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On November 28 2010 05:44 eshlow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2010 04:54 doerit wrote:
But Vitamin D levels are usually not very depleted when a cold or flu occurs, because it is stored in the fatty tissues of the body, therefore it takes a long time to deplete or build up.
If you have a cold that lasts just a couple of days there is no way to deplete the Vitamin D storage of the body significantly. The interesting health effects are cancer prevention.
If you buy a vit D sup make sure to buy Calcifediol, because it is much more potent than the D2 or D3 in the cheap supplements.
edit: actually removed Calcitriol, b/c it is more potent than D2/D3, but it is basically for medical use only, because it is the active form of Vit D (very expensive :D) Your analysis is a bit off. They are depleted why colds or flus occur because they usually occur in the winter.... fall and the beginning of winter with less sun = less vitamin D. It depletes levels, it's when the levels are depleted flu/cold season occurs hence the 2-5 month delay of flu season after summer months Consider that most people are in doors a lot now... and super sun screen proactive. That's why about 85-90% of the general population is vitamin D deficient *all year round*. So I'm not exactly seeing how people's levels aren't depleted... especially in light of the above two facts. That's why supplementing is important in the winter if you can't get much UVB radiation on your skin Anyway, D3 is more potentent than D2... and Calcidiol, and calcitriol are more potent than D3. But no supplement company sells the latter two (only can get them medically as you said), so the best you can get is D3. Also, there's wayyyy more beneficial effects than for upper respiratory tract infections and cancer: http://www.eatmoveimprove.com/2009/10/a-closer-look-at-vitamin-d/
Well first of it all, D2 and D3 are absorbed about the same...there is still discussion about whether or not D3 is better absorbed or not.
You can't say less sun=less vitamin d in general, there are so many variables in this equation, such as skin tone, place of residence, diet, individual factors and like you already mentioned time spent outside, sun hours, etc. Less sun is just one factor, what about people living in the Nordic regions? I doubt they all have depleted vitamin d values.
I am not debating if there is a general Vitamin D deficiency, because there probably is one. But on the other hand there are sub-clinical deficiencies for almost all vitamins/minerals for most of the population because of mainly their diet.
It is always very risky(not health wise, but effect wise) too supplement just one thing for a certain reason like vitamin d during a cold. The site you posted is pretty one sided, it refers to a lot of studies, I like that, but on the other hand it is not a scientific look at vitamin d, because it is just a pro look on it (from what I can tell, I read over it).
So what I am trying to say is, if you are concerned about depleted vitamin values in general during the winter time try to buy a high quality vitamin supplement that has basically everything in it and do it as an addition to a good diet, if you just crank your vitamin intake up (esp. fat-soluble vitamins) for a couple of days will just have a placebo effect, it just takes some time to get the fat-soluble vitamin storages up. Water soluble vitamins can be depleted much quicker during a cold.
And you are right about the possible beneficial effects, cancer treatment was all I could remember from my studies.
Most of my sources are books I have at home, I can put edit them in or pm you next weekend.
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Sure PM me all you got.
D3 is more potent than D2... something on the order of like 20-30x. I read that in the studies when I was researching that. I'm not sure if wikipedia has any sources on that but they might. D2 requires significantly more IU ingestion to get the same effects as D3 on the ug/mL concentration in the blood of active vitamin D.
It's true there's a lot of factors but in general population is waaaaay deficient. Nordic people have fairer skin which makes the sun exposure they have more effective at converting D. Conversely, the opposite is true for people who live near the equator for good reason. BUt yeah, most of the nordic countries also have higher ingestion of fish and other marine animals which tend to have higher levels of vitamin D than land dwelling animals and plants.
And yeah, there's deficiencies of everything.... SAD (standard american diet) ensures that. I'm not sure about your country but yeah most industrial countries have this problem. But it's also true that multi-vitamin supplements don't really do much nor does megadosing vitamins. THe studies have born this out time and time again that there's no decrease in mortality rates from megadosing or multivitamin supplements which underlines the fact that you can't out supplement a poor diet.
The difference with vitamin D and multis is that most multis only have 400 IU (100% DVA at least in US) while we normally generate at least 25x that amount in the sun on a sunny day... so it's not doing anything at all. BUt yeah I'd love to see a review of DVAs and why they chose particular ones...
As for vitamin D it's definitely NOT placebo effective. D3 in the system is rapidly converted in the liver and kidneys to active vitamin D (yes, some goes straight to adipose tissues yes), but there are VDR -- vitamin D receptors -- on every cell in the body. Vitamin D is also responsible for upregulation of some antimicrobial peptides and T-lymphocytes.... and obviously activation of this stuff can occur rapidly just like adminstration of any of the steroid hormones will start exerting effects immediately especially considering that D is a secosteroid (as it is a derivative of cholesterol).
Cortisone, for example, starts exerting its effects within the hour, and usually most people can feel a difference within a couple hours. Orally, there is obviously some time lag between getting it from the digestive system into the body so it's not immediate but there should be obvious effects within at least 8 hours if not 24 hours.
It's not uncommon to be able to sleep off the flu in 1 night (instead of 7+) with higher dose vitamin D. I've done it... and lots of other people I've advised have done it as well.
I do agree in general that it is more risky to supplement fat soluble hormones.... but as the article says there is sufficient research to beleive that 10,000 IU is fairly safe all the time; but 5k if you're worried is fine too. I only suggest higher doses if sick because it works and works well. In conjunction with sleep it eradicates a lot of URTIs.
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I might be confusing Vitamin D with one of the other fat-soluble vitamins when it comes to the intake speed, if I do so my apologies to you.
I'll give you the sources next week, I don't have my books here. But I remember that they were saying that the potential of D2 and D3 is the same, but there is some debate about this going on. But maybe your information is newer on this topic (I think my book was from the late 90s)
I guess the diet in Germany is not as bad as the US at this point, but we are getting there don't worry  . My own multi vitamin has 600 IU and I am a vegetarian. I had my blood values checked two weeks ago and it was around 80.0 ng/mL if I remember that right, at least my doc said it is more than alright.
From what I have learned values of more than 1.000IU for a longer period of time (2-3 months) is not recommended. But I really don't want to say you are wrong, maybe what I know about vitamin d is just outdated, I mean the view on supplements and nutrition in general changes so quickly, because many fields are just being understand on the biochemical levels.
I'll read up on the topic and get back to you if this is alright. But next time when i get sick I'll definitely give it a try.
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Man, need to get me some Vitamin D... Think I'm getting a little sick.
Anyway, week three of SS. I guess I shoulda got on the hype train a little earlier than I had, because damn I love it :D. Gotta say though, I hate bench press.
Anyways, heres the numbers (lbs)
Squat 185, Deadlift 105, Bench 135
Pull ups have increased from only six reps across three sets to 14 across three
Chin ups went from 15 reps to 21 reps across the three.
Shoulder press is the only thing I'm really concerned about. I feel my shoulders are just... weak. I'm up to 75 pounds though.
Through about three weeks I've gained about 9 pounds or so. :D
Should be in the 500 pound club here in two or three weeks.
Is there any deloading within SS or is that just the resets?
By the way, I don't know how y'all track your lifts but I recommend withfit.com to anybody who is having trouble and if you would prefer it to a paper method. They have some programs already in their calenders such as the major variations of SS. And you can make your own as well.
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On November 28 2010 08:15 doerit wrote:I might be confusing Vitamin D with one of the other fat-soluble vitamins when it comes to the intake speed, if I do so my apologies to you. I'll give you the sources next week, I don't have my books here. But I remember that they were saying that the potential of D2 and D3 is the same, but there is some debate about this going on. But maybe your information is newer on this topic (I think my book was from the late 90s) I guess the diet in Germany is not as bad as the US at this point, but we are getting there don't worry . My own multi vitamin has 600 IU and I am a vegetarian. I had my blood values checked two weeks ago and it was around 80.0 ng/mL if I remember that right, at least my doc said it is more than alright. From what I have learned values of more than 1.000IU for a longer period of time (2-3 months) is not recommended. But I really don't want to say you are wrong, maybe what I know about vitamin d is just outdated, I mean the view on supplements and nutrition in general changes so quickly, because many fields are just being understand on the biochemical levels. I'll read up on the topic and get back to you if this is alright. But next time when i get sick I'll definitely give it a try.
there's a difference between ng/mL and nmol/L... 80 ng/mL would be good but generally higher numbers are referred to in nmol/L (which is like 2.5x or something lower than ng/mL). I'm not saying you're wrong but I would like to know if it was absolutely ng/mL
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10232622
There's the study on 10k IU.
Except in those with conditions causing hypersensitivity, there is no evidence of adverse effects with serum 25(OH)D concentrations <140 nmol/L, which require a total vitamin D supply of 250 microg (10000 IU)/d to attain. Published cases of vitamin D toxicity with hypercalcemia, for which the 25(OH)D concentration and vitamin D dose are known, all involve intake of > or = 1000 microg (40000 IU)/d. Because vitamin D is potentially toxic, intake of >25 microg (1000 IU)/d has been avoided even though the weight of evidence shows that the currently accepted, no observed adverse effect limit of 50 microg (2000 IU)/d is too low by at least 5-fold.
I'd say the 1k IU for months is pretty outdated by now.
And considering that I've been taking 10k IU for over a year now and am not dead..... I actually feel better when I take my vitamin D, and if I miss it two or more days I start feeling lethargic and slow.
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Catch:
The resets in SS are a form of deloading.
YOu don't need to deload as a novice like you would as an intermediate or anything like that which is why there aren't any light or heavy or low volume / hgih volume days
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On November 28 2010 09:38 Catch wrote:
Man, need to get me some Vitamin D... Think I'm getting a little sick.
Anyway, week three of SS. I guess I shoulda got on the hype train a little earlier than I had, because damn I love it :D. Gotta say though, I hate bench press.
Anyways, heres the numbers (lbs)
Squat 185, Deadlift 105, Bench 135
Pull ups have increased from only six reps across three sets to 14 across three
Chin ups went from 15 reps to 21 reps across the three.
Shoulder press is the only thing I'm really concerned about. I feel my shoulders are just... weak. I'm up to 75 pounds though.
Through about three weeks I've gained about 9 pounds or so. :D
Should be in the 500 pound club here in two or three weeks.
Is there any deloading within SS or is that just the resets?
By the way, I don't know how y'all track your lifts but I recommend withfit.com to anybody who is having trouble and if you would prefer it to a paper method. They have some programs already in their calenders such as the major variations of SS. And you can make your own as well.
Why are you deadlifting so little? In general dead lift is higher than squat and should DEFINITELY be higher than your bench. And yeah, overhead press is tough, but its awesome 
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THE VITAMIN D FIGHT
FUCK YES!
HIT IT LIKE YOU MEAN IT GUYS! :D
Went to the gym for the first time in like 2/2.5weeks, 90kg Squat, 55kg Press and 50kg PC.
GO :D
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@Decaf.
I wish I knew. They said start low so I started at 65 pounds lol. And then only added 20 pounds each week. After another two weeks though my dead will be higher than my bench.
And oh yeah, its awesome, but damn does it suck
And thanks Eshlow :D
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On November 28 2010 10:43 funkie wrote:
THE VITAMIN D FIGHT
FUCK YES!
HIT IT LIKE YOU MEAN IT GUYS! :D
Went to the gym for the first time in like 2/2.5weeks, 90kg Squat, 55kg Press and 50kg PC.
GO :D
Hm, there's not so much to fight about with Vitamin D... It's beneficial for a lot of things, and reports of intoxifications are mostly anecdotal, when people take 50k IU or so daily for some months.
EDIT: But I don't believe that influenza can be effectively reduced to one day by high doses of Vit. D. At least not the real one.
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wow....over 65kg with less than 2 weeks to cut....stupid holidays....
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On November 28 2010 11:51 Koagel wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2010 10:43 funkie wrote:
THE VITAMIN D FIGHT
FUCK YES!
HIT IT LIKE YOU MEAN IT GUYS! :D
Went to the gym for the first time in like 2/2.5weeks, 90kg Squat, 55kg Press and 50kg PC.
GO :D Hm, there's not so much to fight about with Vitamin D... It's beneficial for a lot of things, and reports of intoxifications are mostly anecdotal, when people take 50k IU or so daily for some months. EDIT: But I don't believe that influenza can be effectively reduced to one day by high doses of Vit. D. At least not the real one.
Next time you have it, try it!
You have to get it in the initial stages where you're starting to feel sick/fever. If you get it mid-week like day 3-4 it may take a bit longer to clear up because it's already brutalizing your immune system and spread throughout upper respiratory tract a lot
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On October 04 2010 10:27 lowkontrast wrote:
16 years old here.
I'm 6'5" and 170lbs.
Used to be 210lbs but I lost some weight from wrestling.
Trying to gain muscle mass to about 190 lbs.
Right now I'm fairly skinny but do have a gut (though not visible through a shirt).
Taking 64 grams of protein after 45 minute workouts.
Diet's healthy - Kashi cereal in the morning, protein after my weight training classes, tuna/turkey sandwich from home for lunch. Soup when I get home, chicken for dinner.
Should I change anything?
What am I doing right to reach my goal (aiming for Summer to meet it)?
*Update*
I already hit 190 lbs in 2 months, so my new goal is 225 lbs. by Summer.
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On November 29 2010 01:25 lowkontrast wrote:Show nested quote +On October 04 2010 10:27 lowkontrast wrote:
16 years old here.
I'm 6'5" and 170lbs.
Used to be 210lbs but I lost some weight from wrestling.
Trying to gain muscle mass to about 190 lbs.
Right now I'm fairly skinny but do have a gut (though not visible through a shirt).
Taking 64 grams of protein after 45 minute workouts.
Diet's healthy - Kashi cereal in the morning, protein after my weight training classes, tuna/turkey sandwich from home for lunch. Soup when I get home, chicken for dinner.
Should I change anything?
What am I doing right to reach my goal (aiming for Summer to meet it)? *Update* I already hit 190 lbs in 2 months, so my new goal is 225 lbs. by Summer.
Eat more eggs and meat. Cut the cereal.
Nice progress btw
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Ditched today's workout in favor of going snowboarding. No regrets.
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On November 29 2010 02:05 eshlow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 29 2010 01:25 lowkontrast wrote:On October 04 2010 10:27 lowkontrast wrote:
16 years old here.
I'm 6'5" and 170lbs.
Used to be 210lbs but I lost some weight from wrestling.
Trying to gain muscle mass to about 190 lbs.
Right now I'm fairly skinny but do have a gut (though not visible through a shirt).
Taking 64 grams of protein after 45 minute workouts.
Diet's healthy - Kashi cereal in the morning, protein after my weight training classes, tuna/turkey sandwich from home for lunch. Soup when I get home, chicken for dinner.
Should I change anything?
What am I doing right to reach my goal (aiming for Summer to meet it)? *Update* I already hit 190 lbs in 2 months, so my new goal is 225 lbs. by Summer. Eat more eggs and meat. Cut the cereal. Nice progress btw
Thanks, eating scrambled eggs with scallions, onions, tomatoes, peppers, and some pork mixed in for breakfast now. Will try to get more meat in my diet though.
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On November 28 2010 12:09 eshlow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 28 2010 11:51 Koagel wrote:On November 28 2010 10:43 funkie wrote:
THE VITAMIN D FIGHT
FUCK YES!
HIT IT LIKE YOU MEAN IT GUYS! :D
Went to the gym for the first time in like 2/2.5weeks, 90kg Squat, 55kg Press and 50kg PC.
GO :D Hm, there's not so much to fight about with Vitamin D... It's beneficial for a lot of things, and reports of intoxifications are mostly anecdotal, when people take 50k IU or so daily for some months. EDIT: But I don't believe that influenza can be effectively reduced to one day by high doses of Vit. D. At least not the real one. Next time you have it, try it! You have to get it in the initial stages where you're starting to feel sick/fever. If you get it mid-week like day 3-4 it may take a bit longer to clear up because it's already brutalizing your immune system and spread throughout upper respiratory tract a lot
I don't really get sick very often, honestly. And when I do, it's not for long. Never had the flu.
I will try it for sure and I do believe it could shorten it by a significant margin, but it sounds way more effective than for example tamiflu from your description. While this is not impossible, I need to see studies on it to believe it.
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Went to gym today but it was closed for the holidays...so i went to the campus gym and was let in for free!
Since i want to be more awesome, i decided all squat reps will be performed noticeably below parallel, if not ATG.
Squatted 10x215 240 260 290 315. Felt amazing afterwards, out of breath and with an amazing leg pump.
OHP @ 155 for 4 sets of 5. Going to attempt 160 again later this week.
BB rows for 8x135,145,155,165,175
Still felt good so i did 3 sets of planks, 3 sets of weighted abs on ball, and then 5 sets of box jumps.
Felt exhaustedly awesome by the time i left.
Noticing more people lifting barefoot and in minimalist shoes, makes me happy lol. Which reminds me, Dimsum what are your thoughts on lifting barefoot vs running shoes for cleans and snatches (until i hopefully get oly shoes)
Forgot about all the pretty girls that do nothing but stretch at the gym on my campus, was awesome :D
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Any shoes are better than nothing.
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On November 29 2010 12:46 AoN.DimSum wrote:
Any shoes are better than nothing.
Really? I feel a ton more stable barefoot than I do with running shoes on when I'm squatting/deadlifting.
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EPT
