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Warp prism speed buff, test map. 5.28.2013 - Page 16

Forum Index > SC2 General
1346 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 14 15 16 17 18 68 Next
Knee_of_Justice
Profile Joined October 2009
United States388 Posts
May 28 2013 19:52 GMT
#301
why not make it so that massive units take up 6 spots in a warp prism instead of 8? Then you could fit in a colossus and a sentry to block the workers from retreating or to bunch them up. That would be a really interesting buff because it wont do anything for noobs but a good player will definitely profit from them. Having massive units take up so many spots just reduces player choices since you cant combine units for maximum benefit.

I really dislike their trend of removing upgrades. They have now made it so that hardly any spells in the game require upgrades too. Sure they arent exciting or anything but they do provide an important possibility for dynamic play (think marine vs dragoon w/ range in broodwar) or at least for scouting and adapting.
Protoss Tactical Guide: http://www.sc2armory.com/forums/topic/7903
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
May 28 2013 19:53 GMT
#302
On May 29 2013 04:50 p14c wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:41 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:26 sitromit wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:17 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:
sigh... some people are just terrible at understanding statistics.

when one race is underperforming then you wont necessarily see that by looking at winrates. what you also need to look at is the amount of players of every race that get far in tournaments. it is obvious when there are only 2-3 players of a certain race in the ro16 that they will perform decently and push the winrate because they are most likely the best players of their respective race while there are a couple of mediocre players of the other races.

We just had a foreign Protoss get 2nd place in a tournament with several Korean players. At MLG top 4 was 2 Terrans, 1 Zerg and 1 Protoss. At IEM we had 2 Terrans and 2 Protoss in Top 4, Protoss got 2nd. Protoss has a very good chance of winning WCS NA. Protoss is dominating in Proleague.

So just because there weren't too many Protoss in the top 8 of WCS KR and EU, when WCS KR Code S had very few Protoss to begin with because of the carry over from last season of WoL, that means Protoss doesn't go far in tournaments?


...where did i say that?
i just explained that winrates alone dont give any conclusion on how a race is doing. also, the metagame of hots is evolving constantly so pointing out tournaments like iem or mlg is pretty pointless.

David Kim is the one pointing out tournaments as an excuse for buffing Protoss. He said that at high level play Protoss doesn't perfom as it should, for normal play the winrates are totally fine.


So you agree that Protoss should be buffed to improve the highest level of play, and that normal level play shouldn't be a huge factor in balance. Glad we could clear that up.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
c0sm0naut
Profile Joined April 2011
United States1229 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-28 19:55:11
May 28 2013 19:54 GMT
#303
if they want to make P a more competitive race, nerf spire transitions by making mutas require an upgrade before the pin you in your base or win the game outright with their speed/regen just because you only have 1 sg and lost phoenixes... and decrease the cost of storm by 50/50

instead they want P to play the same way they alawys do = gimmicks. i have played random for a long time now, and Protoss is not difficult to play. i often win by just randomly attacking at +1 with whatever i have vs Z. when they make enough units to kill mine, i just recall. i make sneak bases constantly, in every matchup. recall works on probes == saves my economy. dt warp in == defends far nexus. Protoss is extremely strong and players are simply not taking full advantage of it on ladder. i just think this warp prism thing will lead to all ins 95% of the time, especially against terran. why don't they give us a list of options, we vote for the one we like the most, then we test it. i hate testing the random crap they come up with because i know it's not a good solution before i even try it and confirm my beliefs..
Mindcrime
Profile Joined July 2004
United States6899 Posts
May 28 2013 19:54 GMT
#304
On May 29 2013 04:34 Incognoto wrote:
I don't really think that Overlords are the problem.. well maybe they are but I feel that no zerg unit can really be dropped effectively.


This is accurate. Zerg drop play is close to nonexistent because there isn't anything good to drop. Zerg drop play is more prevalent in BW and it's not because BW's overlords are better at it. It's because of things like lurkers and defilers and zerglings doing a shit ton more damage.
That wasn't any act of God. That was an act of pure human fuckery.
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
May 28 2013 19:54 GMT
#305
On May 29 2013 04:49 Prime Directive wrote:
I'd rather give it recall and a slight speed boost.

Maybe also Divine shield so you're 100% sure you never lose it?
Eatme
Profile Blog Joined June 2003
Switzerland3919 Posts
May 28 2013 19:55 GMT
#306
I dont know a different solution but I dont like this one at all. I already dislike the massdrop play from terran when I watch streams/vods and having another race doing that would be boring. Also warp prism play is already viable and common.
I have the best fucking lawyers in the country including the man they call the Malmis.
Savko
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada45 Posts
May 28 2013 19:55 GMT
#307
Everyone who is saying "If you buff the warp prism buff ovei speed/medivac boost" It's differences between races that make the game interesting. Nobody wants to see everything as a mirror match with only cosmetic differences between armies. I for one welcome this change. It will be nice to be able to put on some pressure earlier in the game. I'm sick and tired of having to sit im my base until I'm close to maxed.
"Hello! Bye bye sucker. I have Recall. ADIOS" - PartinG
Nightsz
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Canada398 Posts
May 28 2013 19:55 GMT
#308
Seriously? As if PvProleague wasn't considered the top level of play already.
c0sm0naut
Profile Joined April 2011
United States1229 Posts
May 28 2013 19:56 GMT
#309
On May 29 2013 04:54 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:49 Prime Directive wrote:
I'd rather give it recall and a slight speed boost.

Maybe also Divine shield so you're 100% sure you never lose it?


why not, it's consistent at least
Incognoto
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
France10239 Posts
May 28 2013 19:57 GMT
#310
On May 29 2013 04:54 Mindcrime wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:34 Incognoto wrote:
I don't really think that Overlords are the problem.. well maybe they are but I feel that no zerg unit can really be dropped effectively.


This is accurate. Zerg drop play is close to nonexistent because there isn't anything good to drop. Zerg drop play is more prevalent in BW and it's not because BW's overlords are better at it. It's because of things like lurkers and defilers and zerglings doing a shit ton more damage.


Thank you for actually reading my post. :B I felt stupid having written two long posts in this thread without an answer to either of them.
maru lover forever
Nuclease
Profile Joined August 2011
United States1049 Posts
May 28 2013 19:57 GMT
#311
Totally down for it.
Zealots, not zee-lots. | Never forget, KTViolet, Go)Space. | You will never be as good as By.Flash, and your drops will never be as sick as MMA.
Mrvoodoochild1
Profile Joined June 2011
United States1439 Posts
May 28 2013 19:58 GMT
#312
everything should just get a speed boost. Marines should have their stim movement speed by default, ling speed should be default and charge lot speed should be default.
"let your freak flag fly"
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
May 28 2013 20:00 GMT
#313
Its official. Both Grubby and Hero approve of the potential buff via twitter. Hero states "Give it to me!". More drop micro to come if it goes through. How can we be upset with more drop micro from Grubby and Hero?
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
iamcaustic
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
Canada1509 Posts
May 28 2013 20:00 GMT
#314
Conceptually, I really like the idea going into this change: giving Protoss multi-tasking options and harassment opportunities. However, as a Terran I dread dealing with warp-prism related all-ins and cheese.
Twitter: @iamcaustic
Pazuzu
Profile Joined July 2011
United States632 Posts
May 28 2013 20:00 GMT
#315
On May 29 2013 04:54 c0sm0naut wrote:
if they want to make P a more competitive race, nerf spire transitions by making mutas require an upgrade before the pin you in your base or win the game outright with their speed/regen just because you only have 1 sg and lost phoenixes... and decrease the cost of storm by 50/50

instead they want P to play the same way they alawys do = gimmicks. i have played random for a long time now, and Protoss is not difficult to play. i often win by just randomly attacking at +1 with whatever i have vs Z. when they make enough units to kill mine, i just recall. i make sneak bases constantly, in every matchup. recall works on probes == saves my economy. dt warp in == defends far nexus. Protoss is extremely strong and players are simply not taking full advantage of it on ladder. i just think this warp prism thing will lead to all ins 95% of the time, especially against terran. why don't they give us a list of options, we vote for the one we like the most, then we test it. i hate testing the random crap they come up with because i know it's not a good solution before i even try it and confirm my beliefs..


Sorry but this is laughable. An upgrade needed for mutas? that's not a buff to protoss that will just mess up zerg across the board...not really relavent here
"It is because intuition is sometimes right, that we don't know what to do with it"
vhapter
Profile Joined May 2010
Brazil677 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-05-28 20:04:06
May 28 2013 20:03 GMT
#316
Good, now please make muta speed/regen an actual upgrade. Or something else that wouldn't make unscouted mutas an easy win even for noobs.
To live is to fight, to fight is to live!
Toadvine
Profile Joined November 2010
Poland2234 Posts
May 28 2013 20:04 GMT
#317
On May 29 2013 04:58 Mrvoodoochild1 wrote:
everything should just get a speed boost. Marines should have their stim movement speed by default, ling speed should be default and charge lot speed should be default.


It'd be funny if this wasn't the exact direction the game's going.
"There are always some Eskimos ready to instruct the Congolese on how to cope with heat waves." - S.J.Lec
Sankanyo
Profile Joined August 2011
United States140 Posts
May 28 2013 20:04 GMT
#318
I agree with OP. This buff will make protoss all-in a lot stronger. Early pressure and harass is going to suck as well >.>
p14c
Profile Joined May 2010
Vatican City State431 Posts
May 28 2013 20:04 GMT
#319
On May 29 2013 04:53 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:50 p14c wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:41 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:26 sitromit wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:17 SC2ShoWTimE wrote:
sigh... some people are just terrible at understanding statistics.

when one race is underperforming then you wont necessarily see that by looking at winrates. what you also need to look at is the amount of players of every race that get far in tournaments. it is obvious when there are only 2-3 players of a certain race in the ro16 that they will perform decently and push the winrate because they are most likely the best players of their respective race while there are a couple of mediocre players of the other races.

We just had a foreign Protoss get 2nd place in a tournament with several Korean players. At MLG top 4 was 2 Terrans, 1 Zerg and 1 Protoss. At IEM we had 2 Terrans and 2 Protoss in Top 4, Protoss got 2nd. Protoss has a very good chance of winning WCS NA. Protoss is dominating in Proleague.

So just because there weren't too many Protoss in the top 8 of WCS KR and EU, when WCS KR Code S had very few Protoss to begin with because of the carry over from last season of WoL, that means Protoss doesn't go far in tournaments?


...where did i say that?
i just explained that winrates alone dont give any conclusion on how a race is doing. also, the metagame of hots is evolving constantly so pointing out tournaments like iem or mlg is pretty pointless.

David Kim is the one pointing out tournaments as an excuse for buffing Protoss. He said that at high level play Protoss doesn't perfom as it should, for normal play the winrates are totally fine.


So you agree that Protoss should be buffed to improve the highest level of play, and that normal level play shouldn't be a huge factor in balance. Glad we could clear that up.

R U kidding me? Imagine a medivac with warping ability. It's totally game breaking. He should put the Shuttle back in the game. Warping an entire army it's not harassing...
Game Over, Man! Game Over!
Thieving Magpie
Profile Blog Joined December 2012
United States6752 Posts
May 28 2013 20:05 GMT
#320
On May 29 2013 04:34 Scones wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 29 2013 04:30 Mortal wrote:
On May 29 2013 04:26 Hydro033 wrote:
Give (Z)Zerg a decent (T)Way to harass, jesus. Give us viable nydus worms plz that cant be killed by 7 workers

you're complaining about zerg harass? what?

+ Show Spoiler +
seriously, what?


You think zerg has alot of harrass options?

I have:
ling run bys.
mutas

That's all i can come up with


Terrans:

Medivac drops
Hellion run bys
....

That's about it.

Protoss:
Warp Prism play
Oracle/Phoenix
zealot run by

What does this buff "give" protoss? Nothing. Its still the same harass--just that Warp Prism will be more mobile (but less explosive)
Hark, what baseball through yonder window breaks?
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