• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:05
CEST 18:05
KST 01:05
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror4[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10
Community News
Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup10StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026)74Weekly Cups (Sept 21-27): herO and ByuN double2Weekly Cups (Sep 13-20): herO scores triple3
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.17 PTR Patch Notes (Sept 30, 2026) How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4) SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup Back to SC2 after 14 years - Protoss CTRL groups?
Tourneys
Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament 2026 GSTL Grand Finals Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond) SC2 INu's Battles#21 [ 3-Days tournament ]
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
Mutation # 546 Catch the Train The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts Mutation # 544 Double Trouble
Brood War
General
Sagi.gg Launcher Released 20-year-old Valorant player starting StarCraft BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Fantasy returning? BSL Season 23
Tourneys
[ASL22] Semifinal B [ASL22] Semifinal A [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Ro8 Day 4
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Replay Review Process - What do you do? Simple Questions, Simple Answers
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Nintendo Switch Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Total Annihilation Zero
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25! Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Dating: How's your luck? Artificial Intelligence Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
Escaping Into Video Games: G…
TrAiDoS
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Regacy Esports:Our Goa…
regacyesports
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 9414 users

1/24 Balance test map - Page 20

Forum Index > SC2 General
1004 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 51 Next
Constructive criticism is welcome, but no mindless SC2/Developer bashing in this thread.
Yorbon
Profile Joined December 2011
Netherlands4272 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 22:00:11
January 23 2014 21:55 GMT
#381
Hydra change may make pvz more colussus focussed. I don't know if i really like that. It may also path the way to some midgame timings, like +1 speed hydra or something.

I don't know how much the tempest change will change pvz. I'm more worried for pvt, where p has some insane dps against buildings with this change. I think defending expansions as t will become a lot harder in late game as i feel the time to react to base snipes has decreased with this change.

But i am noob, so if i'm wrong, please learn me a thing or two. :$

edit: I think ffadicted makes a good point when he pointed out the weakening of stargate openers. I can imagine committing to much on stargate tech will make p very vulnerable, as hydras are massed much easier now.
ReMinD_
Profile Joined May 2013
Croatia846 Posts
January 23 2014 21:56 GMT
#382
On January 24 2014 06:19 DinoMight wrote:
Who says that a 12 min hydra bust would be slow hydras w no upgrades? You could work in ups.

Now picture this:

PvZ on Deadalus pt. Zerg goes for 2 base Hydra timing.

or PvZ on habitation station. Zerg goes for 3 base Hydra timing w/ gold base.


God forbid that a Protoss has to worry about a timing.
Parting: Well, even I can make better maps than these.
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
January 23 2014 21:56 GMT
#383
On January 24 2014 06:51 Tossim111 wrote:
yes it will be easier to obtain because you dont have to get the upgrade and you can produce ghosts earlier... I think it would be very helpful.

And it can't be stated enough how much Protoss hate EMP. It takes the wind out of any Protoss push.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
NotSoHappy
Profile Joined November 2010
445 Posts
January 23 2014 22:00 GMT
#384
On January 24 2014 06:56 ReMinD_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2014 06:19 DinoMight wrote:
Who says that a 12 min hydra bust would be slow hydras w no upgrades? You could work in ups.

Now picture this:

PvZ on Deadalus pt. Zerg goes for 2 base Hydra timing.

or PvZ on habitation station. Zerg goes for 3 base Hydra timing w/ gold base.


God forbid that a Protoss has to worry about a timing.


12m roach max and before that any of the infamous zerg/roach gate expo busts.
BEARDiaguz
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Australia2362 Posts
January 23 2014 22:00 GMT
#385
On January 24 2014 06:56 ReMinD_ wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2014 06:19 DinoMight wrote:
Who says that a 12 min hydra bust would be slow hydras w no upgrades? You could work in ups.

Now picture this:

PvZ on Deadalus pt. Zerg goes for 2 base Hydra timing.

or PvZ on habitation station. Zerg goes for 3 base Hydra timing w/ gold base.


God forbid that a Protoss has to worry about a timing.


Shhh. They'll turn photon overcharge into a colossus attack soon.
ProgamerAustralian alcohol user follow @iaguzSC2
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
January 23 2014 22:06 GMT
#386
On January 24 2014 07:00 NotSoHappy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2014 06:56 ReMinD_ wrote:
On January 24 2014 06:19 DinoMight wrote:
Who says that a 12 min hydra bust would be slow hydras w no upgrades? You could work in ups.

Now picture this:

PvZ on Deadalus pt. Zerg goes for 2 base Hydra timing.

or PvZ on habitation station. Zerg goes for 3 base Hydra timing w/ gold base.


God forbid that a Protoss has to worry about a timing.


12m roach max and before that any of the infamous zerg/roach gate expo busts.

To be fair the 12 max roach was really powerful due to an ungodly amount of hp, not raw damage.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Ayrkrane
Profile Joined June 2013
Canada15 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 22:10:00
January 23 2014 22:07 GMT
#387
What would you think about reducing the PO net DPS but add some sort of big EMP when it is being cast that reduces the shield of every enemy unit in a certain area around the Nexus to 0 (or maybe adjust that number) ?

It doesnt seem like it would hinder PvP that much, all the opposite, but would allow more early aggression in the other match ups.

Also, the timing of the casting would become very important (all or nothing kind of stuff) in PvP and could make it more exciting than what it is now.

I am no Protoss player, so I am open to any constructive criticism.
Tossim111
Profile Joined October 2009
United States246 Posts
January 23 2014 22:07 GMT
#388
On January 24 2014 06:56 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2014 06:51 Tossim111 wrote:
yes it will be easier to obtain because you dont have to get the upgrade and you can produce ghosts earlier... I think it would be very helpful.

And it can't be stated enough how much Protoss hate EMP. It takes the wind out of any Protoss push.


i still think it evens it out. helps vs mech and immortals are still tough units regardless. the splash dmg tanks do to immortals isnt effective.

its a favor for terrans in the transition from early to mid game. however ghosts are used primarily to neutralize high templars rather than deal dmg to shields of the oppositions army. and protoss, during that time, can still have an effective army even with EMP'd high templar; all the while being defensive with the mcore. I doubt it'll be very OP for protoss.
Tossim111
Profile Joined October 2009
United States246 Posts
January 23 2014 22:10 GMT
#389
On January 24 2014 07:07 Ayrkrane wrote:
What would you think about reducing the PO net DPS but add some sort of big EMP when it is being cast that reduces the shield of every enemy unit in a certain area to 0 (or maybe adjust that number) ?

It doesnt seem like it would hinder PvP that much, all the opposite, but would allow more early aggression in the other match ups.

Also, the timing of the casting would become very important (all or nothing kind of stuff) in PvP and could make it more exciting than what it is now.

I am no Protoss player, so I am open to any constructive criticism.



This makes me think all Blizzard did was secretly implement a No Rush rule into the game...
Lizarb
Profile Joined March 2011
Denmark307 Posts
January 23 2014 22:10 GMT
#390
How about letting Terran build Turret if they either have an engineering bay or a factory. This would help a mech terran in the earlier part of the game

Lower the gas cost of the armory could also be an interesting change.
Only thing I know is that I know nothing.
Squat
Profile Joined September 2013
Sweden7978 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 22:13:10
January 23 2014 22:10 GMT
#391

Ok first of all, yes about the roach, but god no about hydraling... it destroys gateway hahaha

It actually doesn't. Gateway units with good forcefields can beat hydra/ling quite easily.
This will kill SG openings.

Good. Protoss has too many viable openings as it is, zerg needs some way to shut down a few of them without committing fully.
"Digital. They have digital. What is digital?" - Donald J Trump
kroko
Profile Blog Joined May 2004
Finland2136 Posts
January 23 2014 22:11 GMT
#392
Weird stuff.

I think the best idea was posted here by few ppl, remove the MSC vision. It will help atleast blink all in. But the late game TvP needs something. I feel it needs to be somekinda nerf, so it would also help in ZvP and sametime SH needs to be nerfed bit (so P stands a chance in lategame ZvP).
What are these chances? I dunno, I feel this game is fucked up already T_T.

I also hope random small buff for BC and Carrier, I think both need bit more range so they could be microed. Also BC energybar should be removed, so it wouldnt get megahardcountered by HT's. Make it like 'blink'-spell.

Just my random 2 cents.
I have Sick Timing and UnReal Macro
DeadByDawn
Profile Joined October 2012
United Kingdom476 Posts
January 23 2014 22:13 GMT
#393
These changes have discombobulated me. In TvP mech play how are you supposed to afford ghosts without crippling your mech count? The Ghost Academy is 50 gas, every ghost is 200mins & 100 gas. Where does the spare gas come from when you are building factories and tanks? Is just 1-2 ghosts mixed in with tanks useful? Has anyone tried this previously?
Tossim111
Profile Joined October 2009
United States246 Posts
January 23 2014 22:13 GMT
#394
On January 24 2014 07:10 Squat wrote:
Show nested quote +

Ok first of all, yes about the roach, but god no about hydraling... it destroys gateway hahaha

It actually doesn't. Gateway units with good forcefields can beat hydra/ling quite easily.


that will not take you very far as the hydra will trade VERY efficiently.
Cascade
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
Australia5405 Posts
January 23 2014 22:14 GMT
#395
At first glance the hydra buff looks silly to me, but thinking a bit about it I'm interested to see how it works out. Argument is like this:

Mass hydra is not really limited by gas. Or maybe just barely. So yes, you will be able to produce a bit more hydras if you decide to mass them, but seeing how bad mass hydra is now, I don't see that as a big issue. Or so I hope, if they do a test map, we will see. With some luck mass hydra will not be a problem.

What it does do, is to allow for hydras in otherwise gas heavy combinations. 4-1 mineral to gas almost makes hydras a mineral dump. Hydra-ultra maybe? Hydra-BL?

It may be too much, but I'm curious to see how it works out if tested.
ffadicted
Profile Joined January 2011
United States3545 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-23 22:16:21
January 23 2014 22:15 GMT
#396
On January 24 2014 07:10 Squat wrote:
Show nested quote +

Ok first of all, yes about the roach, but god no about hydraling... it destroys gateway hahaha

It actually doesn't. Gateway units with good forcefields can beat hydra/ling quite easily.
Show nested quote +
This will kill SG openings.

Good. Protoss has too many viable openings as it is, zerg needs some way to shut down a few of them without committing fully.


Idk what point of your post was more ridiculous, the fact you think sentry zealot stalker is good composition against mass hydraling (unless you're counting storm and archons as gateway, in which case, you're kinda missing the point of the issue with this thing), or the fact you think it's good to get rid of stargate openings lol
SooYoung-Noona!
wptlzkwjd
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1240 Posts
January 23 2014 22:17 GMT
#397
The ghost buff seems really good, especially for someone like me with a 20% TvP win rate. Well done!
Feel free to add me on steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/MagnusAskeland/
Chvol
Profile Joined August 2010
United States200 Posts
January 23 2014 22:18 GMT
#398
Zergs are only doing SH turtles because it works incredibly well. If Blizzard evens the tables so that protoss is on even footing in the LATE game, almost no zerg is gonna bother going to all the trouble of playing the strat anymore. That's probably for the best, since it's a really boring thing to watch. However, if they want to get rid of the strategy, I'd be more decisive about it. Just change the swarm host into a different type of unit and be done with it.
NotSoHappy
Profile Joined November 2010
445 Posts
January 23 2014 22:19 GMT
#399
On January 24 2014 07:06 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2014 07:00 NotSoHappy wrote:
On January 24 2014 06:56 ReMinD_ wrote:
On January 24 2014 06:19 DinoMight wrote:
Who says that a 12 min hydra bust would be slow hydras w no upgrades? You could work in ups.

Now picture this:

PvZ on Deadalus pt. Zerg goes for 2 base Hydra timing.

or PvZ on habitation station. Zerg goes for 3 base Hydra timing w/ gold base.


God forbid that a Protoss has to worry about a timing.


12m roach max and before that any of the infamous zerg/roach gate expo busts.

To be fair the 12 max roach was really powerful due to an ungodly amount of hp, not raw damage.


I was mainly pointing out a timing. Honestly, all the zergs have forgotten really fast how long the bl/infestor era was.
Squat
Profile Joined September 2013
Sweden7978 Posts
January 23 2014 22:20 GMT
#400
On January 24 2014 07:15 ffadicted wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 24 2014 07:10 Squat wrote:

Ok first of all, yes about the roach, but god no about hydraling... it destroys gateway hahaha

It actually doesn't. Gateway units with good forcefields can beat hydra/ling quite easily.
This will kill SG openings.

Good. Protoss has too many viable openings as it is, zerg needs some way to shut down a few of them without committing fully.


Idk what point of your post was more ridiculous, the fact you think sentry zealot stalker is good composition against mass hydraling (unless you're counting storm and archons as gateway, in which case, you're kinda missing the point of the issue with this thing), or the fact you think it's good to get rid of stargate openings lol

You're being overly dramatic. This will not kill SG openings, it will make them more risky. Which is good, currently protoss can get away more or less any opening because of PO. Giving Z and T more ways to punish bad/greedy P openings is a good move.

And no, zealot sentry stalker of roughly equal army size can beat hydra/ling. You may not be able to, but many protoss players are.
"Digital. They have digital. What is digital?" - Donald J Trump
Prev 1 18 19 20 21 22 51 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 7h 56m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech148
UpATreeSC 93
BRAT_OK 0
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 5026
Bisu 1945
Soulkey 1609
EffOrt 828
Mini 596
Horang2 388
Larva 357
ZerO 327
ggaemo 255
actioN 251
[ Show more ]
Yoon 116
Dewaltoss 112
Mind 92
sorry 84
hero 76
Shinee 70
Sharp 70
Barracks 65
Sea.KH 63
Pusan 57
Snow 48
Hyun 43
Bale 33
Trap 27
ToSsGirL 24
NaDa 20
Rock 17
Terrorterran 16
scan(afreeca) 13
Sacsri 11
Noble 9
zelot 9
ajuk12(nOOB) 6
Dota 2
Gorgc5500
qojqva2516
Dendi1281
420jenkins290
League of Legends
Reynor65
Counter-Strike
fl0m3168
x6flipin1212
Fnx 673
edward40
Heroes of the Storm
crisheroes365
Other Games
Liquid`RaSZi1272
hiko1039
B2W.Neo448
DeMusliM316
XBOCT255
Livibee231
Liquid`VortiX211
FrodaN180
QueenE98
TKL 49
Mew2King43
ZerO(Twitch)19
Organizations
Other Games
WardiTV72
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream29
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• StrangeGG 76
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• HerbMon 37
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV630
League of Legends
• Nemesis3660
• TFBlade587
Other Games
• Shiphtur474
Upcoming Events
PiGosaur Cup
7h 56m
Patches Events
23h 56m
The PondCast
1d 17h
INu's Battles
1d 18h
Percival vs TBD
Zoun vs herO
OSC
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
OSC
3 days
BSL: Ladder Tournament
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Patches Events
4 days
[ Show More ]
BSL Open Qualifier
5 days
BSL Open Qualifier
5 days
WardiTV Weekly
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

CSL 2026 AUTUMN (S22)
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Copium Cup

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Acropolis #5
Acropolis #5 - GSB
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
HCC Season 3
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.