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Kas to retire from SC2? - Page 16

Forum Index > SC2 General
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VmY
Profile Joined August 2011
Netherlands1286 Posts
December 22 2013 15:19 GMT
#301
I can't quite tell by these comments, is this reddit or teamliquid? Pathetic.

I hope he doesn't quit though, Kas is to amazing to do so <3
Why can't I quit you, siege tank? FanTaSy, Mvp.
HN_KrO
Profile Joined December 2013
United Kingdom9 Posts
December 22 2013 16:10 GMT
#302
Not the best way to leave the scene, but oh well it is his decision. Shame that the RTS scene is pretty dead now with hardly any recent releases in the genre or any major up and coming titles in the pipeline. Not much out there to switch to unless you one visits an older title. This may make him stay with sc2 despite its flaws.
Twine
Profile Joined June 2012
France246 Posts
December 22 2013 16:22 GMT
#303
On December 22 2013 07:44 blade55555 wrote:

who are these multiple foreign protoss players? it's naniwa and that's it.



Elfi, Welmu did make some results lately too ^^
#1 Bomber fan | Jin Air best KT
SinCitta
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Germany2127 Posts
December 22 2013 16:25 GMT
#304
I'm 70% sure he doesn't really retire. You don't throw away your career out of rage. Besides, he is a pretty good random player, so I'd see him switching race before he actually retired.
ETisME
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
12478 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-22 16:34:03
December 22 2013 16:33 GMT
#305
On December 23 2013 01:22 Twine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2013 07:44 blade55555 wrote:

who are these multiple foreign protoss players? it's naniwa and that's it.



Elfi, Welmu did make some results lately too ^^

happy is doing quite well in hots and he even plays mech occasionally, what a champ
其疾如风,其徐如林,侵掠如火,不动如山,难知如阴,动如雷震。
HeavenResign
Profile Joined April 2011
United States702 Posts
December 22 2013 16:50 GMT
#306
On December 22 2013 20:03 Fjodorov wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2013 19:43 Drake wrote:
he also hated new maps saying blizzard should ask pros before maps ... i think he not get the point that its a game and they have to master it, not a game made for exactly what they good in ...
he was vs everything who was not terran imba so ...
as nice as he is, he whines way to much for a player as good as he is

hope still he not retire because he has talent, if he stop complaining and start building ghosts vs templar xD

On December 22 2013 19:41 -NeBu- wrote:
Nothing new, Blizzard kill this game, TvP are unplayable for terran, it's a fu**ing joke.

GL in future, Kas!


... thats why taeja won every fuckn tournament and terrans overall has best results right ?
god i hate balance whiners

On December 22 2013 19:21 Fjodorov wrote:
I think what has made alot of pro terrans angry, more angry than other times of imbalance or game issues, is that blizzard recently actively buffed the oracle and nerfed the wm. Especially the oracle buff is impossible to understand for anyone it seems. And its such a kick in the balls to have something like that happen to the game you play 8-10 hours/day. I can imagine anyways. I havent seen anyone on this forum or in any thread actually defend the oracle buff or say its good for the game.


ok look here "its good for the game" ...
how many of the PROS gamers you saw loosing to oracle in recent tournaments ?
right ...


Ask yourself who is doing well and, placing high in tournaments and even winning them? Apart from innovation, its the same few terran players since 2 years back who have been winning stuff no matter what state the game is in.


Maru?
P_e_X
Profile Joined February 2013
Germany43 Posts
December 22 2013 17:01 GMT
#307
thos ladder tosses eat you up alive if you let it happen...
awwwww shiiiiieeet :3
pieroog
Profile Joined June 2010
Poland146 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-22 17:07:20
December 22 2013 17:05 GMT
#308
why so much rage recently? When BL-INF was ruling for 1.5 yrs nobody came even close to the state that is today. is this some kind of collective excuse for not improving and winning ez-mode?

+ ladder is a kingdom of BM - "F-U" is the most common response to my 'HF'
Thor.Rush
Profile Joined April 2011
Sweden702 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-22 17:11:35
December 22 2013 17:09 GMT
#309
It's been pretty much impossible for foreign terrans to succeed since the race got nerfed into the ground over the years. Only top korean pro level is more balanced. Below that, it's insane.

By the way, I switched to toss couple months ago. So you can't say I'm a Terran whiner. I'm officially a protoss player now, until things change.
| SaSe | Naniwa |Stephano | LucifroN | Mvp | MarineKing | ByuN | Polt | MC | Parting |
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
December 22 2013 17:13 GMT
#310
On December 23 2013 01:50 HeavenResign wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 22 2013 20:03 Fjodorov wrote:
On December 22 2013 19:43 Drake wrote:
he also hated new maps saying blizzard should ask pros before maps ... i think he not get the point that its a game and they have to master it, not a game made for exactly what they good in ...
he was vs everything who was not terran imba so ...
as nice as he is, he whines way to much for a player as good as he is

hope still he not retire because he has talent, if he stop complaining and start building ghosts vs templar xD

On December 22 2013 19:41 -NeBu- wrote:
Nothing new, Blizzard kill this game, TvP are unplayable for terran, it's a fu**ing joke.

GL in future, Kas!


... thats why taeja won every fuckn tournament and terrans overall has best results right ?
god i hate balance whiners

On December 22 2013 19:21 Fjodorov wrote:
I think what has made alot of pro terrans angry, more angry than other times of imbalance or game issues, is that blizzard recently actively buffed the oracle and nerfed the wm. Especially the oracle buff is impossible to understand for anyone it seems. And its such a kick in the balls to have something like that happen to the game you play 8-10 hours/day. I can imagine anyways. I havent seen anyone on this forum or in any thread actually defend the oracle buff or say its good for the game.


ok look here "its good for the game" ...
how many of the PROS gamers you saw loosing to oracle in recent tournaments ?
right ...


Ask yourself who is doing well and, placing high in tournaments and even winning them? Apart from innovation, its the same few terran players since 2 years back who have been winning stuff no matter what state the game is in.


Maru?

Maru was not as successful in WoL, but he's one of the oldest Terran players when it comes to SC2 longevity: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2010_TG_Sambo_Intel_StarCraft_II_Open_Season_1
Dingodile
Profile Joined December 2011
4135 Posts
December 22 2013 17:16 GMT
#311
On December 23 2013 02:05 pieroog wrote:
why so much rage recently? When BL-INF was ruling for 1.5 yrs nobody came even close to the state that is today. is this some kind of collective excuse for not improving and winning ez-mode?

1.5yrs? It was from May 2012 - March 2013. And go ask these Terrans, they all prefers OP BL-INF than TvP now.
Grubby | ToD | Moon | Lyn | Sky
docvoc
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
United States5491 Posts
December 22 2013 17:17 GMT
#312
On December 23 2013 02:09 Thor.Rush wrote:
It's been pretty much impossible for foreign terrans to succeed since the race got nerfed into the ground over the years. Only top korean pro level is more balanced. Below that, it's insane.

By the way, I switched to toss couple months ago. So you can't say I'm a Terran whiner. I'm officially a protoss player now, until things change.

So basically, when Terran had a 60+% win rate it was ok. Terran is allowed to crush face, but the other races can't because that's imbalance? There was a singular point before Blord-festor when the game was literally at near perfect balance, but even then there were terrans complaining about "being nerfed into the ground." If korean terrans can do it, there is no reason why a foreigner terran can't learn from them and improve to that point. There isn't some magical barrier that prevents Kas from practicing 13 hours a day every day.
User was warned for too many mimes.
Kevin_Sorbo
Profile Joined November 2011
Canada3217 Posts
December 22 2013 17:21 GMT
#313
Empire should've sent him grind the Kr ladder 2 yrs ago. He would've won tourneys imo.
The mind is like a parachute, it doesnt work unless its open. - Zappa
kusto
Profile Joined November 2010
Russian Federation823 Posts
December 22 2013 17:24 GMT
#314
On December 22 2013 10:12 Nebuchad wrote:
"I think RTS isn’t the right type of game for people who quit because they get frustrated."

This from Dear. It's funny because it's both right and wrong. If you get frustrated too much, then you start to lose hope. But if you don't care about losing, then you won't have the sufficient drive to do the things that are needed to start not losing.



This quote applies to anything where you can lose.
the game is the game
cptjibberjabber
Profile Joined November 2012
Netherlands87 Posts
December 22 2013 17:27 GMT
#315
On December 23 2013 02:05 pieroog wrote:
why so much rage recently? When BL-INF was ruling for 1.5 yrs nobody came even close to the state that is today. is this some kind of collective excuse for not improving and winning ez-mode?

+ ladder is a kingdom of BM - "F-U" is the most common response to my 'HF'


I didn't have any problems with the winfestor days. I could always see why I lost. I would have played a game for 15 minutes, after which I would have to be ready for BL-INF. And if I messed up, i got fungaled. Or something like that. I could always see an opening: I could have counter-dropped, I should have spread better, I should not have sieged my tanks so late, I should have spread my vikings better, etcetera.

But here, I do my opening, scout the protoss, scout he's going blink stalkers and there's nothing I can do to easily counter this cheese, like with all other cheeses. I just plop down bunkers, start making a siege tank and hope I don't lose more than 10 scv's or so. It's infuriating. I don't get the chance to practice my mechanics, I don't get the chance to do what I like to do, I don't get the chance to prepare because I can't do anything against those stalkers when my marines don't have their upgrades. that is why there is so much more hate now.

I completely didn't mine BL-INF. I was in platinum after all, there's so much you can do at that level to improve. But with blink stalkers or oracles, I don't get the chance to improve because of this maddening cheese. I want to play macro TvP's, because they are fun. but those damn protosses won't bloody let me...
HeavenResign
Profile Joined April 2011
United States702 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-22 17:38:48
December 22 2013 17:35 GMT
#316
On December 23 2013 02:13 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 23 2013 01:50 HeavenResign wrote:
On December 22 2013 20:03 Fjodorov wrote:
On December 22 2013 19:43 Drake wrote:
he also hated new maps saying blizzard should ask pros before maps ... i think he not get the point that its a game and they have to master it, not a game made for exactly what they good in ...
he was vs everything who was not terran imba so ...
as nice as he is, he whines way to much for a player as good as he is

hope still he not retire because he has talent, if he stop complaining and start building ghosts vs templar xD

On December 22 2013 19:41 -NeBu- wrote:
Nothing new, Blizzard kill this game, TvP are unplayable for terran, it's a fu**ing joke.

GL in future, Kas!


... thats why taeja won every fuckn tournament and terrans overall has best results right ?
god i hate balance whiners

On December 22 2013 19:21 Fjodorov wrote:
I think what has made alot of pro terrans angry, more angry than other times of imbalance or game issues, is that blizzard recently actively buffed the oracle and nerfed the wm. Especially the oracle buff is impossible to understand for anyone it seems. And its such a kick in the balls to have something like that happen to the game you play 8-10 hours/day. I can imagine anyways. I havent seen anyone on this forum or in any thread actually defend the oracle buff or say its good for the game.


ok look here "its good for the game" ...
how many of the PROS gamers you saw loosing to oracle in recent tournaments ?
right ...


Ask yourself who is doing well and, placing high in tournaments and even winning them? Apart from innovation, its the same few terran players since 2 years back who have been winning stuff no matter what state the game is in.


Maru?

Maru was not as successful in WoL, but he's one of the oldest Terran players when it comes to SC2 longevity: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/2010_TG_Sambo_Intel_StarCraft_II_Open_Season_1


That is awesome, but it was specifically said 'who have been winning stuff no matter what state the game is in'. I still think Maru answers that question since I believe he's referencing players like Taeja/MVP. Thanks for the info though!

Edit: Though if Asia Starcraft League was played on WoL that may count him out :p
emythrel
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United Kingdom2599 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-22 17:37:57
December 22 2013 17:36 GMT
#317
I dont' get why people always seperate our korean terran from foreign terrans, if terran is fine in korea, its fine everywhere else. If korean terrans can beat their overpowered korean Protoss foes then why can't foreign terran beat foreign protoss?. Perhaps the problem isnt with balance but with the players.

The only reason why koeans are better than foreigners is work ethic, there is nothing about being korean that makes u better at starcraft, only the methods they use to train. So basically if you are saying that terran is fine if ur Taeja but not if ur anyone else, the reality of your statement is that you just don't work heard enough. Thats the difference, you aren't as good as your opponents. If Korean terrans can make it work, consistently, and you can't.... its because they are better than you. So maybe instead of blaming balance and David Kim, try looking in a mirror and see that YOU are the problem.

I doubt Taeja gets up in the morning and thinks "I wish David Kim would make my race more powerful so I can put in less practice", no he gets up and practices so fucking hard that even if the race is underpowered, he is sooooo much better than his opponents mechanically, strategically and physically that it doesn't matter. Thats why champions do, they don't bitch and whine.... they work harder than everyone else.

Michael Jordan, Carl Lewis, Kobe Bryant, David Beckham. What do all those names have in common? They are all considered thet best of their era in their respective sports, ask any of them what made them the best and they will all tell you the same thing, I worked three times harder than anyone else.
When there is nothing left to lose but your dignity, it is already gone.
Firlefanz
Profile Joined November 2011
Germany245 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-12-22 18:06:01
December 22 2013 18:02 GMT
#318
On December 23 2013 02:27 cptjibberjabber wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 23 2013 02:05 pieroog wrote:
why so much rage recently? When BL-INF was ruling for 1.5 yrs nobody came even close to the state that is today. is this some kind of collective excuse for not improving and winning ez-mode?

+ ladder is a kingdom of BM - "F-U" is the most common response to my 'HF'


I didn't have any problems with the winfestor days. I could always see why I lost. I would have played a game for 15 minutes, after which I would have to be ready for BL-INF. And if I messed up, i got fungaled. Or something like that. I could always see an opening: I could have counter-dropped, I should have spread better, I should not have sieged my tanks so late, I should have spread my vikings better, etcetera.

But here, I do my opening, scout the protoss, scout he's going blink stalkers and there's nothing I can do to easily counter this cheese, like with all other cheeses. I just plop down bunkers, start making a siege tank and hope I don't lose more than 10 scv's or so. It's infuriating. I don't get the chance to practice my mechanics, I don't get the chance to do what I like to do, I don't get the chance to prepare because I can't do anything against those stalkers when my marines don't have their upgrades. that is why there is so much more hate now.

I completely didn't mine BL-INF. I was in platinum after all, there's so much you can do at that level to improve. But with blink stalkers or oracles, I don't get the chance to improve because of this maddening cheese. I want to play macro TvP's, because they are fun. but those damn protosses won't bloody let me...

Same for me. I was diamond in WoL and while TvZ was hard it wasn't nearly as frustrating as TvP is today. You could always learn something from these macro TvZ's. You realized that you were too passive and weren't actively denying hatcheries and stuff. Maybe BL/Infestor was imbalanced at pro level, at my level of play it wasn't. Good positioning with your vikings could deal with the zerg deathball and if it wasn't enough you could always see in which phase you lost control of the game.

TvP (again: at my level of play!) nowadays is praying that you get into the midgame without playing from ridiculously far behind. Protoss openers come with no risk at all even proxy strategies aren't affected at all when scouted. Terran can die so easily in the early game even if prepared for your opponents strategy.
And when watching the replay you get mad, because the protoss cut so many corners and didn't scout any of your tech. You realize that he'd be absolutely screwed if i just went for a different strategy. Unfortunately i can not reactively allin him (besides the SCV pull), while the protoss can if he spots a weakness in my build. The matchup feels like a giant coin-flip to me.
Haku
Profile Joined August 2013
Germany550 Posts
December 22 2013 18:02 GMT
#319
On December 23 2013 02:36 emythrel wrote:
I dont' get why people always seperate our korean terran from foreign terrans, if terran is fine in korea, its fine everywhere else. If korean terrans can beat their overpowered korean Protoss foes then why can't foreign terran beat foreign protoss?. Perhaps the problem isnt with balance but with the players.

The only reason why koeans are better than foreigners is work ethic, there is nothing about being korean that makes u better at starcraft, only the methods they use to train. So basically if you are saying that terran is fine if ur Taeja but not if ur anyone else, the reality of your statement is that you just don't work heard enough. Thats the difference, you aren't as good as your opponents. If Korean terrans can make it work, consistently, and you can't.... its because they are better than you. So maybe instead of blaming balance and David Kim, try looking in a mirror and see that YOU are the problem.

I doubt Taeja gets up in the morning and thinks "I wish David Kim would make my race more powerful so I can put in less practice", no he gets up and practices so fucking hard that even if the race is underpowered, he is sooooo much better than his opponents mechanically, strategically and physically that it doesn't matter. Thats why champions do, they don't bitch and whine.... they work harder than everyone else.

Michael Jordan, Carl Lewis, Kobe Bryant, David Beckham. What do all those names have in common? They are all considered thet best of their era in their respective sports, ask any of them what made them the best and they will all tell you the same thing, I worked three times harder than anyone else.


Thats just right. If the foreign players would put more work into the game, they would get more success. It has nothing to do with genetics of koreans or anything else. Also the race is not underpowered.
Foreign Zergs are also worse than Korean Zergs and its not because of their race is underpowered, they are just not good enough.
Jaedong | Life | MKP | PartinG | LosirA | ByuN | TaeJa | TY | TLO | Bomber | HerO | Rotti | Dark | Stephano | Maru | Ragnarok | MC | IdrA | Serral | Creator | Bunny | INnoVation | Liquid | Prime | JinAir
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
December 22 2013 18:05 GMT
#320
That's unfortunate, Kas was one of the best foreing Terrans (one could maybe even argue THE best), I hope he calms down or at least comes back as soon as PvT swings back to a more balanced state.
Get off my lawn, young punks
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