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On January 09 2015 23:38 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 23:32 Musicus wrote:On January 09 2015 23:23 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:21 Penev wrote:On January 09 2015 23:15 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:13 farvacola wrote:
^this is simply untrue lol
nkr is still unable to account for the fact that Gom is literally the only SC2 broadcaster in the world to offer such a low quality stream option, including Kespa productions lol. Everyone needs an advocate, I suppose. GOM is also the only non-major company to broadcast a weekly Sc2 league out of Korea. Comparing them to SpoTV is comparing apples to oranges. Because they're a small company? That just doesn't matter. If you can't offer a similar product for similar prices it's not going to work. They aren't the only Korean league any more. You could argue that GSL is (a lot) better but I don't think a lot of people would agree with that. This is what I don't really get. The paid for product is actually on par with SpoTVs. It's the free product that no one pays for that is now inferior from GOM. What you get for your money is actually not worse because of this. It sounds like you are arguing that a viewer that did not sub is of no value. Not of no value, but of less value.
But of higher potential value.
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On January 09 2015 23:39 Musicus wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 23:38 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:32 Musicus wrote:On January 09 2015 23:23 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:21 Penev wrote:On January 09 2015 23:15 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:13 farvacola wrote:
^this is simply untrue lol
nkr is still unable to account for the fact that Gom is literally the only SC2 broadcaster in the world to offer such a low quality stream option, including Kespa productions lol. Everyone needs an advocate, I suppose. GOM is also the only non-major company to broadcast a weekly Sc2 league out of Korea. Comparing them to SpoTV is comparing apples to oranges. Because they're a small company? That just doesn't matter. If you can't offer a similar product for similar prices it's not going to work. They aren't the only Korean league any more. You could argue that GSL is (a lot) better but I don't think a lot of people would agree with that. This is what I don't really get. The paid for product is actually on par with SpoTVs. It's the free product that no one pays for that is now inferior from GOM. What you get for your money is actually not worse because of this. It sounds like you are arguing that a viewer that did not sub is of no value. Not of no value, but of less value. But of higher potential value.
No, of potential equal value to be correct 
I'm sure they thought about it. Are more people going to subscribe if we keep 480p free, or if we make it only 360? Judging by the numbers of subscribers, the first day was a success. Guess we'll have to wait and see how it works out for the rest of the season.
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When Gom dies now, nobody will care anymore, SpoTV comes in.
240p is a joke. You need the basic viewers to generate the sub viewers you want to milk. But with 240p you will just get a one time effect of more people subbing for MEDIUM 480p! and then less and less basic viewers and less and less people who will sub. I subbed in the past, because S3 last year brought great games. But this is a joke. They did it without any notification just like a large fuck you to all the viewers, who maybe subbed or not. Many people like me subbed in the end of the season to give the money for something they have enjoyed the last 3 month, they pay for the finished product, not for the product, they will possible get. Now all these folks wount subb anymore after the season, but most of them will never sub again. Sub to thank for 240p high qualitiy starcraft? JOKE. I will sub this time SpoTV, either SSL or PL, i dont know yet.
The joke gets doubled, when you watch the korean youtube stream which has 1080p for koreans (and proxyusers like me) for free.
What they dont understand:
They buisnessmodel with the englisch streams is to ask for money because the viewers like the product and are willing to support it. Nobody is willing to support someone, who gives you 240p and forces you to pay to watch something in watchable quality. Not in times, where you dont have to pay for all the streaming servers, because twitch/amazon gives you the infrastructure.
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On January 09 2015 23:06 farvacola wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 23:02 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 22:59 Penev wrote:On January 09 2015 22:57 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 22:54 Penev wrote:On January 09 2015 22:50 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 22:49 Penev wrote:On January 09 2015 22:42 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 22:41 BlueStar wrote:On January 09 2015 22:38 KeksX wrote:
Much more surprising is that they still do anything for SC2 with 15k~ish viewers on twitch. Though I don't know if thats all viewers...
I guess monetizing so heavily is the only way they can make it profitable...? Or add sponsors? Or involve community into sponsor relationship in order to get more money from the sponsors? Or 10239 different things that can anyone think about, not just showing the middle finger to the people because of whom you are alive...? :D Just imagine what is possible. They've tried to get sponsors in the past but struggled, even when sc2 was bigger. Also they aren't alive because of people who watched for free on 480p. They are alive because of subscribers. But I imagine Blizzard only cares about viewer numbers. Kinda strange to fund a tournaments price pool with these quality settings while (all the!) others offer better, including the ones who arrange their own price pool.. What does Blizzard have to do with this? They have nothing to do with GOM. Like I said; They're funding their price pool. I'm just saying that I can't imagine them being happy about this. I'm adding a reason for this maybe being a stupid move by Gom. Well it doesn't matter if Blizzard funds the prize pool. If they can't run GSL because it doesn't break even then what? Well, then the competition takes over. Competition? It's about the fact that running a starcraft 2 league in korea isnt profitable if noone wants to pay for it. I feel like all we have here are butthurt people who used to have awesome content for free. These people are now sad because it turns out nothing is actually free. So when practically every single other SC2 broadcast provides 480p min, how exactly does this "nothing is free" argument make any sense? Even Kespa, of all the organizations in the world, is showing Gom up.
"Of all the organizations in the world" - you mean the only other company that broadcasts SC2 in Korea that happens to be bigger than GOM?
Yeah. Of course they're showing them.
Everyone saying "it doesn't matter if GOM dies, we have other broadcasts" is delusional. We have KeSPA/OGN and OlimoLeague and thats it. And if GOM is not profitable, how long do you think those guys are?
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Oh yeah, and when we come to other sports and the natural concurrents, we got this:
"All OGN contents will be free from 2015. You can enjoy all HD videos for free. Special thanks to all OGN fans and all your support"
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There is a French stream every Wed/Friday at 8.00 PM CET for GSL.
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On January 09 2015 23:40 nkr wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 23:39 Musicus wrote:On January 09 2015 23:38 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:32 Musicus wrote:On January 09 2015 23:23 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:21 Penev wrote:On January 09 2015 23:15 nkr wrote:On January 09 2015 23:13 farvacola wrote:
^this is simply untrue lol
nkr is still unable to account for the fact that Gom is literally the only SC2 broadcaster in the world to offer such a low quality stream option, including Kespa productions lol. Everyone needs an advocate, I suppose. GOM is also the only non-major company to broadcast a weekly Sc2 league out of Korea. Comparing them to SpoTV is comparing apples to oranges. Because they're a small company? That just doesn't matter. If you can't offer a similar product for similar prices it's not going to work. They aren't the only Korean league any more. You could argue that GSL is (a lot) better but I don't think a lot of people would agree with that. This is what I don't really get. The paid for product is actually on par with SpoTVs. It's the free product that no one pays for that is now inferior from GOM. What you get for your money is actually not worse because of this. It sounds like you are arguing that a viewer that did not sub is of no value. Not of no value, but of less value. But of higher potential value. No, of potential equal value to be correct
Correct. But the number of non subs will always be higher than of subs, so they value that isn't just money through subs, will drastically suffer if they shun non subs away with a low quality stream. It means less eyes on their ads, less people recommending GSL to their friends, less new players and no potential to grow in the future. The are milking the viewers they already have and are sacrificing their potential to grow I think. It's just no way to stay competitive, just a way to stay alive longer. Which the english stream should not be necessary for in the first place. But I see your point too and we'll just have to see what Gom will do in the future and how long they are able to keep the sub wall up.
Edit:
Yeah what you said!
On January 09 2015 23:40 nkr wrote:
Guess we'll have to wait and see how it works out for the rest of the season.
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On January 09 2015 23:45 Aeromi wrote:
There is a French stream every Wed/Friday at 8.00 PM CET for GSL.
hahahhaa i love every single bit of these posts
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aww thats a shame, lets hope it won't be to many ZvZs ?
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Wasn't able to watch GSL since east coast USA, but this sounds like a mess :/
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China6329 Posts
I'm ok with locking high and above behind the paywall, they have to make money somewhere and it's completely justified but man, medium too? This is overblown and a huge step back.
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United States164 Posts
On January 09 2015 23:56 vult wrote:
Wasn't able to watch GSL since east coast USA, but this sounds like a mess :/
Personally if it was a bit more clear (maybe this is twitch.tv's fault) that the 13.99 isnt for a month, but for a season, there would be less complaints. I personally have paid 19.99 for seasons dating back to 2010, but the 13.99/month soured my usual habit of purchasing a ticket without hesitation.
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I've always been fine with a paywall for highest quality but in an age where every single sport stream from a major organization is either free high quality or going free high quality or something like a $5 sub a month taking this much money for a product that has not proven itself to be better than the free products the past year is mind-boggling.
We do have to keep in mind that ultimately we are not the target audience anyway though, they really only care about Korean views and revenue.
On January 10 2015 00:05 Taronar wrote:
I don't really understand that Koreans can just watch source on youtube for free. Basicly means that English stream has to pay for itself. New production costs which come up with English stream is just Tasteless and Artosis (and some material costs) so that can't be such a huge investment. Invest more in finding sponsors even in EU and AM should really fix that part up... Having low quality streams like that while begging for money in order to even continue to exist is just really bad business
Free Korean stream because that's the only viewer number they really care about.
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I don't really understand that Koreans can just watch source on youtube for free. Basicly means that English stream has to pay for itself. New production costs which come up with English stream is just Tasteless and Artosis (and some material costs) so that can't be such a huge investment. Invest more in finding sponsors even in EU and AM should really fix that part up... Having low quality streams like that while begging for money in order to even continue to exist is just really bad business
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On January 10 2015 00:05 Taronar wrote:
I don't really understand that Koreans can just watch source on youtube for free. Basicly means that English stream has to pay for itself. New production costs which come up with English stream is just Tasteless and Artosis (and some material costs) so that can't be such a huge investment. Invest more in finding sponsors even in EU and AM should really fix that part up... Having low quality streams like that while begging for money in order to even continue to exist is just really bad business
I'd bet it has to do with the fact that the average EU/NA viewer has more money than the average KR viewer?
Also they are not "begging" for money.
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On January 09 2015 23:50 Undead1993 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 09 2015 23:45 Aeromi wrote:
There is a French stream every Wed/Friday at 8.00 PM CET for GSL. hahahhaa i love every single bit of these posts
I find it hilarious too. It's crazy how Aeromi never gets tired of mentionning the French streams ! :D
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I only subbed to GSL like once or twice, since it was too early to watch when being in school. Last year PL came up and I subbed that (as a university student I can now watch that early). Now that there are only 2 days of PL a week I felt like I wanted to expand to either an SSL or a GSL sub as well to fill the hole.
I just don´t like the feeling of being milked that GSL gave me with their step. So I decided to sub SSL. They feel more honest. Also: when I sub for 14 Dollars a season I don´t even get source? When I then read that Koreans get it for free I kinda feel as if I just was a big wallet to them. No thanks.
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I bought premium, because I am not a hobo. Imo at some point every big organization will have to switch to a model that relies on subscriptions, because the free viewer numbers just aren't that great for SC2.
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On January 09 2015 23:43 Clonester wrote:
When Gom dies now, nobody will care anymore, SpoTV comes in.
240p is a joke. You need the basic viewers to generate the sub viewers you want to milk. But with 240p you will just get a one time effect of more people subbing for MEDIUM 480p! and then less and less basic viewers and less and less people who will sub. I subbed in the past, because S3 last year brought great games. But this is a joke. They did it without any notification just like a large fuck you to all the viewers, who maybe subbed or not. Many people like me subbed in the end of the season to give the money for something they have enjoyed the last 3 month, they pay for the finished product, not for the product, they will possible get. Now all these folks wount subb anymore after the season, but most of them will never sub again. Sub to thank for 240p high qualitiy starcraft? JOKE. I will sub this time SpoTV, either SSL or PL, i dont know yet.
The joke gets doubled, when you watch the korean youtube stream which has 1080p for koreans (and proxyusers like me) for free.
What they dont understand:
They buisnessmodel with the englisch streams is to ask for money because the viewers like the product and are willing to support it. Nobody is willing to support someone, who gives you 240p and forces you to pay to watch something in watchable quality. Not in times, where you dont have to pay for all the streaming servers, because twitch/amazon gives you the infrastructure.
^can't stand it.. well written
WORD
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On January 09 2015 19:59 Seeker wrote:Uhhh.... Bad news... Just heard back from GOM. So... Yeah... Sorry guys...
Well, well... Torrents when?
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EPT
