Would Iron Talon make sense post-Roshan?

I know he's proficient, but until you're fast enough to clear the whole jungle you should still get returns on Iron Talon.

Then again if you can skip QB all together it doesn't seem cost efficient.

Ultimately I'm not trying to push one way or the other though. I've tried looking on stat sites about Iron Talon + Ursa, but the stats are hard to parse since people will sell it before the game ends.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 28 2016 20:55 GMT

#5442

I hate you guys for breaking up those two stats posts.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 28 2016 20:58 GMT

#5443

1 million unique for

Shadow Shaman (Lane)

If interested in a timeline of 1 million hits and milestones, you can check it here: http://steamcommunity.com/id/0825771

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 28 2016 21:05 GMT

#5444

On January 28 2016 23:40 BluemoonSC wrote:
What's up with the jungle naix picking up an oov?

Also, I think that lane Ursa will not need an iron talon. I wanna say that they will never need one but I'm sure there's some obscure scenario out there where it's valuable. QB to cut down some trees is more than enough unless I'm missing something.

I will remove OOV on jungle Naix.

Was thinking of adding that Radiance build though.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 28 2016 21:08 GMT

#5445

Velzi

Finland659 Posts

January 28 2016 21:14 GMT

#5446

So i just played Spectre (since we discussed that hero) and went Iron Talon -> RoH -> Urn -> Phase -> Radi -> Manta -> Skadi -> Refresher -> AC, seemed to work pretty well.

I had huge debate between phase and treads with myself, decided to try phase this time but it didnt really feel like having impact i was hoping for. Also i maxed out R > Q > W > E, 4-1-1-1 into 4-4-1-1. Was decent i think, lane was kinda rough.

I didnt really jungle with the Iron Talon early on so dunno how much item actually achieved but it was good to push out the lane and taking occasional camps between creep waves.

Belisarius

Australia6233 Posts

January 29 2016 00:19 GMT

#5447

If you get phase that late you're wasting a lot of its effectiveness. One of the main reason to get phase is for its strength in lane; the extra damage gets a lot of lasthits and the active lets you harass through and around creeps very smoothly. If you pick it up after all those minor items you're not cashing in on that at all.

RE: ursa talon, I'm inclined to agree with bluemoon. Ursa also gets a lot less value from Talon than most other heroes because of the way fury swipes works. He likes hitting things with lots of HP lots of times. That missing 40% is only 1 or 2 hits by the time you get there, which is a lot less significant than on eg. spec.

Logo

United States7542 Posts

January 29 2016 01:25 GMT

#5448

On January 29 2016 09:19 Belisarius wrote:
RE: ursa talon, I'm inclined to agree with bluemoon. Ursa also gets a lot less value from Talon than most other heroes because of the way fury swipes works. He likes hitting things with lots of HP lots of times. That missing 40% is only 1 or 2 hits by the time you get there, which is a lot less significant than on eg. spec.

Makes a lot of sense to me (it did before when Bucky and Blue brought it up as well).

BluemoonSC

SoCal8910 Posts

January 29 2016 12:57 GMT

#5449

On January 29 2016 06:14 Velzi wrote:
So i just played Spectre (since we discussed that hero) and went Iron Talon -> RoH -> Urn -> Phase -> Radi -> Manta -> Skadi -> Refresher -> AC, seemed to work pretty well.

I had huge debate between phase and treads with myself, decided to try phase this time but it didnt really feel like having impact i was hoping for. Also i maxed out R > Q > W > E, 4-1-1-1 into 4-4-1-1. Was decent i think, lane was kinda rough.

I didnt really jungle with the Iron Talon early on so dunno how much item actually achieved but it was good to push out the lane and taking occasional camps between creep waves.

Yeah that's all its for, really. Clear the wave quickly with it, and jungle a camp with it.

On spec it makes sense bc the only time she will stop farming is post-level 6, haunting in for a kill.

Any reason you went talon before upgraded boots and the roh?

Velzi

Finland659 Posts

January 29 2016 14:08 GMT

#5450

I was against solo offlane sand king and my support decided to pull like a mad so i needed a way to get last hits and push out the lane without standing in the sandstorm for too long.

Same reason for the "early" RoH, needed the regen for the sandstorm spam. I did have random gold start so i had tango mango salve stout rop branch start. I had like 40 last hits or something @10min so the lane was really rough.

Sand king kinda left the lane at one point so i was able to use Iron Talon to get some jungle going for me. When he was in the lane he just pushed the lane at my tower with the sandstorm so couldnt jungle at that point. We did kill him twice in the first 6minutes so got some extra gold from there.

at any point before phase i didnt feel like needing the laning power but i kinda went for it because i always buy treads, just to try out.

TheYango

United States47024 Posts

January 29 2016 17:07 GMT

#5451

The actual thing to do in that situation is buy a sentry for yourself and punish him for Sandstorming in random places.

Also, there isn't really a reason to get RoH and Urn. They more or less supplant one another's purpose.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 29 2016 17:59 GMT

#5452

What do you guys think of Aether Lens on Lina? I personally hate it, but it;s in the guide and I've seen it bought 50/50

Sn0_Man

Tebellong44238 Posts

January 29 2016 18:02 GMT

#5453

lens is great on lina. Increases range of your euls catch, plus lets you stand even more at the back of fights and DPS (similar to old aghs increasing ult range, but all your abilities). Not that lina's other stuff is exactly range starved but aether lens extends that a lot.

It'd be a lot more situational if you didn't always have a euls so the catch is so much better with lens.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 29 2016 18:07 GMT

#5454

Damn, that's what I figured. still hate it.

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 29 2016 18:08 GMT

#5455

On January 29 2016 10:25 Logo wrote:

Show nested quote +

Makes a lot of sense to me (it did before when Bucky and Blue brought it up as well).

I will remove Iron Talon when I get in

tehh4ck3r

Magrathea7080 Posts

January 29 2016 19:29 GMT

#5456

Aether lens Lina basically undoes 2 patches of nerfs to her
It's pretty good

BluemoonSC

SoCal8910 Posts

January 29 2016 20:49 GMT

#5457

On January 30 2016 02:07 TheYango wrote:
The actual thing to do in that situation is buy a sentry for yourself and punish him for Sandstorming in random places.

Also, there isn't really a reason to get RoH and Urn. They more or less supplant one another's purpose.

yeah this is why i was sorta curious about it. i think if anything, you could get a bracer if you're looking for the extra toughness otherwise you have all this HP regen, but not a whole lot of HP or anything else. thats neither here nor there though.

RE: Lina aether - on support lina, 100% pick up. on core lina...maybe. i guess it can translate into some easy kills early on and it'll pay off like that but is it too much of a detour?

if you opened up mana boots and disassembled to make it once you had the cash it would be good i think. but idk. is it too much money thats not going towards that euls combo..and can you make it obvious enough in the guide that people will actually disassemble their stuff?

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 30 2016 20:45 GMT

#5458

Going to revert Drow's build to a more pub-ish build (Shadow Blade). I feel that the current build, there is too much strain and a lot of movement speed or escape. I understand that's her strongest flaw however:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=128743885

Torte de Lini

Germany38463 Posts

January 30 2016 21:06 GMT

#5459

Lifestealer
Moved Hand of Midas to Situational Items
Removed Orb of Venom

Ursa (Jungle)
Moved Morbid Mask to Core Items
Removed Iron Talon

Outworld Devourer
Moved Blink Dagger to Core Items
Moved Force Staff to Situational Items

Drow Ranger
Added Yasha to Core Items
Moved Shadow Blade to Core Items
Moved Manta Style to Extension Items

Mirana
Added Observer Ward to Starting Items
Removed Wraith Band
Removed Iron Branch

HackDice

United Kingdom3 Posts

January 31 2016 15:43 GMT

#5460

Aether lens is pretty good on Lina but I think an under appreciated item on her is Dragon Lance. Only 1 of the 2 components disassembles into a useful item for her but it buffs her already long range to absurd levels and gives you more room to right click enemies without being stunned or caught out of position.