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TPW Mapmaking Team Officially Retires - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Timetwister22
Profile Joined March 2011
United States538 Posts
August 24 2013 12:58 GMT
#21
Esv is the dominate power once again. Muhahahaha. No but really, good luck to all of who who step away. Was fun.
Former ESV Mapmaker | @Timetwister22
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
August 24 2013 13:07 GMT
#22
This seems unnecessary. Doesn't TPW normally cycle between mindless inactivity and intense productivity?
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
Ragoo
Profile Joined March 2010
Germany2773 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-24 13:11:09
August 24 2013 13:10 GMT
#23
On August 24 2013 21:41 Big J wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2013 21:29 Ragoo wrote:
On August 24 2013 21:26 Big J wrote:
sad, I always loved browsing through topmaps.
However I gotta say you are being very harsh on blizzard/community. Neither the players, nor the viewers want to have 20+ tournament maps around. Mappools will simply be kept small and rotate slowly.

It's not on the maps to revolutionize the metagame, it's on the players. (no matter how many out-of-context BW replies I get for this sentence, I will put it out)


Ehm 20+ maps is a horrible idea. I never proposed such a thing. In fact I think for the longest time we had too many tournament maps around.

More maps means maps and map pools can be less unique or you have a hard time practicing.

In BW map pools were 4 or 5 maps big but they were really well made and diverse plus they were rotated more often which would be a more desirable state.


Well, blizzard makes a few maps per season. Kespa makes a few maps per season. Gom makes a few maps per season. A few maps of various community mapmakerteams and contests make it into the mappools every few seasons.

There is not a lot of room for any other maps, unless you want the united global mappool to be bigger.


And why not, Korea already has exclusive maps why can't NA and EU also have exclusive maps.

And why the hell does Blizzard have to make maps? It's not their strongest area so why do it when they can have maps for free from the community who has some experts for mapmaking.

Also the rotation for maps is still too slow.
Member of TPW mapmaking team/// twitter.com/Ragoo_ /// "goody represents border between explainable reason and supernatural" Cloud
ScorpSCII
Profile Joined April 2012
Denmark499 Posts
August 24 2013 13:14 GMT
#24
On August 24 2013 21:37 chuky500 wrote:
Does it have to do with the fact that the CSL map contest only accepts 2 maps per team or just a coincidence ?

There's no connection. That rule just made everyone not care about the contest.
Mapmaker | Author of Atlas, Rao Mesa & Paralda
eTcetRa
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia822 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-24 13:31:05
August 24 2013 13:30 GMT
#25
On August 24 2013 21:41 Big J wrote:
Well, blizzard makes a few maps per season. Kespa makes a few maps per season. Gom makes a few maps per season. A few maps of various community mapmakerteams and contests make it into the mappools every few seasons.

There is not a lot of room for any other maps, unless you want the united global mappool to be bigger.



That is just entirely not true Big J I don't know where you pulled that from.


Blizzard might make a new map every WCS season, and it would probably be a bad map.
We can assume that Gom and Kespa will continue to be alternating seasons, so the hosting company might get an allocated map for their season. "A few community maps" simply don't get added every few seasons. Every couple years sure.

Ideally every WCS season we're getting one new map from Blizzard (we shouldn't be, they are bad) and one Kespa/Gom map. That leaves room for one new community map (for a reasonable rotation) EVERY season. 3 new maps 4 old maps every season.

What would be better is one new Gom/Kespa map and two new community maps (or vice versa)...

Tall order.
Retired Mapmaker™
Arceus
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Vietnam8333 Posts
August 24 2013 13:41 GMT
#26
Obviously only more or less standard maps get in the rotation. Look at Anaconda/Gwanghalli being left out this season while Polar Night (aka 90 degree rotation of some older map) gets in.
What's worse? I feel like even GOM is getting very Blizzard-ish recently as their maps seem more and more generic each season.
Hell, thats what our community want. No safe 3rd? fuck this shit Rotational symmetry? fuck this shit Big 4-player map? fuck this shit. the list goes on
Jukado
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
805 Posts
August 24 2013 13:43 GMT
#27
Hello! I am a broodwar map maker, and I read all SC2 map threads here on tl. Im not sure if you know of me, hence the mini intro, but I have really enjoyed all your creations.
Im interested in what you guys are planning on doing next. Personally I am finding pixel art, and also 3d modelling in blender really fun at the moment.
+ Show Spoiler +

Random pixel art article
http://gas13.ru/v3/tutorials/sywtbapa_breathing_life_into_sprites.php
Gallery page of the official blender website
http://www.blender.org/features-gallery/gallery/art-gallery/

You guys are all expert 3d modellers now, where will you take these talents?
Are there any games you are interested in getting involved with?
Basically, whats on the cards now?

Alot of mapping concepts from sc2 transfer over to broodwar, so if you fancy doing some broodwar map making, head to broodwarmaps.net There have been over 10 new maps uploaded there in the last week alone, so we are pretty active!
Star Tale Public Domain project. Maps: (2)Gates Of Memphis, (2)Marshmallow Toast, (4)Bubbles, (4)Clay Fields, (6)Numbskull Desert. Also the Vaylu Public Domain Tileset. Also Ramp Palettes, Brood War guides and some fun stuff. Links in my profile
Loxley
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Netherlands2480 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-24 18:03:30
August 24 2013 14:06 GMT
#28
On August 24 2013 20:50 Archas wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2013 20:45 Stijn wrote:
So there's 7 people in this team, and they all collectively decided to never start the Galaxy Editor again?

Is it really so unbelievable? Making competitive maps for StarCraft II has always been an uphill struggle, and Blizzard hasn't exactly been entirely receptive to integrating the community maps into the ladder for a long, long time. Barring the two TLMC events, there's always been a nigh-impregnable barrier for mapmakers to deal with in order to get any sort of return on their time.

While I'm saddened by the disbanding of TPW's incredibly talented team of cartographers, I unfortunately can't say I'm very surprised by it either. Good luck to all of you fine people.


ROI? Hmm why not make maps just for the love of the game? Mapmaking as long as I know it always has been about fans of the game giving something. From the first half-life maps, to great maps like cloud kingdom in sc2. Isn't appreciation and love of the community enough? Does there need to be a revenue-model in place?

Still I have enough trust that there will be people making maps simply because they can and want to create stuff they like to play themselves.

[edit]Dayum was supposed to be a reaction to http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=426719#7
quoted it for better reference :/
월요 날 재미있
a176
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada6688 Posts
August 24 2013 14:14 GMT
#29
[image loading]

This is the shit that Blizzard "designs" and decides to throw it into the ladder pool for its community.

And people are asking why the mapmakers leave the scene, if not the game altogether?
starleague forever
a176
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada6688 Posts
August 24 2013 14:16 GMT
#30
On August 24 2013 23:06 Loxley wrote:
ROI? Hmm why not make maps just for the love of the game? Mapmaking as long as I know it always has been about fans of the game giving something. From the first half-life maps, to great maps like cloud kingdom in sc2. Isn't appreciation and love of the community enough? Does there need to be a revenue-model in place?

Still I have enough trust that there will be people making maps simply because they can and want to create stuff they like to play themselves.


You might want to re-read the OP
starleague forever
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
August 24 2013 14:17 GMT
#31
On August 24 2013 22:41 Arceus wrote:
Obviously only more or less standard maps get in the rotation. Look at Anaconda/Gwanghalli being left out this season while Polar Night (aka 90 degree rotation of some older map) gets in.
What's worse? I feel like even GOM is getting very Blizzard-ish recently as their maps seem more and more generic each season.
Hell, thats what our community want. No safe 3rd? fuck this shit Rotational symmetry? fuck this shit Big 4-player map? fuck this shit. the list goes on

Polar night being included is so that there is greater alignment between WCS and Ladder. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=426693
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
eTcetRa
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia822 Posts
August 24 2013 14:18 GMT
#32
On August 24 2013 23:06 Loxley wrote:
ROI? Hmm why not make maps just for the love of the game? Mapmaking as long as I know it always has been about fans of the game giving something. From the first half-life maps, to great maps like cloud kingdom in sc2. Isn't appreciation and love of the community enough? Does there need to be a revenue-model in place?

Still I have enough trust that there will be people making maps simply because they can and want to create stuff they like to play themselves.


Doesn't look like you read the OP at all...
Retired Mapmaker™
Meerel
Profile Joined March 2012
Germany713 Posts
August 24 2013 15:41 GMT
#33
On August 24 2013 22:43 CardinalAllin wrote:
Hello! I am a broodwar map maker, and I read all SC2 map threads here on tl. Im not sure if you know of me, hence the mini intro, but I have really enjoyed all your creations.
Im interested in what you guys are planning on doing next. Personally I am finding pixel art, and also 3d modelling in blender really fun at the moment.
+ Show Spoiler +

Random pixel art article
http://gas13.ru/v3/tutorials/sywtbapa_breathing_life_into_sprites.php
Gallery page of the official blender website
http://www.blender.org/features-gallery/gallery/art-gallery/

You guys are all expert 3d modellers now, where will you take these talents?
Are there any games you are interested in getting involved with?
Basically, whats on the cards now?

Alot of mapping concepts from sc2 transfer over to broodwar, so if you fancy doing some broodwar map making, head to broodwarmaps.net There have been over 10 new maps uploaded there in the last week alone, so we are pretty active!


well maybe i will make something with maps in the future, but for now its mostly Dota and rl stuff.
we arent really 3d modeller for the most part i think, some made some basic stuff like lefix. i think the skills you get from mapmaking is mostly in leveldesign
SDMF
MorroW
Profile Joined August 2008
Sweden3522 Posts
August 24 2013 16:05 GMT
#34
i used to make melee maps back in the day for fun but a little hoping something would be used in tournaments. but quickly i realized the structure in tournament formats and blizzard having control i quickly lost hope for it.
how maps have been selected and which maps has been played through-out sc2 is a tragedy :/
Progamerpls no copy pasterino
myRZeth
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany1047 Posts
August 24 2013 16:07 GMT
#35
cool blizzard, glad to have to play your maps in the future
sabas123
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Netherlands3122 Posts
August 24 2013 16:07 GMT
#36
On August 24 2013 21:41 Big J wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2013 21:29 Ragoo wrote:
On August 24 2013 21:26 Big J wrote:
sad, I always loved browsing through topmaps.
However I gotta say you are being very harsh on blizzard/community. Neither the players, nor the viewers want to have 20+ tournament maps around. Mappools will simply be kept small and rotate slowly.

It's not on the maps to revolutionize the metagame, it's on the players. (no matter how many out-of-context BW replies I get for this sentence, I will put it out)


Ehm 20+ maps is a horrible idea. I never proposed such a thing. In fact I think for the longest time we had too many tournament maps around.

More maps means maps and map pools can be less unique or you have a hard time practicing.

In BW map pools were 4 or 5 maps big but they were really well made and diverse plus they were rotated more often which would be a more desirable state.


Well, blizzard makes a few maps per season. Kespa makes a few maps per season. Gom makes a few maps per season. A few maps of various community mapmakerteams and contests make it into the mappools every few seasons.

There is not a lot of room for any other maps, unless you want the united global mappool to be bigger.

maby rotate more quickly between them?

tpw, gl in everything you will do in the rest of your live
The harder it becomes, the more you should focus on the basics.
Uvantak
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
Uruguay1381 Posts
August 24 2013 17:53 GMT
#37
Well that was unexpected, i didn't thought that you guys would release a "press statement", but yeah, TPW had been quite innactive for a good while, but here 'im waiting you guys suck at retiring just like ProdiG ^^

Also what will happen to sc2melee.net will you guys keep updating it? will you give the control of the page to someone? or will you put the web down for good?
@Kantuva | Mapmaker | KTVMaps.wordpress.com | Check my profile to see my TL map threads, and you can search for KTV in the Custom Games section to play them.
Loxley
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
Netherlands2480 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-08-24 18:03:18
August 24 2013 18:02 GMT
#38
remove please. Double post.
월요 날 재미있
IronManSC
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States2119 Posts
August 25 2013 01:26 GMT
#39
On August 24 2013 20:59 Qikz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 24 2013 20:51 Vindicare605 wrote:
It's really sad how little support there has been in the foreign community for mapmakers.

It's sad to see you guys go. Hopefully Blizzard gets their act together at some point and hopefully it'll be enough to bring some life back into the community.


The issue with saying statements like this is that these people were never hired by anyone. I'm pretty sure the teams that make maps for Kespa/OGN are all on staff are they not? Admittedly it's still shit and it has been for a very long time, but the SC2 community thanks to terrible game design for the entirety of WoL and maybe even now cannot seem to accept that not every map has to be Ohana. I singlehandedly blame that map for the majority of problems the map making community has.

Ironman I'm sorry, but you made a very stale and boring map to watch and play, yet people lapped it up for some reason and since that map and Daybreak stayed in the pool for so long, the majority of people won't accept the more off the wall maps that these teams create. Korpulu for example was by far the most interesting map in the TLMC and because it didn't resemble Daybreak/Ohana/other boring as hell easy 4 base maps, people hated it and didn't vote for it.

The issues with map making outside of Korea are numerous. Blizzard may be one yes, but the community at large is the largest. Any time a map appears with 4 spawns people protest that it be made cross spawns. I mean what is the point of even bothering to make a 4P map if it's only going to have 2 sets of possible spawns? Why not just make a 2 player map? That issue alone stagnated the entire metagame in WoL due to the lack of variety in maps in WoL and is starting to do the same in HoTS too.

I wish you guys the best of luck as Monitor and Terranlover made some of my favourite maps, it's a shame you all lost your passion and drive but I can understand why. I wish it didn't have to end like this ;/



Ok? It's not like I haven't heard this complaint before, and I even admitted several times that it has become a boring map. You guys keep on throwing it out there, don't you? What's your point, ultimately? Like any map, you don't know exactly how it will play out. When the meta-game changes, so do play styles on any particular map. I'm willing to bet that you did not know that Ohana was boring and stale in its beginning stages. It just happened to turn out that way. It seems like you are implying that Ohana set the baseline tone for what maps are accepted and what aren't until further notice. Sorry to disappoint you guys, but seriously, it's about time you get over the ohana thing.
SC2 Mapmaker || twitter: @ironmansc || Ohana & Mech Depot || 3x TLMC finalist || www.twitch.tv/sc2mapstream
TheFish7
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
United States2824 Posts
August 25 2013 02:43 GMT
#40
It is a real shame to think of all the wasted potential. To think that maps like derelict watcher and newkirk precinct are being used in tournaments while maps like strangewood mire get tossed aside. I mean here are guys that took melee mapping, which is basically glorified chessboard redesign, and turned it into an art form.

[image loading]
~ ~ <°)))><~ ~ ~
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