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On March 15 2011 21:45 naim wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2011 20:54 Grettin wrote:
Pay-to-view wont work and i don't think its a good idea at all. If people wants to watch the games, then they watch. No need to donate or pay for it.
People needs to know about this and start donating for before the tournament and for the "prize pool". And then possible during the games trough PayPal etc. hm okok pay-to-view does't work, agreed. But what is the point of donating for a "prize pool"? Isn't the idea of charity, that everybody donates to one cause? Players/casters donate some of their time, viewers some of their money. Am I wrong?
Yeah, that's the thing... as far as getting spectators to donate goes, it might be quicker to just get a TL admin to nag day9 to make a pre-show announcement and put a link or something -- and in fact that would probably be slightly more effective, since day9 is notorious for making people do things. Just having a show match might not earn that much, since most people that are interested presumably would have donated already...
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I would suggest that instead of a pay to play tournament use casters who will cast the events, and the money they earn from the event through advertisements can be used to be sent to the doctor. Remember there are a lot of casters. If you can get some big name casters for a consecutive cast, that would be ideal, Day9, Tasteless(We only see him in GSL!) and have casters switch out places, run ads between commercials and anytime there is a wait period
People will know 100% that all revenue will go to Earthquake/Tsunami/Japan, so there won't be as much whining, not only that by being a viewer all those individuals will be supporting the tournament, Esports and the victims.
(Only reason I don't suggest a pay to play is because most people/gamers can't even fend off a couple of bucks, sorry I don't make 65k like I did 2 years ago right now I barely make 700 dollars a month and my expenses are 1k a month.) Aka Student.
Also I do recommend a prize tournament probably not 1k or maybe a divided amount such as if it's 1k
1st place wins 250/donates 300
2nd place wins 125/donates 175
3rd place wins 50/donates 100
These are just random numbers that equal 1k. I just think donating more than you win would be better. + any profits made go to Japan too. Another side note is that 300/175/100 could be a tax write off.
Also by no means does that people can't "Donate" to the event either, meaning we can do a multi-prong attack on this event =B. Don't you still get 5 dollars from paypal for signing up?
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How many T-shirts would you need Dump actually?
I have a few people who might want to do something.
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On March 15 2011 22:04 GertHeart wrote:
I would suggest that instead of a pay to play tournament use casters who will cast the events, and the money they earn from the event through advertisements can be used to be sent to the doctor. Remember there are a lot of casters. If you can get some big name casters for a consecutive cast, that would be ideal, Day9, Tasteless(We only see him in GSL!) and have casters switch out places, run ads between commercials and anytime there is a wait period
That'd give me nerd chills, but I think it might dilute the viewership.
People will know 100% that all revenue will go to Earthquake/Tsunami/Japan, so there won't be as much whining, not only that by being a viewer all those individuals will be supporting the tournament, Esports and the victims.
Web ads could be hard to deal with. If ustream/YouTube/etc work anything like the way Google AdSense does, the casters will have a hard time knowing exactly how much money was made on any one ad.
(Only reason I don't suggest a pay to play is because most people/gamers can't even fend off a couple of bucks, sorry I don't make 65k like I did 2 years ago right now I barely make 700 dollars a month and my expenses are 1k a month.) Aka Student.
I hear you. Hmmm...
Well if people are going to donate, they're going to have to spend some amount or another, so...
With pay-to-play, even if they end up not donating or playing, people could still watch the finals, which presumably would have some high-profile players and casters. But yeah, the logistical challenge is the big problem with that idea.
Also I do recommend a prize tournament probably not 1k or maybe a divided amount such as if it's 1k
1st place wins 250/donates 300
2nd place wins 125/donates 175
3rd place wins 50/donates 100
These are just random numbers that equal 1k. I just think donating more than you win would be better. + any profits made go to Japan too. Another side note is that 300/175/100 could be a tax write off.
Sounds good to me, but is that enough to satisfy the pros?
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On March 15 2011 22:23 Zergneedsfood wrote:
How many T-shirts would you need Dump actually?
I have a few people who might want to do something.
Awesome. Thanks for that.
We'll probably have to settle on a business model before we can ask though. If we decide to just do pro games, we won't need any; if we decide to provide prizes to the winners of n games or something we might need a fair number.
If we do pay-to-play, it might be interesting to do something like, for instance, $10 and n wins for a tee-shirt or $15 to play + a tee-shirt unconditionally.
Feel free to shoot my ideas down by the way; I'm just brainstorming.
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Make a raffle for a part of these t-shirts under the donators.
Sell the rest and donate the money.
Or send the t-shirts directly to Japan. :/
Sorry, that sounds drastic but i could imagine they would need fresh water and blankets more than money.
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On March 15 2011 23:12 naim wrote:
Make a raffle for a part of these t-shirts under the donators.
Sell the rest and donate the money.
Or send the t-shirts directly to Japan. :/
Sorry, that sounds drastic but i could imagine they would need fresh water and blankets more than money.
And you can't buy those things with money? Has the world changed completely because of this incident?
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On March 15 2011 23:12 naim wrote:
Make a raffle for a part of these t-shirts under the donators.
Sell the rest and donate the money.
Or send the t-shirts directly to Japan. :/
Sorry, that sounds drastic but i could imagine they would need fresh water and blankets more than money.
Actually you're absolutely right. Hmm...
Well, the reasoning for donating money as opposed to anything else is that once the infrastructure is in place, the Red Cross can probably deal with blankets and water and such, but medication and treatment for people who've lost their insurance coverage is undoubtedly going to be a much more complicated issue that can only be resolved with money.
But yeah, given that we have the capacity to donate clothing, there's probably no reason that we shouldn't.
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Dump, I only made the suggestion for one reason, because I do know how hard it is to calculate but I know it's possible, there is another possible step, create a seperate utsream/justin.tv account have it become a partner, and just have all the funds go to that one, and allow all the casters access to it.
I'm just trying to give outside of the box idea's.
On a side note Idra's going to phoenix to be in a small lan with a small prize pool. DieStar/EmpireKas/Dimaga/Stalife etc.. I could go on forever play for 100 dollar prize pools almost daily. So getting big names to join won't be impossible, and probably the larger the tournament the better, unless you can get good player names and start with Bo3 first set. Usually just setting one up and hoping people show up now kinda works.
Or send the t-shirts directly to Japan. :/
Sorry, that sounds drastic but i could imagine they would need fresh water and blankets more than money.
Money buys it, and is easily transferable. Most nations prefer money in bad situations.
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On March 15 2011 23:23 Grettin wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2011 23:12 naim wrote:
Make a raffle for a part of these t-shirts under the donators.
Sell the rest and donate the money.
Or send the t-shirts directly to Japan. :/
Sorry, that sounds drastic but i could imagine they would need fresh water and blankets more than money. And you can't buy those things with money? Has the world changed completely because of this incident?
A little bit... but I think the bottlenecking resource is in fact gasoline right now.
Again I should consult with the doc whenever he's in an area with working Internet. He'd know both by observation and by past experience how we might best deliver resources.
Right now he's working on low-power generators with scarce fuel, and he's going from dawn to dusk without even making time to eat, from what I hear.
Is there anything else you guys might want to ask him? I'm going to shoot him an email soon.
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On March 15 2011 23:27 GertHeart wrote:
Dump, I only made the suggestion for one reason, because I do know how hard it is to calculate but I know it's possible, there is another possible step, create a seperate utsream/justin.tv account have it become a partner, and just have all the funds go to that one, and allow all the casters access to it.
I'm just trying to give outside of the box idea's.
That could work. It might be harder to promote, though. For instance if Husky were to cast, he'd have to have a link from his YouTube page -- his subscribers wouldn't see it directly. If day9 were to cast, he'd need to announce it in one of his dailies.
But yeah, either way, let's get our own stream going on ustream or what not.
On a side note Idra's going to phoenix to be in a small lan with a small prize pool. DieStar/EmpireKas/Dimaga/Stalife etc.. I could go on forever play for 100 dollar prize pools almost daily. So getting big names to join won't be impossible, and probably the larger the tournament the better, unless you can get good player names and start with Bo3 first set. Usually just setting one up and hoping people show up now kinda works.
Cool, that's good to know.
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I've read the thread so far and this could turn it wonderfully. It's a great way to make e-sports (and more people in generall) contribute to Japan after this disaster.
I was thinking about this as well, but never really gave it much thought untill I read this thread and really got inspired. What do you think about trying to make local fundraising tournaments as well as this one (that hopefully will get quite large, I terms of fundraising). Or do you think that a smaller online tournament (for the EU server, since that's where I'm located) will just split the money, and not really increese it?
(First post, be gentle)
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On March 15 2011 23:47 Viper Jr. wrote:
I've read the thread so far and this could turn it wonderfully. It's a great way to make e-sports (and more people in generall) contribute to Japan after this disaster.
I was thinking about this as well, but never really gave it much thought untill I read this thread and really got inspired. What do you think about trying to make local fundraising tournaments as well as this one (that hopefully will get quite large, I terms of fundraising). Or do you think that a smaller online tournament (for the EU server, since that's where I'm located) will just split the money, and not really increese it?
(First post, be gentle)
I'm honestly not too sure, but I think it boils down to two variables:
1. operational overhead -- most if not all charitable organizations have expenses, so only a certain percentage makes it to the people on the ground. Some organizations are known for taking up nearly all the funding. In our case the most significant cost will probably be the prize pool. What the overhead of multiple tournaments is as opposed to one large tournament is sort of up in the air, I think.
Having one tournament with a lot of volunteers might reduce redundant use of man hours, though people might potentially be more familiar with the SC community in their own regions.
2. marketing -- if it turns out that there's a significant snowball effect, one large tournament might be more successful than a lot of smaller ones, as we'll be able to get bigger names on board. On the other hand, having a ton of small tournaments all over the world might have better reach.
Hard to say. Would love to have as much help as we can get, though.
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Just wanted to quickly post in-between my schedule to say that this is an awesome idea and if there is absolutely anything I could do to help then i'd love to be a part of this!
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On March 14 2011 20:06 PlagueRat wrote:
We should allow the quake to do significant enough dmg, so that we may invade, and enslave them.
User was temp banned for this post.
jesus tl users are such aspies sometimes
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On March 16 2011 00:05 dump wrote:
I'm honestly not too sure, but I think it boils down to two variables:
1. operational overhead -- most if not all charitable organizations have expenses, so only a certain percentage makes it to the people on the ground. Some organizations are known for taking up nearly all the funding. In our case the most significant cost will probably be the prize pool. What the overhead of multiple tournaments is as opposed to one large tournament is sort of up in the air, I think.
Having one tournament with a lot of volunteers might reduce redundant use of man hours, though people might potentially be more familiar with the SC community in their own regions.
2. marketing -- if it turns out that there's a significant snowball effect, one large tournament might be more successful than a lot of smaller ones, as we'll be able to get bigger names on board. On the other hand, having a ton of small tournaments all over the world might have better reach.
Hard to say. Would love to have as much help as we can get, though.
Just basicly thinking out loud here:
I'm thinking about a much smaller tournament here. It would be great if the DumpTournament (I'll call it that, just to make things clear) gets some of the more established players and gets resonally big. But like you said that, will cost money (some at least). So, what if the DumpTournament aims to be "as big as possible" with some of the tips and ideas that are giving in this thread, and other small tournaments settle for a lot less.
For example:
Let's say I decide to make a smaller tournament for the same cause. Then maybe just advertise it on billboards in different schools, some swedish/city local internet communities etc. The pricepool is 10% of the entrence money (should not be needed, but if it attractes more people, it's worth it), the rest goes directly to Japan (via some pre-decided foundation/your contact/etc). The tournament is online, and replay based. So when it's started, everyone has 3 days (for example) to play the match and send the replay to me. When the three days are over, a new round begin etc. This way, there is really nothing to lose. There will be no expenses (so that will not be a problem), and since it a smaller tournament, it will not "take" players from the big, glourious Fundraising DumpTournament. And if there are just 5 people attending, then it's at least more than nothing, and perhaps enough to make at least one familys' life at least a little better.
Any thought on that? And like I said, I'm just thinking out loud here. Maybe it's a bad idea, maybe it's not.
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On March 16 2011 00:24 Viper Jr. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2011 00:05 dump wrote:
I'm honestly not too sure, but I think it boils down to two variables:
1. operational overhead -- most if not all charitable organizations have expenses, so only a certain percentage makes it to the people on the ground. Some organizations are known for taking up nearly all the funding. In our case the most significant cost will probably be the prize pool. What the overhead of multiple tournaments is as opposed to one large tournament is sort of up in the air, I think.
Having one tournament with a lot of volunteers might reduce redundant use of man hours, though people might potentially be more familiar with the SC community in their own regions.
2. marketing -- if it turns out that there's a significant snowball effect, one large tournament might be more successful than a lot of smaller ones, as we'll be able to get bigger names on board. On the other hand, having a ton of small tournaments all over the world might have better reach.
Hard to say. Would love to have as much help as we can get, though. Just basicly thinking out loud here: I'm thinking about a much smaller tournament here. It would be great if the DumpTournament (I'll call it that, just to make things clear) gets some of the more established players and gets resonally big. But like you said that, will cost money (some at least). So, what if the DumpTournament aims to be "as big as possible" with some of the tips and ideas that are giving in this thread, and other small tournaments settle for a lot less. For example: Let's say I decide to make a smaller tournament for the same cause. Then maybe just advertise it on billboards in different schools, some swedish/city local internet communities etc. The pricepool is 10% of the entrence money (should not be needed, but if it attractes more people, it's worth it), the rest goes directly to Japan (via some pre-decided foundation/your contact/etc). The tournament is online, and replay based. So when it's started, everyone has 3 days (for example) to play the match and send the replay to me. When the three days are over, a new round begin etc. This way, there is really nothing to lose. There will be no expenses (so that will not be a problem), and since it a smaller tournament, it will not "take" players from the big, glourious Fundraising DumpTournament. And if there are just 5 people attending, then it's at least more than nothing, and perhaps enough to make at least one familys' life at least a little better. Any thought on that? And like I said, I'm just thinking out loud here. Maybe it's a bad idea, maybe it's not.
We're still not settled on the size of the tournament, really. It might just be a few pro gamers, or it might be an open thing... there seems to be pros and cons to both.
I think your idea should work too. Maybe if we're lucky, it'll start a trend for fundraiser tournaments run by individuals. That'd be awesome. Plus local tournaments are probably a lot of fun.
Japan's earthquake is horrifying, but there are others that need help too. It's just that Japan's getting a lot of attention because it's so prominent in the global conscious. I'm guilty of that too.
Gotta try to get some sleep, will be back later.
On March 16 2011 00:13 KaelSC wrote:
Just wanted to quickly post in-between my schedule to say that this is an awesome idea and if there is absolutely anything I could do to help then i'd love to be a part of this!
Aye, keep an eye on this thread.
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On March 16 2011 00:48 dump wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2011 00:24 Viper Jr. wrote:On March 16 2011 00:05 dump wrote:
I'm honestly not too sure, but I think it boils down to two variables:
1. operational overhead -- most if not all charitable organizations have expenses, so only a certain percentage makes it to the people on the ground. Some organizations are known for taking up nearly all the funding. In our case the most significant cost will probably be the prize pool. What the overhead of multiple tournaments is as opposed to one large tournament is sort of up in the air, I think.
Having one tournament with a lot of volunteers might reduce redundant use of man hours, though people might potentially be more familiar with the SC community in their own regions.
2. marketing -- if it turns out that there's a significant snowball effect, one large tournament might be more successful than a lot of smaller ones, as we'll be able to get bigger names on board. On the other hand, having a ton of small tournaments all over the world might have better reach.
Hard to say. Would love to have as much help as we can get, though. Just basicly thinking out loud here: I'm thinking about a much smaller tournament here. It would be great if the DumpTournament (I'll call it that, just to make things clear) gets some of the more established players and gets resonally big. But like you said that, will cost money (some at least). So, what if the DumpTournament aims to be "as big as possible" with some of the tips and ideas that are giving in this thread, and other small tournaments settle for a lot less. For example: Let's say I decide to make a smaller tournament for the same cause. Then maybe just advertise it on billboards in different schools, some swedish/city local internet communities etc. The pricepool is 10% of the entrence money (should not be needed, but if it attractes more people, it's worth it), the rest goes directly to Japan (via some pre-decided foundation/your contact/etc). The tournament is online, and replay based. So when it's started, everyone has 3 days (for example) to play the match and send the replay to me. When the three days are over, a new round begin etc. This way, there is really nothing to lose. There will be no expenses (so that will not be a problem), and since it a smaller tournament, it will not "take" players from the big, glourious Fundraising DumpTournament. And if there are just 5 people attending, then it's at least more than nothing, and perhaps enough to make at least one familys' life at least a little better. Any thought on that? And like I said, I'm just thinking out loud here. Maybe it's a bad idea, maybe it's not. We're still not settled on the size of the tournament, really. It might just be a few pro gamers, or it might be an open thing... there seems to be pros and cons to both. I think your idea should work too. Maybe if we're lucky, it'll start a trend for fundraiser tournaments run by individuals. That'd be awesome. Japan's earthquake is horrifying, but there are others that need help too. It's just that Japan's getting a lot of attention because it's so prominent in the global conscious. I'm guilty of that too.
I do beleive that we could cooperate our ideas. Perhaps your tournament will be one with (more or less) progamers, while I (and hopefully others in other countries) try to create open tournaments (since there is nothing to lose in trying to hosting such a simple tournamet).
And yes, it would be fantastic if this starts a trend with fundraisning tournaments. And not just when a big disaster appares, like you said, but everyday, a tournament like this is needed.
I´ll try to continue the brainstorming if I actually could be able to create a smaller, open tournament in Sweden. But if there is anything you need help with, just say it!
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Chill - take a deep breath - calm down. You guys are making this into a much more intricate and difficult than it really is. I will break it down:
The Format and how (i think) it should be done:
1. You run a 64-player pro tournament of which 15 spots are reserved for the largest single contributors. I.e. people who are willing to lay down 1k like that guy will get to play a pro, maybe even on a livestream with thousands of people watching. People already pay up to hundreds to dollars for somthing similar already.
2. You organize the prize pool so its worth playing for. It doesnt need to be more than 1st $300, 2nd $200, 3rd $100. A hell of a lot of good players already play on the Go4sc2 cups, and the prizes are even smaller there. Those prizes will suffice.
3. You set up a paypal account to which watchers of the stream can donate. This can work pretty well. Diggity raised (i think) about 2k for children back in the Brood war days. The community is 10 or 20 times the size it was then. The donations will come. Most people can afford to chip in at least 10 USD.
4. You get the top casters for the tour. This is essential! Preferably one from both "camps"; 1. Day9, Gosucoaching, Tastosis and 2. someone whos huge on youtube. Like Husky.
5. You pick one leader to organize the whole event. A person whos willing to put in the effort and has integrity, so preferably a well know and long standing TL member (Wouldn't want anyone to run off with the money).
6. You set a date and time that will enable most people to participate and watch from BOTH EU and NA. (For instance would be running it right before TSL matches be silly)
7. Once you have cleared the players (pros) and shown this is a really good set up, you go for corporate sponsorship. Look at all the money put in in these types of tours already. For instance, i couldnt imagine Blizz not contributing when the people of their gaming community makes such an effort for relief.
IF you do these things you could have at least 10 - 20k, maybe even 30k within 3 or 4 weeks time. 1 week to set the date and let pro's sign up. 1-2 weeks of hypeing and a "donation race" for a spot in the tour (the better the pros - the bigger the donations). And then you run the tour.
Remember this is CHARITY. Charity is when people give time, effort or money for no gain. If you have the possibility of a prize, fame or just to watch good games, thats plenty. Charity when people go the extra mile for someone else. Every pro say they really wanna see e-sports grow, if a single community can raise tens of thousands of dollars for people they dont know - it will be noticed.
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Aphasie:
You make a very good point. And to relate to my other posts, I do believe that smaller tournaments can be arrange quite easilly, in addition to a really big tournament, like the one you are describing. Of course, the money will be ALOT less than in the epic scenario you are describing, but perhaps it's enough to "get the ball rolling" in terms of local tournament fundraising.
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EPT
