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LotV Design Changes announced - Page 22

Forum Index > SC2 General
907 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 20 21 22 23 24 46 Next All
Isualin
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany1903 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-15 17:03:56
August 15 2016 17:03 GMT
#421
On August 16 2016 02:02 WhosQuany wrote:

Show nested quote +
On August 15 2016 18:43 Isualin wrote:
On August 15 2016 18:21 WhosQuany wrote:
Disruption Sphere: lol? PSI STORM from a Tempest? no thanks Trash the Tempest even though this could counter LURKER play

I think this ability could be utilized really well.
13 cast range, 14 dps for 32 seconds and 43 second cooldown(~75% uptime)


Its a retarded ForceFieldStorm (trust me nobody wants this) from a unit that Protoss doesn´t need and never needed (designed to counter Broodlords)

I don't want it as well but it looks really strong on paper
| INnoVation | The literal god TY | ByuNjwa | LRSL when? |
Gullis
Profile Joined April 2012
Sweden740 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-15 17:43:36
August 15 2016 17:03 GMT
#422
But with splash and uppgrades they pretty much 2 shot them

(not whining just clarifying)
I would rather eat than see my children starve.
WhosQuany
Profile Joined June 2013
Germany257 Posts
August 15 2016 17:06 GMT
#423
On August 16 2016 02:03 Isualin wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 16 2016 02:02 WhosQuany wrote:

On August 15 2016 18:43 Isualin wrote:
On August 15 2016 18:21 WhosQuany wrote:
Disruption Sphere: lol? PSI STORM from a Tempest? no thanks Trash the Tempest even though this could counter LURKER play

I think this ability could be utilized really well.
13 cast range, 14 dps for 32 seconds and 43 second cooldown(~75% uptime)


Its a retarded ForceFieldStorm (trust me nobody wants this) from a unit that Protoss doesn´t need and never needed (designed to counter Broodlords)

I don't want it as well but it looks really strong on paper


Of course its strong but i think this would be to much...
a death ball A-Move Protoss army splashing storms Force-fields and now this BS? pls no
Goin back to Cali
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20285 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-15 17:14:23
August 15 2016 17:09 GMT
#424
On August 15 2016 18:12 Grumbels wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 15 2016 17:51 Cyro wrote:
The more pressing question is not whether Blizzard should have left the siege tank alone back then in order to force players to adjust, which is somewhat pedantic, but to ask why Blizzard didn't take another look at the siege tank when starting with Heart of the Swarm.


They actually did. They adjusted some stuff like removing the research on seige mode, but the widow mine (new child of HOTS) quickly took over through balance changes as being "the thing" to support bio.

Myeah, but it wasn't really a serious attempt and they had been removing other upgrades around that time. The small attack speed increase was mostly for show too.

But it's true that the widow mine seemed a superior alternative better suited to SC2's quick pace and the demands of bio armies. The game is actually full of units that have been overshadowed by their younger, more attractive cousins. It's not at all obvious what should be done with them (send them to a farm upstate?).


It was fairly serious, those two together were great buffs.

It's just that the spotlight was stolen by the warhound (which was poorly designed from the start, highly mobile t2 unit that cost effectively countered every single unit and composition), the widow mine and the hellbat.

All three of these units were tuned to be too strong and then removed / toned down over the years.

Tank has been on the weaker side for a while. Come LOTV they saw that the tank and its styles were performing badly and chose to give it a lot of mobility instead of giving it the ability to fight better which was a mistake IMO and one that they're going back on now with these changes
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
-NegativeZero-
Profile Joined August 2011
United States2141 Posts
August 15 2016 17:12 GMT
#425
On August 16 2016 02:03 Gullis wrote:
But with splash and uppgrades they pretty much 2 shot them

yeah as soon as t has +1 attack it's a guaranteed 2 shot
vibeo gane,
Sweetness.751
Profile Joined April 2011
United States225 Posts
August 15 2016 17:13 GMT
#426
On August 16 2016 02:00 opisska wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 16 2016 01:56 -NegativeZero- wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:12 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 15 2016 01:43 RuneZerg wrote:
should have buffed hydra hp instead of increasing range... already a bad balance between damage output and survivability tbh, i mean new siege tank 2 shots hydras...


Or do they? Maybe you should take a close look at the stats....and actually do the math.

new tank does 40 dmg vs light, hydra has 80 hp, that would be 2 shots


That will leave the hydras with 1 hp after two shots due to regeneration


BOOM

I'll be looking for that apology letter in my PM folder later today.
Elentos wrote: Do you think only 10 life points more for Viking is enough bObA wrote: 10 life points is all you need to send someone to the Shadow Realm.
Cyro
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United Kingdom20285 Posts
August 15 2016 17:15 GMT
#427
On August 16 2016 02:13 Sweetness.751 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 16 2016 02:00 opisska wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:56 -NegativeZero- wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:12 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 15 2016 01:43 RuneZerg wrote:
should have buffed hydra hp instead of increasing range... already a bad balance between damage output and survivability tbh, i mean new siege tank 2 shots hydras...


Or do they? Maybe you should take a close look at the stats....and actually do the math.

new tank does 40 dmg vs light, hydra has 80 hp, that would be 2 shots


That will leave the hydras with 1 hp after two shots due to regeneration


BOOM

I'll be looking for that apology letter in my PM folder later today.


Tanks fire instantly and perfectly simultaneously (with no travel time). It's quite likely that two tanks shooting at the same target can kill it before any regen occurs but i'm not sure if this happens or not
"oh my god my overclock... I got a single WHEA error on the 23rd hour, 9 minutes" -Belial88
opisska
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Poland8852 Posts
August 15 2016 17:21 GMT
#428
On August 16 2016 02:15 Cyro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 16 2016 02:13 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 16 2016 02:00 opisska wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:56 -NegativeZero- wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:12 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 15 2016 01:43 RuneZerg wrote:
should have buffed hydra hp instead of increasing range... already a bad balance between damage output and survivability tbh, i mean new siege tank 2 shots hydras...


Or do they? Maybe you should take a close look at the stats....and actually do the math.

new tank does 40 dmg vs light, hydra has 80 hp, that would be 2 shots


That will leave the hydras with 1 hp after two shots due to regeneration


BOOM

I'll be looking for that apology letter in my PM folder later today.


Tanks fire instantly and perfectly simultaneously (with no travel time). It's quite likely that two tanks shooting at the same target can kill it before any regen occurs but i'm not sure if this happens or not


With the upgrades it becomes a pretty academic point, but I would still find it interesting if someone would be able to make a comparison how a flock of hydras fares against a group of tanks with regeneration on/off (I have no idea how to change stuff like that and even if I had, I am too lazy to be bothered )
"Jeez, that's far from ideal." - Serral, the king of mild trashtalk
TL+ Member
SHODAN
Profile Joined November 2011
United Kingdom1074 Posts
August 15 2016 17:23 GMT
#429
I'm a terran player who has been playing mech since WoL.

I only played bio vs toss, but I quit playing entirely after mech went extinct vT / vZ.

can't wait to test these changes and learn a whole new meta!
Empirimancer
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada1024 Posts
August 15 2016 17:27 GMT
#430
Well, if nothing else these changes will make the game feel different for a while.

Sweetness.751
Profile Joined April 2011
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-15 17:41:33
August 15 2016 17:31 GMT
#431
On August 16 2016 02:15 Cyro wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 16 2016 02:13 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 16 2016 02:00 opisska wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:56 -NegativeZero- wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:12 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 15 2016 01:43 RuneZerg wrote:
should have buffed hydra hp instead of increasing range... already a bad balance between damage output and survivability tbh, i mean new siege tank 2 shots hydras...


Or do they? Maybe you should take a close look at the stats....and actually do the math.

new tank does 40 dmg vs light, hydra has 80 hp, that would be 2 shots


That will leave the hydras with 1 hp after two shots due to regeneration


BOOM

I'll be looking for that apology letter in my PM folder later today.


Tanks fire instantly and perfectly simultaneously (with no travel time). It's quite likely that two tanks shooting at the same target can kill it before any regen occurs but i'm not sure if this happens or not


Yes it will be quite likely (typically the 1st Hydra that walks in), but it nevertheless will always be the extreme exception, not the rule. Edit: Zerg units regen instantly upon taking damage so regardless of how its broken down, you need to do 81 damage to kill a Hydra.


Not to mention, you are complaining about the interaction between Hydras vs Tanks. Do you also complain about Immortals when you build Roaches or Banelings when you build Zerglings?

There are just some units that perform poorly versus another. The real problem I see is that you seem to think the answer to Tanks are...... mass Hydras.

Maybe build some Roaches to absorb the initial volleys, some Zerglings. You may just discover that spamming one unit is not how an RTS should work.
Elentos wrote: Do you think only 10 life points more for Viking is enough bObA wrote: 10 life points is all you need to send someone to the Shadow Realm.
ROOTFayth
Profile Joined January 2004
Canada3351 Posts
August 15 2016 17:32 GMT
#432
lol people crying before it's even live, just wait until it's live, then cry about whatever you feel is too good in game and they will tweak it
Sweetness.751
Profile Joined April 2011
United States225 Posts
Last Edited: 2016-08-15 17:41:55
August 15 2016 17:40 GMT
#433
On August 16 2016 02:31 Sweetness.751 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 16 2016 02:15 Cyro wrote:
On August 16 2016 02:13 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 16 2016 02:00 opisska wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:56 -NegativeZero- wrote:
On August 16 2016 01:12 Sweetness.751 wrote:
On August 15 2016 01:43 RuneZerg wrote:
should have buffed hydra hp instead of increasing range... already a bad balance between damage output and survivability tbh, i mean new siege tank 2 shots hydras...


Or do they? Maybe you should take a close look at the stats....and actually do the math.

new tank does 40 dmg vs light, hydra has 80 hp, that would be 2 shots


That will leave the hydras with 1 hp after two shots due to regeneration


BOOM

I'll be looking for that apology letter in my PM folder later today.


Tanks fire instantly and perfectly simultaneously (with no travel time). It's quite likely that two tanks shooting at the same target can kill it before any regen occurs but i'm not sure if this happens or not


Yes it will be quite likely (typically the 1st Hydra that walks in), but it nevertheless will always be the extreme exception, not the rule. Edit: Zerg units regen instantly upon taking damage so regardless of how its broken down, you need to do 81 damage to kill a Hydra.

Not to mention, you are complaining about the interaction between Hydras vs Tanks. Do you also complain about Immortals when you build Roaches or Banelings when you build Zerglings?

There are just some units that perform poorly versus another. The real problem I see is that you seem to think the answer to Tanks are...... mass Hydras.

Maybe build some Roaches to absorb the initial volleys, some Zerglings. You may just discover that spamming one unit is not how an RTS should work.


Mispost please delete
Elentos wrote: Do you think only 10 life points more for Viking is enough bObA wrote: 10 life points is all you need to send someone to the Shadow Realm.
Daswollvieh
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
5553 Posts
August 15 2016 17:52 GMT
#434
Blizzard has the balls to really change the game, absolutely love it. Feels like Christmas.
royalroadweed
Profile Joined April 2013
United States8301 Posts
August 15 2016 17:56 GMT
#435
A minor buff to thor splash radius and a reduction in broodlord range to 10 will change nothing in regard to thor broodlord interaction. Thors will still get wrecked. I think Blizzard forgot that they buffed the broodlord in lotv. For the entirely of wol and hots the broodlord did have 10 range and the thor had an antiair mode thats better against armored targets. Thors were still garbage against them.
"Nerfing Toss can just make them stronger"
parkufarku
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
882 Posts
August 15 2016 18:13 GMT
#436
Too much unjustified Terran buffs when they are already the strongest race. Ugh.

I know which game I'm uninstalling and unsubscribing on Youtube on.

User was warned for this post
Cyanocyst
Profile Joined October 2010
2222 Posts
August 15 2016 18:29 GMT
#437
Wait don't SC2 tanks have smart fire?

Unlike in brood war where any tank in range would fire, effectively over killing that unit. So if you shuttled in a few zelots into range, just before sending your army you could kind of mitigate the dmg received of the first volley or so, while the rest of your army gap closed.

We'll see how it goes, though i think that something to consider with how powerful the new tanks will be.
|| Fruit Dealer | Leenock | Yughio | Coca | Sniper | True | Solar | Dark |
Fango
Profile Joined July 2016
United Kingdom8987 Posts
August 15 2016 18:30 GMT
#438
On August 16 2016 03:13 parkufarku wrote:
Too much unjustified Terran buffs when they are already the strongest race. Ugh.

I know which game I'm uninstalling and unsubscribing on Youtube on.


Lol I ain't never seen someone comaplin than Terran is the best race, not since WoL or the mech era at the end of HoTS
Zest, sOs, PartinG, Dark, and Maru are the real champs. ROOT_herO is overrated. Snute, Serral, and Scarlett are the foreigner GOATs
[F_]aths
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Germany3947 Posts
August 15 2016 18:31 GMT
#439
On August 15 2016 01:44 Solar424 wrote:
I don't even care if none of these changes get put in: the fact that they are even being considered shows that David Kim has no idea what he is doing. How he has not been replaced yet is one of the great mysteries of the universe.

Why so salty? I think, Dayvie and his team have some great ideas of their own, combined with some of the better player feedback.
You don't choose to play zerg. The zerg choose you.
Deleted User 132135
Profile Joined December 2010
702 Posts
August 15 2016 18:34 GMT
#440
On August 16 2016 03:13 parkufarku wrote:
Too much unjustified Terran buffs when they are already the strongest race. Ugh.

I know which game I'm uninstalling and unsubscribing on Youtube on.


This is not about balance. It is about a new direction of game design. Balance takes place after that has happened, not now.
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