EPTBasetradeTV and NoRegreT disagreement escalates - Page 5
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Starting from Page 11 and onward, if anyone talks about how Blizzard, TOs, and sponsors should no longer support BTTV and Rifkin, you will be temp banned. This adds NOTHING productive to the discussion and only makes the community look immature. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/532710-basetradetv-and-noregret-disagreement-escalates?page=11#216 Additionally, this post deserves to be publicly noticed. | ||
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GornWood
Germany121 Posts
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KalWarkov
Germany4126 Posts
He always has his very own opinion on things and doesn't change it when smarter people tell him that he's wrong User was warned for this post | ||
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WhiteSPiriT
France19 Posts
There is a couple of things to say, that have been globally already said. It's all about the contract, if there is anything written that says the material just go back to Rifkin if he wants, then you have nothing to say about it if you agreed to that. If this is the opposite and nothing is saying that the material should go back in the hands of Rifkin, then Noregret is right about it. So we can't say anything because we don't know what is written in that contract, we can just speculate, and it's not going to salve the situation, only Noregret and Rifkin can do this, it's up to them to read what is written in that contract. That being said, it looks like since a while that Rifkin is quite often into shady cases as this one. I wouldn't make any kind of agreement with him to be honest. To conclude I would like to add that the posts saying "nice drama", "I love dramas" "juicy drama" and so on ... Are just stupid. We are talking about 1500$. That's not nothing. And you can end being in a lot of troubles if you have to pay this amount without anything to back-up. I've seen people being just chased of their home/flat, just because they aren't able to pay their rent. And btw, make this public, is in my opinion, really unprofessional, you have a contract, just execute it. You don't need the community for this, it's private stuff. | ||
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pvsnp
7676 Posts
This could have been solved if both parties were willing to be somewhat reasonable, or failing that, via legal action. In no case should it have involved other players, other issues, or the general public, and the fact that it has degenerated so far that it dragged in all three of those is grossly unprofessional from both sides. Above all, emotionally-fueled decisions have no place in financial transactions, and both sides are guilty of exactly that. | ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19393 Posts
On April 05 2018 23:14 Musicus wrote: I don't think anybody should be siding with Rifkin or Jake as well. That's between them and does not involve us. But I think it's fine to side with the players who are uninvolved and ended up being punished for (imo) no valid reason. If it wasn't for that I would never have posted about this whole thing, which I've known about for months since it was discussed on Dankshrine. Once you target innocent players, I think it's normal for the community to show "outrage" and fight for the players. I can get behind that. I certainly have sympathy for the players in the house. It's a major distraction to have all the noise of business in the background when you need to focus on training. | ||
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RuiBarbO
United States1340 Posts
Also why did this even become public? The OP says something about an "anonymous accuser" but that seems pretty vague. It really doesn't reflect well on either party. | ||
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Silvanel
Poland4769 Posts
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Vanadiel
France961 Posts
On April 06 2018 02:04 LongShot27 wrote: See there's this thing about contracts, you legally have to do what they say. Well first off, that is generally not true, what is in the control has to be legal to begin with. And in this particular case, it's probably not in it otherwise it would have been said first. Probably there was an initial misunderstanding between the two parties about what was going to be the financial implication of BTT, but if the contract does not specify that the stuff bought with rifkin investment belong to him, or that there is a financial guaranty of his investment, I don't think Noregret has any obligations toward him. edit : however, I'd said that this tax stuff against the players seems completely unreasonable, unfair and most likely illegal. | ||
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RuiBarbO
United States1340 Posts
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ETisME
12889 Posts
On April 05 2018 20:57 BasetradeTV wrote: Pasting my response from reddit here as well: Unsure why this is being brought up now, considering the Unity Tax has been there since December. The new information added was not this, but the strike system, which did not exist before. There's a reason there hasn't been a public statement made, and why I won't be making a statement about this: Jake and I both signed a contract that includes a confidentiality clause in it. While he may not be willing to honour a contract, I am. Honestly Riff, this case is honestly the worst I have ever seen from you, not only do you again, get into this messy situation, you don't even solve the matter well. Just look at how you handled this Unity tax as an example. Did you discuss about the amount with noregret? Did you set a period of time of when it needs to be returned by? Did he agree to this compensation method? Did you even notify him about this change in separate email? Did you remind him of this when one of the players enter the tourney? Most importantly, did he acknowledge he is aware of this tax before and/or after the announcement? If you did not do any of the above, I can only see it two ways: Either you are just plain bad at communication and follow up, or this is an intentional hostile move. I am hoping it's the former but whenever I read the tone you use in messages/replies, I ain't so sure. not saying noregret has no blame in this (we don't know the details) but you constantly being in these situation is definitely a clear sign you are not learning fast enough. | ||
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Gurbak
France622 Posts
On April 06 2018 03:14 RuiBarbO wrote: One thing that does strike me as crummy for NoRegret is that, if this does go to small claims court, he has to book a quick flight back to North America to show up and defend himself. If he's in the wrong, then whatever, but if he's in the right or the contract really is ambiguous, then that kind of sucks. someone can represent him i guess | ||
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BisuDagger
Bisutopia19393 Posts
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Nakajin
Canada8991 Posts
On April 06 2018 03:21 BisuDagger wrote: If Scarlett makes it to the GSL finals I will crowdfund this. The quickest way for BTV and NoRegret to get this settled now is to give Scarlett all the resources she needs to make the finals and profit. Your right, lets start a matchfixing patreon  | ||
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HotDOSBuns
Canada172 Posts
But, I'm not here to make personal attacks on Rif. I don't care for him but I don't wish him ill either. It's the shadiness that bothers me, and this is not the first time I've felt that way towards him. He would make an excellent Macbeth; "Look like the innocent flower, but be the serpent under it." If at the end of the day, Jake owes him money, then so be it. But the 10% tax thing seems a little more than ridiculous and completely unfair to the players in the house. Drama can be fun on occasion but this is not one of those times. All I can hope for is that this unfortunate situation gets resolved and works out as fairly as possible for both parties. | ||
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palexhur
Colombia730 Posts
On April 06 2018 02:52 WhiteSPiriT wrote: I just created an account to participate to the discussion. There is a couple of things to say, that have been globally already said. It's all about the contract, if there is anything written that says the material just go back to Rifkin if he wants, then you have nothing to say about it if you agreed to that. If this is the opposite and nothing is saying that the material should go back in the hands of Rifkin, then Noregret is right about it. So we can't say anything because we don't know what is written in that contract, we can just speculate, and it's not going to salve the situation, only Noregret and Rifkin can do this, it's up to them to read what is written in that contract. That being said, it looks like since a while that Rifkin is quite often into shady cases as this one. I wouldn't make any kind of agreement with him to be honest. To conclude I would like to add that the posts saying "nice drama", "I love dramas" "juicy drama" and so on ... Are just stupid. We are talking about 1500$. That's not nothing. And you can end being in a lot of troubles if you have to pay this amount without anything to back-up. I've seen people being just chased of their home/flat, just because they aren't able to pay their rent. And btw, make this public, is in my opinion, really unprofessional, you have a contract, just execute it. You don't need the community for this, it's private stuff. Sorry but it they dont have any clause in the contract about that equipment, the owner of the things is the one who bought with his money that equipment, it is not like: "ok I put the furniture in anybodys apartment then if we part ways and I leave the apt, then that furniture now belongs to that person , if is not in the contract". | ||
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deacon.frost
Czech Republic12134 Posts
Not sure how 'murrica's law works, thanks in advance. | ||
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Keeemy
Finland7855 Posts
Or maybe Rifkin truly is a nice guy.  | ||
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Nakajin
Canada8991 Posts
On April 06 2018 03:48 Keeemy wrote: So Rifkin "threatened" NoRegreT with legal action back in december 2017 but still hasn't actually done anything? Surely if the legal options would have been "easy wins" (as Rifkin said) he would have done it already. Or maybe Rifkin truly is a nice guy. To be fair a cross-pacific civil lawsuit for 1500$ seems like a bit of an mess, I think their residencr in Canada are in different provinces to, don't know how civil lawsuit work in those cases since they all have their own tribunal system as far as I know. | ||
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On April 06 2018 03:53 Nakajin wrote: To be fair a cross-pacific civil lawsuit for 1500$ seems like a bit of an mess, I think their residencr in Canada are in different provinces to, don't know how civil lawsuit work in those cases since they all have their own tribunal system as far as I know. A well written contract would have a forum selection clause, but if the contract was well written I doubt things would have come to this. If there isn't jurisdiction could be a nightmare to establish. | ||
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Keeemy
Finland7855 Posts
On April 06 2018 03:53 Nakajin wrote: To be fair a cross-pacific civil lawsuit for 1500$ seems like a bit of an mess, I think their residencr in Canada are in different provinces to, don't know how civil lawsuit work in those cases since they all have their own tribunal system as far as I know. It would probably be a mess, I agree. I just thought it was funny how he threatened with legal action and boasted how it would be an easy win, but probably never intended to actually go through with it. Or maybe he did, who knows. Just show us the contract(s) and let us, the awesome community of TL, be the judges.  Otherwise all we can do is speculate and gossip, and that's not good for anyone. | ||
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