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Penev
28536 Posts
On June 12 2015 02:33 Elentos wrote: Show me a previous announcement from KeSPA itself and I'll take it back. The only one I've seen was from Team MVP. He's talking about this one I assume: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/484881-kespas-official-statement-on-match-fixing | ||
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Elentos
55594 Posts
On June 12 2015 02:39 Penev wrote: He's talking about this one I assume: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/484881-kespas-official-statement-on-match-fixing Which is not about MarineKing and does not say that they proved it (that specific game) wasn't matchfixing. So I'm not taking it back completely. | ||
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Canucklehead
Canada5074 Posts
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Penev
28536 Posts
On June 12 2015 02:42 Elentos wrote: Which is not about MarineKing and does not say that they proved it (that specific game) wasn't matchfixing. So I'm not taking it back completely. Looks like he combined the MVP one and this one in his mind, memory tend to do these kind of things | ||
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Elentos
55594 Posts
On June 12 2015 02:59 Penev wrote: Looks like he combined the MVP one and this one in his mind, memory tend to do these kind of things Yeah, it happens. Still, no reason for him to react like he did. | ||
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KappaKingPrime
United States468 Posts
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Penev
28536 Posts
On June 12 2015 03:20 KappaKingPrime wrote: Bad luck MK, plays horrible and gets accaused for matchfixing... Hey, at least the betters were lucky. Oh no they weren't, considering the match got VOIDED | ||
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T.O.P.
Hong Kong4685 Posts
Do the Kespa people even have any incentive to catch match fixers? I wouldn't be surprised if they were afraid the SC2 scene will decline like broodwar if players are convicted of match fixing. If that happens, a lot of the Kespa people would lose their jobs. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9448 Posts
On June 11 2015 12:33 Chuddinater wrote: I'm from America, so people are always innocent until proven guilty. I agree. Osama Bin Laden was innocent. User was warned for this post | ||
Heyoka
Katowice25012 Posts
On June 12 2015 03:32 Penev wrote: Hey, at least the betters were lucky. Oh no they weren't, considering the match got VOIDED Ahhhh, the NOT! joke. Classic. | ||
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caznitch
Canada645 Posts
On June 12 2015 03:58 T.O.P. wrote: I can't believe how much people read this PR bullshit and take it as fact. The whole interview consists of them saying "Trust us, we're tough on match fixers". Do the Kespa people even have any incentive to catch match fixers? I wouldn't be surprised if they were afraid the SC2 scene will decline like broodwar if players are convicted of match fixing. If that happens, a lot of the Kespa people would lose their jobs. Why don't you think about it this way: Is there any empirical evidence that could possibly convince you that your assumptions are wrong? If the answer is no, then you are hopeless. | ||
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fronkschnonk
Germany622 Posts
On June 12 2015 03:58 T.O.P. wrote: I can't believe how much people read this PR bullshit and take it as fact. The whole interview consists of them saying "Trust us, we're tough on match fixers". Do the Kespa people even have any incentive to catch match fixers? I wouldn't be surprised if they were afraid the SC2 scene will decline like broodwar if players are convicted of match fixing. If that happens, a lot of the Kespa people would lose their jobs. Neither do many people read the kespa statements as facts, nor are they saying "Trust us, we're tough on match fixers". Most people - including me - believe, that kespa did, what they said, which is checking the replay (which probably didn't give new insights), grilling MK and checking his personal data. As I learned in this thread they also investigated on other people like Casters just to play safe. They took several months to investigate and stated now, that they didn't find proof of matchfixing according to MK. They're not saying, that MK is 100% innocent, but they can't judge him as guilty and so it would be against law to penalize him. For your speculations on kespas motivations on catching match fixers: could be true, could be not true - you're free to investigate in that case, but ranting online won't make that case clearer. | ||
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Penev
28536 Posts
Hmm? Just pointing out that there's a little more than MK's horrible play that got him accused.. | ||
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KrazyTrumpet
United States2520 Posts
Seriously, they did about as thorough an investigation as can reasonably expected. Can we drop this stupid subject now? Was this really necessary? Really... | ||
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Penev
28536 Posts
On June 12 2015 05:34 KrazyTrumpet wrote: b-but the betting lines! statistics and probabilities! I thought they proved everything!!! Seriously, they did about as thorough an investigation as can reasonably expected. Can we drop this stupid subject now? Was this really necessary? Really... I educated myself about the b-betting lines, I suggest you to do the same. And Chuddinaters comment wasn't the best as well tbh | ||
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Swoopae
Australia339 Posts
On June 12 2015 02:58 Canucklehead wrote: Always knew mkp was innocent. Glad to see kespa investigated and came to the same conclusion. Theres a big difference between innocent and not legally convicted as guilty Marineking is not legally guilty, but there is a greater than 95% chance that he is guilty in reality as it would require a ridiculous set of coincidences for him not to be Oj simpson wasnt legally guilty of killing his wife either but everyone knows he is overwhelmingly likely to be guilty If they didnt find a smoking gun so be it; he doesnt get punished but that doesnt mean he didnt fix the match | ||
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Swoopae
Australia339 Posts
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pure.Wasted
Canada4701 Posts
On June 11 2015 14:17 RenSC2 wrote: As someone who vehemently believes that MK match-fixed, I have to grudgingly accept the answers and let this one drop. It doesn't mean that I believe MK is innocent, it just means that we'll never be able to conclusively prove it despite all the strong circumstantial evidence. Hopefully the investigation and possible penalties scare every player who contemplates throwing a match and we won't have this situation anymore. However, I have a bad feeling that it'll just make players be a little more careful about how they match-fix and make sure that there isn't a money-trail or conversation-trail to catch them on. This post carries the stench of truth. We wanted an investigation, we got an investigation. Was it a thorough, sincere investigation? Maybe. Was MKP simply so good at hiding his tracks that no one but Sherlock Holmes would find him out? Maybe. But our legal options have been exhausted. I wish I could say that this renewed my interest in SC2, but it doesn't. | ||
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IntoTheEmo
Singapore1170 Posts
On June 12 2015 01:37 Penev wrote: Thanks TL, good questions generally. Although, and I said this before, concerning the MK match, it's not just the spinecrawler that makes it suspicious. He claims to expect a speedling all-in from what he scouted but that makes no sense at all. Also, of course, the suspicious betting patterns deserve a KeSPA rsponse but shows they're unwilling to answer questions related to that. As a side note I want to point out that it scares me to see some people post KeSPA = cool style responses. Not that KeSPA necessarily is in the wrong here but seriously people, a little more critical thinking pls, don't just bow to the authorities. Yeah no kidding, people look at the accusations so one-dimensionally, it's almost cringeworthy. Scouting the LATE pool and no Hatch in the natural -> Doesn't scout with Reapers even though there was little risk of losing them, not playing safe even after having scouted the odd opening build (No speedlings possible at the time) -> Puts down 3rd CC -> Fails to check for or notice creep/spine crawler = Okay so maybe he played without his brain plugged in for that match -> and THEN you have the bizarro BETTING LINES that got voided. = Implying a significant amount of people set it up or knew the outcome in advance Call it witch-hunting, but in this case the "witch" is pretty much flying around on a broom and casting spells in people's faces. Sure, there could be a reasonable explanation, but ultimately it looks so blatantly suspicious that you can't fault people for feeling that way. Heck, people are so quick to dismiss some well thought out posts. There is a difference between "Hmm, it did look a bit weird, but I suppose KeSPA did a good enough job that I feel MKP is innocent" and "Lol look those naysayers are wrong KeSPA said everything was fine!" - despite everything that was pointed out. Anyway, I suppose you still can't charge him since there isn't evidence beyond a reasonable doubt. Besides, this investigation looks like it's going nowhere so... meh. Apathy. Edit: Oh, and thanks TL for getting us an interview - considering the circumstances, that couldn't have been easy. | ||
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brickrd
United States4894 Posts
i'm pretty sure if hillary clinton suddenly won 2016 with 85% of the vote and an official investigation concluded that there was nothing irregular about the election no one would be saying "pfffft, your statistics and probabilities don't mean anything" | ||
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