In-Game Standard Hero Builds Project - Page 310

On May 26 2016 10:17 Belisarius wrote:

I strongly disagree.

Choosing a "build" commits them to 7k worth of items on what they see as a railroad path, with nothing more than the name to aid what is an incredibly nuanced decision. "Core - Lane" vs "Core - Aggressive" - what does that even mean? That is not clear to anyone.

In effect, this just means they will pick randomly. Because one of the options in the dual guide is usually niche, that means they will perform much worse on average than if you just gave them a single progression.

Situational items are much simpler because they are a single purchase with a clear use case that can be described. If they never buy a single one, they still follow a workable core->extension build. If they instead buy one inappropriately they are at least not stuck continuing down that path.

Saturating situationals is not a problem at all. In almost all cases, your dual guides are either overly redundant so there is little to add, like mek necro, or one build is unnecessary and all those items can simply be deleted, like rightclick bounty.

On May 26 2016 12:12 Birdie wrote:
I got suggestions

Assault Cuirass on BH is silly, then again the whole carry BH thing is silly so w/e, worst cancer in my pubs is rejoicing over a BH pick then seeing him with 800 HP and a desolator at 20 minutes.

Ember Spirit Lane absolutely should not have PMS as a starting item. Buy it at the sideshop. Start with stout shield/8 tangos and buy quelling at sideshop, or stout/tango/mango/salve/branches, or stout/RoP/tangos. You can't go out to lane as an ember with only 1 set of regen, and there's not enough value in the immediate PMS. Mid is completely different in this regard.

Bloodthorne on medusa is silly. Buy a MKB if you're against evasion. If you're against someone you can't lock down then get your team to do it; if they don't they it's outside of the guide's scope for a 1 in 1000 game item.

PMS on terrorblade is still core IMO. I would argue radiance is situational. Is MKB usually an extension item in guides generally? You want it only vs evasion so it's situational always IMO but I don't know for sure your policy on this. Octarine's pretty good too, even without radiance, although with radiance it's pretty fun.

On May 26 2016 17:26 Birdie wrote:

Who cares what BH has at lvl 19, he is not a carry hero in anything but as a gimmick. His standard build should be roaming or offlane, with mana boots, mek, greaves, with items like blink and force staff, played as 4 usually.

You got the Ember fixes round the wrong way. Mid wants PMS immediately (starting items). Lane does NOT want PMS immediately (starting items), he wants it early game (early game items).

Of all the carry heroes to get a bloodthorne on medusa makes almost the least sense IMO.

On May 26 2016 18:05 Birdie wrote:
It's inherently bad because the game changed significantly around BH, even if his stats and damage didn't change significantly. Kunkka carry is somewhat legit, necro support is somewhat legit, abba carry is somewhat legit. BH carry is like, on the level of rubick mid. Sure you can pull it off but it's so far off how the hero should optimally be played that it's not rly very good to be teaching people to play it like that.

On May 26 2016 22:46 Logo wrote:
Right click bounty may not have been nerfed, but supp bounty is buffed.

Even if your team stinks Greeves means you can purge dust and give yourself hp to escape getting caught out. This lets you be way more aggressive because the things that reliably catch you out are very diminished.

Shuriken, now that it bounces is going to deal way way more damage in a teamfight than right clicks even with right click items. Having the sustained mana to keep tossing them is way more important than right clicks. Especially if you don't max jinada early.

If your team deals no damage then items like Solar Crest or even Dagon (or veil even) will fix that a lot better than right click items because you can use them safely and live longer to keep throwing out tracks and shurikens. Plus the easiest way to solve a team's damage problem is getting them a bunch of track gold.