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Apoteosis
Chile820 Posts
- Marines - Widow Mines - Thors - Liberators - Battlecruisers - Turrets (these are not units but still) Zerg units that are hard-counters to liberators: - Viper (parasitic bomb) - Corruptors Erase the valkyriesque AA attack on the liberator and mutas should counter it effectively, and Terran should rely on marines and thors to defend them from mutalisk flocks. With this nerf, tvz will go back to his former glory. | ||
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Shuffleblade
Sweden1903 Posts
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:26 DinoMight wrote: Unless Terrans can win with 80% Tanks they will continue to complain... Vultures and Goliaths are ok too. So are mass science vessels and wraiths and Valkeries and Dropships and BCs. Just specifically SC2 units are not fine. I mean, it makes sense if you think about it. It's not the same as in BW so it shouldn't be called the same. Let's call SC2 Mech from now on "real Mech" and BW Mech shall keep its name "Mech". | ||
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p68
100 Posts
On January 14 2016 03:46 blade55555 wrote: Blizzard just ignore mech, only a select few players want to turtle mech let's please not give it to them as that will ruin the tvz match up if that becomes a strong style. Ignore mech or turtle mech? You are suggesting that they're the same thing and they're not. Mech does not mean turtle until you get a 200/200 sky Terran army. Mech was forced to turtle because of its lack of aggressive capacity, which is a design issue. Moving out before 200/200 was practically suicide. The difference between mech and bio, regarding pace, should be steadily increasing aggression vs constant hyper-aggression, not turtling vs not-turtling. LOTV economy prohibits turtling on 3 base anyway. To Blizzard, I'd say that tankivacs is actually an item that helps mech be aggressive. The issue is this play-style better synergies best with bio, because medivacs. Issue 1: Hellbats Although hellbats can be healed by medivacs, hellbats aren't in a very good spot in LOTV, with the brief exception of early TvZ timing pushes. They suck at dodging corrosive bile (combination of their movement speed and their limited attack range) and disruptor shots. Marines outclass them not only in this respect, but also in DPS and the ability to shoot air units. Hellbats a great unit for boosting medivacs and dropping them on top of the enemy army, but taking up four cargo slots really killed this as a general tactic. Thus, one issue I propose with mech is the current status of hellbats. There are many ways to consider improving them, including making transformation time faster to improve mobility, reverting the cargo space nerf, or give them a "super waddle" short burst of speed to help close distance. Issue 2: Anti-air I believe Blizzard still plans on addressing this by buffing the Thor, but they haven't talked about it in a while. If it goes through, it's a good ground-to-air solution for mech. Issue 3: Cyclone Along with the tankivac, this is a unit that has aggression-potential. Problem is, it's fragile, expensive, and scales terribly. Its use in the current meta is restricted to building one or two in the early game to help defend, and in more rare cases, participate in early pressure. But past the early game, the unit effectively disappears from the battlefield. I personally don't know what could be done with the unit, given its design makes balance rest on a very fine line between underused and overpowered. Whatever happens, it would be great for this unit to scale better and allow mech to be aggressive without having to wait till 200/00. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:29 Shuffleblade wrote: Nerfing one part of PO and buffing another is not, "a nerf". Its a buff in some situation and a nerf in others. Which means its a change or a patch. Most definitely not a nerf, you are not on the same page as everyone else. Because everyone else wants a PO nerf, not a PO change. No. People are calling for it to be "less spammable." That's exactly what they've done with this PO change. In effect, it will be a nerf. Because it will force Protoss to make more defensive units rather than relying on PO. | ||
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avilo
United States4100 Posts
On January 14 2016 04:53 KeksX wrote: I personally agree with the "Ignore Mech" notion. At least in regards to the "pure mech" composition. I can't think of a single game where I faced pure mech and thought "Well, that was fun" afterwards. Actually those are the most frustrating games, even if I win. So Even if balanaced, it's neither fun to watch nor to play against mech. Much rather see mech units being viable in combination with bio play. Add diversity instead of an alternative. In fact, I'd love to see that with all the races. Going "this one composition that will be my unit comp until the very end" is pretty much the only thing that seriously annoys me currently. Tech switching and having multiple units available instead of just a few that I selected in the early game is the most exciting thing for me. The reason you've had this experience is because blizzard has always nerfed mech repeatedly and kept mech so bad that it's impossible to ever split up your army because tanks are so weak. What that means is in order to play a mech game you basically have to sit there doing nothing until you have a critical enough mass of units to move on the map...and then when you have that critical mass of "mech" units your opponent now just builds mass air and the "meching" player has to sit there another 20-30 minutes massing their own air units because he can't attack since nothing from the factory can actually shoot up and kill units. THAT is why you've had a terrible experience playing versus mech. If they address those issues (which they won't because they don't want to listen) then mech would be fun to play vs and play with. I'm cynical because blizzard's interest in strategic diversity in SC2 has always come down to making random units faster and nerfing mech repeatedly any time it's iviable to the point it's unplayable or you have to turtle for 30 min to play it which is a catch-22 because no one including myself wants to be forced to sit in our base for 30 min with no aggro options at all. There are two core issues with mech right now: 1) The siege tank does not zone or trade effectively versus any ground units in the game, especially in low numbers. It needs more damage back like it originally had. People including myself have done analysis on this for YEARS. There's literally a teamliquid thread on it from a few weeks ago that blizzard ignores/doesn't acknowledge. If they cared they'd talk about this, yet every time it's brought up they ignore it (purposely)? 2) MECH HAS NO ANTI-AIR FROM THE FACTORY. This shit has been said for years as well and blizzard continuously just ignores it or won't listen. This is the second reason mech games are always idiotic turtle only games because if my opponent starts making mass raven, mass carrier, mass tempest, or broodinfestor or even void rays there's literally nothing cost effective i can make from 10 factories. Widow mines are RNG, cyclones suck and have less health than a marauder because THEY WERE NERFED 5+ TIMES. Thor anti-air is absolute trash as well versus anything that's not a muta or a phoenix. So if i have 15 tanks, hellions, cyclones, mines, and a badass mech army, and i move out on the goddamn map and my opponent decides he wants to build 4 tempest or 4 carriers guess what? His 20 or so supply completely nullifies my 140 supply mech army....and i have to go back to base, sit there and do nothing for half an hour while i spam vikings/liberators/ravens to be able to even play teh game anymore. So...to blizzard please listen: 1) Make the siege tank stronger. Remove the shitty medivac drop that fucks up TvT so badly and is just overall stupid. Make the siege tank a THREAT like the liberator, something people should be afraid to engage, not just literally a move any random unit into and trade effectively like they do now. 2) Make cyclones/mines/thors better at fighting against air units. These units should be SUPER FUCKING STRONG against air so that if i go "mech" with 7+ factories and my opponent decides to be a bitch and build 4 tempests, i can just crank out 7-10 cyclone/thor from my factories instead of have to turtle for another half an hour building 6 starports and massing air units to fight his air when i wanna actually have an action packed game and fight my opponent with ground to ground units. There you go. Will blizzard read this feedback? Maybe. Highly doubt they'll listen, been through this for 4+ years now, they refuse to listen to any feedback in regards to mech. So sorry if i'm not optimistic, blizzard will most likely find some inadvertent way to nerf mech more rather than address it =/ | ||
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bObA
France300 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:29 p68 wrote: Ignore mech or turtle mech? You are suggesting that they're the same thing and they're not. Mech does not mean turtle until you get a 200/200 sky Terran army. Mech was forced to turtle because of its lack of aggressive capacity, which is a design issue. Moving out before 200/200 was practically suicide. The difference between mech and bio, regarding pace, should be steadily increasing aggression vs constant hyper-aggression, not turtling vs not-turtling. LOTV economy prohibits turtling on 3 base anyway. To Blizzard, I'd say that tankivacs is actually an item that helps mech be aggressive. The issue is this play-style better synergies best with bio, because medivacs. Issue 1: Hellbats Although hellbats can be healed by medivacs, hellbats aren't in a very good spot in LOTV, with the brief exception of early TvZ timing pushes. They suck at dodging corrosive bile (combination of their movement speed and their limited attack range) and disruptor shots. Marines outclass them not only in this respect, but also in DPS and the ability to shoot air units. Hellbats a great unit for boosting medivacs and dropping them on top of the enemy army, but taking up four cargo slots really killed this as a general tactic. Thus, one issue I propose with mech is the current status of hellbats. There are many ways to consider improving them, including making transformation time faster to improve mobility, reverting the cargo space nerf, or give them a "super waddle" short burst of speed to help close distance. Issue 2: Anti-air I believe Blizzard still plans on addressing this by buffing the Thor, but they haven't talked about it in a while. If it goes through, it's a good ground-to-air solution for mech. Issue 3: Cyclone Along with the tankivac, this is a unit that has aggression-potential. Problem is, it's fragile, expensive, and scales terribly. Its use in the current meta is restricted to building one or two in the early game to help defend, and in more rare cases, participate in early pressure. But past the early game, the unit effectively disappears from the battlefield. I personally don't know what could be done with the unit, given its design makes balance rest on a very fine line between underused and overpowered. Whatever happens, it would be great for this unit to scale better and allow mech to be aggressive without having to wait till 200/00. Very interesting post | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3410 Posts
 I think the problem with Mech viability is the new economy and the dependency of Mule's. We keep mentioning how much variance we have in the map pool, if Mech does not show up as a viable build in either matchup on any of these crazy different maps, then something is wrong with the core of Mech. I think the two most important things holding Mech back that I can think of now is a strong opener + the need for Map control to get expansions up, which is much more important in LotV. As for Protoss after this update, I think we will struggle vs Terran on the ladder. In tournaments we can still P R O T O S S our way through brackets by bringing the cheese. And we have the advantage of having more maps in the pool that favour us. But for the ladder, we don't have the advantage of mind games AND we need to veto our good PvT maps away, because it's a nightmare in PvZ. More games will go the distance and Terran is favoured once they get rolling with 75 starting energy Ghosts and range upgraded Liberators. PvZ I'm mostly scared of the early game, with stronger Overlord drops due to the Overcharge nerf and it might make Protoss play way too safe and that will make greedy Zergs stronger. | ||
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Psychobabas
2531 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On January 14 2016 04:32 Hider wrote: Solid comment from the guy who is a fan of the Ultralisk w/ +2 armor, and who doesn't think it is a-move'ish at all. /s Maybe you could consider that mech doesn't have to be boring if tank is strong enough and you are spread over multiple bases? @ Blizzard Nerf siege pick up further and buff its attack speed further. SIege pick up shouldn't be used as transportation tool but rather as escape-tool/dodge skillshots. Maybe because Terrans can counter Ultralisks with ghosts? Sorry you can't make marine/marauder all game and have to actually transtion? Terran's have shown they can do it (well korean terran's at least, maybe you should try it first?). For the mech part, I just don't see with the way sc2 is designed as mech ever being viable without it being a turtley style. They would have to radically change a lot of things, not just on Terran side either for it to be viable while not making it a turtley style. If there is a way to do this, fine let's do it. Otherwise let's not have it at all because turtle mech is the most boring thing ever, just as bad as turtle swarmhost/blcorrinf/etc/etc. Boring turtle styles should not be in this game. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15975 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:36 avilo wrote: The reason you've had this experience is because blizzard has always nerfed mech repeatedly and kept mech so bad that it's impossible to ever split up your army because tanks are so weak. What that means is in order to play a mech game you basically have to sit there doing nothing until you have a critical enough mass of units to move on the map...and then when you have that critical mass of "mech" units your opponent now just builds mass air and the "meching" player has to sit there another 20-30 minutes massing their own air units because he can't attack since nothing from the factory can actually shoot up and kill units. THAT is why you've had a terrible experience playing versus mech. If they address those issues (which they won't because they don't want to listen) then mech would be fun to play vs and play with. I'm cynical because blizzard's interest in strategic diversity in SC2 has always come down to making random units faster and nerfing mech repeatedly any time it's iviable to the point it's unplayable or you have to turtle for 30 min to play it which is a catch-22 because no one including myself wants to be forced to sit in our base for 30 min with no aggro options at all. There are two core issues with mech right now: 1) The siege tank does not zone or trade effectively versus any ground units in the game, especially in low numbers. It needs more damage back like it originally had. People including myself have done analysis on this for YEARS. There's literally a teamliquid thread on it from a few weeks ago that blizzard ignores/doesn't acknowledge. If they cared they'd talk about this, yet every time it's brought up they ignore it (purposely)? 2) MECH HAS NO ANTI-AIR FROM THE FACTORY. This shit has been said for years as well and blizzard continuously just ignores it or won't listen. This is the second reason mech games are always idiotic turtle only games because if my opponent starts making mass raven, mass carrier, mass tempest, or broodinfestor or even void rays there's literally nothing cost effective i can make from 10 factories. Widow mines are RNG, cyclones suck and have less health than a marauder because THEY WERE NERFED 5+ TIMES. Thor anti-air is absolute trash as well versus anything that's not a muta or a phoenix. So if i have 15 tanks, hellions, cyclones, mines, and a badass mech army, and i move out on the goddamn map and my opponent decides he wants to build 4 tempest or 4 carriers guess what? His 20 or so supply completely nullifies my 140 supply mech army....and i have to go back to base, sit there and do nothing for half an hour while i spam vikings/liberators/ravens to be able to even play teh game anymore. So...to blizzard please listen: 1) Make the siege tank stronger. Remove the shitty medivac drop that fucks up TvT so badly and is just overall stupid. Make the siege tank a THREAT like the liberator, something people should be afraid to engage, not just literally a move any random unit into and trade effectively like they do now. 2) Make cyclones/mines/thors better at fighting against air units. These units should be SUPER FUCKING STRONG against air so that if i go "mech" with 7+ factories and my opponent decides to be a bitch and build 4 tempests, i can just crank out 7-10 cyclone/thor from my factories instead of have to turtle for another half an hour building 6 starports and massing air units to fight his air when i wanna actually have an action packed game and fight my opponent with ground to ground units. There you go. Will blizzard read this feedback? Maybe. Highly doubt they'll listen, been through this for 4+ years now, they refuse to listen to any feedback in regards to mech. So sorry if i'm not optimistic, blizzard will most likely find some inadvertent way to nerf mech more rather than address it =/ great analysis! do you think the suggested thor buff would be enough for mech AA? | ||
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weikor
Austria580 Posts
Turns out we figure out a lot about davids subconcious by analyzing his dreams. I agree with the actual balance update a lot, even if i think protoss could use some lategame help (unless we want to see tempests in the game) | ||
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Big J
Austria16289 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:36 avilo wrote: The reason you've had this experience is because blizzard has always nerfed mech repeatedly and kept mech so bad that it's impossible to ever split up your army because tanks are so weak. What that means is in order to play a mech game you basically have to sit there doing nothing until you have a critical enough mass of units to move on the map...and then when you have that critical mass of "mech" units your opponent now just builds mass air and the "meching" player has to sit there another 20-30 minutes massing their own air units because he can't attack since nothing from the factory can actually shoot up and kill units. THAT is why you've had a terrible experience playing versus mech. If they address those issues (which they won't because they don't want to listen) then mech would be fun to play vs and play with. I'm cynical because blizzard's interest in strategic diversity in SC2 has always come down to making random units faster and nerfing mech repeatedly any time it's iviable to the point it's unplayable or you have to turtle for 30 min to play it which is a catch-22 because no one including myself wants to be forced to sit in our base for 30 min with no aggro options at all. There are two core issues with mech right now: 1) The siege tank does not zone or trade effectively versus any ground units in the game, especially in low numbers. It needs more damage back like it originally had. People including myself have done analysis on this for YEARS. There's literally a teamliquid thread on it from a few weeks ago that blizzard ignores/doesn't acknowledge. If they cared they'd talk about this, yet every time it's brought up they ignore it (purposely)? 2) MECH HAS NO ANTI-AIR FROM THE FACTORY. This shit has been said for years as well and blizzard continuously just ignores it or won't listen. This is the second reason mech games are always idiotic turtle only games because if my opponent starts making mass raven, mass carrier, mass tempest, or broodinfestor or even void rays there's literally nothing cost effective i can make from 10 factories. Widow mines are RNG, cyclones suck and have less health than a marauder because THEY WERE NERFED 5+ TIMES. Thor anti-air is absolute trash as well versus anything that's not a muta or a phoenix. So if i have 15 tanks, hellions, cyclones, mines, and a badass mech army, and i move out on the goddamn map and my opponent decides he wants to build 4 tempest or 4 carriers guess what? His 20 or so supply completely nullifies my 140 supply mech army....and i have to go back to base, sit there and do nothing for half an hour while i spam vikings/liberators/ravens to be able to even play teh game anymore. So...to blizzard please listen: 1) Make the siege tank stronger. Remove the shitty medivac drop that fucks up TvT so badly and is just overall stupid. Make the siege tank a THREAT like the liberator, something people should be afraid to engage, not just literally a move any random unit into and trade effectively like they do now. 2) Make cyclones/mines/thors better at fighting against air units. These units should be SUPER FUCKING STRONG against air so that if i go "mech" with 7+ factories and my opponent decides to be a bitch and build 4 tempests, i can just crank out 7-10 cyclone/thor from my factories instead of have to turtle for another half an hour building 6 starports and massing air units to fight his air when i wanna actually have an action packed game and fight my opponent with ground to ground units. There you go. Will blizzard read this feedback? Maybe. Highly doubt they'll listen, been through this for 4+ years now, they refuse to listen to any feedback in regards to mech. So sorry if i'm not optimistic, blizzard will most likely find some inadvertent way to nerf mech more rather than address it =/ And you give no explanation how this will prevent that "terrible experience playing versus mech" as you call it yourself. Cool, you buff an alternative way to play Mech more aggressively. You also buff the shitass turtlestyle, because you can literally play the exact same way you do now, just with buffed tanks/cyclones/Thors. The 60supply of ground units that you have to accompany your air-deathball currently will just be stronger, so you may get away with 50supply instead and build even more ravens and liberators. I've seen enough streams of you to know that one of your most frequent reasonings for not attacking is that you often say "the only way I can lose this game right now is if I attack and he gets a lucky *X*". How does this change? You just get an even better deathball if you "just buff" parts of the air/ground Mechball. So you have even more reason to "not attack right now, because it's the only way to lose". | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15975 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:42 blade55555 wrote: Maybe because Terrans can counter Ultralisks with ghosts? 1 fungal or 3 baneling hits and all your ghost die and your 120 supply bio army dies to 60 supply of ultras. | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany15975 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:44 Big J wrote: And you give no explanation how this will prevent that "terrible experience playing versus mech" as you call it yourself. Cool, you buff an alternative way to play Mech more aggressively. You also buff the shitass turtlestyle, because you can literally play the exact same way you do now, just with buffed tanks/cyclones/Thors. The 60supply of ground units that you have to accompany your air-deathball currently will just be stronger, so you may get away with 50supply instead and build even more ravens and liberators. I've seen enough streams of you to know that one of your most frequent reasonings for not attacking is that you often say "the only way I can lose this game right now is if I attack and he gets a lucky *X*". How does this change? You just get an even better deathball if you "just buff" parts of the air/ground Mechball. So you have even more reason to "not attack right now, because it's the only way to lose". just nerf liberators/raven/whatever and turtling into the ultimate air army won't be viable anymore | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On January 14 2016 03:46 blade55555 wrote: Blizzard just ignore mech, only a select few players want to turtle mech let's please not give it to them as that will ruin the tvz match up if that becomes a strong style. This is probably the most selfish comment I've seen on internet over the last few months. This comment comes from and defines a Zerg player who loves to play the "if I get there, you lose and you deserve it" game. You must have been the first and last one to defend the Broodlord/Infestor bullshit. I'm amazed by the lack of self reflection you are able to pull off here. | ||
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PinoKotsBeer
Netherlands1385 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:36 avilo wrote: The reason you've had this experience is because blizzard has always nerfed mech repeatedly and kept mech so bad that it's impossible to ever split up your army because tanks are so weak. What that means is in order to play a mech game you basically have to sit there doing nothing until you have a critical enough mass of units to move on the map...and then when you have that critical mass of "mech" units your opponent now just builds mass air and the "meching" player has to sit there another 20-30 minutes massing their own air units because he can't attack since nothing from the factory can actually shoot up and kill units. THAT is why you've had a terrible experience playing versus mech. If they address those issues (which they won't because they don't want to listen) then mech would be fun to play vs and play with. I'm cynical because blizzard's interest in strategic diversity in SC2 has always come down to making random units faster and nerfing mech repeatedly any time it's iviable to the point it's unplayable or you have to turtle for 30 min to play it which is a catch-22 because no one including myself wants to be forced to sit in our base for 30 min with no aggro options at all. There are two core issues with mech right now: 1) The siege tank does not zone or trade effectively versus any ground units in the game, especially in low numbers. It needs more damage back like it originally had. People including myself have done analysis on this for YEARS. There's literally a teamliquid thread on it from a few weeks ago that blizzard ignores/doesn't acknowledge. If they cared they'd talk about this, yet every time it's brought up they ignore it (purposely)? 2) MECH HAS NO ANTI-AIR FROM THE FACTORY. This shit has been said for years as well and blizzard continuously just ignores it or won't listen. This is the second reason mech games are always idiotic turtle only games because if my opponent starts making mass raven, mass carrier, mass tempest, or broodinfestor or even void rays there's literally nothing cost effective i can make from 10 factories. Widow mines are RNG, cyclones suck and have less health than a marauder because THEY WERE NERFED 5+ TIMES. Thor anti-air is absolute trash as well versus anything that's not a muta or a phoenix. So if i have 15 tanks, hellions, cyclones, mines, and a badass mech army, and i move out on the goddamn map and my opponent decides he wants to build 4 tempest or 4 carriers guess what? His 20 or so supply completely nullifies my 140 supply mech army....and i have to go back to base, sit there and do nothing for half an hour while i spam vikings/liberators/ravens to be able to even play teh game anymore. So...to blizzard please listen: 1) Make the siege tank stronger. Remove the shitty medivac drop that fucks up TvT so badly and is just overall stupid. Make the siege tank a THREAT like the liberator, something people should be afraid to engage, not just literally a move any random unit into and trade effectively like they do now. 2) Make cyclones/mines/thors better at fighting against air units. These units should be SUPER FUCKING STRONG against air so that if i go "mech" with 7+ factories and my opponent decides to be a bitch and build 4 tempests, i can just crank out 7-10 cyclone/thor from my factories instead of have to turtle for another half an hour building 6 starports and massing air units to fight his air when i wanna actually have an action packed game and fight my opponent with ground to ground units. There you go. Will blizzard read this feedback? Maybe. Highly doubt they'll listen, been through this for 4+ years now, they refuse to listen to any feedback in regards to mech. So sorry if i'm not optimistic, blizzard will most likely find some inadvertent way to nerf mech more rather than address it =/ Yes please | ||
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Nazara
United Kingdom235 Posts
HotS "Mech" was nothing more then a "mechanical type unit composition" with all the Vikings and Ravens flying around. To know what Mech as a playstyle is, this thread has to be read - http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/360325-in-defence-of-mech The reason why SC2 "mech" was a turtle kind was simple - Tanks were not immobile enough but also not strong enough (compared to other units like Immortal and all other Tank soft and hard counters) to move out on the map. The overkill protection means Tanks need to be balanced around lower burst damage output. Overkill protection means that each and every extra Tank adds as much damage/dps as the first one. With overkill enabled, Tanks could be stronger (again, relative to other units), but their mobility has to be reduced (Tankivac has to go). http://imgur.com/ycaGxCv Weak tank and positional play is the reason why "mech" play in SC2 is the turtle kind - if you don't wait till highest supply possible, you will die once you move out because you sacrificed a number of bases (because of immobile army) and your main force is not enough to push all the way across the map and trade with enemy army head on. Also, Blinding Cloud is a hard counter to heavy Tank play. Giving Terran a counter to Viper (like a big nerf to PB so Vikings can counter them) is not the way to go, as it makes the game even more volatile, unforgiving and based on hard counters, which is not strategical at all. Instead, the Blinding Cloud should be looked at. Dark Swarm was a better design in every way, as it offered more counter play (splash damage, spells) beside sniping the Defiler before it casts it or retreating your forces. I'm not saying that Dark Swarm needs to come back, but that Blinding Cloud maybe could use a redesign or replacing. If, however, Mech means to anyone just units with a mechanical tag, then please state that, and buff whatever you want. Just don't call it Mech. | ||
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Aocowns
Norway6070 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:50 Everlong wrote: This is probably the most selfish comment I've seen on internet over the last few months. This comment comes from and defines a Zerg player who loves to play the "if I get there, you lose and you deserve it" game. You must have been the first and last one to defend the Broodlord/Infestor bullshit. I'm amazed by the lack of self reflection you are able to pull off here. he's a decent zerg player who stopped playing because of things like SH turtling, just saying | ||
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RaFox17
Finland4581 Posts
On January 14 2016 05:46 Charoisaur wrote: 1 fungal or 3 baneling hits and all your ghost die and your 120 supply bio army dies to 60 supply of ultras. No fungals or bane hits and your ultras all die and terran loses nothing. | ||
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