EPTOh, and it's also only the "best" if you ignore the Phanteks that had a better load delta with stock fans...
No, just no. Use reliable reviews.
Computer Build Resource Thread - Page 1293
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
Oh, and it's also only the "best" if you ignore the Phanteks that had a better load delta with stock fans... No, just no. Use reliable reviews. | ||
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Belial88
United States5217 Posts
For a lot of people, their time is worth a lot more than the price difference. I tend to think your valuations almost always treat time and effort as 0 cost or close to that. I don't mean this in a good or a bad way (whether anything is worth it depends on the situation), but it takes a certain type of person to rebend CPU pins. Some people buy refurbished hard drives. Others don't. etc. Yea, I mean I'm not going to recommend someone buy a broken pin CPU for their next build further than as a suggestion. And a refurbished HDD is of course maybe much, HDD is one of those few items you really want to buy new, not used. Not every part needs to be bought used, but similarly, not every part needs to be bought new. I think you can save a lot of money and keep the exact same performance, by buying smartly. Buy your CPU, HDD, motherboard, and PSU new. RAM? Cheap, replaceable, durable, buy it used, it's rarely overvolted by anyone so there's not even the infinitely small chance an overclock hurt it, like a used CPU. Heatsinks? Great value used sometimes, especially when something silly like a broken mount knocks it to 10% price new, even though you can email the manufacturer for a free mount or at most, buy one for $9. GPUs? You can buy some great, older gen GPUs that are more powerful than anything but the flagships cards out today, for ridiculously low prices, a 460 for $60 outperforms a 550 and 650, even though they are twice the cost than the 460 used, and clock for clock is equal to the 560. There's dozens of cards like 4850's, 9800s and 8800s, 4870, 9900, 260s, that you can find for under $25 and will do a great job performing most modern games on medium-high graphics, in some cases, you can these and similar GPUs for $10. Meanwhile, due to the whole upgrading bullshit of GPUs and families and generations, you have $60-80 GPUs new that just won't perform half as well as that used $10 GPU in very good condition on ebay, simply because that $80 GPU is a 610, which happens to be the newest generation, even though it's the absolute shittiest card of that generation and worst than the flagship of the 8xxx series or 48xx series. Ignoring prices and all that, dealing with occasionally faulty products, returns, etc. through something like eBay is just flat-out worse than dealing with most reputable large retailers. Hence "gambling." You can argue over how much worse (acceptably worse, maybe not much worse? maybe). I'd argue it's not worse at all through ebay. It alsways sucks dealing with returns, faulty products, et cetera. I've hand stand-up companies screw me over in RMAs even though I bought the item new, and was under warranty, and had receipts and everything, while I've gotten manufacturer support for items that I told them, that I had boughten off ebay as used. It's always a gamble. With certain items, there's definitely a gamble, both new and used, while with others, there's much less of a gamble. Non-mechanical heatsinks or older gen parts sold for mere dollars? Great to buy used. High-end hardware that's been used like GPU and CPU? Buy it used from ebay from a reputable seller who has a return policy and an extremely reliable record (which it seems every seller has, due to how ebay fucks over everyone who tries to sell on ebay). Ebay is draconian when it comes to selling. There are many people out there that realize that ebay is a buyer's heaven. Pay on Delivery allows you to pay for an item AFTER you received it - you can't even do that with newegg! Sellers never get the funds until AFTER you give positive feedback! With newegg, you actually have to pay for the item first. I can't imagine what's safer than being able to pay for an item only after you've tested it out. btw pro tip: there exist billions of people that don't live in teh USA *gasp*. also some people like PWM control for CPU cooling My post was indicating that PWM is a good thing, not a bad thing. And I'm aware many people don't live in US, that's why when I recommend ebay, it's in response to sellers who live in the US. In general I only recommend to US posters, since price dictates everything when it comes to computer parts. An FX cpu even will be a better value than anything else out there and the best chip to buy if the price is low enough. It's definitely not black and white, but I don't make it out to be, either. A smart buyer should always consider buying used, take a look at ebay, know to shop around. Newegg slightly overcharges everything (they have great deals and combos for an online store, granted). You don't need to pinch pennies, but you can get both a better system and save more money if you buy the right things used, and the right things new. Ebay is hardly as dangerous as it's made out to be, it's extremely safe, and it's very obvious what's a good seller, and a bad seller. frankly it's rare to even see a bad listing, much less see it for an item your considering, you just can't be a bad seller on ebay for long.... ebay/paypal will reimburse you if you get ripped off/bad item/slightly screwed over, and then deal with the bad seller on their own. Ebay is a lot of things, but the one thing it isn't, is a gamble to buy used, or a shady place. It's a lot different than craigslist. I don't think it's even possible to get ripped off ebay as a buyer really... especially if you have half a brain. With options like pay after delivery and funds after positive feedback... it's really not possible. Now as a seller, on the other hand... | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
On December 07 2012 07:58 Belial88 wrote: GPUs? You can buy some great, older gen GPUs that are more powerful than anything but the flagships cards out today, for ridiculously low prices, a 460 for $60 outperforms a 560 Just to ignore all the anecdotal stuff, while still demonstrating that you're still making shit up? http://www.anandtech.com/show/4344/nvidias-geforce-gtx-560-top-to-bottom-overclock/12 | ||
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Tytan64
United States8 Posts
Im getting 2 1TB drives, so i can put games on one, and music, pics, and other shit on another. Organization purposes, which might hopefully give me quicker read times. I got the 1866 ram because it didnt cost me any more than the other RAM. And I got 16 GB for multitasking, so i know it wont slow my conmputer down regaurdless, and go into Virtual memory. How much power do i think it will use, I dont know. I just went with what i felt i might need, and then some to make sure. enlighten me with your thoughts Myrmidon. Like i said, this is the first one im building, and i threw it together. Im currently depoyed, so money isnt a HUGE concern for me, althought the cheaper the better. BUT i still am planning on getting a badass PC that does everything that i want it too. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
On December 07 2012 08:11 Tytan64 wrote: I am going to have 2 Viewsonic VX2453MH-LED 24-Inch Ultra-thin Widescreen LED Monitors. They run 1920x1080, and are 2ms response monitors. Im getting 2 1TB drives, so i can put games on one, and music, pics, and other shit on another. Organization purposes, which might hopefully give me quicker read times. I got the 1866 ram because it didnt cost me any more than the other RAM. And I got 16 GB for multitasking, so i know it wont slow my conmputer down regaurdless, and go into Virtual memory. How much power do i think it will use, I dont know. I just went with what i felt i might need, and then some to make sure. enlighten me with your thoughts Myrmidon. Like i said, this is the first one im building, and i threw it together. Im currently depoyed, so money isnt a HUGE concern for me, althought the cheaper the better. BUT i still am planning on getting a badass PC that does everything that i want it too. Unless you're planning multi-display gaming on 2 monitors (just don't) you don't need extra GPU power to handle it. | ||
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Belial88
United States5217 Posts
On December 07 2012 07:57 JingleHell wrote: So, that cooler with enough fans on it to no longer come anywhere near it's original price point, can be considered to be the best in what looks like someone's home, with a variable ambient, meaning air conditioning/heat is probably coming on/off and affecting results. Oh, and it's also only the "best" if you ignore the Phanteks that had a better load delta with stock fans... No, just no. Use reliable reviews. No, you just swap out the front fan with a case fan. There's a bad design issue, if you can call it that, where the front fan runs much faster than the rear fan (or is it the other way around? I forget exactly) or they don't run in sync, that causes the heatsink to maybe not perform as well as it could. Plug the front fan as molex instead of PWM, or, simply use another 120mm fan, like a case fan, and then use the stock fan, as a case fan. You could also just sell the 2 fans, they are both high quality, or just sell the 120mm fan, and buy 2 x yate loon high's from petras tech shop for less than $15 after shipping. Let's say you don't sell the fan, worst case scenario, your paying $55 for a heatsink fan that's leaps and bounds better than that piece of overpriced crap cooler master or h60. Or, simply stick with stock. Those graphs you provided are absolute shit, everyone knows frostytech is a joke (it's obvious, unless your going to tell me that an Hyper 212 Evo is indeed better than a Thermalright Silver Arrow LOL), at stock settings, the Assassin will destroy both the H60 and coolermasters watchamacallit. Moparman actually is on a benching team and does LN2 events. I might not be smart, but he's sure of hell lot smarter than you when it comes to this stuff, and probably more knowledgeable than the guys at frostytech. He also keeps the room air conditioned to stable temps. The same would be said for the frostytech set up... i mean there isn't exactly a better place to run a bench but inside an air conditioned room with a ceiling fan. He also didn't use a case. Yes, the phanteks is the best heatsink in the world at stock settings. It's also significantly more expensive, it's about $20 more than a NH-D14 (which is the 2nd quietest stock fan in the world and 3rd best fan in the world, tied with the Silver Arrow which is the quietest on stock) and obviously, twice as expensive as the Assassin. For the $81 of the phanteks, you could get the Assassin, and buy 3 x 140mm of the best fans out there, and it'll outperform anything in the world. Or, accept the 1-2*C difference on stock fans with half the price. Or better yet, how about the guy just buys an H60 or Coolermasters POS for a higher price, and MUCH worse cooling! Phanteks, NH-d14, Silver Arrow, Assassin, they are all inarguably, the 4 best heatsinks in the world. There is no reason not to buy them if they are cheaper or equal in price to the heatsink being considered. Your obviously a troll. Asking for reliable reviews, then posting frostytech. I'll take you seriuosly again when you tell me the Hyper 212 Evo does not, in fact, beat the Silver Arrow in cooling. LOL. Let's say your correct and the Assassin loses to the Phanteks or Silver Arrow or NH-D14. What the fuck does that even mean, who cares, it's still one of the top 4 coolers in the world and 1-2*C difference from the SA/D14/Phanteks. Oh right, because the frostytech review says it's a really bad cooler. LOL | ||
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Belial88
United States5217 Posts
On December 07 2012 08:08 JingleHell wrote: Just to ignore all the anecdotal stuff, while still demonstrating that you're still making shit up? http://www.anandtech.com/show/4344/nvidias-geforce-gtx-560-top-to-bottom-overclock/12 Oops, will edit that. I meant to say clock for clock a 460 it's better than the 550/650. I was probably thinking, of the fact that the 460 performs identically to the 560 when overclocked. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-EVO-CPU-Cooler-Review/1407/6 212 Evo coming in just behind a NH C14, which is an excellent cooler. http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/cm_hyper212_evo/4.htm Competitive with NH D14 Are you just going to call anything that doesn't make you sound smart a trash review? Because it seems lots of people agree that's a pretty fair cooler, so it calls your entire attack on frostytech into question. To be fair, they've had a few reviews go wonky due to certain designs with their testbed, but frankly, I'd say making ad homs based on this is ludicrous. Long story short, don't go making shit up so it supports a pet theory of yours. http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Gamer-Storm-Assassin-CPU-Cooler-Review/1540/6 That's a not so awesome review. Without crossdecking to Frostytech. Good, but not amazing. Certainly not "best in the world!!1one" material. | ||
Womwomwom
5930 Posts
Processors with high voltages and high LCC probably have decaying transistors and will not likely be DOA or die any time soon. What it may mean is that it will be considerably more unstable than processors bought new and will likely need higher voltages just to remain stable at certain clocks. That or it just randomly crashes. Now how quickly can you accurately blame the seller for the dying processor especially if he sells the item "as in" like in the case of just about all electronics? Yeah OK I'm just going to leave my product on stock settings and run stress benchmarks for a week to make sure its fine. Nevermind that its a processor and I'm just as liable to be the person who fucked the processor up. Nevermind that time is worth money. Nevermind that unless its a very old processor, I'm not going to save that much money. It should be obvious, but with how ebay works nowadays I don't think it's possible to list a technical item without posting the exact technical model and details. A bad listing, and a good listing, will stand out, and the process is fairly automated these days anyways. It should be obvious you have no clue about monitors from this comment. Even a good listing won't tell you anything except you might expect zero dead pixels. Nothing else, you cannot determine things like tinting, minor panel flaws like grey stripping (v. annoying), true amount of backlight bleed (camera doesn't pick it up unless you exacerbate the exposure), etc. with mere photos unless the person selling it knows about all of these things. And with things like actual display temperature and brightness (very important!), the seller most likely cannot measure it because they lack the hardware to do. So how do you get the seller to accurately put down product details beyond product specs that are utterly meaningless when they lack the ability to do so? Product specs are pointless for most people looking for specific items because they already know it. What they want to know is what condition everything is in and the only way to know is if you are able to inspect the item before selling. Most sellers don't know about it. Most sellers that know about it know that most of these things are subjective. Most people have phone or cheap point and shoots and they display LCD content extremely badly so you're not going to see it. These sort of problems extend towards all sorts of electrical devices from cameras to power supplies. Belial88, I buy lots of stuff off the second hand market. I reckon my second hand audio hardware is worth more than your entire computer so don't try and think I'm ignorant of the second hand market. Most of the time it actually IS a gamble because most of the time, you cannot inspect the hardware you see. Nevermind the addition problems you get from not dealing with a reputable central source. | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
Exactly what is wrong with this testing method at worst it provides a relative cooling performance assuming an controlled room temperature. It's not like it's the thunderbrid era were intel and amd don't use heat spreaders and you have to worry about cracking your cpu so the rough size of the cooper heating element provides a more consistent heating source then running some program to task a cpu. In the world of testing things if you just want to measure one thing you remove and simply till it's as bare bones as possible. | ||
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Womwomwom
5930 Posts
The Silver Arrow's default fan configuration is geared towards silence. The TY-140s only spin at like 1300RPMs or something really slow because I know they're absolutely fantastic for undervolting. On the otherhand, the Coolermaster Hyper 212 Evo's fan spins at like 2000RPM. So its not impossible that the Coolermaster Hyper 212 Evo can match the Silver Arrow when the Silver Arrow's stock fan configuration is significantly quieter. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
If I was going to look at noise first, though, I'd probably use SPCR. Lol, same link as other dude. Last time I looked at his post it was edited blank. semantics: Apparently they have had some problems with some of the new coolers with the Vapor Chambers coming in at considerably cooler than real world, Myrm had a decent theory about Vapor chambers possibly working more efficiently in a verticle test bench configuration than in a tower. Although that would have no relevance compared to that other test belial linked with the potentially questionable results, since that was also vertically mounted test bench. | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
On December 07 2012 09:56 JingleHell wrote: http://www.frostytech.com/testmethod_mk2.cfm If I was going to look at noise first, though, I'd probably use SPCR. Lol, same link as other dude. Last time I looked at his post it was edited blank. semantics: Apparently they have had some problems with some of the new coolers with the Vapor Chambers coming in at considerably cooler than real world, Myrm had a decent theory about Vapor chambers possibly working more efficiently in a verticle test bench configuration than in a tower. Although that would have no relevance compared to that other test belial linked with the potentially questionable results, since that was also vertically mounted test bench. New coolers use vapor chambers??? lol wut why would they all it is, is a wide squarish heatpipe it's the same science behind them they both benefit from being mounted vertically assuming a simple configuration they do generally work better when assisted by gravity, only poorly designed ones only rely on gravity. Not that it means anything to me ever sense i picked up a CM HAF XB In case people don't get why, heat doesn't rise it goes to the place of lower energy and in a closed system like a vapor camber or heat pipe it just means away from the heating element ie cpu. And gravy isn't an issue when they use wicks and capillary action to move the fluid though the system. Anyways all it being vertical means you can cheat a bit with quality of the wick in some instances. In summation, orientation in a quality heat pipe or vapor chamber wouldn't matter as gravity would have little to no effect on it capillary action >>> gravity, in a poorly made one yes orientation can matter. | ||
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JingleHell
United States11308 Posts
On December 07 2012 10:27 semantics wrote: New coolers use vapor chambers??? lol wut why would they all it is, is a wide squarish heatpipe it's the same science behind them they both benefit from being mounted vertically assuming a simple configuration they do generally work better when assisted by gravity, only poorly designed ones only rely on gravity. Not that it means anything to me ever sense i picked up a CM HAF XB I know specifically the TPC 812, not sure if others do or not, because if you look at tests mounted in a tower compared to vertical test benches, it comes in lackluster for the price, whereas in vertical it looks amazing. | ||
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lac29
United States1485 Posts
I use Adobe Photoshop/Illustrator/InDesign and Solidworks 3D modeling, as well as tablet drawing. I've noticed a bit of lag when I use these pieces of software. I also plan on playing HotS when it comes out (although I don't care too much on playing it on the highest settings) and already play some steam games. Can I get some recommendations as to what I should upgrade within a particular budget? For ex ... if I need to upgrade my gfx card I think I'm willing to spend around $150. I'm not sure about CPU and motherboard yet. I'm looking more for bang for my buck. HD - Western Digital WD Blue WD5000AAKX 500GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive RAM - G.SKILL Sniper 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Desktop Memory Model F3-10666CL9D-8GBSR CPU - Intel Core i3-2100 Sandy Bridge 3.1GHz LGA 1155 65W Dual-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 2000 BX80623I32100 GFX - SAPPHIRE 100293L Radeon HD 5570 1GB 128-bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready Low Profile Ready Video Card motherboard - ASRock H61M-VS LGA 1155 Intel H61 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard optical - ASUS 24X DVD Burner - Bulk 24X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 12X DVD+R DL 24X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM Black SATA Model DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS - OEM power - Antec EarthWatts Green EA-380D Green 380W Continuous power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply case - Antec Three Hundred Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case | ||
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Belial88
United States5217 Posts
On December 07 2012 08:21 JingleHell wrote: http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-EVO-CPU-Cooler-Review/1407/6 212 Evo coming in just behind a NH C14, which is an excellent cooler. http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/cm_hyper212_evo/4.htm Competitive with NH D14 Are you just going to call anything that doesn't make you sound smart a trash review? Because it seems lots of people agree that's a pretty fair cooler, so it calls your entire attack on frostytech into question. To be fair, they've had a few reviews go wonky due to certain designs with their testbed, but frankly, I'd say making ad homs based on this is ludicrous. Long story short, don't go making shit up so it supports a pet theory of yours. http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Gamer-Storm-Assassin-CPU-Cooler-Review/1540/6 That's a not so awesome review. Without crossdecking to Frostytech. Good, but not amazing. Certainly not "best in the world!!1one" material. Hardware secrets isn't too hot of a benchmark either. First off, the problem is stock fans. A lot of CPU coolers seem a lot better than they really are, because they have shitty, loud, strong fans (Hyper 212+, Phanteks), or they do worse because they have a much milder fan optimized for low sound (NH-D14, Hyper 212 EVO). A good example of this is the H70. It's the worst closed loop cooler out there, but it sells and 'performs' better because at stock it includes 2 power, loud, shitty fans. You compare closed loop 120mm rad systems, and you'l find the H50 consistently outperforms the H70, but on benchmarks like at Hardwaresecrets, you wouldn't know that, because the H50 only comes with a single fan that's optimized to be quiet. Apples to apples man. Not a hard concept. You can also look at the benchmark and see it's full of crap, too. Your telling me a Hyper 212 EVO is significantly better than an Antec Kuhler 620, THE best 120mm closed loop cooler out there? And Oh, look, the Spire Thermax II, which Frostytech rates as THE BEST COOLER IN THE WORLD and better than Phanteks/NH-d14/Assassin/SA, is near the bottom of the barrel. Surely this can't be a proper site to trust if the Spire Thermax Eclipse doesn't come as #1 cooler?! Oh look at that, the NH-D14 is worse than the Kuhler 620, Megahalems, Hyper 212 Evo, and H70. Seriously dude. I'm don't care too much about benchmarks used, but when you keep citing benches that show the Hyper 212 EVO to beat a NH-D14, which is consistently ranked as in the top 5 air coolers in the world, it's a joke. Everyone knows hardwaresecrets is a joke. While your at it, please don't cite Tomshardware as your next bench. lol at hyper 212 evo 'comparative to a nh-d14'. Your clueless dude. A 4 HDT is not going to beat a an 8 heatpipe dual tower with a 140mm fan and 120mm fan at stock. The Hyper 212 Evo is just a lapped Hyper 212+ with a shittier fan, it only tests 1-2*C more than the Hyper 212+ at most. I really don't think you know what you are talking about when you think that basically a lapped Hyper 212+ is better than a 620 or NH-D14. Just google this shit, instead of picking the worst benchmarks sites out there on purpose to be a troll. Assassin. Best heatsink in the world apples to apples! Inarguably, in the top 5 heatsinks in the world - Thermalright Silver Arrow, NH-D14, Phanteks, at both stock and apples to apples. | ||
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Rachnar
France1526 Posts
rest of the build is still plenty good don't worry about it (but if do want an upgrade for photo design, etc.... you'd need a better cpu, the problem being, the i3 is good, but not the best, and i find it idiotic going from a 110$ cpu to a 180$ i5 for not that much gain, and the i7 costs a lot. So i'd advice an Xeon which cost a bit more then the i5 but a lot less then the i7 : http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117286 ,but even then after writing this much i'd still advice just upgrading your graphics card for gaming unless you don't really care about it) | ||
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Belial88
United States5217 Posts
On December 07 2012 09:44 semantics wrote: http://www.frostytech.com/testmethod_mk2.cfm Exactly what is wrong with this testing method at worst it provides a relative cooling performance assuming an controlled room temperature. It's not like it's the thunderbrid era were intel and amd don't use heat spreaders and you have to worry about cracking your cpu so the rough size of the cooper heating element provides a more consistent heating source then running some program to task a cpu. In the world of testing things if you just want to measure one thing you remove and simply till it's as bare bones as possible. When every result they have is clearly bullshit and goes against everything that every other review, personal anecdote, and user reviews, show. A hyper 212 is not better than an NH-D14. A Hyper 212, lapped(evo) or not, is not one of the top 5 best heatsinks in the world, and is definitely not the best heatsink in the world +/- 2*C. | ||
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MisterFred
United States2033 Posts
On December 07 2012 11:49 Belial88 wrote:+ Show Spoiler + On December 07 2012 08:21 JingleHell wrote: http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Cooler-Master-Hyper-212-EVO-CPU-Cooler-Review/1407/6 212 Evo coming in just behind a NH C14, which is an excellent cooler. http://www.overclockersclub.com/reviews/cm_hyper212_evo/4.htm Competitive with NH D14 Are you just going to call anything that doesn't make you sound smart a trash review? Because it seems lots of people agree that's a pretty fair cooler, so it calls your entire attack on frostytech into question. To be fair, they've had a few reviews go wonky due to certain designs with their testbed, but frankly, I'd say making ad homs based on this is ludicrous. Long story short, don't go making shit up so it supports a pet theory of yours. http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Gamer-Storm-Assassin-CPU-Cooler-Review/1540/6 That's a not so awesome review. Without crossdecking to Frostytech. Good, but not amazing. Certainly not "best in the world!!1one" material. Hardware secrets isn't too hot of a benchmark either. First off, the problem is stock fans. A lot of CPU coolers seem a lot better than they really are, because they have shitty, loud, strong fans (Hyper 212+, Phanteks), or they do worse because they have a much milder fan optimized for low sound (NH-D14, Hyper 212 EVO). A good example of this is the H70. It's the worst closed loop cooler out there, but it sells and 'performs' better because at stock it includes 2 power, loud, shitty fans. You compare closed loop 120mm rad systems, and you'l find the H50 consistently outperforms the H70, but on benchmarks like at Hardwaresecrets, you wouldn't know that, because the H50 only comes with a single fan that's optimized to be quiet. Apples to apples man. Not a hard concept. You can also look at the benchmark and see it's full of crap, too. Your telling me a Hyper 212 EVO is significantly better than an Antec Kuhler 620, THE best 120mm closed loop cooler out there? And Oh, look, the Spire Thermax II, which Frostytech rates as THE BEST COOLER IN THE WORLD and better than Phanteks/NH-d14/Assassin/SA, is near the bottom of the barrel. Surely this can't be a proper site to trust if the Spire Thermax Eclipse doesn't come as #1 cooler?! Oh look at that, the NH-D14 is worse than the Kuhler 620, Megahalems, Hyper 212 Evo, and H70. Seriously dude. I'm don't care too much about benchmarks used, but when you keep citing benches that show the Hyper 212 EVO to beat a NH-D14, which is consistently ranked as in the top 5 air coolers in the world, it's a joke. Everyone knows hardwaresecrets is a joke. While your at it, please don't cite Tomshardware as your next bench. lol at hyper 212 evo 'comparative to a nh-d14'. Your clueless dude. A 4 HDT is not going to beat a an 8 heatpipe dual tower with a 140mm fan and 120mm fan at stock. The Hyper 212 Evo is just a lapped Hyper 212+ with a shittier fan, it only tests 1-2*C more than the Hyper 212+ at most. I really don't think you know what you are talking about when you think that basically a lapped Hyper 212+ is better than a 620 or NH-D14. Just google this shit, instead of picking the worst benchmarks sites out there on purpose to be a troll. Assassin. Best heatsink in the world apples to apples! Inarguably, in the top 5 heatsinks in the world - Thermalright Silver Arrow, NH-D14, Phanteks, at both stock and apples to apples. Apples to apples is a useful benchmark for coolers... but I generally prefer NOT using apples-to-apples benchmarks. If I buy a fan, most of the time I'm going to use the fans that come with it. Of course, for me personally I'm not going to give the thermal performance more than a look or two - I'm going to look straight at those acoustic benchmarks. Where, of course, apples-to-apples would be pretty meaningless. If you look at the benchmarks that really matter (to me), no one in the world is going to think a Phanteks is any good. But you wouldn't be able to tell that from apples to apples. There's a reason I use an HR-02 Macho. And trust me, it's not the cooling performance (though that's supposed to be pretty decent). | ||
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semantics
10040 Posts
On December 07 2012 11:56 Belial88 wrote: When every result they have is clearly bullshit and goes against everything that every other review, personal anecdote, and user reviews, show. A hyper 212 is not better than an NH-D14. A Hyper 212, lapped(evo) or not, is not one of the top 5 best heatsinks in the world, and is definitely not the best heatsink in the world +/- 2*C. You must not be able to read table http://www.frostytech.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=2692&page=5 Coolermaster Hyper 212 Evo 15.9 Noctua NH-D14 14.5 Or you can't frame statements properly because it seems that no version of hyper 212 does better then nh-d14, you also don't get that they only use 1 thermal compound for all their test removing pre packaged thermal compound from the equation. They run the fans at highest voltage where it applies it doesn't deal with fan profiles etc. It's max performance possible out of the heatsink. If they are any level of smart they would also use torque screwdriver to when applicable secure all at same pressure, pressure and thermal compound strongly determine the effectiveness in quite a few coolers. Again where is the flaw in the method? If you're looking for an answer your method of deduction is based on what everyone is telling you? Not on a logical process? So in your world a testing platform in which heat induced is identical and reproducible. A measurement taken at the point of contact by proper equipment thermal compound which is used for all tests And fans set to 5v for low fan speed and 12v for high fan speed is not a valid process in arriving cooling performance? At best you can frame an argument on if you're using the same thermal compound why not use the same fan for all test but you run into issues in tests where the fan is integrated in the system. You confuse the information that is presented you perhaps take a look at a Fan and rate it based on dBa and CFM without taking a look at the graph between Static pressure and CFM which can be usually obtained from a manufacture, which gives a much better idea of what the fan can do for w.e application you wish. For frosty tech the only thing that is being measured is heat displacement with the fans running at 5v and at 12v, lowest profile and highest profile. And you can make judgments based on that. I mean do you even look at the dBa levels for fans running at max speed shits over 50 dBa most of the time this is a system in distress not what you run 24/7 (although i did sleep in a room with a server rack and a shit ton of delta fans you get surprising numb do the hum of really loud fans after awhile)it is displaying cooling potential nothing more nothing less. Which only answers a small part of the question of what heatsink is best for me? It falls into a similar vein as testing games and just posing the avg fps it doesn't quite paint a picture of what is occurring but it's still valid form of information gathering assuming testing is reproducible. | ||
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