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On June 10 2015 18:10 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 18:06 pmp10 wrote:
How much support from WCS is GOM getting?
If it's about the same as SSL then they are perfectly replaceable. it isn't a simple case of phoning up blizzard and stating you are "starting a tournament so fund me please" Someone in the scene will have to start up a tournament , get the infrastructure and get the players involved, then get blizzard involved. With how the scene is in Korea , and with kespa ,potentially, muscling out the competition. It is no where near a case of GSL being "perfectly replacable
Maybe, but I can't imagine Blizzard being happy about having half of their Korean premier tournaments being broadcasted in low. Not the best contract negotiation position.
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On June 10 2015 18:05 Mojito99 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 17:52 SC2Toastie wrote:On June 10 2015 17:51 xdevilx2 wrote:
If they struggle with money then I doubt that the few extra subs that they will get help. I mean thats maybe 200$ more? And were did you get those figures? Regarding the money side of this decision. Essentially, this move hurts the english viewership only. As far as I know, the majority of sponsors of the GSL do not have the english audience as a target group. So increased english viewership offers nothing to Gom. Therefore its absolutely reasonable to "charge extra" simply because neither GOM nor their sponsors were benefitting from english viewership in the first place. The only reason to provide a free HD stream is because the additional exposure offers enough value to the sponsors to compensate the provider of the service (which would be the Goms, Dreahhacks, IEMs) to not put up a paywall. Most reasonable economic "growth models" would advice against this sort of move. But for an organisation with no intent on expanding or bringing in foreign "investment" - aka sponsors - there is really nothing to say against it. Happy to hear counter arguments :D
GSL = Global Starcraft II League, but apparently it's sponsored by Koreans for Koreans. Why an international sponsor can't be brought on board to allow the English stream to be high / source, I don't know.
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Actually i support this move.
GSL is the premier league of SC2, with the best tradition and some of the best shows.
Tastosis are the best couple of casters. They are human beings and have moods....just like anyone else.
When they are on their game, nobody from SPOTV can equal them.
I enjoyed subbing to the excellent content that GSL was providing before this twitch BS.
I payed, got premium quality, GOM player smooth working (i still use GOM player at home today for movies)
, no commercials.......
All the people here that are bashing GOM and claiming its death and ''they dont know what they are doing'" should really think about what they would do if they were in GOM's place.
GOM was forced into a place where their content''s quality is controlled by another company (twitch) which may or may not care about the GSL at all. The guy's message in the OP is crystal clear, the time is now to choose between either paying to support, or NO GSL AT ALL. For me, the choice is crystal clear. I will pay. Each one can have his own choice.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
On June 10 2015 18:13 Penev wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 18:10 KelsierSC wrote:On June 10 2015 18:06 pmp10 wrote:
How much support from WCS is GOM getting?
If it's about the same as SSL then they are perfectly replaceable. it isn't a simple case of phoning up blizzard and stating you are "starting a tournament so fund me please" Someone in the scene will have to start up a tournament , get the infrastructure and get the players involved, then get blizzard involved. With how the scene is in Korea , and with kespa ,potentially, muscling out the competition. It is no where near a case of GSL being "perfectly replacable Maybe, but I can't imagine Blizzard being happy about having half of their Korean premier tournaments being broadcasted in low. Not the best contract negotiation position.
what does that have to do with GSL being replaceable?
Korean business has a reputation for adopting a hardball approach so it is possible this is a move from GOM to get more money out of blizzard.
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Well I have never watched GSL so this doesnt effect me :D
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bring back gom player and yearly subscription and i am sure a lot more people will buy that
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On June 10 2015 18:19 inermis wrote:
bring back gom player and yearly subscription and i am sure a lot more people will buy that
and gom old vod system. This one was gorgeous.
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It's sad to see this happen, i do not approve this change since when they stream other games like world of tanks and what not they don't need to set the stream to low. Not gonna watch gsl anymore.
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And why don't they cooperate with Blizzard and WCS so that they can have profit?
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On June 10 2015 18:14 Hassan_RO wrote:
The guy's message in the OP is crystal clear, the time is now to choose between either paying to support, or NO GSL AT ALL. For me, the choice is crystal clear. I will pay. Each one can have his own choice.
I pay (sub/donate a bit) to my favorite streamers from time to time, whenever I feel like it. But I do because I want to show my appreciation, like "hey, good job, you deserve it".
Forcing people to sub or try to watch the unwatchable stream on low (is it even 240p?). Nope, they won't get anything from me that way. That's only my choice though.
Not gonna lie though, I won't be sad when Artosis will be free from GOM to cast more passionstone stuff.
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On June 10 2015 18:14 Hassan_RO wrote:
All the people here that are bashing GOM and claiming its death and ''they dont know what they are doing'" should really think about what they would do if they were in GOM's place.
I would be working hard to provide value and incentive to people who subscribe, such as a clear and easy VOD system, exclusive content (interviews, selections etc) and whatever else they may think of. The live stream is how you bring people to the service, and it's the extras that make people want to pay. Pushing people away probably gives a short term gain but hurts in the long run.
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Bad move IMO. Watching random streams showed me people love to subscribe to support their favorite streamers, not because they are forced to. Some of them (and not talking about MOBA streams) get A LOT of subs every month.
This should lower the viewer count a lot and in the long run the money they make.
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On June 10 2015 18:15 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 10 2015 18:13 Penev wrote:On June 10 2015 18:10 KelsierSC wrote:On June 10 2015 18:06 pmp10 wrote:
How much support from WCS is GOM getting?
If it's about the same as SSL then they are perfectly replaceable. it isn't a simple case of phoning up blizzard and stating you are "starting a tournament so fund me please" Someone in the scene will have to start up a tournament , get the infrastructure and get the players involved, then get blizzard involved. With how the scene is in Korea , and with kespa ,potentially, muscling out the competition. It is no where near a case of GSL being "perfectly replacable Maybe, but I can't imagine Blizzard being happy about having half of their Korean premier tournaments being broadcasted in low. Not the best contract negotiation position. what does that have to do with GSL being replaceable? Korean business has a reputation for adopting a hardball approach so it is possible this is a move from GOM to get more money out of blizzard.
You should really word your speculations more like they're just that. Otherwise it's difficult to have a reasonable discussion.
In order to being replaced you first have to have the running contract expire/ not prolonged. That is what it has to do with "GSL being replaceable". I'm adding to the discussion, not merely responding to your claims.
If, in these dire times for SC2, any other company is willing to invest in a replacement tournament seems not too likely..
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Situation with Spotv or Kespa is entirely different from GOM. Not that an average viewer necessarily knows or should care, and they are in their right not to, but please stop talking out of your entitled ass.
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this happened one day after hasuobs switched from sc2 to heroes. coincidence? I think not
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Even medium suffers from a lot of artifacting now. Oh Korea :/
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On June 10 2015 18:15 TheBloodyDwarf wrote:
Well I have never watched GSL so this doesnt effect me :D
I just waited for people writting stuff like this. Pretty narrowminded.
If GSL shuts down, it will effect the korean scene, foreign scene and just StarCraft overall.
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I would surmise that when the quality was on low, GOM saw an increase in subscriptions - makes sense - who want's to watch when you can't even read the flippin worker / army sizes etc due to pixelated low quality.. So they went back to medium, and likely saw a drop off in subscriptions, and well.. this is the result - back to low.
We have to remember that GOM is in this to make money, just like you and I want more money in our pockets, so does GOM. For good or bad, that's just the way it is.
Now I want to give some feedback which hopefully GOM will read, as to why I wont be subscribing, and what it would take for me to resubscribe.
Firstly, as a foreigner I feel somewhat left out in the dark regarding your content. It seems so polarised towards the Korean market only, this is in stark contrast to your statement GOMTV, known as the global standard for eSports. It's not global if you only really cater to the Korean market. All the pieces you run in between games is only ever in Korean, no subtitles. Post match interviews are only ever in Korean, with translations through an earpiece. It seems to me that you don't cater well for the rest of us. Perhaps this is a small point, but for me is a small slice of the whole, and can (and should) Be improved upon in my most humble opinion. Proleague is exactly the same. This regularly gets commented on in live report threads here on TL.
Seeker made a comment in a thread on the Proleague MarineKing incident (where he translated for us what was being said) On the workload involved in doing this, finding the time and so on. It shouldn't be on his (or others) shoulders to translate for you. It's your product and if you want global appeal, you need to get more global in your production.
On June 10 2015 16:16 SetGuitarsToKill wrote:
I prefer Proleague, GSL has 2 casters who wish they were casting other games and is equal in game quality to S2SL, so there's really no reason to watch anymore is there?
The above hits the nail on the head for me. And is the biggest barrier for you getting my money. When I watch rugby, guess what, I like to hear about rugby (insane position to take I know) Same for football or documentaries. If I want a dose of any media, I like to have that topic on the board. Not random bullshit. I don't want comedy, or stories, or how excited someone is for the next season of Game of Thrones. I want to hear about StarCraft. Period. Keep the stories for post game. This is not to say that the odd anecdote isn't welcome. But the amount of extraneous crap spouted by Artosis and Tasteless is a real turn off for me. I recall a game moonglade and tasteless casted which lasted about 8 mins, the first 7 of which was tasteless waxing lyrical about how excited he was for the next season of Game of Thrones. This is not good enough. And guys, before you leap to the (ex) Casting Archons defense, this is about my thoughts on the whole GOM package and how they can get me to stump up for GSL (like I do for proleague).
When I watch CS:GO, DOTA or even the odd bit of Heroes (still following you Khaldor, keep it up  ) Its about CS:GO, DOTA or Heroes!! Shocking. Might those Twitch channel surfers be more interested to be taught by casters concepts of the game? What units did? What's happening? New META? Transfers? Build orders in use? What happened last game? What's coming up next week? Would anyone have me believe that the downtime at the start couldn't be better filled? An aspect of the game negated with LotV though.. Would you have me believe that the StarCraft scene is stale and uninteresting with nothing worthy of discussion? Just get the fuck out of here.
These two points for me are stopping me, and of the two, the second is by far the greater. I don't have a problem with you asking for money for providing the service you do. It's how business works (though I have to say that "medium or riot" Promo codes is just slapping me in the face - biting the hand that feeds you.
I thank you for continuing to give us GSL, it must be hard with such a niche small market. I understand that money makes the world go round. Money I'd be happy to give you, if you just polished the product a little more, focussed the casters, and integrated the foreign scene. Though ultimately I feel your future is out of your hands, and lies in Blizzards, hope you have contingency plans..
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i'd like to see the finances here, but i understand that's even more touchy because there's going to be a lot of questions raised out of a company trying to be transparent.
we never really get to see who's behind production like when we had mr.chae on board (who is now with afreeca i believe).
there was a lot of money injected into the first seasons and it eventually teetered off when (i'm assuming) there was less of a community to back it monetarily.
please remember that attendance to all regular league games is free. i can imagine that what they provide for the audience there has diminished as well (junk food getting passed around, aside).
it's up to the players as well as the organizers to come up with something sustainable.
having 3-0's, non attractive players as well as builds, and no build up of hype surrounding player matchups and their abilities all factor into making the scene quite niche.
we are lucky to have a community where we can freely talk about this stuff like we're all friends who are watching side by side. it is however demotivating as a spectator if your game simply isn't the most popular when all your other friends are watching and playing something else.
starcraft 2 will just have to get more popular or else the quality of everything involved will eventually devolve like with what is happening with GSL now.
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GSL 2010: Buy the ticket and it will go toward making the show and the stream better.
GSL 2015: Buy the ticket or we will downgrade your experience into oblivion.
Honestly, doing things like this will get GSL no new viewers, and obviously isn't a sound long term plan. They've cut so many things from GSL now; the website, gstl, finals venues, vods uploaded late or not at all, and don't communicate anything to their fans except for middle finger announcements like these. I can't begin to even speculate what kind of mismanagement issues they have that would cause this, but it just feels like they are trying to milk a shriveling viewerbase.
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EPT
