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IMKR
United States378 Posts
and why? also did it come with it or did you choose to upgrade to that choice? Im using windows 7 on my laptop cuz that was the OS with it but i love windows 7. Im curious with this because if i build a pc, i want windows 7 but im afraid that it will die out soon. but i hate the way windows 8 is. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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IMKR
United States378 Posts
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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IMKR
United States378 Posts
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
I like Windows 7, but I hear Win 8 makes games run better or faster, is it significant enough? | ||
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Evire
Norway198 Posts
On October 14 2013 16:42 skyR wrote: Windows 8 because it was like $10. Better than Windows 7 but Windows is still shit. $10 really? Where? I'm still using windows 7 because of better driver support for my CPU cooler, but I'm looking to get win8.1 in the future | ||
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IMKR
United States378 Posts
and like with windows xp and vista it died out, (since windows 7 is already a better version i can see why) and im wondering if future software will require windows 8 and above (assuming next OS in windows comes out and i hate that one too) EDIT: oh wow haha, i read that windows 8 for $10 as in he got it for $10 less. well dam, if i can find windows 8 for $10 ill definitly go for that over windows 7 lol | ||
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IMKR
United States378 Posts
is there any clean new ones thats used for installing the OS onto a pc that has no OS installed at it all? (or can i just use these anyways) from my understanding, one that has "upgrade" in it is for when you already have a OS and you want to override it with a new one. and OEM is for people that builds the PC and plan on selling it. (correct)? like PC companies or an individual looking to sell the pc they made after installing OS. | ||
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Mysticesper
United States1183 Posts
For 99% of the people out there, that isn't much of a reason to "need" windows 8.1 over what you have now. It's purely cosmetic & some performance upgrades. I suppose another reason is for metro applications. XP is problematic due to new drivers & SATA support on install (though I assume custom installers fix that), but again, that is over 10 years old. You should be fine with win7 for another 5-10 years. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
OEM are for builders and and upgrade is essentially the same thing. I hope you realize that Windows 8 comes on all PCs because it's the latest... it doesn't mean that previous Windows support got dropped. Very few software is going to require a certain operating system. DX11.2 is exclusive to Windows 8.1 if that means anything to you... Windows 8 also has native USB 3.0 support whereas 7 does not. | ||
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Rollin
Australia1552 Posts
On October 14 2013 16:58 Torte de Lini wrote: How do I get Windows 8 for 10$? I like Windows 7, but I hear Win 8 makes games run better or faster, is it significant enough? That's not possible. Regardless, my friend has windows 8 and has trouble running most games not released in the last year, it's so bad that I had to install a winxp virtual machine for some of his older games that run on win 7 fine :/ | ||
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Czarnodziej
Poland624 Posts
On October 14 2013 17:11 skyR wrote: Windows 8 also has native USB 3.0 support whereas 7 does not. Sadly these windows drivers are pretty bad, so I strongly recommend to install the drivers from your mainboard/usb controller manufacturer. | ||
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Czarnodziej
Poland624 Posts
On October 14 2013 18:20 Rollin wrote: That's not possible. Regardless, my friend has windows 8 and has trouble running most games not released in the last year, it's so bad that I had to install a winxp virtual machine for some of his older games that run on win 7 fine :/ Either these games are pretty obscure or your friend is not tech savvy enough to figure it out. I never had problems with software in Win8. | ||
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WonnaPlay
Netherlands912 Posts
Windows 8 is NOT an improvement on Windows 7, except that it significantly works better with tablets and touch-screen interactable systems. In most Business environments Windows 7 is still the main OS, and the next phase of migrations will come with the new windows after that. IMO Windows 8 is just an expansion on Windows 7 with more support for tablets. I'm actually amazed that a blue poster prefers Windows 8 over Windows 7 :o  Edit : Yes the start up might be a little faster on Windows 8, but the compatibility with applications is significantly worse | ||
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Scorch
Austria3371 Posts
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Targe
United Kingdom14103 Posts
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
i still use 7 cause 8 is crap (good for tablets, but my eyes kill me atfer 10 minutes on pc with it) and to the usb 3.0 support ... a driver of 50kb isnt that hard to install xDDDDD | ||
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Crypdos
Netherlands110 Posts
You really don't want Windows 8... trust me. | ||
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Sverigevader
Sweden388 Posts
If you spend all of your time upgrading your software, instead of using it, you won't get any work done. I learned that the hard way Windows 7 will not die out any time soon. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
Windows 8 File History saved my butt a few times. That's hourly backups for files. You can browse all old versions of the files (though the UI for that is pretty crappy). I could revert stupid mistakes I made, overwriting files etc. It was definitely worth it to choose 8 over 7 because of the time I saved from that feature. The boot times are not really faster with 8. You can start something like a web-browser pretty early after boot, but everything you've scheduled to run at start up will still be doing stuff at that point and might get in the way. I don't really like anything about Windows 7 or 8. Both work alright, but there's nothing about either that I would say is great, and there are things that are annoying and features that are missing. Both are "meh" to me. Spending the full price to switch from one to the other is surely stupid. | ||
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WonnaPlay
Netherlands912 Posts
On October 14 2013 23:15 Ropid wrote: Windows 8 File History saved my butt a few times. That's hourly backups for files. You can browse all old versions of the files (though the UI for that is pretty crappy). I could revert stupid mistakes I made, overwriting files etc. It was definitely worth it to choose 8 over 7 because of the time I saved from that feature. That is not a function that is new to Windows 8. Windows 7 already has this. I think the automatic backup is once a day or something, but you can adjust those settings to w/e you want. | ||
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Nich
397 Posts
and i know people doesn't like the metro screen, but most of the time you are not looking at that screen, just treat it as a full screen start button, if you don't have your windows 7 start menu on screen half of the time, you probably won't see the metro screen as much as people suggest. i have to admit that windows 8 is not as user friendly as Microsoft think it is, but if u are experience with windows and knows some shortcuts(win+d & win-e), you should not have problem operating a windows 8 machine. if u feel comfortable with 7 just get 7, if you are unable to get 7 and hesitating the get 8, it is not as bad as people are portraying it | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On October 14 2013 23:21 WonnaPlay wrote: That is not a function that is new to Windows 8. Windows 7 already has this. I think the automatic backup is once a day or something, but you can adjust those settings to w/e you want. Nope, it's something new. Windows 8 has Windows 7 system images, Windows 7 backups of files, and that new File History stuff. It searches through the libraries you have defined in the File Explorer and saves changes. It does this hourly. It works alright even if let loose on dozens of gigabytes of files (I only tried this on an SSD). | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
On October 14 2013 18:20 Rollin wrote: That's not possible. Regardless, my friend has windows 8 and has trouble running most games not released in the last year, it's so bad that I had to install a winxp virtual machine for some of his older games that run on win 7 fine :/ It's possible he means current games, windows 8 uses a different WDDM and DXGI which can effect performance on the rendering end as well as cpu bound areas, while also windows 8 handles threaded tasks better as well. On October 14 2013 22:31 Drake wrote: in the start of windows 8 no one wanted to buy it, so they rly sold it for 10€ ^^ now its like 80 like everything else so you missed your time i still use 7 cause 8 is crap (good for tablets, but my eyes kill me atfer 10 minutes on pc with it) and to the usb 3.0 support ... a driver of 50kb isnt that hard to install xDDDDD They sold it for 15USD i guess it was 10€ then but they sold it for that price for those who bought windows 7 like 1 year before windows 8. But in reality all you had to do was lie a bit and say you bought a new computer with windows 7 in the last year to get the discount. | ||
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Mackem
United Kingdom470 Posts
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Eisregen
Germany967 Posts
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rawb
United States252 Posts
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On October 15 2013 00:47 rawb wrote: I use windows 8. Don't have any problems with it. Probably going to get 8.1 if they keep a low-cost, yearly update cycle. It's a free update. It won't be automatic through Windows Update so it's not quite a service pack. It will supposedly be available in the app store or something. | ||
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JustPassingBy
10776 Posts
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omisa
United States494 Posts
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semantics
10040 Posts
On October 15 2013 00:47 rawb wrote: I use windows 8. Don't have any problems with it. Probably going to get 8.1 if they keep a low-cost, yearly update cycle. Windows 8.1 is free to those with windows 8 already... | ||
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rawb
United States252 Posts
 Hopefully further incremental versions are free or similarly priced to Mac OS. | ||
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d00p
711 Posts
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
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peidongyang
Canada2084 Posts
=D | ||
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MidnightZL
Sweden203 Posts
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IMKR
United States378 Posts
On October 14 2013 17:11 skyR wrote: OEM are for builders and and upgrade is essentially the same thing. Does this mean that if I am buying a new copy of an OS for a new pc I just buy the OEM version? Is that the regular one? | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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BillGates
471 Posts
So all the programs that are fixing win8 and brining back win7 functionality are at the same time destroying the small, tiny performance than win8 had in very few applications. As of now there is no reason to choose win8 over win7, win7 is more reliable, actually faster over win8 with the 3rd party stuff installed and has more functions and is easier to use. | ||
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Blisse
Canada3710 Posts
Absolutely nothing lost moving up to 8 from 7. Most annoying part is honestly just turning off my computer. Need to log out before turning off which is stupid, but doesn't really affect me. Otherwise, everything's basically faster, start menu isn't necessary, guy above me doesn't know what he's talking about, and development for 8.1 systems was pretty broken (as of 2-3 weeks ago) because MS rushed out a lot of stuff. Can't find a reason to switch back to 7. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
Everyone saying Windows 8 is terrible are just bad and inefficient so they need a start menu. | ||
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Gnosis
Scotland912 Posts
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Blisse
Canada3710 Posts
On October 15 2013 09:27 skyR wrote: You don't need to log out before shutting down.. windows c > settings > power > shutdown, a lot of clicks but meh. Everyone saying Windows 8 is terrible are just bad and inefficient so they need a start menu. I know how to do it with WIN+I through the Settings bar, I'm saying the standard way for people who haven't Google'd WIN+I or the Charms bar is WINKEY, click on Username, Log Out, click on Power Button, Shut Down. They have people drilled into one way of Shutting Down with all their previous releases and totally screwed up on slowly moving people to their new way. And logging out first is where people have ended up. | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20323 Posts
Everyone saying Windows 8 is terrible are just bad and inefficient so they need a start menu. To be fair you're listing four actions for something that can be done in previous versions of windows with a snap mouse to bottom left and two clicks I don't mind win8, just hesitant to use a new OS for no reason. It's disturbing how much better Battlefield 4 runs on it though, they really need to get their shit sorted out before launch. 20-50% increases in FPS and much more consistent performance instead of constantly dipping below 60fps on the best cpu's (due to better utilization of available cpu) from dual boxing a different OS is disgusting | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20323 Posts
Maybe i'll give it a shot if it allows for better screen cap performance of dx9 games for streaming, because it's terrible on w7, but i've not actually seen any numbers showing it supposedly being better, just rumor | ||
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QuackPocketDuck
410 Posts
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Leeto
United States1320 Posts
I run w7 on my desktop and I prefer it over w8, but it's really not that big of a deal. | ||
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BillGates
471 Posts
On October 15 2013 09:23 Blisse wrote: ~1 year personally with 8 + a good amount of 8.1 as a developer. Absolutely nothing lost moving up to 8 from 7. Most annoying part is honestly just turning off my computer. Need to log out before turning off which is stupid, but doesn't really affect me. Otherwise, everything's basically faster, start menu isn't necessary, guy above me doesn't know what he's talking about, and development for 8.1 systems was pretty broken (as of 2-3 weeks ago) because MS rushed out a lot of stuff. Can't find a reason to switch back to 7. I'm Bill Gates, I think I know a thing or two about win operating systems. Win7 is the better OS, the 1% performance increase that you get in some applications in win8 is instantly removed once you install 3rd party applications bringing back the start menu and other core features that win8 just doesn't have. Its not worth to upgrade, win7 is more stable, more reliable and actually faster overall since you don't need bloat-ware just to have the same functions that win7 has naturally. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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hacklebeast
United States5090 Posts
I am having a problem with win 8 right now where I am unable to register it, so every time I turn on my comp it installs updates, uninstalls updates, then says "please wait" for an hour.If you count that then win 7 starts up ~58 min faster, but that's kind of an extreme case. | ||
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wptlzkwjd
Canada1240 Posts
Windows 8.1 Beta is pretty much the same as Windows 8 except you can customize the start screen to show your wallpaper instead of the solid color. There's also a rainbow fish during the start-up instead of the new Windows logo lol. That's pretty much all I noticed so far. Oh and I guess the start button is back but I actually found that annoying and removed it xD. Looks much cleaner to me without the start button (Yeah I'm crazy) and I actually liked that they removed it in 8. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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Cyro
United Kingdom20323 Posts
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Fragile51
Netherlands15767 Posts
1: Native multimonitor support: Not having a taskbar on my 2nd monitor is pretty annoying now that i've gotten used to having it. 2: Task manager for w7 is so...so much worse than the one in w8. 3: Fulscreen start menu makes so much more sense than that awkward little thing in the lower left of the screen that only serves as an oversized search dialog. 4: Win+X shortcut is a really useful one for me as a developer. 5: More efficient memory usage across the board. I also much prefer the aesthetic of w8 but that's not really a dealbreaker so i won't hold that against 7. Conclusion: w7/w8? w8 100% of the time. The biggest issue i have with w8 is the fact that booting up in safe mode has become way harder for some inexplicable reason, so whenever you have to troubleshoot something you have to take a couple more steps before you can do so. Very annoying, but not enough to make me stick with 7. It was a damn good OS, but w8 is pretty much an upgrade in every meaningful way to me. | ||
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iPlaY.NettleS
Australia4383 Posts
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Rollin
Australia1552 Posts
On October 15 2013 17:06 Fragile51 wrote: I use w8 on my home PC and w7 on my work PC. So far i'm missing 5 things at work: 1: Native multimonitor support: Not having a taskbar on my 2nd monitor is pretty annoying now that i've gotten used to having it. 2: Task manager for w7 is so...so much worse than the one in w8. 3: Fulscreen start menu makes so much more sense than that awkward little thing in the lower left of the screen that only serves as an oversized search dialog. 4: Win+X shortcut is a really useful one for me as a developer. 5: More efficient memory usage across the board. I also much prefer the aesthetic of w8 but that's not really a dealbreaker so i won't hold that against 7. Conclusion: w7/w8? w8 100% of the time. The biggest issue i have with w8 is the fact that booting up in safe mode has become way harder for some inexplicable reason, so whenever you have to troubleshoot something you have to take a couple more steps before you can do so. Very annoying, but not enough to make me stick with 7. It was a damn good OS, but w8 is pretty much an upgrade in every meaningful way to me. 2. Windows 7 and 8 both have poor task managers, personally I find process hacker much better in every way. The only reasonable difference imo is that startup programs have been moved from msconfig to task manager, but you have to go to msconfig to edit startup services (wtf inconsistency?). 3. Not for me, it's horrendous and nowhere near as efficient for me, not to mention i usually am concentrating on something else when i bring up the start menu and just type in what i want to do. Forcing me to completely break from my flow when I want to do something I don't have to look at is retarded. | ||
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WonnaPlay
Netherlands912 Posts
On October 15 2013 15:44 skyR wrote: Not crazy, the start button was a giant waste of space. IMO the cover screen is a waste of time, for anything not a tablet. I'm quite familiar with the Windows structure, yet whenever I'm trying to find something in Windows 8, I usually end up starting most my applications using CMD. The start button was a great way to quickly search for programs, no matter if they were in the start menu or not. Basically I use Windows 8 more like it was DOS instead of making progress with the OS. | ||
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nam nam
Sweden4672 Posts
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NeThZOR
South Africa7387 Posts
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MrCon
France29748 Posts
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mantequilla
Turkey781 Posts
Windows 8 itches my fingers when I use it though. Don't like the new start menu and such. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
Using Windows 7 because i really don't like the new interface. Also microsoft account to dl stuff like skype is bullshit. You can install it without it but... it's a pain in the ass. I want to do what i want on my computer. W8 is far too restrictive for me. I had WinXP until w8 get announced. Then i switched to windows 7. I'll wait for Windows 10 to be announce to install W9 | ||
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SixStrings
Germany2046 Posts
On October 15 2013 15:13 skyR wrote: You clearly don't since Windows is fucking terrible -.- Didn't peg ya for a Mac user. | ||
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Caladan
Germany1238 Posts
Win 8 is like the equivalent to Windows Vista. Microsoft even admitted it that Win 8 is very bad, hence that's why they made Win 8.1. Windows 7 has every hardware support (64 Bit, DirectX 11, SSD support, 64GB RAM support, etc.) you will need in the next couple of years, is very stable and it's GUI is much better. Really no one needs the new Win 8 GUI, unless you have a touch screen device, in which case you probably will get a mobile OS/Android. Guess why Win 8 is so cheap. Tl;Dr: Use Windows 7. No reason for 8. I'm a tech guy. | ||
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
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SixStrings
Germany2046 Posts
Is it allowed to discuss hackingtoshs here? | ||
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Mindcrime
United States6899 Posts
On October 15 2013 18:01 WonnaPlay wrote: IMO the cover screen is a waste of time, for anything not a tablet. I'm quite familiar with the Windows structure, yet whenever I'm trying to find something in Windows 8, I usually end up starting most my applications using CMD. The start button was a great way to quickly search for programs, no matter if they were in the start menu or not. Basically I use Windows 8 more like it was DOS instead of making progress with the OS. You don't need to click the start button to bring up the menu, and Windows 8 still has search. | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
On October 16 2013 00:32 Ben... wrote: Maybe Linux? Either or. He's definitely right though. Windows is not a good operating system at all. Once you use a UNIX-based OS for a while you can't go back to Windows. After using Mac OS for nearly 4 years and Linux for 7 I find Windows absolutely insufferable to use. I'm at the point where I only use Windows for games and avoid it for absolutely everything else unless I have to use it. I'd much rather use Mac OS or Linux for doing actual work. They're both way faster than Windows and not nearly as much work to maintain. It's hard to see how poorly designed Windows is until you have used something else for a decent length of time, but once you do, you will find Windows turns into more of an exercise in frustration than anything else. The main reason why windows is so insufferable is because of business and their love for legacy support. | ||
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RebirthOfLeGenD
USA5860 Posts
On October 15 2013 09:27 skyR wrote: You don't need to log out before shutting down.. windows c > settings > power > shutdown, a lot of clicks but meh. Everyone saying Windows 8 is terrible are just bad and inefficient so they need a start menu. ALT + F4 seems the fastest to me. | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
If you just want to shut down, tap the power button. | ||
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Natolumin
France72 Posts
But yeah, even though I almost only use the desktop when I'm at home, I'm not doing any kind of productive work on windows. I actually have to use my mouse way too often (whereas when you have a correctly configured WM, you can do almost anything you need with only a keyboard. That's my main problem with windows, not the OS especially, but rather that it requires me to leave the keyboard and grab the mouse to do virtually anything. Plus it doesn't have virtual desktops without installing awkward addons which don't work half the time. As for windows 8, I don't own a tablet thank you (I mean, fullscreen menu ? really ?) | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_keyboard_shortcuts | ||
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zhurai
United States5660 Posts
not interested at all in Windows 8 | ||
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Wiggins8
Germany107 Posts
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Czarnodziej
Poland624 Posts
All the hate stemming from its OPTIONAL component, which is touch-optimized interface. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 16 2013 18:07 Czarnodziej wrote: Amount of opinions brimming with technological idiocy regarding Windows 8 in this thread is staggering. All the hate stemming from its OPTIONAL component, which is touch-optimized interface. A lot of people don't know how to skip the OPTIONAL components that are in it in the DEFAULT configuration. For example my GF is new to the PC universe and she prefers W7 on my PC than the W8 on her computer and asked me if i could put W7 on her computer. She asked me how i could do this or that on my computer and she couldn't. She has no experience in computers and just find W8 hard to use. She can't find her programs, (the skype things really made her angry because she couldn't find what she just installed) etc... On October 16 2013 04:20 Wiggins8 wrote: Win7 obviously, its the only viable OS for Gamers. I like that if i contract your name it goes => W8 :p | ||
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Iksf
United Kingdom444 Posts
Tried Windows 8.1 alpha leak a few months ago, didnt like a lot of the changes from windows 8 and was buggier (duh). Never got around to trying the RTM. Would prefer to use Linux in an ideal world but I got bored of trying to force various games to work with poor performance. Love Valves new moves into the Linux area but until theres sc2 for Linux or processors that can handle sc2 with ease even through wine are well priced il probably be using Windows 8. | ||
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Natolumin
France72 Posts
On October 16 2013 03:35 semantics wrote: Learn shortcuts they too exist in windows. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Table_of_keyboard_shortcuts Not customizable. That's still better than no shortcuts obviously, but I don't really want to have to learn two different sets of them :/ On October 16 2013 18:10 FFW_Rude wrote: A lot of people don't know how to skip the OPTIONAL components that are in it in the DEFAULT configuration. For example my GF is new to the PC universe and she prefers W7 on my PC than the W8 on her computer and asked me if i could put W7 on her computer. She asked me how i could do this or that on my computer and she couldn't. You can actually remove the metro menu (or at least make it not fullscreen) ? Well I certainly didn't know that (but, again, I don't have windows 8, and putting it in the default configuration is still pretty annoying IMO) I mean, I'm sure the metro menu is an improvement on many points, I just really hate that it takes up all of the screen Does anyone with multiple monitors know how it behaves with your scondary+ monitors by the way ? | ||
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Zykor
United States58 Posts
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
On October 17 2013 02:58 Natolumin wrote:You can actually remove the metro menu (or at least make it not fullscreen) ? Well I certainly didn't know that (but, again, I don't have windows 8, and putting it in the default configuration is still pretty annoying IMO) I mean, I'm sure the metro menu is an improvement on many points, I just really hate that it takes up all of the screen Does anyone with multiple monitors know how it behaves with your scondary+ monitors by the way ? Start screen pops up on whatever monitor you have your mouse on. And yes, there is software to change the height of the startscreen, you can see a picture of my setup in my profile. | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
On October 17 2013 03:24 skyR wrote: Start screen pops up on whatever monitor you have your mouse on. And yes, there is software to change the height of the startscreen, you can see a picture of my setup in my profile. Personally i don't think it matters i just type in what and click i want vs pinning or using start menu. Probably not the best for everyone but good enough for what i do. | ||
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scott31337
United States2979 Posts
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Tobberoth
Sweden6375 Posts
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Lwerewolf
Bulgaria78 Posts
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BillGates
471 Posts
On October 15 2013 15:44 skyR wrote: Not crazy, the start button was a giant waste of space. Yeah, because having a tiny 40x40 pixels icon in the low left bottom of the screen is such a HUGE, HUGE waste of space, and the important features it gives you like accessing all your most used applications, your default browser, maybe few lesses used programs but that are key to you and so you have them pinned on the start menu screen, of course the ability to see all programs arranged by alphabet in a tiled way, the control panel, documents, devices, etc... shortcuts that are customizable and removable if you don't want them there, your windows profile and settings, the easy shutdown button, etc... all easily accessible by pressing a 40x40 pixels icon that gives you so much control, so much flexibility, such ease of use is terrible. I mean why make it easy and simple for yourself, when you can make it hard and complex? | ||
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Gnosis
Scotland912 Posts
On October 17 2013 08:10 BillGates wrote: Yeah, because having a tiny 40x40 pixels icon in the low left bottom of the screen is such a HUGE, HUGE waste of space, and the important features it gives you like accessing all your most used applications, your default browser, maybe few lesses used programs but that are key to you and so you have them pinned on the start menu screen, of course the ability to see all programs arranged by alphabet in a tiled way, the control panel, documents, devices, etc... shortcuts that are customizable and removable if you don't want them there, your windows profile and settings, the easy shutdown button, etc... all easily accessible by pressing a 40x40 pixels icon that gives you so much control, so much flexibility, such ease of use is terrible. I mean why make it easy and simple for yourself, when you can make it hard and complex? How is any of this an issue in Win8? | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On October 17 2013 08:10 BillGates wrote: I mean why make it easy and simple for yourself, when you can make it hard and complex? There's still an invisible start button in the lower left corner of the screen on normal Windows 8. This makes the 8.1 button a waste. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 17 2013 19:33 Ropid wrote: There's still an invisible start button in the lower left corner of the screen on normal Windows 8. This makes the 8.1 button a waste. Wut ? Where ? Can't find it. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
There's also the top left corner of the screen which jumps between the last two apps you have visited. The desktop counts as an app, so you can swap between an app and the desktop with that. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 17 2013 21:39 Ropid wrote: Just click in the lower left corner of your screen. The target is about 5x5 pixel large. There's also the top left corner of the screen which jumps between the last two apps you have visited. The desktop counts as an app, so you can swap between an app and the desktop with that. Well i Windows+D for desktop But it's cool. I don't use W8 myself but my GF computer has it and it's a nice find. Thank you | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
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iloveav
Poland1480 Posts
Id rather someone else give the reasons, and that way I only agree with them. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 17 2013 23:22 Ropid wrote: No, I meant you can swap between two of the new fullscreen apps with that top left corner. The whole normal desktop with normal program windows open counts as one "app" for that. Oh ok thx | ||
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WellCrap
Sweden122 Posts
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BillGates
471 Posts
Because it doesn't have it? | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
It does have a start button. It's in the lower left corner of the screen. It's popping up if you move the mouse pointer into that corner there. | ||
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wptlzkwjd
Canada1240 Posts
It does have it. When Windows 8 starts up for the first time, it explains everything pretty well and quickly because there aren't many changes. It's a waste of space in that, you can have an entire desktop with just your wallpaper and some notifications on the left without the oddity of the Windows button on the bottom left. The whole argument is moot because it's now Windows 8.1 and that does have a start button (which I'm eagerly awaiting for the update to remove it again). The new start menu gives you everything you had before except it takes up the entire screen. Honestly, in terms of practicality it doesn't matter because you're going to be searching for something anyways. You can always type in whatever program you want to run without having to search for it. The shutdown button...again it explains it very clearly the first time you boot up Windows 8 on where that is. Motioning your mouse to the top or bottom right gives you more options where you can access your personalization of Windows as well as change power settings, keyboard layout, etc etc. Don't judge it before you've fully tried the experience. I'm probably biased though because I loved the new changes the first time I saw Windows 8 because I love having a very clean and tidy desktop and magically (the lack of a Windows button) being able to make all my programs appear full screen was almost like a rich Bruce Wayne/Batman fantasy (albeit a more colorful one). | ||
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doktorLucifer
United States855 Posts
There are few cosmetic and ui changes, but ultimately, it's mostly the same as win7/xp to me. I haven't had stability or speed issues, so there's that... I think the start menu and more metro options (disable?) will be available in 8.1, which I believe is coming out soon... Ideally, I'd just use a windows VM in linux to game, but there isn't good hardware support for that, and VGA-passthrough methods are iffy for specific cards. I'm also not sure how easy/hard VGA-passthrough is to setup for a VM... | ||
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Natolumin
France72 Posts
On October 18 2013 17:08 wptlzkwjd wrote: Don't judge it before you've fully tried the experience. I'm probably biased though because I loved the new changes the first time I saw Windows 8 because I love having a very clean and tidy desktop and magically (the lack of a Windows button) being able to make all my programs appear full screen was almost like a rich Bruce Wayne/Batman fantasy (albeit a more colorful one). You could always autohide the taskbar... that's not ideal, but your programs will still take up all the screen when you maximize them. Honestly, in terms of practicality it doesn't matter because you're going to be searching for something anyways. You can always type in whatever program you want to run without having to search for it. I do that with dmenu on linux (or a non-obtrusive gmrun-like thing for full commands). I can type while looking at the screen and not at the keyboard. I can still look at something else while launching a program. I can run any script, be it upgrading some software, altering configuration, download software, taking notes in a plaintext file, without missing a second of my fullscreen film. I can't do that with an obtrusive fullscreen menu. The start menu was not great, but for that matter it was a bit better. And you could still just hit the Win key, then type in whatever you want to search or run, and it didn't take up one full screen in the default setup. | ||
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ZerglingAteMyFace
Iceland2 Posts
i would rather loose an eye then going to windows 8, i just hate every change they made after 7. | ||
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yhzh
United States7 Posts
Sure the w8 start screen and W8 'apps' are incredibly pointless for a mouse+kb setup, but you never have to use them and they do make sense in a touch environment. It takes maybe 5 days to get used to it if you put any effort into it. I think most people are just pissed that things have changed. Most of the ui changes and various design decisions are pointless for most people, but I don't think they've made W8 objectively worse in the end. The most significant ui change is probably the new PC settings app where some relatively important options are placed/replicated/hidden. It's pretty much the only place where you have to deal with a full screen metro app, and even then only occasionally. On October 18 2013 19:15 Natolumin wrote: I do that with dmenu on linux (or a non-obtrusive gmrun-like thing for full commands). I can type while looking at the screen and not at the keyboard. I can still look at something else while launching a program. I can run any script, be it upgrading some software, altering configuration, download software, taking notes in a plaintext file, without missing a second of my fullscreen film. I can't do that with an obtrusive fullscreen menu. The start menu was not great, but for that matter it was a bit better. And you could still just hit the Win key, then type in whatever you want to search or run, and it didn't take up one full screen in the default setup. In 8.1, the search function has been brought back up to par. You don't need to know if you need to do a app,settings, or file search anymore, which was probably the dumbest thing about windows 8. The search sidebar only covers up about a fifth of the screen if you search with one of the dedicated search shortcuts (win + (q,w,f,s)) or the charms bar. Once you know some of the new keyboard shortcuts, some things are a bit faster/more convenient than before. I only ever used the start menu to search for stuff, and I never really felt that covering the screen for a couple of seconds when my focus would have been on the search anyways was truly detrimental in any way. | ||
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Mathewep2010
United States63 Posts
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dani`
Netherlands2402 Posts
With the new option to boot straight to desktop you don't even need to actively ignore it, you just never see it again and forget it existed in the first place. I did use Start8 to bring back the old start menu (and skip the new start menu on boot, a feature introduced natively with 8.1 as well) since I hardly use the start menu to begin with so I don't see the need for a full screen version with fancy tiles -- though looking at it now it seems the new Start works perfectly fine as well for just searching some stuff every now and then. I use Launcy to launch my applications and do other stuff (logging out / shutting down etc) so while I agree they made e.g. shutting down tedious (it needed many actions) it never affected me personally anyway. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 21 2013 21:38 dani` wrote: Most people who shit on Windows 8 but love Windows 7 are pretty ignorant. They are extremely alike, it's just that Windows 8 introduced the new Start Menu which catches everybody's attention. Apart from that it's basically the same or faster / better. So if you just completely ignore the new Start Menu you'll end up with Windows 7 but better, which is what I'm doing. With the new option to boot straight to desktop you don't even need to actively ignore it, you just never see it again and forget it existed in the first place. I did use Start8 to bring back the old start menu (and skip the new start menu on boot, a feature introduced natively with 8.1 as well) since I hardly use the start menu to begin with so I don't see the need for a full screen version with fancy tiles -- though looking at it now it seems the new Start works perfectly fine as well for just searching some stuff every now and then. I use Launcy to launch my applications and do other stuff (logging out / shutting down etc) so while I agree they made e.g. shutting down tedious (it needed many actions) it never affected me personally anyway. Well i have windows 8 and windows 7 and i fail to see how am i ignorant.. Softwares that need a windows account are bullshit because downloading programms is a pain in the ass. Every time i open an office file it goes full screen and it mask the bar so i can't switch between programs easily. the window update thing that takes quite a lot of ressources. 20updates per week with restart of the computer without being asked. Or even better : "your computer will restart in 2hours" and you can't do squat about it. That's not happening in W7. They are little small thing in W8 that are annoying. Just small little things. That's why i like W7 a lot more than W8. Also updates on restart takes like FOREVER to load on a good computer (ASus rog G70) For a casual user that don't know a lot about computer here's what i hear => - Option to boot straight to desktop does not exist. - Using start menu is mandatory - It's annoying to have to shut down the computer by pressing the button... i can't shutdown when i am into windows... - Where the hell are my applications ? I installed a bunch of things and i can't find them anymore So.. I think you have a faire point but the first sentence : people are ignorant... You modify the way W8 works by default, You use programs to do action that W8 can do (ie shutdown when you know how to find it). So you don't use the settings that a new user can have. Also a lot of people think that they need to use the metro interface now which piss them off. W8 is a pain in the ass because everytime a new friend/family person have it. I have tons of phone calls about how you do this or that | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
On October 21 2013 21:57 FFW_Rude wrote:+ Show Spoiler + On October 21 2013 21:38 dani` wrote: Most people who shit on Windows 8 but love Windows 7 are pretty ignorant. They are extremely alike, it's just that Windows 8 introduced the new Start Menu which catches everybody's attention. Apart from that it's basically the same or faster / better. So if you just completely ignore the new Start Menu you'll end up with Windows 7 but better, which is what I'm doing. With the new option to boot straight to desktop you don't even need to actively ignore it, you just never see it again and forget it existed in the first place. I did use Start8 to bring back the old start menu (and skip the new start menu on boot, a feature introduced natively with 8.1 as well) since I hardly use the start menu to begin with so I don't see the need for a full screen version with fancy tiles -- though looking at it now it seems the new Start works perfectly fine as well for just searching some stuff every now and then. I use Launcy to launch my applications and do other stuff (logging out / shutting down etc) so while I agree they made e.g. shutting down tedious (it needed many actions) it never affected me personally anyway. Well i have windows 8 and windows 7 and i fail to see how am i ignorant.. Softwares that need a windows account are bullshit because downloading programms is a pain in the ass. Every time i open an office file it goes full screen and it mask the bar so i can't switch between programs easily. the window update thing that takes quite a lot of ressources. 20updates per week with restart of the computer without being asked. Or even better : "your computer will restart in 2hours" and you can't do squat about it. That's not happening in W7. They are little small thing in W8 that are annoying. Just small little things. That's why i like W7 a lot more than W8. Also updates on restart takes like FOREVER to load on a good computer (ASus rog G70) For a casual user that don't know a lot about computer here's what i hear => - Option to boot straight to desktop does not exist. - Using start menu is mandatory - It's annoying to have to shut down the computer by pressing the button... i can't shutdown when i am into windows... - Where the hell are my applications ? I installed a bunch of things and i can't find them anymore So.. I think you have a faire point but the first sentence : people are ignorant... You modify the way W8 works by default, You use programs to do action that W8 can do (ie shutdown when you know how to find it). So you don't use the settings that a new user can have. Also a lot of people think that they need to use the metro interface now which piss them off. W8 is a pain in the ass because everytime a new friend/family person have it. I have tons of phone calls about how you do this or that I don't understand why you are using apps instead of traditional desktop software? And you fail to see how you're ignorant... The restart crap happens in Windows 7 as well, it's just less pushy about it. Most people complaining about Windows 8 aren't your typical users so yes most of them are ignorant. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 00:14 skyR wrote: I don't understand why you are using apps instead of traditional desktop software? And you fail to see how you're ignorant... The restart crap happens in Windows 7 as well, it's just less pushy about it. Most people complaining about Windows 8 aren't your typical users so yes most of them are ignorant. I don't use them. But most "normal" user are. But apperently we can't talk about those persons... We can only insult them. The "restart crap" is not happening in W7 as it is with W8... 7 have the restart in the same place that vista had, Xp had, 98 had, 95 had. Windows 8 have it hidden in some place elsewhere. There is little things like that, that was move because... no reason. I have my computer on Windows 7. My GF computer is on Windows 8. I find annoying that i need to search for things that aren't in the same place. That i need to explain things that i would have not on windows 7 (where to find skype or teamspeak for example). I don't say Windows 8 is crap. It just that it's not as intuitive as the other windows. For exemple : My Dad called me because he was "stuck" in Powerpoint... because he didn't know how to exit full screen. And Alt-Tab is for him science fiction (i'm exagerating) but he asks me everytime if i can put him on "the other windows. You know. The one that works" | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
The restart crap does happen in Windows 7, it just takes longer than it does in Windows 8. The auto update actually has been drastically improved over Windows 7, believe it or not. Windows 8 is less intuitive for the inefficient users but it's far from crap in comparison to other versions of crappy Windows which is what most people are saying when they complain. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 00:50 skyR wrote: How am I insulting those people. Most of those people don't update to the latest operating systems just for the heck of it. Most of them are using OS X, Windows 7, Vista, or XP. The restart crap does happen in Windows 7, it just takes longer than it does in Windows 8. The auto update actually has been drastically improved over Windows 7, believe it or not. Windows 8 is less intuitive for the inefficient users but it's far from crap in comparison to other versions of crappy Windows which is what most people are saying when they complain. Well i felt that the ignorant with dots was insulting. Maybe i got it the wrong way. Well... if your a blue maybe you are more competent than i am talking about this. But for what i see with the 2 computer that i have at home. The updates are so fucking long on W8 and not in W7 (the windows 8 computer is far more powerfull than mine). You say that W8 is great when you say yourself that you don't use the inbuilt functions as apps (well... i should say function ) So i don't understand.. Of course lamba user don't UPGRADE. They just buy new computer which comes with W8. And NO ONE updates "for the heck of it" (Or they have lots of money and don't know what to do with it) Questions : (real ones) - Do you use metro ? - Do you use any of the new function of W8 ? - Do you feel odd coming back to W7 (or XP for that matter) ? if yes why ? - How have you delt with the start menu when it was W8.0 ? Maybe the G70 that i got for my GF was with a W8 version with loads of apps/crap in it as sometimes "not homebuild cpu" are ? Maybe this is why i feel this way ? | ||
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Mindcrime
United States6899 Posts
On October 22 2013 00:36 FFW_Rude wrote: For exemple : My Dad called me because he was "stuck" in Powerpoint... because he didn't know how to exit full screen. And Alt-Tab is for him science fiction (i'm exagerating) but he asks me everytime if i can put him on "the other windows. You know. The one that works" ? Powerpoint is the exact fucking same in Windows 7 and Windows 8. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
If you count searching as using metro than I use metro but besides that, I don't use metro. Windows Defender is built into Windows 8 now, I guess if you count that as a new feature than I use that. But no I don't really use anything on Windows 8. It has better multi-monitor support but it still sucks compared to DisplayFusion. IE10 is better but I still prefer Chrome. Why would I feel odd going back to 7 or XP. Search works exactly the same. I don't use start for anything besides search. I'm not sure what you mean with how I dealt with the start menu when it was 8.0? Rarely when I need a software I don't have pinned, I hit windows key and search. I refuse to update to 8.1 because 8.1 does not support MSN (yes I still use this, Skype is a POS). | ||
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Mindcrime
United States6899 Posts
On October 22 2013 01:18 skyR wrote: Why would I feel odd going back to 7 or XP. Search works exactly the same. I don't use start for anything besides search. I don't think you've used XP recently. Search on XP is just terrible. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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Zocat
Germany2229 Posts
On October 22 2013 00:36 FFW_Rude wrote: + Show Spoiler + I don't use them. But most "normal" user are. But apperently we can't talk about those persons... We can only insult them. The "restart crap" is not happening in W7 as it is with W8... 7 have the restart in the same place that vista had, Xp had, 98 had, 95 had. Windows 8 have it hidden in some place elsewhere. There is little things like that, that was move because... no reason.+ Show Spoiler + I have my computer on Windows 7. My GF computer is on Windows 8. I find annoying that i need to search for things that aren't in the same place. That i need to explain things that i would have not on windows 7 (where to find skype or teamspeak for example). I don't say Windows 8 is crap. It just that it's not as intuitive as the other windows. For exemple : My Dad called me because he was "stuck" in Powerpoint... because he didn't know how to exit full screen. And Alt-Tab is for him science fiction (i'm exagerating) but he asks me everytime if i can put him on "the other windows. You know. The one that works" What? Windows 7 (Laptop): http://imgur.com/SyFGXOb Windows 8 (Desktop): http://imgur.com/b0cPlwQ How is that a different position? I personally have both set do "Check for updates automatically, download & install manually". Also learn: Win-X most important shortcut in Win8. Also shutting down Win8: Win-D Alt-F4 Enter. For programs which you basically have always open: Pin them to your startbar. That's what it's for. And you can start them with Win-# (1-0 I think). So when I boot I hit Win (also removes the initial Metro) 1-2-3 and start my browser as well as 2 other programs which are running 100% of the time. For StartMenu: I personally dont see a difference between hitting Win and then selecting the program from my StartMenu or hitting Win and then selecting the program from my Metro interface. Also keep in mind that you can start additional instances of programs with holding the Shift-Key while starting them. If you're 50+ and afraid of hotkeys. Yes, stay away from Win8. If not, adapt and be more productive (most of those shortcuts also work in previous Window versions). | ||
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Cyro
United Kingdom20323 Posts
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Rollin
Australia1552 Posts
On October 22 2013 01:22 Mindcrime wrote: I don't think you've used XP recently. Search on XP is just terrible. I miss using the keyboard to open stuff in one button from the start menu though, I used to just pin the programs I commonly used there with different letters, so firefox was win + i, word was win + w, etc. The best part was win + u + u to shutdown, so easy, although win + s was faster/more intuitive I guess from 95/98/2k. Now I have to type half the word in to get what I want... I miss windows xp  EDIT: And the fucking peeking "feature" from vista onwards when you're alt tabbing pisses me off. Not to mention adding the desktop as a "window" when you're alt tabbing, wtf that's what windows + D is for, it makes tabbing much more annoying as i hate tabbing between lots of things (faster to use mouse). Most of the absurd features that were added from xp -> vista I've disabled on my win7 comp or I'd probably be on a different OS by now and just give up on games/engineering programs. | ||
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Xapti
Canada2473 Posts
The downside is no official DX10+ support, but apparently it's been added in via 3rd party. Default installs of XP probably also have security issues, and application support might be starting to get a little bit lacking now as well. I heard that custom PC manufacturers have had a huge amount of consumers asking for Windows 7 over Windows 8. Apparently like 75% or something. Windows 8 has very little to offer over 7 as far as I know aside from different UI. I wouldn't even consider Windows 8 before 8.1 came out. And if you already have Windows 8, apparently to upgrade to 8.1 will be a pain in the ass: http://www.informationweek.com/software/windows8/microsoft-suspends-windows-rt-81-update/240162895 http://news.softpedia.com/news/Upgrading-from-Windows-8-1-Preview-to-RTM-Will-Remove-All-Installed-Apps-358777.shtm (doesn't seem to apply to to 8→8.1 though) My OS is a stripped down version of 7 x64 so that it takes up only 5 GB of space (that's like the size of the Windows 8.1 update alone). With reduced services running it should be performing better as well. Personally I'm not a fan of supporting Microsoft when there's no other option due to their monopoly on application support, and I'd just as well use a pirated version of Windows and not use any of their registered-user/paid services. I like the concept of GNU-Linux but it's not entirely there with games support and several other major/minor applications many people may want to use. | ||
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B_Type13X2
Canada122 Posts
If Metro is so good why was 8.1 which essentially does what alot of modders and programmers did with add on programs necessary? The answer is because although a group of people did like Metro a larger group of people didn't and its a realization that their market share would suffer as people look for solutions that are simply not metro. Anyone else having a flashback to Vista where retailers would offer the choice between XP and Vista and most users chose XP and microsoft called this, "choosing a more familiar user experience." that's PR spin at its finest. And finally windows metro does have its place and that place is on touchscreen enviroments like tablets, phones, and Laptop/tablet hybrids. I don't see its place on my desktop computer. It should have been an option I could enable not something that is on by default. | ||
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Jophess
United States95 Posts
Instead of complaining about how "terrible" Metro UI is, I fixed it with a simple program and haven't seen it since first installing the OS. If you don't like Metro, don't use it. It's quite the novel concept. | ||
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Derez
Netherlands6068 Posts
On October 22 2013 01:36 Cyro wrote: Skype is terrible with the IP stuff, forced auto updates (sometimes it will just NOT ask for permission), throwing ads (with volume!) in your face etc, didn't used to be that way. I don't actually know of a decent solution for IM with any kind of features (few people seem to be defaulting to stuff like IRC+teamspeak) Using pidgin with MSN gets pretty close to perfect if you're still using MSN. No reason for it not to work on 8.1. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On October 22 2013 04:06 Jophess wrote: Windows 8 with Start 8. Instead of complaining about how "terrible" Metro UI is, I fixed it with a simple program and haven't seen it since first installing the OS. If you don't like Metro, don't use it. It's quite the novel concept. True. I've done the same thing with Pokki, the only issue is often integrated shell that removes metro UI that is originally built into OS's are often coded much more effectively, and less hardware usage. I know most of the programs that change windows 8 to a more windows 7 UI, actually take up a large chunk of RAM. Hopefully windows 8.1 changes this (I'm dling it right now, will report back with opinion) | ||
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Jophess
United States95 Posts
On October 22 2013 05:36 wei2coolman wrote: True. I've done the same thing with Pokki, the only issue is often integrated shell that removes metro UI that is originally built into OS's are often coded much more effectively, and less hardware usage. I know most of the programs that change windows 8 to a more windows 7 UI, actually take up a large chunk of RAM. Hopefully windows 8.1 changes this (I'm dling it right now, will report back with opinion) Start 8 is currently using 952 KB of memory. 8.1 doesn't actually change anything regarding the start menu/button other than adding a button, which brings you to the Metro start screen. | ||
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MugenXBanksy
United States479 Posts
On October 22 2013 01:36 Cyro wrote: Skype is terrible with the IP stuff, forced auto updates (sometimes it will just NOT ask for permission), throwing ads (with volume!) in your face etc, didn't used to be that way. I don't actually know of a decent solution for IM with any kind of features (few people seem to be defaulting to stuff like IRC+teamspeak) To be completely honest the only time skype gives me shit is if I am streaming and then it just straight up crashs. Never got any of those pesky sound ads. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On October 22 2013 06:07 Jophess wrote: Start 8 is currently using 952 KB of memory. 8.1 doesn't actually change anything regarding the start menu/button other than adding a button, which brings you to the Metro start screen. I think classic shell was also another one of the light weight programs as well. I liked pokki quite a bit though, the search function off start was super nice. Been using 8.1 for a 30 minutes, the fact that you can keep your desktop background in start menu, makes going into the start menu less annoying visually anyways. Still not sure if I'm gunna keep the 8.1 start button. I might switch back to pokki, but I'm gunna give 8.1 a chance. Also, just looked up what powershell can do, windows 8 is a nice step up from windows 7 in terms of control of your computer Would like to have tiles in Metro to have some transparency. | ||
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B_Type13X2
Canada122 Posts
On October 22 2013 04:06 Jophess wrote: Windows 8 with Start 8. Instead of complaining about how "terrible" Metro UI is, I fixed it with a simple program and haven't seen it since first installing the OS. If you don't like Metro, don't use it. It's quite the novel concept. Exactly what I did, but you shouldn't have to install 3rd party programs to do what should have been an option on day 1. Metro should have been optional, but instead its forced enjoyment until you install 3rd party programs to make it into what it should have been. What happens to my dads laptop if something happens to it? I talked him through a reformat before but it is very frustrating over the phone to explain what 3rd party programs to install and in what order to do it in. All I can say is I hope 8.1 is free for people who already have 8. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
On October 22 2013 03:39 B_Type13X2 wrote: [...] If Metro is so good why was 8.1 which essentially does what alot of modders and programmers did with add on programs necessary? The answer is [...] On October 22 2013 10:32 B_Type13X2 wrote: [...] Exactly what I did, but you shouldn't have to install 3rd party programs to do what should have been an option on day 1. Metro should have been optional, but instead its forced enjoyment until you install 3rd party programs to make it into what it should have been. What happens to my dads laptop if something happens to it? I talked him through a reformat before but it is very frustrating over the phone to explain what 3rd party programs to install and in what order to do it in. All I can say is I hope 8.1 is free for people who already have 8. I don't know what you want with 8.1. Did you see it? It fixes nothing about those problems you say 8 has. All of those are still there. For example, if Dad installs 8 on his laptop, the moment he clicks on a picture or .pdf, he will be trapped inside a Metro program, wondering where the taskbar is and how to quit the viewer and get back to his desktop and his web browser, starting to think about picking up the phone to call you. I think 8.1 does more if you have a tablet, exactly the opposite of what you want from it. There's less settings solely in the desktop Control Panel, and the Mail app is much better, and I think there's some sort of improvement about how two apps side by side work. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 01:18 Mindcrime wrote: ? Powerpoint is the exact fucking same in Windows 7 and Windows 8. Nope, when you open an office document on W8 (at least for me) it takes it to full screen immediatly and you can't hit the windows button tu bring the "bar at the bottom" (sorry i don't know how it's called in english) because it brings metro. So it's a different way of display. It's not huge again i know. But you can't use what you know works on W7 or any of the older ones in W8 for that. (i just talk about lambda user, you can alt tab just fine). On October 22 2013 01:18 skyR wrote: I never said Windows 8 is great. It's just less crappy than Windows 7. Lots of people update for the heck of it. If you count searching as using metro than I use metro but besides that, I don't use metro. Windows Defender is built into Windows 8 now, I guess if you count that as a new feature than I use that. But no I don't really use anything on Windows 8. It has better multi-monitor support but it still sucks compared to DisplayFusion. IE10 is better but I still prefer Chrome. Why would I feel odd going back to 7 or XP. Search works exactly the same. I don't use start for anything besides search. I'm not sure what you mean with how I dealt with the start menu when it was 8.0? Rarely when I need a software I don't have pinned, I hit windows key and search. I refuse to update to 8.1 because 8.1 does not support MSN (yes I still use this, Skype is a POS). Well i can't know how people update for the heck of it when it costs something like 90€ to upgrade (i think at one point it was less but it was 30€ or something). Windows defender is built into Windows 7 as well so i don't understand what you are saying Multi-monitor support is fine. I have 3monitors on my W7 and a WHDMI adapter (the wifi hdmi) that works fine in W7 and doesn't work on W8. But multiple monitor works fine in W8. Just the same has W7. I don't know what is display fusion. Is that a 3rd party program ? Ie 10 is kind of the same as ie9 for me (php developper here). But i use chrome as well. Oh ok you don't use Start menu. That's maybe why we see things differently. I use it quite a lot. On the other hand i don't use search. My computer is really cleaned up (i have 2,5Tb so i must file it because i want to find everything quickly. But i'm just a maniac :p ). On October 22 2013 01:31 Zocat wrote: What? Windows 7 (Laptop): http://imgur.com/SyFGXOb Windows 8 (Desktop): http://imgur.com/b0cPlwQ How is that a different position? I personally have both set do "Check for updates automatically, download & install manually". Also learn: Win-X most important shortcut in Win8. Also shutting down Win8: Win-D Alt-F4 Enter. For programs which you basically have always open: Pin them to your startbar. That's what it's for. And you can start them with Win-# (1-0 I think). So when I boot I hit Win (also removes the initial Metro) 1-2-3 and start my browser as well as 2 other programs which are running 100% of the time. For StartMenu: I personally dont see a difference between hitting Win and then selecting the program from my StartMenu or hitting Win and then selecting the program from my Metro interface. Also keep in mind that you can start additional instances of programs with holding the Shift-Key while starting them. If you're 50+ and afraid of hotkeys. Yes, stay away from Win8. If not, adapt and be more productive (most of those shortcuts also work in previous Window versions). Well i was talking about the shutodwn thing. (you know, start, stop computer etc...). And for windows update, it just that on W8 there is on option (default) that reboot the computer and you can't do something about it (it happens on W7 but you can say that you don't want to reboot). Again Small thing.Oh cool about the shift key. I did not know that EDIT : Keep in mind that it just talking and asking question from me I'm not hating on anything. I like to see why people like something that i don't. Because if you don't have opinions that differs from you, you can't change your mind about anything So maybe i'll see here a lot of things that i don't know and that will help me deal with W8 when i must use it | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
On October 22 2013 17:39 FFW_Rude wrote:+ Show Spoiler + On October 22 2013 01:18 Mindcrime wrote: ? Powerpoint is the exact fucking same in Windows 7 and Windows 8. Nope, when you open an office document on W8 (at least for me) it takes it to full screen immediatly and you can't hit the windows button tu bring the "bar at the bottom" (sorry i don't know how it's called in english) because it brings metro. So it's a different way of display. It's not huge again i know. But you can't use what you know works on W7 or any of the older ones in W8 for that. (i just talk about lambda user, you can alt tab just fine). On October 22 2013 01:18 skyR wrote: I never said Windows 8 is great. It's just less crappy than Windows 7. Lots of people update for the heck of it. If you count searching as using metro than I use metro but besides that, I don't use metro. Windows Defender is built into Windows 8 now, I guess if you count that as a new feature than I use that. But no I don't really use anything on Windows 8. It has better multi-monitor support but it still sucks compared to DisplayFusion. IE10 is better but I still prefer Chrome. Why would I feel odd going back to 7 or XP. Search works exactly the same. I don't use start for anything besides search. I'm not sure what you mean with how I dealt with the start menu when it was 8.0? Rarely when I need a software I don't have pinned, I hit windows key and search. I refuse to update to 8.1 because 8.1 does not support MSN (yes I still use this, Skype is a POS). Well i can't know how people update for the heck of it when it costs something like 90€ to upgrade (i think at one point it was less but it was 30€ or something). Windows defender is built into Windows 7 as well so i don't understand what you are saying Multi-monitor support is fine. I have 3monitors on my W7 and a WHDMI adapter (the wifi hdmi) that works fine in W7 and doesn't work on W8. But multiple monitor works fine in W8. Just the same has W7. I don't know what is display fusion. Is that a 3rd party program ? Ie 10 is kind of the same as ie9 for me (php developper here). But i use chrome as well. Oh ok you don't use Start menu. That's maybe why we see things differently. I use it quite a lot. On the other hand i don't use search. My computer is really cleaned up (i have 2,5Tb so i must file it because i want to find everything quickly. But i'm just a maniac :p ). If your office document takes you to full screen than you're using the office app... and not the traditional office. Hence my comment earlier about why are you using the office app? Traditional office on 7 and 8 are the exact same. Yes, Windows 8 was on sale for $15 for a few months but I think you're forgetting that people also have access to MSDNAA, TechNet, and some also do pirate it. My mistake. They rebranded Microsoft Security Essentials to Windows Defender for 8. I always get those two mixed up. Windows 7 doesn't have extended taskbar and can't have multiple wallpapers. Windows 8 adds this basic stuff. Searching will always be faster than navigating through folders no matter how organized you are. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 19:05 skyR wrote: If your office document takes you to full screen than you're using the office app... and not the traditional office. Hence my comment earlier about why are you using the office app? Traditional office on 7 and 8 are the exact same. Yes, Windows 8 was on sale for $15 for a few months but I think you're forgetting that people also have access to MSDNAA, TechNet, and some also do pirate it. My mistake. They rebranded Microsoft Security Essentials to Windows Defender for 8. I always get those two mixed up. Windows 7 doesn't have extended taskbar and can't have multiple wallpapers. Windows 8 adds this basic stuff. Searching will always be faster than navigating through folders no matter how organized you are. I did not know it was an app... i thought it was the normal function. MSDNAA ? TechNet ? Multiple wallpapers on different screens i take it ? Well... I'm kind of like : "Windows+R" "H:\Music\Folder1\" etc... with autocompletion, it will always be faster this way The only thing i'll search with the search function are windows file (dlls, cab) or something like that. Also. How do you quote me on one line ? I'm always quoting big posts | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
Hmm that's basically the exact same thing as pressing windows and typing that, minus pressing R. I quote by entering spoilers. | ||
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BillGates
471 Posts
On October 18 2013 13:52 Ropid wrote: It does have a start button. It's in the lower left corner of the screen. It's popping up if you move the mouse pointer into that corner there. Wow, its like I'm talking to little babies. Win8 doesn't have the start button, win8.1 brings the start button, but not the start button functionality that brings the start menu with its files, folders, shortcuts, search, profile, etc... So both win8 and win8.1 don't have a start button, which is important because it brings up the start menu which is extremly useful and you can do everything from it, without having to take a full screen and go in a different mode just to be able to do few things, than you can do easily and more efficently in win7 through the start menu. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 20:18 skyR wrote: MSDNAA and TechNet gives you free Windows and other Microsoft software. Hmm that's basically the exact same thing as pressing windows and typing that, minus pressing R. I quote by entering spoilers. The same thing if you indexed all of your 2,5Tb discs though. Oh ok you spoilered But i don't get MSDNAA and technet ? If they give free stuff to everyone i don't see how that is legit. I might have to do a search for that | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
I wonder if people actually use w8 at work at Microsoft. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 20:53 skyR wrote: You don't need drives indexed to search. I have 5TB of storage, none of it indexed. I find it quite slow when i use the search when it's not indexed. I thought you had to. On October 22 2013 21:06 Sufficiency wrote: I feel Windows 8 will be a terrible OS to work on for serious tasks. As someone who use w7 at work I cannot imagine my frustration if I switch. I wonder if people actually use w8 at work at Microsoft. We have some people on W8 with new laptops at work. Some cry, some don't. We had a few demands on going back to W7 but not too many. Maybe 1/5 | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 21:18 skyR wrote: Results come up as you type, at least for me. I don't really see how much more faster you would need it to be. Well results come up not as fast as you type for me. And search function also give you stuff that are INSIDE text file for exemple. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
Search does not search inside file contents unless you specify "content:". | ||
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sorrowptoss
Canada1431 Posts
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Zocat
Germany2229 Posts
On October 22 2013 17:39 FFW_Rude wrote: Well i was talking about the shutodwn thing. (you know, start, stop computer etc...). And for windows update, it just that on W8 there is on option (default) that reboot the computer and you can't do something about it (it happens on W7 but you can say that you don't want to reboot). Again Small thing.Ok, sorry somehow I misunderstood you. But I still dont see your problem, since I was never forced to reboot in my Windows 8. I just installed an update (manually started the download & installation progress) and it says "A reboot is required for the update to be finished" with a "Restart now" button. I closed the window via the x on the top right. Now the Windows Update says: "We'll finish installing some updates the next time your PC is restarted." I wont see any mention from this update until I shutdown/start the PC. So when I go to bed tonight and/or when I boot it up tomorrow. On October 22 2013 20:34 FFW_Rude wrote: The same thing if you indexed all of your 2,5Tb discs though. Oh ok you spoilered But i don't get MSDNAA and technet ? If they give free stuff to everyone i don't see how that is legit. I might have to do a search for that I dont know about technet, but not to everyone. Your academic institution (or company?) needs to have a contract with MS to pay for Dreamspark access. You get free access to most MS products like Windows, Visual Studio, Blend, Expression, ... The only big thing missing is Office even though that will be available on 1st Dec (might be a German only promotion though, dont know). | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 22 2013 21:27 skyR wrote: Your example was a folder address which would bring up that folder's content. Search does not search inside file contents unless you specify "content:". I think my search function is not well parametred in that case because it does and i don't specify anything Is there other function in W8 that you like and does not happens in W7 ? @Zocat i will look on my GF computer and see what i can change to stop this restart madness. Because it just does not ask questions. I think it's the default : "Auto download and install that does that". I don't think we have those things in France for the MS partenership. Or i just don't know about it. | ||
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Sufficiency
Canada23833 Posts
On October 22 2013 21:08 FFW_Rude wrote: I find it quite slow when i use the search when it's not indexed. I thought you had to. We have some people on W8 with new laptops at work. Some cry, some don't. We had a few demands on going back to W7 but not too many. Maybe 1/5 Do you work at Microsoft? | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
Also how is Emet not auto included in every copy of windows? | ||
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endy
Switzerland8970 Posts
On October 23 2013 00:12 FFW_Rude wrote: I don't think we have those things in France for the MS partenership. Or i just don't know about it. They're free, it's just not advertised properly so most students have no idea. It's usual through a Dreamspark Premium partnership. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
Now I'm wondering if I can get the student upgrade version for this PC and use it on my next PC when I pick up a new one next year... And if so, do I need to install Win7 and then upgrade to Win8 and THEN upgrade to Win8.1? This whole thing seems messy. Part of me wants to upgrade because I wouldn't mind having a legit windows, but at the same time, perhaps the benefits are minor. That candyass UI is fucking disgraceful and installing third party software to get rid of it is a clumsy solution. | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
There are still technical limitations regarding Windows 8 Core vs. Pro vs. Enterprise versions with the key. The Pro key will only install on OEM, Upgrade and normal Windows 8 Pro discs, not on Enterprise. | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
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CatNzHat
United States1599 Posts
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Dontkillme
Korea (South)806 Posts
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
Not at all. Why ? | ||
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coolix
China2 Posts
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Hokay
United States738 Posts
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BillGates
471 Posts
On October 24 2013 03:58 Hokay wrote: Desktop is windows 7. Laptop is a macbook with osx & bootcamp. I can never go back to a pc laptop after owing several MBP. LOL, those are expensive as fuck, for the same performance of windows laptops. Like $1500 macbook performs equivalent to a $1000 Asus windows laptop. The OS is also worse since there are a lot less programs, games and productivity suites for apple os. | ||
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ffadicted
United States3545 Posts
On October 14 2013 16:42 skyR wrote: but Windows is still shit. lol no, still significantly better than anything available, and that's why you use it I use Windows 8, not a fan of the whole metro idea, but the regular desktop stuff is great | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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shubcraft
Germany145 Posts
http://usabilitygeek.com/windows-8-vs-windows-7-speed-and-performance-testing/ http://kotaku.com/5935337/lets-see-how-windows-8-performs-against-windows-7 Win 8 has some aspects with more performance but when it comes to gaming win 7 is slightly faster. | ||
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Mahanaim
Korea (South)1002 Posts
Works like a charm after the graphics performance problems were fixed XD | ||
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Rollin
Australia1552 Posts
On October 24 2013 04:04 BillGates wrote: LOL, those are expensive as fuck, for the same performance of windows laptops. Like $1500 macbook performs equivalent to a $1000 Asus windows laptop. The OS is also worse since there are a lot less programs, games and productivity suites for apple os. Yeah because "performance" is the sole reason you buy a laptop as opposed to a desktop. Battery life, build quality, screen quality, trackpad/keyboard quality and size/weight are completely unimportant. A $500 desktop performs equivalent to a $1000 Asus Windows laptop. He also has bootcamp, so he can use Windows or OSX if he wants. Personally I use Linux for my 'nix needs, but OSX is also a reasonable choice. There is so much ignorance here I can't tell if you're retarded or trolling, although I'm leaning towards the latter. | ||
[Phantom]
Mexico2170 Posts
On October 15 2013 10:23 Blisse wrote: I know how to do it with WIN+I through the Settings bar, I'm saying the standard way for people who haven't Google'd WIN+I or the Charms bar is WINKEY, click on Username, Log Out, click on Power Button, Shut Down. They have people drilled into one way of Shutting Down with all their previous releases and totally screwed up on slowly moving people to their new way. And logging out first is where people have ended up. Pro tip: Go to desktop mode (you probably are there already) Press alt+f4 Press enter Profit. | ||
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pebble444
Italy2501 Posts
Edit:spelling | ||
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Ropid
Germany3557 Posts
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pebble444
Italy2501 Posts
On October 24 2013 13:45 Ropid wrote: Look up "freeciv" to replace civ2. It started out as some sort of clone and is open source. It will run on Windows 7. On your laptop, add the "freeciv-gtk" and "freeciv-extras" ubuntu packages. yeah i tried that one out several times before. Its just not the same. Mostly its the sounds and the texts. OUR WORDS ARE BACKED WITH NUCLEAR WEAPONS, there' s just no comparison. Maybe this way its better cause i would just get hooked and pay it non stop. Thanx the same for the tip | ||
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Hokay
United States738 Posts
On October 24 2013 04:04 BillGates wrote: LOL, those are expensive as fuck, for the same performance of windows laptops. Like $1500 macbook performs equivalent to a $1000 Asus windows laptop. The OS is also worse since there are a lot less programs, games and productivity suites for apple os. Performance isn't everything, it's all about the user experience and productivity on osx. You must be living in the past? Productivity is fine on macs. You now get their productivity suite for free with OSX Maverick which was released to the public for free yesterday. We don't even have to pay for out major OS upgrade like Windows 8 or have to buy a productivity suite like Office. The build quality and user experience of macbooks is great. I like the high resolution of the retina display that looks better than all of the past crappy laptops I have ever owned in my life time. Pictures & text look crispy as fuck. The battery life is very efficient with OSX, and the glass trackpad + finger gestures is too good to ever go back to the archaic methods of cheap plastic laptop window trackpads with terribly executed or lacking finger gesture commands to control or navigate quickly in and out of any program without pushing a single physical button. Most laptops feel cheap, look cheap, are cheaply built with ugly screens etc. so until they step up their game & windows step up the user experience & productivity, I see no reason for me to ever buy one unless my job required one, or I wanted to game on the go. I find the user experience just plain worse on so many levels. I use to be on the hate bandwagon for macs for about a decade until I bought one for school & traveling while photographing & video editing. Yes they are a bit pricey, but you get top notch customer support, a uniquely positive user experience that laptops fail to provide, high quality built machine that easily syncs to many apple services, apps & devices. I use my macbook for non-gaming stuff so I'm ok with not having widows 95% of the time. If I wanted windows on the go I'll just dual boot on my mac which I rarely do. | ||
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
On October 24 2013 14:38 Hokay wrote: They don't even get worse performance. Under OS X they work significantly more efficiently than the equivalent machine does under Windows. OS X is designed to be incredibly efficient while still giving great performance. Mavericks improved the battery life of my 15" i7 MBP by roughly an hour just with the under-the-hood improvements they did (now I have around 8ish hours of battery life under standard use).Performance isn't everything, it's all about the user experience and productivity on osx. You must be living in the past? Productivity is fine on macs. You now get their productivity suite for free with OSX Maverick which was released to the public for free yesterday. We don't even have to pay for out major OS upgrade like Windows 8 or have to buy a productivity suite like Office. And yeah, Macs achieved parity a while ago when it comes to programs for doing actual work, and the few that aren't available can be easily accessed via VMs or dual booting, though I have yet to run into any I need for school (I'm in comp sci) other than Visual Studio, which I can easily run with a VM. I used to hate Macs too. Then I actually used one and realized they aren't so bad. I then got one with the idea that if I didn't like it I could sell it and 4 years later I still have that machine and it works just as well as the day I got it. Then I got another with a quad core i7 and it can do basically anything I want it to while still having enough battery to last me the day. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
Macs are exepensive but are solid stuff. i will never buy a mac because i just hate it (and because it costs so much, can't play games or have to get a dual boot/ boot camp etc...) but yeah. Don't say that mac are shit. All OS are good. they works for what they were designed for (Unless Windows Millenium :p). I don't mind working on OSX or on Linux (well i'm kind of forced to :p). But in my home. Always PC. It's just a preference. Also they are so much bad idea on everything in the computer market. Like : Microsoft have shitty tech support, Macs can't do squat with games, Linux is just for programers and hipsters blablabla. You want a gaming machine. Go for a PC. You want a work machine. Go for a Mac. You want to learn how to do stuff while working. Go for Linux. That's basicly what i tell to people when asked. Of course i might say : "But if you get a mac, you need to buy an expresso machine and lift you finger when talking". But that's just teasing :p | ||
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wussleeQ
United States3130 Posts
need to figure out someday how to get to there through enterprise | ||
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Hokay
United States738 Posts
On October 24 2013 17:42 FFW_Rude wrote: I always tease mac user because they are sensitive as fuck and in a general thing they take you from up (i don't know if it works in english). So i tease them. So actually backing up why you like or hate something is being "sensitive fuck"? I just explained why a mac is worth it to me when someone tells you the typical "lolololol you can get a laptop for cheaper with the same performance bla bla macs are overpriced" that most ignorant people say. There are way more other reasons to get a computer aside from performance to dollar ratio or gaming on a laptop. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On October 24 2013 19:36 Hokay wrote: So actually backing up why you like or hate something is being "sensitive fuck"? I just explained why a mac is worth it to me when someone tells you the typical "lolololol you can get a laptop for cheaper with the same performance bla bla macs are overpriced" that most ignorant people say. There are way more other reasons to get a computer aside from performance to dollar ratio or gaming on a laptop. No no. It's just that i have a lot of friend that use mac that just jump on the pc hate whenever they can for no reason. And when i tease them they just lose it I do know that mac is good and stuff etc... They are not overpriced. They are the right price for what it is. But i really like to tease mac user about this because they all (that i know) say PC is shit for no reason. Like you know. You come to their house and they go with : "oh i bought a new mac, it's so more powerfull than a pc". And you are like "wtf ? Can you give me a coffee before starting this ?". I surely mistyped and was misunderstood And i didn't said sensitive fuck (which would be a insult) but : "sensitive as fuck" which would be translated to "highly sensitive" (or maybe i'm mistaken ?) | ||
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Hokay
United States738 Posts
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Xapti
Canada2473 Posts
On October 22 2013 01:36 Cyro wrote: yeah totally.Skype is terrible with the IP stuff, forced auto updates (sometimes it will just NOT ask for permission), throwing ads (with volume!) in your face etc, didn't used to be that way. I don't actually know of a decent solution for IM with any kind of features (few people seem to be defaulting to stuff like IRC+teamspeak) I think it would be nice if there was an IRC-like protocol with improved infrastructure at it's base level, and perhaps even some sort of decentralized (yet universal/ubiquitous) communication. Improve security/privacy would also be helpful, since I think there's some issues. On October 22 2013 04:30 Derez wrote: Isn't the closing of MSN servers super imminent? In fact I thought that the servers themselves maybe even went down. No point piloting/riding a sinking ship, man. In fact wouldn't virtually all your contacts left MSN since the program no longer functions (as far as I know)? You hook Pidgin up with Skype too or something?Using pidgin with MSN gets pretty close to perfect if you're still using MSN. No reason for it not to work on 8.1. Considering how much longer the live messenger Network has stayed up for, I do regret leaving it at the time I did (like 4 years ago) instead of staying with it for a bit longer though. The one thing preventing me from easily jumping on Pidgin is pretty much the fact that I still need to have Skype running to have Skype messaging support (although I might hop on anyway). Trillian supports Skype-less Skype protocol, but it has other issues. Anyway enough of that off-topic stuff. | ||
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Xapti
Canada2473 Posts
On October 24 2013 14:38 Hokay wrote: Windows users don't need to buy Office to compose office-like documents; They have access to free Microsoft web office, or of course alternatives like Libreoffice....OSX Maverick which was released to the public for free yesterday. We don't even have to pay for out major OS upgrade like Windows 8 or have to buy a productivity suite like Office. Anyway, the main point I have is that you don't have to pay to upgrade because any time you buy a Mac PC you have to spend an bunch of extra money. That money more than exceeds the cost for the OS and office software unless you valuate those things at high values. Not only that, but you have to do-so EVERY TIME you buy a new machine, rather than just once, even if the operating system and software are the same versions as on the older machine. | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
Microsoft only prevented you from using the MSN client but there are patches (eg. MSN Reviver) that circumvent this. The servers are still up and running. I'm no network expert but I'd be very surprised if they just bought down the servers since Skype and Outlook both connect to the same server? | ||
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Hokay
United States738 Posts
On October 28 2013 08:56 Xapti wrote: Windows users don't need to buy Office to compose office-like documents; They have access to free Microsoft web office, or of course alternatives like Libreoffice. Anyway, the main point I have is that you don't have to pay to upgrade because any time you buy a Mac PC you have to spend an bunch of extra money. That money more than exceeds the cost for the OS and office software unless you valuate those things at high values. Not only that, but you have to do-so EVERY TIME you buy a new machine, rather than just once, even if the operating system and software are the same versions as on the older machine. The unique user experience, apple services, app ecosystem, aesthetics, form factor & top notch build quality allows Apple to sell their hardware at a premium. Whether if all that is worth it is up to you. | ||
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Xapti
Canada2473 Posts
On October 28 2013 09:14 skyR wrote: If you mean physical server that doesn't mean anything; fact is Skype uses a different protocol and the live messenger stuff was transferred over to it. As far as I heard the old servers for the messaging network Microsoft used was going down. I don't think Outlook uses the protocol (just the contacts), and I don't see see why [at least the web version of] Outlook would need to use the protocol since it's through the web browser (and I didn't think the installed program really did any instant messaging but I haven't seen it in a while so maybe that changed).Pidgin and other open source messengers don't support Skype since their protocol isn't available publicly. Microsoft only prevented you from using the MSN client but there are patches (eg. MSN Reviver) that circumvent this. The servers are still up and running. I'm no network expert but I'd be very surprised if they just bought down the servers since Skype and Outlook both connect to the same server? The Pidgin-Skype thing is more complex than what you're talking about. Pidgin does support Skype with a plugin but it needs Skype running (maybe you knew that). There is a kit of APIs/software that allows programs to support the Skype protocol —hence Trillian's use— but it's restrictive to use (binds the developers and the users), which is not something the developers of Pidgin think is worth it (which is a logical opinion an open-source organization to have); It also obviously makes the program no longer entirely open source technically. Anyway that is a topic for another thread really so I should probably stop talking about it. | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
Is it possible tu have a real start menu and not going into metro and to the huge ass list of applications that i don't use 95% of them ? | ||
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skyR
Canada13817 Posts
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Ben...
Canada3485 Posts
On November 21 2013 04:20 FFW_Rude wrote: There are applications that will do what you want but nothing built in, no. You can check out stuff like Start8 and the like. There's a ton of them.Hello people. So i installed 8.1 i thought that i would get a start menu but i just got a button that opens metro. Is it possible tu have a real start menu and not going into metro and to the huge ass list of applications that i don't use 95% of them ? | ||
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FFW_Rude
France10201 Posts
On November 21 2013 04:28 Ben... wrote: There are applications that will do what you want but nothing built in, no. You can check out stuff like Start8 and the like. There's a ton of them. Oh ok i thought 8.1 would have one. I misread Thanks. I'm going to reinstall start 8 then since 8.1 fucked up my start 8 install (among other things). | ||
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peidongyang
Canada2084 Posts
ios7 for my tablet | ||
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felisconcolori
United States6168 Posts
Windows 8 under the hood is smexy, but the face on that thing can stop traffic. The extra features don't really interest me, and the solid proven track record of 7 is just fine for me. | ||
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