• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:39
CEST 18:39
KST 01:39
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End7Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2915Serral wins Maestros of the Game 244ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7
Community News
Weekly Cups (August 10-16): SHIN doubles2GSTL Returns in 2026!44Weekly Cups (Aug 3-9): Protoss get shut out7RSL goes to London! 2026 Offline Finals Nov 21-2212Weekly Cups (July 27-Aug 2): SHIN's big week0
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) Serral wins Maestros of the Game 2 GSTL Returns in 2026! SC4ALL II: SC2 Player Announcement 6/8 - Maru Weekly Cups (August 10-16): SHIN doubles
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) 2026 GSTL Announcement PIG STY FESTIVAL 8.0! (13 - 23 August) WardiTV Mondays 2026 KungFu Cup Announcement
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
Nexus Wars 2021 GUIDE [M] (2) Industrial Park
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 539 Thunder Dome Mutation # 538 Media Blackout Mutation # 537 Hostile Territory
Brood War
General
Are you ready for ASL 22? NEW HYPE VIDEO BW General Discussion [ASL22] Ro24 Preview: Summer's End [Personal Project Share] Terran Defense v0.60 SC4ALL II: Brood War Player Announcement 3/4 - soO
Tourneys
[ASL22] Ro24 Group C CSLAN 4 is Coming! [ASL22] Ro24 Group A [ASL22] Ro24 Group B
Strategy
Odyssey Mineral Stack Saturation Fighting Spirit mining rates Any training maps people recommend? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Anyone here play Quakeworld back in the day? Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread EVE Corporation
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish TSM pausing esports and CLG Dead
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank TL Mafia Community Thread NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Artificial Intelligence Thread The Letting Off Steam Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
MarineLorD Fan Club The ShoWTimE Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread Series you have seen recently...
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NBA General Discussion Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop
TL Community
The Automated Ban List Northern Ireland Global Starcraft
Blogs
LOCKPICKING NOOB
LUCKY_NOOB
Chinese Gen Z: Between Dream…
TrAiDoS
Cathedral Of CS And NY pizza a…
FuDDx
Please support my new stand…
Peanutsc
Hello guys!
LIN1s
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 7283 users

Community Feedback Update - March 6 - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
291 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 13 14 15 Next All
Fango
Profile Joined July 2016
United Kingdom8987 Posts
March 07 2018 00:06 GMT
#21
I'd rather nydus get changed that overlord drops if I'm honest. Droperlords at least seemed holdable to some degree in recent pro matches. I don't actually remember the last time I saw a nydus fail
Zest, sOs, PartinG, Dark, and Maru are the real champs. ROOT_herO is overrated. Snute, Serral, and Scarlett are the foreigner GOATs
Zaros
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United Kingdom3692 Posts
March 07 2018 00:08 GMT
#22
On March 07 2018 09:06 Fango wrote:
I'd rather nydus get changed that overlord drops if I'm honest. Droperlords at least seemed holdable to some degree in recent pro matches. I don't actually remember the last time I saw a nydus fail


This might weaken the nydus anyway if you dont have to open stargate the nydus might suck vs a robo opening or twilight.
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23579 Posts
March 07 2018 00:12 GMT
#23
On March 07 2018 09:05 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 07 2018 08:55 Musicus wrote:
Back to defense only as zerg or go super all-in with that Elazer/Rogue nydus bullshit.

An aggressive option that could set up a cool macro game was too much I guess.

The Stargate problem is a scouting problem and not a "must open stargate to survive ling drops" problem imo.


We rarely ever saw "aggressive options that could set up macro games". Sure people occasionally went for some 8 ling drops for some harassment, but overwhelmingly it was 16 lings or ling/ravager or ling/baneling off a minimal drone count that either killed the opponent or lost.

Well I still think the ling drops were the least all-in option compared to ling/bane, ling/ravager or nydus/roach/queen all-ins. All those will still be viable. Would've rather seen the nydus bs removed for example.
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
ilikeredheads
Profile Joined August 2011
Canada1995 Posts
March 07 2018 00:17 GMT
#24
Raven nerf seems excessively harsh. They are the only thing keeping terran relevant in late game but let's nerf it
Ramiz1989
Profile Joined July 2012
12124 Posts
March 07 2018 00:27 GMT
#25
On March 07 2018 09:17 ilikeredheads wrote:
Raven nerf seems excessively harsh. They are the only thing keeping terran relevant in late game but let's nerf it

I definitely think that Terran should have a late game army that could put up a fight against Zerg and Protoss, but that being said I don't think that massing casters is a way to go. We all know how massing Infestors in WoL looked like, and although I've seen mass Infestors in one of Serral's games(against Trap I think?) at the Katowice, it was mostly for Neural Parasite on big units and not for spamming Fungal Growth and Infested Terrans like they were used for before.

Any late playstyle that revolves around spamming mostly casters and trading energy for minerals should be eradicated in my opinion no matter the race, casters are there to support the rest of your army. Even having like 10 casters can be overwhelming, but it is still fine I guess, as long as you are not having something like 30 of them. I still have nightmares from those games where I've seen 40+ Infestors and nothing else, pure horror...
"I've been to hell and back, and back to hell…and back. This time, I've brought Hell back with me."
ZigguratOfUr
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Iraq16955 Posts
March 07 2018 00:27 GMT
#26
On March 07 2018 09:12 Musicus wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 07 2018 09:05 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On March 07 2018 08:55 Musicus wrote:
Back to defense only as zerg or go super all-in with that Elazer/Rogue nydus bullshit.

An aggressive option that could set up a cool macro game was too much I guess.

The Stargate problem is a scouting problem and not a "must open stargate to survive ling drops" problem imo.


We rarely ever saw "aggressive options that could set up macro games". Sure people occasionally went for some 8 ling drops for some harassment, but overwhelmingly it was 16 lings or ling/ravager or ling/baneling off a minimal drone count that either killed the opponent or lost.

Well I still think the ling drops were the least all-in option compared to ling/bane, ling/ravager or nydus/roach/queen all-ins. All those will still be viable. Would've rather seen the nydus bs removed for example.


Nerfing nydus wouldn't improve Protoss opening diversity one wit. And 16 ling drops are just as all-in as the others when you have barely any drones.
LTCM
Profile Joined May 2017
174 Posts
March 07 2018 00:45 GMT
#27
I cannot believe anyone is even defending ling drops in their current shape. No one can say with a straight face that they were good for the game post msc removal. Overlords are already so strong in all their forms there's no way blizzard wasn't going to nerf them somehow.
Byun is a convicted match-fixer.
DomeGetta
Profile Joined February 2012
480 Posts
March 07 2018 00:48 GMT
#28
Rogue wins the last 3 major tournaments and we are nerfing terran? We finally saw terran win a couple late game scenarios vs zerg and already killing the raven?? 30 might be too much dmg but 5 is ridiculous..start at 5??? 6 x nerf? Dont try 15 first or even 10 rofl??? What in the fuck am i reading. 1 more corrupter shot on vikings LOL
DomeGetta
Profile Joined February 2012
480 Posts
March 07 2018 00:51 GMT
#29
On March 07 2018 09:27 Ramiz1989 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 07 2018 09:17 ilikeredheads wrote:
Raven nerf seems excessively harsh. They are the only thing keeping terran relevant in late game but let's nerf it

I definitely think that Terran should have a late game army that could put up a fight against Zerg and Protoss, but that being said I don't think that massing casters is a way to go. We all know how massing Infestors in WoL looked like, and although I've seen mass Infestors in one of Serral's games(against Trap I think?) at the Katowice, it was mostly for Neural Parasite on big units and not for spamming Fungal Growth and Infested Terrans like they were used for before.

Any late playstyle that revolves around spamming mostly casters and trading energy for minerals should be eradicated in my opinion no matter the race, casters are there to support the rest of your army. Even having like 10 casters can be overwhelming, but it is still fine I guess, as long as you are not having something like 30 of them. I still have nightmares from those games where I've seen 40+ Infestors and nothing else, pure horror...

Yah i agree with late game turtle playstyle being retarded..problem is that protoss and zerg both already have it ..carriers and broodlords both need out of the game if terran has no answer..terran air cant fight zerg or protoss air this is clear with a useless raven.
LaughNgamez
Profile Joined April 2015
Canada525 Posts
March 07 2018 00:52 GMT
#30
They should just increase the connection time for the AAM so it's more easy to split vs. There's plenty of AOE in the game in which the only counter play is to split. It's a better alternative instead of nerfing the unit to shit so it has 2 nerfed useless abilities.
(◕‿◕✿) Hopefully one day a decent caster http://www.youtube.com/LaughNgamez (◠‿◠✿)
THERIDDLER
Profile Joined July 2014
Canada137 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-07 00:56:40
March 07 2018 00:55 GMT
#31
They should get community feedback before making changes
Please don't fricken hack, its just a game.
LTCM
Profile Joined May 2017
174 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-07 00:58:41
March 07 2018 00:57 GMT
#32
On March 07 2018 09:51 DomeGetta wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 07 2018 09:27 Ramiz1989 wrote:
On March 07 2018 09:17 ilikeredheads wrote:
Raven nerf seems excessively harsh. They are the only thing keeping terran relevant in late game but let's nerf it

I definitely think that Terran should have a late game army that could put up a fight against Zerg and Protoss, but that being said I don't think that massing casters is a way to go. We all know how massing Infestors in WoL looked like, and although I've seen mass Infestors in one of Serral's games(against Trap I think?) at the Katowice, it was mostly for Neural Parasite on big units and not for spamming Fungal Growth and Infested Terrans like they were used for before.

Any late playstyle that revolves around spamming mostly casters and trading energy for minerals should be eradicated in my opinion no matter the race, casters are there to support the rest of your army. Even having like 10 casters can be overwhelming, but it is still fine I guess, as long as you are not having something like 30 of them. I still have nightmares from those games where I've seen 40+ Infestors and nothing else, pure horror...

Yah i agree with late game turtle playstyle being retarded..problem is that protoss and zerg both already have it ..carriers and broodlords both need out of the game if terran has no answer..terran air cant fight zerg or protoss air this is clear with a useless raven.


Terrans have never had an issue fighting carriers and it's dishonest to say otherwise. Terran already has plenty of options to fight carriers straight up.
Byun is a convicted match-fixer.
brickrd
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
United States4894 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-07 01:17:34
March 07 2018 01:01 GMT
#33
the problem with ling drops is more than just holding them but, as others have said, that it forces out early defense in the main mineral line as well as stargate units to shut down drop ovies.

i have been a Z/P player for years, and i love the new dropperlords, but speaking objectively as someone who plays both matchups there's too much flexibility in how zerg can play out the game. holding the allins is entirely possible, but there's zero margin for error in any detail of your build, your wall and your micro, it's a highly practiced and unforgiving early game interaction that makes the game less fun in PVZ.

i would compare it to when PVZ cannon rushing was extremely safe and extremely frustrating to play against back in HOTS. it's not really that PVZ is imba because of unit interactions (once you get to midgame protoss is fine), but it feels extremely stunted and scripted from the protoss point of view. there's almost no way to mix it up early as toss without dying to a lot of popular high-percentage allins.

i don't feel like it's fair for protoss to be punished for greedy walling the natural when they HAVE TO wall the natural to play a macro game. there's no "safer option" for protoss builds, if you don't gate expand you're fucked. with the mineral growth rate of LOTV you can't even do one base tech builds anymore because the pylon timings aren't right
TL+ Member
DomeGetta
Profile Joined February 2012
480 Posts
March 07 2018 01:21 GMT
#34
On March 07 2018 09:57 LTCM wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 07 2018 09:51 DomeGetta wrote:
On March 07 2018 09:27 Ramiz1989 wrote:
On March 07 2018 09:17 ilikeredheads wrote:
Raven nerf seems excessively harsh. They are the only thing keeping terran relevant in late game but let's nerf it

I definitely think that Terran should have a late game army that could put up a fight against Zerg and Protoss, but that being said I don't think that massing casters is a way to go. We all know how massing Infestors in WoL looked like, and although I've seen mass Infestors in one of Serral's games(against Trap I think?) at the Katowice, it was mostly for Neural Parasite on big units and not for spamming Fungal Growth and Infested Terrans like they were used for before.

Any late playstyle that revolves around spamming mostly casters and trading energy for minerals should be eradicated in my opinion no matter the race, casters are there to support the rest of your army. Even having like 10 casters can be overwhelming, but it is still fine I guess, as long as you are not having something like 30 of them. I still have nightmares from those games where I've seen 40+ Infestors and nothing else, pure horror...

Yah i agree with late game turtle playstyle being retarded..problem is that protoss and zerg both already have it ..carriers and broodlords both need out of the game if terran has no answer..terran air cant fight zerg or protoss air this is clear with a useless raven.


Terrans have never had an issue fighting carriers and it's dishonest to say otherwise. Terran already has plenty of options to fight carriers straight up.


Im not talking about fighting them straight up. Im talking about mothership / tempest/ all splash damage caster/colo comp stats was using. Maru loses that 100% without the 20 ravens. There is no answer. There is literally no arguement that carriers arent a turtlewhores dream unit.
breaker1328
Profile Joined March 2016
Canada300 Posts
March 07 2018 01:22 GMT
#35
I'm not surprised at all by the Raven change. It's called "Anti Armor Missile", not "Nuke." I'm not sure exactly a minor buff to Vikings is going to mean for the match up though. Feels like something is missing.
TheWinks
Profile Joined July 2011
United States572 Posts
March 07 2018 01:23 GMT
#36
If you want the anti-armor missile to be used "as intended" you have to give terrans a way to take effective engagements while the debuff is up. I would argue it currently is being used as intended though because the only time you see large amounts of damage come out of AAM is when units are clumped up from move commands. When they're spread out, very little effective damage is done and very few units get hit by the debuff. In that sense the damage serves as a disincentive for the enemy from just always running away, which clumps up their units.

The compensatory buff to the Viking does absolutely nothing though. This should never reach live without appropriate compensation for a massive late game nerf.
ZigguratOfUr
Profile Blog Joined April 2012
Iraq16955 Posts
March 07 2018 01:31 GMT
#37
On March 07 2018 10:23 TheWinks wrote:
If you want the anti-armor missile to be used "as intended" you have to give terrans a way to take effective engagements while the debuff is up. I would argue it currently is being used as intended though because the only time you see large amounts of damage come out of AAM is when units are clumped up from move commands. When they're spread out, very little effective damage is done and very few units get hit by the debuff. In that sense the damage serves as a disincentive for the enemy from just always running away, which clumps up their units.

The compensatory buff to the Viking does absolutely nothing though. This should never reach live without appropriate compensation for a massive late game nerf.


Are you seriously arguing that ravens are working "as intended" when mass raven is specifically what Blizzard doesn't want to happen? As for "very little effective damage" being done lol
seemsgood
Profile Joined January 2016
5527 Posts
March 07 2018 01:34 GMT
#38
Stop buffing air units!!!!!!!!!!!!!!God damn it blizzard!!! Just stop!
franzji
Profile Joined September 2013
United States583 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-07 01:41:32
March 07 2018 01:40 GMT
#39
Well, at IEM we did see raven builds where they were not massed... vs. both Zerg and Protoss.

So I am very glad blizzard isn't letting mass raven become the game. The viking buff is a much better buff too, even helps T vs. P.

And the overlord drop nerf is so great... Though scarlett is going to be known by some people as the zerg who made it to the GSL RO8 by overlord drops.

I think the game is in a great spot and I like that they keep fixing little things here and there with community feedback.
seemsgood
Profile Joined January 2016
5527 Posts
March 07 2018 01:43 GMT
#40
On March 07 2018 08:05 Snakestyle1 wrote:
I saw it coming, I knew the ravens were not gonna stay, it was really broken.

Also, as a zerg player who recently offraced some protoss, I also saw the ling drop nerf coming. Damn that is really strong when the protoss doesnt have tight build order and good micro and building placement. I had a lot of problems against early ling drop + mass ling flood builds, I always took so much damage.

Overall, 2 really solid changes. I still wonder if mothership reallly needs to be in the game. I know its too cool looking and epic to remove, but balance wise, it doesnt seem fair that only protoss has 1 hero unit. ( 2, with probius) Do they really need an extra recall in the mothership? They already have nexus recalls, which are really clutch...


As for terran late game, the viking buffs is alright.. but...

Battlecruisers!! What are you waiting for? The fix is easy.

The problem with battle cruisers against zerg especially, is that they are DOUBLE hard countered by the corruptors.

I explain.
1) Their armor is armored and massive, meaning they take a LOT of dmg from corruptors.
2) They attack really fast for really little damage, similar to marines. Meaning the corruptors natural high armor of 2 hard counters the BCs attack. Its pretty much like marines shooting at ultralisks.

The fix is obvious, you have to make BCS more like starcraft1 bcs. Attack slower, for high damage. Maybe a tiny bit of cleave damage to 2 close targets? Might be too strong.

Obviously if you buff the BCs, teleport and yamato have to be reworked.

Make the bcs a strong a-move unit. Terran does not have good late game A-move units. Their late game units are all super micro intensive, while the other races late game unit is super a-move.

Capital air units are strong because spell casters are strong.
Raven + BC in HOTS,Broodlord + infestors or vipers and of course Carriers + High templars.
Those big ass ship can't do shit without support and tier 2 anti air of any race will destroy them all.We can nerf viper or raven but protoss is not the case.This time the carrier itself needs to be nerfed not HTs.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 13 14 15 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 7h 21m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft423
mouzHeroMarine 320
UpATreeSC 16
BRAT_OK 3
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 30619
Calm 4976
Light 1565
Bisu 1004
Mini 754
Shuttle 671
Soma 589
ZerO 326
Soulkey 315
Hyuk 244
[ Show more ]
Stork 231
Snow 221
Rush 189
Dewaltoss 156
hero 115
PianO 66
Yoon 61
Mong 55
Liquid`Ret 54
JYJ 48
Barracks 28
sSak 21
Terrorterran 21
soO 19
Rock 18
NaDa 13
Free 12
Noble 7
firebathero 0
Dota 2
qojqva6518
Dendi1949
BananaSlamJamma247
resolut1ontv 142
Counter-Strike
fl0m6326
olofmeister1894
shoxiejesuss1444
x6flipin661
byalli546
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King107
Heroes of the Storm
Grubby2097
Other Games
singsing1714
Liquid`RaSZi1385
FrodaN536
DeMusliM319
RotterdaM212
ToD118
Beastyqt114
C9.Mang063
Chillindude48
Trikslyr48
SteadfastSC48
KnowMe46
ZerO(Twitch)20
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
lovetv 12
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Shameless 35
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• Pr0nogo 2
• Michael_bg 1
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV859
League of Legends
• TFBlade904
Other Games
• Shiphtur314
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
7h 21m
The PondCast
17h 21m
KCM Race Survival
17h 21m
Replay Cast
1d 7h
Escore
1d 17h
PiG Sty Festival
1d 19h
CranKy Ducklings
2 days
PiG Sty Festival
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
3 days
[ Show More ]
PiG Sty Festival
3 days
The Patches Monday
4 days
GSL
5 days
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSLAN 4
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
K-JUNGMAN
ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
CSL Season 22: Qualifier 1
RSL Revival: Season 6
PiG Sty Festival 8.0
META DYMY #4
Esports World Cup 2026
Esports World Cup 2026: LCQ
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W8
CSL Season 22: Qualifier 2
CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - TRS
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Acropolis #5 - GSA
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
Big Dog Cup 2026 Div 1
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.