• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 23:20
CEST 05:20
KST 12:20
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2914Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16)38Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format16[IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend!5Weekly Cups (July 6 - 12): Protoss strike back12BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion8
StarCraft 2
General
Balance hotfix patch 5.0.16b (July 16) [D] Wireframe Casting Removed Clem: "I don't have that much hope in Blizzard" Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format Is the larve respawn broken?
Tourneys
Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) WardiTV Summer Cup 2026 GSL CK #5 Race War RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event HomeStory Cup 29
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 534 Burning Evacuation Mutation # 533 Die Together Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family
Brood War
General
Pros Debate: Zerg Unfairly Nerfed? (ASL S22 map) Etiquete rules in Asl? BW General Discussion Recent recommended BW games Recommended FPV games (post-KeSPA)
Tourneys
Escore Tournament - Season 3 Small VOD Thread 2.0 [IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend! [Megathread] Daily Proleagues
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Power Rank NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread The Games Industry And ATVI Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread MLB/Baseball 2023 McBoner: A hockey love story Tennis[sport] Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
Northern Ireland Global Starcraft The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Poker (part 2)
Nebuchad
The Experiences We Want and …
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 6799 users

Starbow - Page 325

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 323 324 325 326 327 346 Next
SmileZerg
Profile Joined March 2012
United States543 Posts
November 09 2014 00:09 GMT
#6481
I do find it kind of amusing how shamelessly they ripped some of the ideas from us.

Stasis Wards on Oracles, Blizz? However did you think of that? ;D
"Show me your teeth."
404AlphaSquad
Profile Joined October 2011
839 Posts
November 09 2014 00:14 GMT
#6482
On November 09 2014 09:09 SmileZerg wrote:
I do find it kind of amusing how shamelessly they ripped some of the ideas from us.

Stasis Wards on Oracles, Blizz? However did you think of that? ;D

That doesnt matter. If Blizzard truly had "stolen" ideas from StarBow to make a better game, wouldnt that make everyone happy?
aka Kalevi
Foxxan
Profile Joined October 2004
Sweden3427 Posts
November 09 2014 00:17 GMT
#6483
starbow once had static mines?

I saw a comment today that said beta the first half of 2015.
This was after the sc2 multiplayer panel.
SmileZerg
Profile Joined March 2012
United States543 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-09 00:22:53
November 09 2014 00:21 GMT
#6484
On November 09 2014 09:14 404AlphaSquad wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 09 2014 09:09 SmileZerg wrote:
I do find it kind of amusing how shamelessly they ripped some of the ideas from us.

Stasis Wards on Oracles, Blizz? However did you think of that? ;D

That doesnt matter. If Blizzard truly had "stolen" ideas from StarBow to make a better game, wouldnt that make everyone happy?

Oh I agree, I didn't say it was a bad thing, just that I thought it was funny.

On November 09 2014 09:17 Foxxan wrote:
starbow once had static mines?

No but they were very obviously inspired by the Null Wards on the Sentinel.
"Show me your teeth."
Xiphias
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Norway2223 Posts
November 09 2014 18:56 GMT
#6485
An overview of similarities between Starbow and changes announced to come in LotV: (reddit thread: http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/2lrh9o/thoughts_and_ideas_from_starbow_in_legacy_of_the/)

Things the same in Starbow

  • 8 seconds warp in time for units from warpgates.
  • The lurker (but ofc from BW as well)
  • Dropships/Medivacs being able to pick up tanks in siege mode.
  • Speed and range upgrade to Banshee


Things similar in Starbow

  • The new economy structure.
  • Warp drive "blink" for the Battlecruiser.
  • Oracle stasis trap is mighty similar to the sentinel's null ward.
  • New corruptor ability to deal with ground buildings feels similar to the blight ability on the Devour.


Please do not misunderstand this post. I am hyped about LotV and happy that some ideas from Starbow is making it in to SC2. I am also aware that many of these ideas may have been developed independently and may not "come" from Starbow.

But the first thing I noticed from the LotV announcement was the similarities so I could not help myself from making these lists
aka KanBan85. Working on Starbow.
Foxxan
Profile Joined October 2004
Sweden3427 Posts
November 09 2014 19:03 GMT
#6486
The eco is unchanged in lotv.....
The corruptor ability is from the campaign.
-Dustin-
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States718 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-10 22:19:13
November 10 2014 22:18 GMT
#6487
On November 10 2014 03:56 Xiphias wrote:+ Show Spoiler +

An overview of similarities between Starbow and changes announced to come in LotV: (reddit thread: http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/2lrh9o/thoughts_and_ideas_from_starbow_in_legacy_of_the/)

Things the same in Starbow

  • 8 seconds warp in time for units from warpgates.
  • The lurker (but ofc from BW as well)
  • Dropships/Medivacs being able to pick up tanks in siege mode.
  • Speed and range upgrade to Banshee


Things similar in Starbow

  • The new economy structure.
  • Warp drive "blink" for the Battlecruiser.
  • Oracle stasis trap is mighty similar to the sentinel's null ward.
  • New corruptor ability to deal with ground buildings feels similar to the blight ability on the Devour.


Please do not misunderstand this post. I am hyped about LotV and happy that some ideas from Starbow is making it in to SC2. I am also aware that many of these ideas may have been developed independently and may not "come" from Starbow.

But the first thing I noticed from the LotV announcement was the similarities so I could not help myself from making these lists

Yeah it kinda took some of the hype out of it. Through most of the videos I was like seen it... seen it... but if its in Starbow it must be good I'm hoping they don't screw LotV up.
Kireak
Profile Joined March 2011
Sweden358 Posts
November 15 2014 15:56 GMT
#6488
I've posted in in the starbow forums, but I think regardless of whether Legacy of the void will be a great game or not it will mean that Starbow becomes more unique. If you want to play with old early rushes like 6 pool, early barracks pressure etc it means that you will have to play Starbow. It differentiates Broodwar and Starcraft 2 further, which means it will naturally differentiate Starbow further from Starcraft 2.
Tresher
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany404 Posts
November 15 2014 16:27 GMT
#6489
On November 10 2014 04:03 Foxxan wrote:
The eco is unchanged in lotv.....
The corruptor ability is from the campaign.

Eco itself not but you start with 12 workers and Mineral Patches and Gas geysers have less value.
Corruptors are not avaiable in Campaign.
Extreme Force
AndAgain
Profile Joined November 2010
United States2621 Posts
November 16 2014 04:46 GMT
#6490
An issue with Starbow I see is that players feel obliged to play in a certain style - whether it's like BW or however they'd like SC2 to be. So we're not gonna see what Starbow actually plays like until there's a strong enough incentive to win.
All your teeth should fall out and hair should grow in their place!
starslayer
Profile Joined August 2011
United States696 Posts
November 16 2014 04:54 GMT
#6491
On November 10 2014 04:03 Foxxan wrote:
The eco is unchanged in lotv.....
The corruptor ability is from the campaign.


the blink for bcs also was tired in hots beta for a bit if i remember right
i came here to kickass and chew bubblegum and i'm all out of bubble gum
FeyFey
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany10114 Posts
November 16 2014 06:37 GMT
#6492
So Starbow took ideas of the community and LotV did as well ... shocking. Wanted Sieged Tanks pickup able a few month into WoL, since they were the expensive thing that died first in combination with Bio and it made no sense to me that the meatshields for greedy Terrans are their expensive weaponry. So yay that LotV might have it, and yay that Starbow has it.

And BCs had a speed boost in HotS at some point. The warp idea came from the Hyperion mission.

Most from that list I recognized as ideas before Starbow implemented them. But skills are often just different versions of something that already existed in its pure form at some point. And to say something similar is a copy in that world makes everything a copy.

But I had to think of Starbow as well when I saw the LotV presentation, but I also think about Starbow if someone suggests anything here, no offense since I like to play the Mod.

(Gliding off topic now)

The other thing that came to my mind was, damn that looks like the Voidzone hell you know from MMOs and Dota style games. And while most Sc2 units and skills are somehow related to Sc1, you can also see that they got some inspiration from the rpg rts scene that split itself apart from the original rts scene around the decline of Wc3. And of course inhouse titles like D3.

Voidzones add some spice to LotV though and the intention is pretty clear too. Speed up the game but slow down big armies with voidzones. Makes the game alot harder to play and for me it sounds like LotV shouldn't be played on fastest, if you want players be able to handle the game without looking like idiots to viewers. But maybe LotV will bring back this BW effect where you think that you could never pull that off what just happened.
brickrd
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
United States4894 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-16 06:42:09
November 16 2014 06:39 GMT
#6493
nvm bad post
TL+ Member
Xiphias
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Norway2223 Posts
November 16 2014 21:35 GMT
#6494
Changes to testmap, Ahli made a lot of these changes happen, creds to him!

  • Medics have +50 max energy (total of 150)
  • Infested terrans are now 35 energy.
  • Carriers are now even more BW (thanks to Ahli)
  • Roaches are now on hatchery tech with roach warren requirement. They are 120 hp with 1 armor and 8 normal damage. For every hit on an enemy, the roach will add an effect which deals 6 damage over 5 seconds but does not stack. They also get a burrow speed bonus on creep.
  • Burrow upgrade on hatchery is now 100/100 and takes 120 seconds.
  • Mutalisks now have spread/clump button. Not super effective, by design.
  • Mutalisk attack aesthetics improved, thanks to dec for stealing that from SC2BW mod
  • Nydus worm no longer makes a noise for the opponent when finished.
  • Banelings now reveal cloaked units upon impact for 5 seconds.
  • Sentinel attack improved in terms of reliability.
  • Lurker sounds fixed.
  • SCV call-down back at 25 energy (I messed up with the 40 energy).
  • Inject back to 3 sec (it was 5 for a while).


Most of this stuff is pretty strait forward, but the roach and the infested terran changes I wanna say a bit about.

The roach idea props goes to Kireak and they are designed now to soft counter stalkers, but to be countered by dragoons to potentially add some more flavor to PvZ. Roach stats as they now stand may be bad though, this is initial testing. The extra damage effect it now has should help to discourage massing them as several roaches hitting the same target is less effective now.

trb found some incredibly broken strategies by abusing early infested terrans which was completely contrary to our game design philosophy with them. They probably actually need to be 50 energy, but we will try 35 for now. He could basically hard counter FFE and there was nothing toss could do about it with 0 risk to the zerg player.

If all the changes on the testmap feels good then this will be very similar to next patch. My impression is that the most controversial one is the instant inject.

Reminder about the names:
  • Fighting Spirit testmap: "sbow FS v0.510 testmap"
  • Unit tester: "Xiphias tester" (This is not to praise myself, I initially made this map just to test some stuff myself and it's much easier to update the mod behind a map then to change the map itself....)


Also, we will test a different version of the Herc as soon as LotV mod is done with it so we can "burrow" it :D
aka KanBan85. Working on Starbow.
royalroadweed
Profile Joined April 2013
United States8301 Posts
November 16 2014 21:40 GMT
#6495
On November 16 2014 13:54 starslayer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 10 2014 04:03 Foxxan wrote:
The eco is unchanged in lotv.....
The corruptor ability is from the campaign.


the blink for bcs also was tired in hots beta for a bit if i remember right

I think they had a slower, shorter medivac boost.
"Nerfing Toss can just make them stronger"
Incognoto
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
France10239 Posts
November 16 2014 21:42 GMT
#6496
On November 09 2014 09:09 SmileZerg wrote:
I do find it kind of amusing how shamelessly they ripped some of the ideas from us.

Stasis Wards on Oracles, Blizz? However did you think of that? ;D


Shame they didn't steal the way you guys set up gathering instead.
maru lover forever
Espers
Profile Joined August 2009
United Kingdom606 Posts
November 16 2014 21:57 GMT
#6497
I feel there's absolutely no direction with these Starbow changes. The Roach change doesn't seem very creative or interesting, they won't be fun to use at all. Stalkers will still hurt the PvZ matchup more than they add since Zerg can't tech behind Spine Crawlers, giving them very limited options.
Vehk
Profile Joined December 2010
United States151 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-11-17 01:25:30
November 17 2014 01:25 GMT
#6498
The Roach change makes them a very different unit. The complaints about the Roach were that that it is a "make a big ball of them" SC2 type unit. This Roach becomes less effective per cost if you mass a bunch of them due to the way the damage over time doesn't stack. It makes them more of a sprinkle them in your army type unit. In smaller numbers the Roach can change targets to maximize damage.
Organizer, Administrator, and Caster of Monday Night Starbow
Xiphias
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Norway2223 Posts
November 17 2014 01:59 GMT
#6499
On November 17 2014 06:57 Espers wrote:
I feel there's absolutely no direction with these Starbow changes. The Roach change doesn't seem very creative or interesting, they won't be fun to use at all. Stalkers will still hurt the PvZ matchup more than they add since Zerg can't tech behind Spine Crawlers, giving them very limited options.


The intention, especially since they are on hatch tech, is that you won't need a wall of spine crawlers (which does not help much anyways vs stalkers).
aka KanBan85. Working on Starbow.
Xiphias
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Norway2223 Posts
November 19 2014 15:27 GMT
#6500
Testmap update!

Things currently in the testmap which is not in the live version. A lot of this might get patched into the live version in the next patch. Warning, the testmap changes a lot all the time:

  • Max energy of Orbital, Nexus and Queens set to 45.
  • Rift is now 40 energy.
  • Lidar upgrade removed from the engineering bay.
  • Scan now starts on a 50 second cooldown with 2 charges. Energy cost of scan removed.
  • 3 second inject. Stick with 25 range for now.
  • Vision reduction like in the testmap. Most units got -1.
  • Infested terrans having marine stats.
  • Infested eggs having no armor.
  • Infestor burrow movement speed down to 2.8
  • Ensnare no longer reveals cloaked units.
  • Sentinel attack change to be two short beams of 5 damage each. The second beam fires shortly after the first and will not fire if you "scoot and shoot".
  • Null ward no longer cloaked. It now lives 15 seconds and has a weapon which deals 16 damage with a weapon speed of 1,5 and 8 range. Life of null ward increased to 25/25. Remember that null-wards, although they are flying units, cannot be placed over unpathable terrain nor dead-space.
  • Banelings always do their effect upon death.
  • Bug fix banelings to reveal cloaked units.
  • Parasite lasts 60 sec +1 range and no cast delay time.
  • Missile turrets missiles are 12,5% faster (bug fix).
  • Irradiate does 8 dmg / sec for 22 sec. Total of 176 damage.
  • Burrow trail for infestors (bug fix).
  • Remove burrow queen hatch requirement bug.
  • Fixed Greater spire tooltip.
  • Medics +50 starting energy.
  • Infested terrans are now 35 energy.
  • Roaches are now on hatchery tech with roach warren requirement. They are 150 hp with 1 armor and 10 normal damage. For every hit on an enemy, the roach will add an effect which deals 8 damage over 5 seconds but does not stack. They also get a burrow speed bonus on creep. They unlock burrow from the burrow upgrade on hatchery.
  • Burrow upgrade on hatchery is now 100/100 and takes 120 seconds.
  • Mutalisks now have spread/clump button. Not super effective, by design.
  • Mutalisk attack aesthetics improved
  • Mutalisk range decreased to 3.25
  • Nydus worm no longer makes a noise for the opponent when finished.
  • Sentinel cost reduced to 75/125.
  • Nurture swarm is energy cost set to 40. It increases BT by 150% (up from 100%), but still heals for the same amount. (75 hp).
  • Overseers have new ability. Spawn Wespling. Cost 100 energy. Spawns a small flying unit with 2,5 movement speed for 25 seconds. The Wespling has 50 life.
  • Overseer speed reduced to overlord speed.
  • Vulture hp increased to 80.
aka KanBan85. Working on Starbow.
Prev 1 323 324 325 326 327 346 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
00:00
Crank Gathers S4: Group Stage
CranKy Ducklings129
LiquipediaDiscussion
PSISTORM Gaming Misc
23:00
FSL playoffsTeamLeague STvsASH
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft577
RuFF_SC2 177
WinterStarcraft158
Nina 83
FoxeR 60
trigger 31
PiLiPiLi 7
StarCraft: Brood War
Leta 1721
NaDa 64
Noble 56
Icarus 8
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm166
League of Legends
JimRising 644
Counter-Strike
summit1g9451
taco 310
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King257
amsayoshi26
Heroes of the Storm
Trikslyr64
Other Games
ViBE196
XaKoH 125
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2505
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 104
• OhrlRock 2
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 14
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Stunt225
Other Games
• Scarra1249
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
5h 40m
Clem vs Lambo
Scarlett vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
6h 40m
Epic.LAN
9h 40m
IPSL
12h 40m
Dragon vs Hawk
RSL Revival
1d 5h
Classic vs Trap
herO vs SHIN
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 6h
OSC
1d 9h
IPSL
1d 12h
Bonyth vs Ret
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
Monday Night Weeklies
2 days
[ Show More ]
PiGosaur Cup
3 days
The PondCast
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
6 days
Korean StarCraft League
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S3: W3
HSC XXIX
Eternal Conflict S2 E2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
YSL S3
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 3
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 1
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
SCTL 2026 Spring
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W4
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 2
Escore Tournament S3: W5
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Logitech G Connect 2026
StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.