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On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out.
Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral.
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United States1807 Posts
On June 30 2024 08:47 JJH777 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out. Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral.
It wouldn't even be a discussion. In fact, if you removed Maru from the equation and tacked INnoVation's 2012-2017 peak onto Mvp's WoL results, there wouldn't be a discussion either.
He'd have 7 Code S/SSL wins and another three final appearances while the next best player, NesTea, only had three wins and had retired a half decade before. As for the rest of the world, there wasn't another player with more than two KIL wins. Add in a top 5 Proleague resume and a boatload of weekender wins, and you have an unimpeachable resume (I say this while admitting that I also place a lot of value on being the first to do something, such as soO's four straight finals in 2013-14, sOs' trio of World championship between 2013 and 2015, Mvp's 2011 run, NesTea's back to back wins and INnoVation being the first to win a KIL for the fourth time in 2017).
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On June 30 2024 08:47 JJH777 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out. Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral.
You had a GSL every month or so back in the day, Mvp wasn't nearly as dominant as Serral has been, his winrate records pale in comparison to Serral, Serral not only has better winrate vs koreans but he also faces better Koreans on average than Mvp did, due to Qualifiers/early GSL rounds.
But if Mvp's WoL was Maru's, maru would actually have a couple years he was the best player in the world, right now he has arguably a few semesters sprinkled throughout his carreer.
Again, 99% of this thread focus on whatever noise they like, I'm just looking at who is actually stomping the competition the hardest and longest, and it's Joona Sotala undisputed, and no one is even close.
This should have ended the goat discussion weeks ago:
![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/rUpEjhr.png)
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On July 05 2024 09:39 LostUsername100 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2024 08:47 JJH777 wrote:On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out. Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral. You had a GSL every month or so back in the day, Mvp wasn't nearly as dominant as Serral has been, his winrate records pale in comparison to Serral, Serral not only has better winrate vs koreans but he also faces better Koreans on average than Mvp did, due to Qualifiers/early GSL rounds. But if Mvp's WoL was Maru's, maru would actually have a couple years he was the best player in the world, right now he has arguably a few semesters sprinkled throughout his carreer. Again, 99% of this thread focus on whatever noise they like, I'm just looking at who is actually stomping the competition the hardest and longest, and it's Joona Sotala undisputed, and no one is even close. This should have ended the goat discussion weeks ago:
Can I ask what is the source of this picture? It’s fun
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Northern Ireland24504 Posts
On July 05 2024 12:45 njleslu2024 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2024 09:39 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 30 2024 08:47 JJH777 wrote:On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out. Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral. You had a GSL every month or so back in the day, Mvp wasn't nearly as dominant as Serral has been, his winrate records pale in comparison to Serral, Serral not only has better winrate vs koreans but he also faces better Koreans on average than Mvp did, due to Qualifiers/early GSL rounds. But if Mvp's WoL was Maru's, maru would actually have a couple years he was the best player in the world, right now he has arguably a few semesters sprinkled throughout his carreer. Again, 99% of this thread focus on whatever noise they like, I'm just looking at who is actually stomping the competition the hardest and longest, and it's Joona Sotala undisputed, and no one is even close. This should have ended the goat discussion weeks ago: Can I ask what is the source of this picture? It’s fun
Somebody who fucked up numerous numbers in the making of it
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On July 05 2024 14:40 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2024 12:45 njleslu2024 wrote:On July 05 2024 09:39 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 30 2024 08:47 JJH777 wrote:On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out. Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral. You had a GSL every month or so back in the day, Mvp wasn't nearly as dominant as Serral has been, his winrate records pale in comparison to Serral, Serral not only has better winrate vs koreans but he also faces better Koreans on average than Mvp did, due to Qualifiers/early GSL rounds. But if Mvp's WoL was Maru's, maru would actually have a couple years he was the best player in the world, right now he has arguably a few semesters sprinkled throughout his carreer. Again, 99% of this thread focus on whatever noise they like, I'm just looking at who is actually stomping the competition the hardest and longest, and it's Joona Sotala undisputed, and no one is even close. This should have ended the goat discussion weeks ago: Can I ask what is the source of this picture? It’s fun Somebody who fucked up numerous numbers in the making of it
For example?
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Northern Ireland24504 Posts
On July 06 2024 00:50 njleslu2024 wrote:Show nested quote +On July 05 2024 14:40 WombaT wrote:On July 05 2024 12:45 njleslu2024 wrote:On July 05 2024 09:39 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 30 2024 08:47 JJH777 wrote:On June 30 2024 00:48 LostUsername100 wrote:On June 28 2024 07:41 Cactus66 wrote:
I don't know why you guys are putting so much effort into comparing Maru's GSL path vs Serral's spring path. If you wanted to judge the tournament difficulty by path you would compare Maru's GSL path to Maru's spring path. That properly shows the difficulty of the tournament to win from Maru's perspective. And the conclusion you can draw from that exercise is tournaments with Serral in them are generally harder to win than tournaments without Serral in them.
Serral will typically have the easiesr path compared to everyone else in the tournament. He's usually the top seed, but most importantly he doesn't have to play Serral.
If Maru had Mvp's WoL, or Life/Innovations HOTS, I'd almost understand putting him as #1 (I wouldn't really because those expansion lasted 2 years), but he peaked at the same time Serral did, we get to watch them duke it out. Are you really saying that Maru with 8 more premier wins during HotS or WoL including 1-2 world championships and random weekenders would still not be the goat in your eyes? With that his trophy list would completely eclipse Serral's. That's some crazy bias towards Serral. You had a GSL every month or so back in the day, Mvp wasn't nearly as dominant as Serral has been, his winrate records pale in comparison to Serral, Serral not only has better winrate vs koreans but he also faces better Koreans on average than Mvp did, due to Qualifiers/early GSL rounds. But if Mvp's WoL was Maru's, maru would actually have a couple years he was the best player in the world, right now he has arguably a few semesters sprinkled throughout his carreer. Again, 99% of this thread focus on whatever noise they like, I'm just looking at who is actually stomping the competition the hardest and longest, and it's Joona Sotala undisputed, and no one is even close. This should have ended the goat discussion weeks ago: Can I ask what is the source of this picture? It’s fun Somebody who fucked up numerous numbers in the making of it For example?
Turns out I fucked up and misread, disregard!
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EPT
