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Warp prism speed buff, test map. 5.28.2013 - Page 15

Forum Index > SC2 General
1346 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 13 14 15 16 17 68 Next
Al Bundy
Profile Joined April 2010
7257 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-28 19:45:08
May 28 2013 19:41 GMT
#281
Hmm that's interesting... they could have went other ways but we shall see. From what I've seen, the effectiveness of the Warp Prism seems to depend not only on its own capabilities, but also on the map layout.
o choro é livre
KrazyTrumpet
Profile Joined April 2010
United States2520 Posts
May 28 2013 19:41 GMT
#282
On May 29 2013 04:34 drugsarebad wrote:
buff oracle..... useless cheese unit, low hp, too slow, too expensive


They were gonna buff oracle speed, but everyone FREAKED THE FUCK OUT over that, too.
www.twitch.tv/krazy Best Stream Quality NA @KClarkSC2
Sulice
Profile Joined August 2012
France16 Posts
May 28 2013 19:42 GMT
#283
I think this patch could work fine if the duration between phasing and transportation mode is increased a bit.
So it would be more difficult to warp everywhere.
WhalesFromSpace
Profile Joined March 2012
390 Posts
May 28 2013 19:42 GMT
#284
This unit is already too ridiculous given the capacity to reactively allocate entire production cycles without more than mineral and 2 supply commitment. Now it is even more ridiculous because the health buff remains in place...
Nihility
Prog455
Profile Joined April 2012
Denmark970 Posts
May 28 2013 19:44 GMT
#285
On May 29 2013 04:33 dirtydurb82 wrote:
Show nested quote +

A-BomB Ireland. May 29 2013 02:34. Posts 68 PM Profile Quote #
I APPROVELast edit: 2013-05-29 02:35:14
A-BOMB on http://www.justin.tv/abombtv (high level protoss stream)


If the goal is high-level, dynamic play, this is a good buff. I thought Toss were doing pretty well, but I guess the numbers don't lie.


Do you really think that this is actually going to change any part of Protoss play that is not an all-in? At the moment this buff cost 100/100 and can be upgraded from a building you need no matter what if you want Colossus. This is a stupid buff, because Robotic Facility is already occupied with building Observers, Immortals and Colossi. If this upgrade did actually make a difference in lategame it would have been used already.
Incognoto
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
France10239 Posts
May 28 2013 19:44 GMT
#286
On May 29 2013 04:35 Phoenix2003 wrote:
So T gets speedvacs and Z gets speed mutas, so I don't see what the big issue is. As for the whole removal of upgrades thing. Well, Siege up removal and Z no longer needs evo chamber for spores. Seems fair to me. P needs all the help they get from their current turtle to 200/200(or gimmicky all-ins/ timing attacks) playstyle. Naturally, the asshat T/Z players are opposed to any kind of upward mobility for protoss. No surprise there.*rollseyes*


Well Phoenix are already pretty damn mobile. So are Oracles. The recall mechanic of the mothership core allows Protoss to move out and do whatever until it's time to leave. Honestly, in PvZ, moving out with a mothership core to force units and then recall once those units are made should be standard. Being able to move your army for free out of a sticky situation is a form of mobility. Dark templar being dropped and warped all over the map is another form of highly mobile harass.

Warp Prism being even more mobile from the start basically does boost their early game presence (useful for all-ins and such) and doesn't really change anything mid to late game, where the 100/100 upgrade wasn't all that expensive to begin with. That's when Warp Prism harass should definitely start to be used vs immobile zerg armies.

I think that's the analyze some people are making here. Basically, Protoss can be pretty mobile with some tech paths, but if they choose to turtle up to 200/200 and then move out, then they have sacrifice mobility for a very powerful army. With this change, Protoss players don't really get a mobility boost except in the very early game, where that mobility is really just useful for all-ins.
maru lover forever
Bahamuth
Profile Joined September 2011
134 Posts
May 28 2013 19:44 GMT
#287
On May 29 2013 04:42 WhalesFromSpace wrote:
This unit is already too ridiculous given the capacity to reactively allocate entire production cycles without more than mineral and 2 supply commitment. Now it is even more ridiculous because the health buff remains in place...


Yea Warp Prism op.
Emzeeshady
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Canada4203 Posts
May 28 2013 19:44 GMT
#288
--- Nuked ---
Pazuzu
Profile Joined July 2011
United States632 Posts
May 28 2013 19:45 GMT
#289
On May 29 2013 04:11 KredeOWN wrote:
so only immortal drops in pvp. stupid idea


Unfortunate first post my friend haha
"It is because intuition is sometimes right, that we don't know what to do with it"
TeeTS
Profile Joined June 2011
Germany2762 Posts
May 28 2013 19:46 GMT
#290
On May 29 2013 02:38 ACrow wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 02:35 Plansix wrote:
On May 29 2013 02:33 ReMiiX wrote:
I want medivacs to have speed boost all the time.

Seriously though, with the old buff on warp prism health this would be way way way to difficult to beat. Maybe if they dropped shield or health I could see the speed increase being fair.


If protoss can figure out how to stop the speed vacs, I am sure terran can figure out how to stop a speed prism. Its not like it is going to warp in two hellbats.

Imagine if the prism could heal the hellbats. That would be bat-shit crazyyyyy.


imagine every unit terran builds would be able to pop out of a medivac right away. that would be crazy shit too.

warp prisms are definately the wrong unit to buff, they are very very strong as they are. before bringing in silly buffs like that, I would prefer a medivac nerf D:
Emzeeshady
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Canada4203 Posts
May 28 2013 19:47 GMT
#291
--- Nuked ---
anessie
Profile Joined August 2011
180 Posts
May 28 2013 19:49 GMT
#292
Need an anti-air immortal with range 9 upgrade ty.
igay
Profile Blog Joined November 2011
Australia1178 Posts
May 28 2013 19:49 GMT
#293
sounds good to me, the man train would be physco lol
MVP <3 MKP <3 DRG <3
Pandahunterz
Profile Joined March 2013
Netherlands213 Posts
May 28 2013 19:49 GMT
#294
NO simply no, this is even worse than the oracle speed. warpprisims are already hard enough to catch without speed. With speed it will be simply impossible to kill them everytime they drop/warp, meaning you will have to stay in base all-game long, disallowing any kind of pressure on the toss or risk losing your mean/natural and maybe even more. As an upgrade it's reasonable, as it requires a commitment of the protoss, and it gives the opponent some more time to tech up and get ways to actually counter the drops (for as far possible). removing the upgrade requirement will simply make early drop rushes (like dt drops) way too strong if not impossible to defeat if not perfectly prepared (meaning 50 turrets covering all of your base).
About toss being too weak, in my opinion they have the strongest units in the game at the moment (i dont mean just 1 op unit but almost all) but they seem to have a hard time to get to the right composition. when played perfectly though toss is still the strongest race and calling them overall weak and needing a buff is, in my eyes, just retarded.
Prime Directive
Profile Joined December 2011
United States186 Posts
May 28 2013 19:49 GMT
#295
I'd rather give it recall and a slight speed boost. It still feels like you are going to lose the Prism to Mutas once they are on the field.
p14c
Profile Joined May 2010
Vatican City State431 Posts
May 28 2013 19:50 GMT
#296
On May 29 2013 04:41 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:26 sitromit wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:17 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:
sigh... some people are just terrible at understanding statistics.

when one race is underperforming then you wont necessarily see that by looking at winrates. what you also need to look at is the amount of players of every race that get far in tournaments. it is obvious when there are only 2-3 players of a certain race in the ro16 that they will perform decently and push the winrate because they are most likely the best players of their respective race while there are a couple of mediocre players of the other races.

We just had a foreign Protoss get 2nd place in a tournament with several Korean players. At MLG top 4 was 2 Terrans, 1 Zerg and 1 Protoss. At IEM we had 2 Terrans and 2 Protoss in Top 4, Protoss got 2nd. Protoss has a very good chance of winning WCS NA. Protoss is dominating in Proleague.

So just because there weren't too many Protoss in the top 8 of WCS KR and EU, when WCS KR Code S had very few Protoss to begin with because of the carry over from last season of WoL, that means Protoss doesn't go far in tournaments?


...where did i say that?
i just explained that winrates alone dont give any conclusion on how a race is doing. also, the metagame of hots is evolving constantly so pointing out tournaments like iem or mlg is pretty pointless.

David Kim is the one pointing out tournaments as an excuse for buffing Protoss. He said that at high level play Protoss doesn't perfom as it should, for normal play the winrates are totally fine.
Game Over, Man! Game Over!
Kingsky
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Singapore298 Posts
May 28 2013 19:50 GMT
#297
It might just be me but... i actually feel there needs to be big changes in the protoss race to balance it. it has really strong gimmicky all-ins but weak overall play.

To be honest, in the WCS korea and europe, the protoss battles were pretty boring to watch. i REALLY enjoyed TvZ and TvT, not so much ZvZ, ZvP, ZvP , PvP , TvP

Mainly because Terran is so versatile, and mech, biomine, skymech and the zerg reactions make the battles really great
Why do people hate the Colossus? Because the Colossus is like banksters from Wall Street: “too big to fail”. - TheDwF
Pazuzu
Profile Joined July 2011
United States632 Posts
May 28 2013 19:50 GMT
#298
On May 29 2013 04:47 Emzeeshady wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:45 Pazuzu wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:11 KredeOWN wrote:
so only immortal drops in pvp. stupid idea


Unfortunate first post my friend haha

Well at least he was right. Not like I am complaining though. PvP can;t get any worse :p.


To be honest it's still way ahead of where it was this far into WoL; at least there are multiple builds people can choose from instead of the Ol' faithful 4 gate
"It is because intuition is sometimes right, that we don't know what to do with it"
Emzeeshady
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
Canada4203 Posts
May 28 2013 19:51 GMT
#299
--- Nuked ---
p14c
Profile Joined May 2010
Vatican City State431 Posts
May 28 2013 19:52 GMT
#300
David Kim wants to transform every match-up in a TvT. Let's see who drops first kind of game. It will turn SC2 into such a gimmicky game.
Game Over, Man! Game Over!
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