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I think that is a problem in itself. There's no real reason that jungle prophet should get orchid while the other gets mael. I don't even know how a "pusher" core is distinct from a "jungle" core anyway, given the entire guide is for jungle.
Whether or not we split prophet, I would prefer all builds have one clearcut set of post-laning items that work, rather than multiple builds that can be mixed up. This applies to a lot of heroes, like the current BH guide as well.
Earlygame tabs are different because it's clear when they're applicable. You buy mid starting items if you are mid, and safelane starting items if you are safelane. It's much less clear when you might want to buy the "pusher" midgame core or the "roamer" midgame core or whatever, and that leads to confusion and very terrible 1k builds.
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For lina, I don't really like mana boots and lens together as core since you are likely to disassemble boots for lens and after lens + euls you don't really need mana boots. Usually you just buy mana boots, then buy euls, then disassemble for lens. Mana boots are early-game and supporting boots, are are not crucial once you can afford lens + euls.
Also the starting items don't add up to enough gold nor do they make any mention of wards/courier which would fit this more supporting guide.
Furion itemization is ridiculous anyway since so many different things are viable on a game-by-game basis. From what i've seen, phase-drums-maelstrom seems to be a very common and solid build but obviously there are so many situations where you'd rather have orchid or aghs or w/e.
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Pretty sure the build is brown boots->Euls->mana boots->disassemble for aether lens and keep on brown until you get bots. (For lina).
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That's some late-ass mana boots for a lane support lina considering the team impact of mana boots on ur supports
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SoCal8933 Posts
agreed on the lina boots discussion, sn0.
how do we get ppl to see that they should disassemble the boots for aether tho?
how does this change for mid lina..arcanes -> disassemble into aether -> euls? or arcanes -> euls -> disassemble into aether?
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tbh mid linas I see often go for phase into euls (lens optional) although I really like the mana boots > euls > lens build even as core. Birdie's brown boots -> euls -> lens build is fine too.
Mid's primary variation comes with the larger items as shadowblade is much preferable to blink since it enhances your DPS and solo pickoff potential greatly and items like force and ghost sceptre are much less useful. Also Ocore is basically never the lina item (consider refresher as a 6th slot after hex).
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SoCal8933 Posts
I was playing around with some builds on her (mainly the mana boots, lens, and euls combo) yesterday so I was curious.
can confirm the octarine core thing, I didn't like how it felt when I built it.
I liked the lothar (was flamed for it, but w/e) because it allowed me to position myself better (and avoid some dmg) against heroes like spectre, OD, etc.
ill play around with it some more today bc I want my damn lina set
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Are you finally getting payed by valve torte?
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On March 17 2016 05:12 Sn0_Man wrote:
That's some late-ass mana boots for a lane support lina considering the team impact of mana boots on ur supports
ye except it's core lina we were talking about afaik
Mana boots do nothing for core lina, euls does everything.
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United States47024 Posts
On March 17 2016 14:55 Birdie wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2016 05:12 Sn0_Man wrote:
That's some late-ass mana boots for a lane support lina considering the team impact of mana boots on ur supports ye except it's core lina we were talking about afaik Mana boots do nothing for core lina, euls does everything.
"Lane" Lina is support. The core build is the current "Middle" build because nobody plays safe lane carry Lina, lol.
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On March 17 2016 16:05 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2016 14:55 Birdie wrote:On March 17 2016 05:12 Sn0_Man wrote:
That's some late-ass mana boots for a lane support lina considering the team impact of mana boots on ur supports ye except it's core lina we were talking about afaik Mana boots do nothing for core lina, euls does everything. "Lane" Lina is support. The core build is the current "Middle" build because nobody plays safe lane carry Lina, lol.
I don't think anyone mentioned lane lina other than torte's link to the 1mill on guide thing. Sn0 specifically mentioned core in the post I originally replied to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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United States47024 Posts
On March 17 2016 16:32 Birdie wrote:
Sn0 specifically mentioned core in the post I originally replied to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
For lina, I don't really like mana boots and lens together as core
See, I read this as him meaning "as core items" and not "as a core hero", given the context.
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Ye re-reading the post it's about support, RiP my reading comprehension
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On March 17 2016 16:39 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2016 16:32 Birdie wrote:
Sn0 specifically mentioned core in the post I originally replied to ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ See, I read this as him meaning "as core items" and not "as a core hero", given the context.
You mean you don't understand me when I say, "Core is core on a core ES"?
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On March 17 2016 07:17 Artisreal wrote:
Are you finally getting payed by valve torte?
not in the foreseeable future.
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I'll remove Oct. Core on Lina.
For all builds, I just assume the player won't be disassembling Arcane Boots because 1. They don't conserve mana very well, so the extra mana gain is appreciated
2. No one to distinguish it and not enough people are reading the item notes unfortunately (as far as I can tell).
I'll adjust Lina Lane to have Cour + Wards
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Lycan (Jungle)
Added Ring of Basilius to Early Game
Moved Iron Talon to Starting Items
Moved Stout Shield to Early Game
Removed Sobi Mask
Removed Quelling Blade
 Lina (Lane)
Added Courier to Starting Items
Added Observer Ward x2 to Starting Items
Added Refresher Orb to Luxury Items
Removed Octarine Core
Lina (Middle)
Added Refresher Orb to Luxury Items
Removed Octarine Core
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SoCal8933 Posts
On March 17 2016 16:05 TheYango wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2016 14:55 Birdie wrote:On March 17 2016 05:12 Sn0_Man wrote:
That's some late-ass mana boots for a lane support lina considering the team impact of mana boots on ur supports ye except it's core lina we were talking about afaik Mana boots do nothing for core lina, euls does everything. "Lane" Lina is support. The core build is the current "Middle" build because nobody plays safe lane carry Lina, lol.
this is why I dislike the current system and cant wait for torte to change it. as a new player that doesn't watch games featuring high lvl players, will you recognize this? or will you see someone have a good game on her, want to try her, pick a guide, and assume you should be taking farm from your actual cores?
my educated guess is the latter.
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United States47024 Posts
That is also why I felt the idea of labeling 4 position supports as "offlane" or "core" was terrible.
Because what do you think is actually going to happen when people see that?
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bfCnlBh.png)
