In-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 361

On November 14 2017 08:43 TheWanderingZebra wrote:


Really? I'd assume you'd want to test that out first before going with my suggestion :/.

Actual Schedule (CET)
Day 1 - 1 hour
- 5:30-6:30AM: Setting up Data Sheet + Reading Patch Notes

Day 2 - 1 hour
- 11:30-12:30AM: Applied 7.07c Changes to Applicable Heroes

Day 3 - 5 hours
- 10:30-3:30PM: Applied 7.07b revised changes for Heroes A-M

Day 4 - 5 hours
- 8:30-11:30AM: Applied 7.07b revised changes for Hero N-P
- 1:30-3:30PM: Applied 7.07b revised changes for Hero Q-Z
- 4:00-5:00: Reading Final Feedback, Update Databases, Announcement Post

Total Elapsed Time: 12 Hours

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Total changes made: 200 approx. changes
50 Guides applied
108 Guides remain unchanged

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This latest update was made possible thanks to the feedback from the following community members. Sincerest thank you to: B. Jacobson, bdonballer, Pontual, flygon727, szymond70, DarthyTMC


Patreon.com/Torte, heartfelt appreciation and mention goes to these generous monthly Patron campaign supporters. Sincerest thank you to:

Alfred Vogl, Cam Connor, Michael Carmody, szymond70, Loke Nielsen, Teruyo, Stepan Dyachovskiy, Chhatra Sule, Simon B, Dylan Lauritsen, Thane Brimhall, Mathew Buhler, Sean McMurray, James, Leonardo Lambertini, Sutas, Nicholas Chlumecky, Bartlomiej Jan Pasek, James Sarjeant, Jordan Parker, Sam Muriello, Kenneth Sologaistoa, Hamad AlZayani, DaChrisse, AE89l4, Firebat4321, Jeroen Koenders, Alan Meng, Jade Wardle, Dice, Vodka, Killataco, Andrew Krigline, Garbarise, Andrew Heckathorn, Demartan, Captain Marvelous, Christian Traeger, Katilyn McDougle, Benjamin Richter, dsrtfx_xx, Michael Kaeser, Lowe Schmidt, Tony Heugh, James Merrill, Guitaringegg, JimmaDaRustla, Daxdiv, Ryan Goss, Nate Hubbard, The WLD Crew, Matthew Nami, AD2L, tale, Matthew Freshwater, andy nelson, sh0shin, Oscar Swahn, Christopher Garcia, Korbinian, Kevin Janssens, D Kash Money, Swaroop Hegde, Anagh Kumar Baranwal, Jesse Ruth, Luke Mirman, Jose Cacho, Eric Barett, JJ Sigler, Mr Magnificent, Ian Lunderskov, Unfun, Douglas Hitchcock, Kistaro Windrider, Nick Mayo, Paul Martindale, Liam Metzeling, Stefan Chladek, George Azarias, Julian Koniger, Christopher Dickson, S J, Tyler Reid, Hursha, Aaron Bell, Cooper Johnson, Samuel Enocsson, slashershot, Igor Dolgiy, Josh Laseter, Gerald Callow, zyberspace, Kjetil Kultom, Steve, Genc Musliu, Joshua Rodman, Moe Foster

On November 14 2017 05:45 Logo wrote:
You may need to rethink the Phoenix skill build. 4 spirits, 2 dive @ 7 seems to be the dominant build in pro games and has a much better winrate in pubs now. I'm not exactly sure what changed, but I think it's in part a delayed consequence of 6.88 & 7.00 changing Sunray and a general change in how laning functions (I don't think you as universally have good setups to Sunray people for kills).

On November 14 2017 18:31 bdonballer wrote:
Been playing medusa a lot. Skilling ult at lvl 6 is almost always worth it surviving ganks and buying time for your team to teleport in. I always go 0-4-2-1 at lvl 7. This way you can stay in lane without dying. After lvl 7 is when I start taking split shot so as to not to push your lane too much into the offlaner. You don't really benefit from split shot before lvl 8 because you don't have the damage to farm neutrals.

I also think that the better talent at 15 is the extra mana steal talent. If you hit 3 heroes with this you are back at full mana (aka tank even more damage!). 35% mana steal is insane. Attack speed you are already building with the mass amount of agility items you are taking.

See this game to see how the build works out:
https://www.dotabuff.com/matches/3561234852

On November 15 2017 14:10 CosmicSpiral wrote:
Initial impressions:

Delaying the second point in Corrosive feels...dubious? If this guide is for all skill levels, then we should assume that many readers won't play safe enough to make a max Poison build pay off. Q-E with 1 point in W is currently the popular build at high levels due to its counterplay potential.

If you're going the magic build on Viper, pick one of Veil or Kaya. Don't get both. Either you'll miss the second timing on your power curve and become useless once BKB/Force/Glimmer comes out, or you'll struggle to re-position yourself in fights as everyone else becomes more mobile. The combination is also less reliable on Viper than on heroes like Zeus and Pugna since Viper can't get guaranteed damage off of casting his spells. Honestly I prefer Kaya -> Radiance -> SnY/Manta or Drums -> Radiance -> AC: they are both more stable and less all-in on trying to overwhelm with magic damage.

I'd also say that for the Pike/Maelstrom opener, the first two talents should be +20 AS and +100 attack range. I know the talent tree is supposed to be generalized over all circumstances, but the alternative options make a substantial difference for this build.

The magic and attacker builds are so different in purpose, each one probably deserves their own situational and extension categories.

The more and more I test it out, the more I become convinced a distinct Diffusal-oriented build exists.

Linken's is great on the hero now. It's not essential enough to be part of a standard build, but it ranks right behind Butterfly as the extension item you want to get.

Aghs may be situationally worthwhile with Octarine to round out the magic build.

Silver Edge is redundant now that Viper has his own source of break and he doesn't rely so heavily on kills to scale. Nullifier or Sheepstick are probably better replacements (you already have Bloodthorn listed).