Bisu was good at doing was copying and modifying builds Stork and Kal used previously to win games and making it better.

slight typo. In fact, best was a much better at not and.

Thanks for the translation ^^. Nice insight
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
FragKrag
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States11554 Posts
March 28 2010 10:05 GMT
#8
rofl Nal_rA just comes in with the killer
*TL CJ Entusman #40* "like scissors does anything to paper except MAKE IT MORE NUMEROUS" -paper
Brett
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
Australia3822 Posts
March 28 2010 10:13 GMT
#9
hahaha that's gold...

ty MrHoon!
chongu
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Malaysia2593 Posts
March 28 2010 10:16 GMT
#10
On March 28 2010 18:49 MrHoon wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
rA : You know... Go.Go's TvP is actually really really good.

Kim Carrier : ?

Um-Jae-Kyung : ?

Kingdom : ?


LOOOOOL
SC2 is to BW, what coke is to wine.
pyrogenetix
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
China5098 Posts
March 28 2010 10:21 GMT
#11
very interesting thanks for the translation!
Yea that looks just like Kang Min... amazing game sense... and uses mind games well, but has the micro of a washed up progamer.
alffla
Profile Blog Joined November 2005
Hong Kong20321 Posts
March 28 2010 10:24 GMT
#12
looooool "as we all know, gogo's tvp is HORRENDOUS"

...

ra: gogos tvp is actually the ownage

hahah

thanks h00n
Graphicssavior[gm] : What is a “yawn” rape ;; Masumune - It was the year of the pig for those fucking defilers. Chill - A clinic you say? okum: SC without Korean yelling is like porn without sex. konamix: HAPPY BIRTHDAY MOMMY!
KristianJS
Profile Joined October 2009
2107 Posts
March 28 2010 11:01 GMT
#13
looool @ the end

Really interesting conversation, hope to see Bisu renew himself in the future though. Thanks for the translation!
You need to be 100% behind someone before you can stab them in the back
Nytefish
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United Kingdom4282 Posts
March 28 2010 11:03 GMT
#14
And this is why you should practise cheese!
Also why Bisu's PvP is good.
No I'm never serious.
meegrean
Profile Joined May 2008
Thailand7699 Posts
March 28 2010 11:10 GMT
#15
yep, bisu should start mixing up more builds, including riskier ones. hope he makes a comeback next OSL.
Brood War loyalist
Heyoka
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Katowice25012 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-03-28 11:19:29
March 28 2010 11:13 GMT
#16
np bisu has MSL in the bag

That was really interesting, thanks
@RealHeyoka | ESL / DreamHack StarCraft Lead
29 fps
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
United States5724 Posts
March 28 2010 11:14 GMT
#17
lol @ rA. great way to end it.
4v4 is a battle of who has the better computer.
Bill Murray
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States9292 Posts
March 28 2010 11:19 GMT
#18
i feel like they have terrible biases. kingdom is sore over the fact that he got his zealots stuck behind his gateway and instantly ALT+QQed LOL
University of Kentucky Basketball #1
emucxg
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Finland4559 Posts
March 28 2010 11:25 GMT
#19
rA : You know... Go.Go's TvP is actually really really good.

Kim Carrier : ?

Um-Jae-Kyung : ?

Kingdom : ?


looool
LaiShin
Profile Joined November 2005
Australia978 Posts
March 28 2010 11:26 GMT
#20
Thanks for the translation. Very very interesting. Looking forward to more of this.
1 2 3 4 5 7 8 9 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 2h 7m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SortOf 152
StarCraft: Brood War
Larva 1704
BeSt 287
ToSsGirL 33
Noble 33
Icarus 8
Soulkey 1
NotJumperer 1
Dota 2
monkeys_forever551
League of Legends
JimRising 608
Other Games
summit1g10313
WinterStarcraft408
C9.Mang0252
ViBE149
Trikslyr19
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick629
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream374
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• intothetv
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki28
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1533
• Lourlo1123
• Stunt770
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
2h 7m
Wardi Open
5h 7m
OSC
6h 7m
Tenacious Turtle Tussle
17h 7m
The PondCast
1d 3h
Replay Cast
1d 16h
OSC
2 days
LAN Event
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
WardiTV Korean Royale
3 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Wardi Open
5 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Wardi Open
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

SOOP Univ League 2025
RSL Revival: Season 3
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
Slon Tour Season 2
META Madness #9
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2

Upcoming

BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.