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I was thinking there could be an optional indicator that players could turn on to display how much range a unit has. If the player has this on, then when the player selects a unit, then a circle will appear around the unit showing how far it can shoot (like how pylon power range is displayed).
This would only work if a single unit is selected, and if some option is toggled/some button is pressed. Obviously, people would keep it off most of the time, but it would be useful even in pro matches when you can see where to place dragoons to hit depots or exactly where to siege tanks to be in range of key areas.
Furthermore there could be another circle to show unit vision range, but this should be kinda obvious and less important anyway (except with maybe tanks since they shoot farther than they can see).
This would help newbs be more familiar with the game, yet it also has some forseeable uses at higher level play.
People might claim this noobifies the game, but it makes such a small impact to actual gameplay, since most good players have an extremely good idea of how far their units shoot anyway.
Thoughts/comments?
Mandatory SC2 thread poll:
Poll: Range indicator a good idea?
(Vote): yes, cool idea
(Vote): no, bad reason (specify)
(Vote): I don't care, FOR THE OVERMIND!
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as long as it can be turned on and off;/ But i think it's sorta unnecessary.
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Canada7170 Posts
I say togglable only in campaign, since by multiplayer, people should have enough shkill to be able to judge correctly. But i don't think it is needed at all.
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range is usually visualized as a circumference of a circle, not a full circle, which is just as helpful but less cluttering.
TA would show those circles for all selected units. Since unit types had wildly varying ranges, up to several screens, it was probably more needed there. In BW, the only cases where it might be useful are tank vs tank fights, and reaver vs static defense. More rarely, ranged dragoons vs range 5 bunkers, though trial-and-error works just as well in that specific case.
I don't care if they add it
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You can see range of the Tank in a Siege mode at the Terran Gameplay Video. That's a good thing and obviously not all units need that.
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So many people say that they want such-and-such a feature as a toggleable option, but unless it's a few menus deep, more than one or two toggleable options will clutter the UI. This one in particular seems pretty useless. Knowing exactly how far a unit shoots is a skill you have to learn through practice. A decent player knows how to set up siege tanks exactly in range, then scan and have them shoot when they gain vision, killing their opponent's tanks before they shoot back. I see no reason to take another skill out of the game. If you want it an option in single player, so you can learn their ranges, that's fine.
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Stegosaur
Netherlands1231 Posts
I voted no, because it will dumb down the game.
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We get you're all rough and tough BW experts. Okay. I don't see how firing circles can impede gameplay, but I do see how they can enchance it. Yes.
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On September 30 2007 01:27 Stegosaur wrote:
I voted no, because it will dumb down the game.
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This is fucking hilarious. Has any one of you ever used the phrases "dumb-down" or "newbify" outside of SCII discussions? I mean, how can you "dumb-down" a toaster? You can't, you can make it easier to use. Whatever. Snobs.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
you can dumb down chess and make it tictactoe.
optional feature maybe, but then it makes appreciating progames harder for the casual fans.
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You can dumb-down IQ and make it post count. 
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
doesn't quite work that way.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
anyway, point is, some people think figuring out the range the hard way is an enjoyable part of the game. if you treat it instrumentally then thing doesn't work out the same.
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I say that range should be more of instinctual thing. I mean, most players will probably eventually end up with the ability to think, "ok, so the marine has about this range on the screen", and will be able to make an estimate range which will be good enough to battle with. Also, if you have 100 units, the range circles will be way too cluttered.
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On September 30 2007 01:44 oneofthem wrote:
anyway, point is, some people think figuring out the range the hard way is an enjoyable part of the game. if you treat it instrumentally then thing doesn't work out the same.
This is a matter of habit: in other games, HP and damage points have to be figured out instinctively, yet making it so in SCII would cause a mass TL suicide. Any element of chance or luck (such as hostile creeps or weather effects) is frowned upon. No, SC is a very precise, very mathematical game, which allows progamers to kill 500 Sunkens with two marines and a medic. That's what makes people compare it to chess and that's why I want to leave nothing "under the hood", from range to rate of fire.
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I can get used to the "game's in pre-alpha" but that "it will dumb down the game" is way too much to stand...
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my beef with the phrase "dumb-down" is that it implies somehow there is intellectual prowess behind the ability to, for instance, select a few buildings and build from them very fast, compared with the "dumbed down" version using MBS. It's derogatory - implying MBS is made especially for idiots, or something, which is utter nonsense. Skill != Intelligence. You need skill where your general intelligence alone cannot cope.
In BW you need lots of skill because it goes much faster than you can keep track of with analytical thought only. So you start to notice patterns, memorize them, practice, and develop skills. As you get more skilled, you use your intelligence less, not more, for handling anything heading your way in the game. Of course, vs a similarly skilled person, the decision-making remains a large factor, but vs a less skilled player you can win almost without thinking, which is in correspondence with my main point.
OMG did I just start an MBS war? oh I forgot to add that 0.999........ != 1.
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Stegosaur
Netherlands1231 Posts
Stop being so fucking anal about it. The guy asked a question and I replied. I think giving people lots of help playing the game equals dumbing it down, because it takes away from things you can figure out yourself.
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EPT
