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It would make things take longer in setting up for Lans, offline tournies, pro-games, etc.. If each player had to change each of their race's hotkeys in a menu before the game, among all the other changes they need to make. You wouldn't be able to just hop on behind someone else's rig and blast some D's.
Something I like about Starcraft is that other than potentially having to get used to different mouse sensitivity, you can sit down at any computer with SC, and retain most of your skill. It would suck if you played on custom hotkeys for a year, then went to a lan and got raped because you were hitting T instead of K or something like that.
Perhaps server-side profile settings? That would be cool.
It's not a big deal if people re-map keys, and Blizzard, if I remember, already said they would allow for custom hotkeys in a menu(I might be absolutely insane but I swear I remember them saying that.)
But these were some small issues with the remap hotkeys thing.
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the main issue i see with that is different keyboards, for example
player 1 uses a g-15 and binds shit to the side buttons
player 2 uses a dt35 (i think they're called) and does not have the extra buttons
without saying anything about if it is or isn't actually a major advantage, one keyboard could and may be viewed as having an advantage over the other
a uniform keyset avoids this 'problem' all together
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On March 17 2009 08:32 SoleSteeler wrote:Show nested quote +On March 16 2009 15:27 ven_ wrote:On March 16 2009 02:52 SoleSteeler wrote:On March 15 2009 19:02 ven_ wrote:
haha, if those are the only lessons learned from wc3 we really have to prepare for the worst. Care to elaborate? What are the technical limitations of War3 that we are missing? None... there are indeed lessons to be learned from WC3 but none of the things mentioned by the OP have got anything to do with them. Again, elaborate. What are these lessons? The things that most people perceive as being "wrong" with War3 aren't in SC2 in the first place. Namely things like heroes, items, creeps, upkeep, low unit count, high HP units, etc.
It's not really that I think there's something wrong with War3. Well, it has a few issues but they're pretty minor and as you already pointed out War3 and Sc2 are so different that they probably won't impact the latter at all.
It's just that I don't really see how the OP's issues are related to Warcraft 3.
What he states as lessons to be learned from War3 could've already been learned from the original Starcraft. Which didn't happen because most of those things are useless. -_-;;
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accidentally alt q q'ing is the reason why i now do F10 + E + Q
edit: holy fuck. 1999 posts. i have no clue what to use my 2000th post on. it probably won't be epic
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they could quite easily make it ALT-Q then O for OK or E for end scenario
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On March 17 2009 20:20 nataziel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2009 15:07 lowlypawn wrote:
Feed back so far has been good. Accommodations the colors for color blind players is a good idea, and I remembered one more idea that should definitely be implemented.
* Injured units should bleed! (Or smoke if they are mechanical)…Health bars are ugly and old school. In WC3 they added the feature to always have them on, that was a step in the right direction but they still look terrible. A much better solution that is already partially implemented would be to make injured units bleed (or smoke if they are mechanical). Building already have this feature so it would not be hard for blizzard to add this to all the units. The only problem I can see would be a frame rate issue. If you have a hundred zerglings all bleeding at once I could see that slowing down the game. But then again I’m sure there would be a way to have a simpler bleed animation for slower computers that would not take any more CPU cycles then those ugly heath bars.
You've got to be joking, how would you tell the actual HP of the unit at a glance if there are no health bars? Animations are incredibly imprecise, not to mention the fact that they'll just make the game more confusing to look at. It's the same argument about extended death animations, they add nothing to the gameplay and just confuse players and make it harder to play the game. Sure, with buildings it's ok to have them because it's not very often you need to know the exact HP of a building, but a health bar really isn't very intrusive and makes the whole experience a lot better.
Health bars also don't show precisely how many hit points a unit has left. You have to click on the unit to see the exact number. But you could make the bleed animation look clean and easy to see. As the unit gets more damaged it could bleed more and start looking more banged up. It would certainly look better then a health bar floating in air above each unit.
Another point is knowing “exactly” how much heath left is not as important in SC as WC3. In WC3 you really need to know if that next Coil Sormbolt is going to kill your hero so you can town portal right before it hits. There is no TP in starcraft so stopping a killing blow is really not an option. Just knowing a unit is in the red will be more then adequate.
Also the resistance to custom keys is strange, one person said it would take too long to set up at tournaments. How long dose it take to plug a keyboard and mouse in? Then you just load your custom keys file from a CD and check the box. Would take 60 seconds. I do like the idea of keeping the custom keys configuration stored on the server! Also don't most people bring their own computers to LAN parties anyway?
The bottom line is do you guys want to take SCII to a new level or RTS gaming or do you just want SC/BW with a facelift?
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Skimming isn't revealing any mentions of the usefulness of the windows key. Yes, back in the day, I hated it, but I've gotten more used to it. It's very convenient for its hotkey functions (like win+E for explorer, win+D for minimize all/show desktop, etc). An ability to disable it would be most welcome, of course.
And yeah, there are gaming keyboards that disable it. (btw, pm me if you know anything about a keyboard with antighosting that's otherwise fairly normal and not too expensive, and isn't some wasd area-only crap.)
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On March 18 2009 05:15 ven_ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2009 08:32 SoleSteeler wrote:On March 16 2009 15:27 ven_ wrote:On March 16 2009 02:52 SoleSteeler wrote:On March 15 2009 19:02 ven_ wrote:
haha, if those are the only lessons learned from wc3 we really have to prepare for the worst. Care to elaborate? What are the technical limitations of War3 that we are missing? None... there are indeed lessons to be learned from WC3 but none of the things mentioned by the OP have got anything to do with them. Again, elaborate. What are these lessons? The things that most people perceive as being "wrong" with War3 aren't in SC2 in the first place. Namely things like heroes, items, creeps, upkeep, low unit count, high HP units, etc. It's not really that I think there's something wrong with War3. Well, it has a few issues but they're pretty minor and as you already pointed out War3 and Sc2 are so different that they probably won't impact the latter at all. It's just that I don't really see how the OP's issues are related to Warcraft 3. What he states as lessons to be learned from War3 could've already been learned from the original Starcraft. Which didn't happen because most of those things are useless. -_-;;
Ahhh okay. Sorry, I just wasn't sure what you were getting at before.
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we need to get blizzard to confirm LAN is in SC2 , i couldnt imagine them being stupid enough to leave it out.would be a horrible decision , the series would go backwards.
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How do you accidentally alt+QQ in Starcraft? O.O
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Alt+qq and alt+tab seems to be rare, i think the most common problem is the windows key beacuse unlike alt+qq and alt+tab you only need to press the windows key once and that's it your game is ruined. Plus the windows key is near to the shift and ctrl keys w/c is used very often.
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Well, even if you accidentally hit your windows key it's not ruined because if you notice it before you unpress the button you can still prevent it by also pressing Control and then releasing both buttons.
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On March 19 2009 18:20 ven_ wrote:
Well, even if you accidentally hit your windows key it's not ruined because if you notice it before you unpress the button you can still prevent it by also pressing Control and then releasing both buttons.
I didnt know that, thanks for the tip. The old soultion to this is to remove the windows key from the keyboard.
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First of all, you CAN edit your hotkeys in WC3, but it involves creating a separate .txt file for the hotkeys and therefore casual players (like myself) don't usually do it. A fast way to custom map your keys would definitely useful. I also think this wouldn't be 'unfair' because in fact NOT being able to edit your hotkeys favors people with larger hands that can easily stretch over the keyboard.
Pro players edit their hotkeys. True story: Grubby (one of the best WC3 pro players) once sat down at his girlfriends computer and accidentally lost a game for her by alt+qq. It even happens to pros, so the ability to disable it is definitely useful.
Second, I just went through my NGL-mappack (NGL is probably the largest WC3-league that uses only custom maps) and all maps are over 1 MB in size. This is probably too much to include the map in the replay file.
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For some reason I really thought this thread was going to be along the lines of 'how i learned to micro from WC3'. How silly of me.
For the windows key, pressing any button while holding it will negate the keystroke, no matter what order you release them in. Except windows+D and E, i guess.
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On March 19 2009 23:45 Equaoh wrote:
For some reason I really thought this thread was going to be along the lines of 'how i learned to micro from WC3'. How silly of me.
For the windows key, pressing any button while holding it will negate the keystroke, no matter what order you release them in. Except windows+D and E, i guess.
The problem is that in WC3 if you get 120+ apm you start spamming alt non-stop and don't keep it pressed. I really can't imagine myself noticing that I've pressed win-key instead of alt for this 0,5 sec (especially that I don't know any person from WC3 even on average level that would actually take a peek at the keyboard during the game).
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On March 13 2009 15:28 omninmo wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2009 15:19 Ingenol wrote:
SC2 has the same alt functionality as War3, so disabling altQQ would be really nice (Q is obviously a great key to rebind something to). is this for real? hold down alt to see health? not sure how i feel about this
you can actually toggle it now to always show health bars and press alt to temporarily remove them (which I use on w3c)
Also, I've never alt QQ'd or alt-tabbed accidentally from sc or wc3. I mapped all hero spells to
ZXCV and most of the buildings for undead to match the
qwer
asdf
zxcv
format
and I changed burrow back to U >,< !!
PS- take a pen or screwdriver and just pop the window and scroll lock keys out. Most worthless keys on the board anyways.
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when you use default hotkeys, summoning a quillbeast while holding alt to see life bars is a death setance
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As long as you only summon one quillbeast, you'll be fine. Why would you be pressing Alt while summoning a quillbeast anyway?
I played with QWER keys for a very long time now and even though almost everything I train at my buildings is on Q and I press the Alt key pretty much all the time inbetween the other actions I never even once accidentally hit Alt + Q at the same time.
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On March 18 2009 03:02 404.Nintu wrote:
It would make things take longer in setting up for Lans, offline tournies, pro-games, etc.. If each player had to change each of their race's hotkeys in a menu before the game, among all the other changes they need to make. You wouldn't be able to just hop on behind someone else's rig and blast some D's.
Something I like about Starcraft is that other than potentially having to get used to different mouse sensitivity, you can sit down at any computer with SC, and retain most of your skill. It would suck if you played on custom hotkeys for a year, then went to a lan and got raped because you were hitting T instead of K or something like that.
Perhaps server-side profile settings? That would be cool.
It's not a big deal if people re-map keys, and Blizzard, if I remember, already said they would allow for custom hotkeys in a menu(I might be absolutely insane but I swear I remember them saying that.)
But these were some small issues with the remap hotkeys thing.
In WC3 you can save your hot key config in a really small file, its easy to carry it around in any pendrive.
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EPT
