Call to Action: May 2 Balance Testing - Page 30

On May 05 2013 20:56 Thrillz wrote:


The Queen patch was completely unnecessary for balance because TvZ at that point was extremely even and exciting to watch. I don't even remember that people were complaining about it, it was completely out of the nowhere. Originally it was +25 energy, then without communication and thorough testing they gave +2 range. While Terran certainly dominated for a longer period due to balance, the Zerg domination probably hurt SC2 more.

On May 04 2013 02:49 rQvicious wrote:
blizz you better; think about this carefully all i ever see are terran nerfs and protoss\zerg buffs...

already the fucking protoss planetary fortress is op; and now you wanna gaurentee at least one oracle in us "terran" players mineral lines every game..

On May 06 2013 00:50 reneg wrote:


It wasn't exciting to watch. It was painful. Terran player would make a bunch of helions, then move on in. As someone else just pointed out, there was no tension from a T perspective. Now they at least have to think about it for a second before blindly throwing 6 or 8 helions into your base with hardly any attention paid to them.

If the Z played it perfectly, they'd be able to escape it, but so many helions can roast so many drones so quickly that it was extremely easy for it to become an uphill battle.

On May 06 2013 01:02 Zarahtra wrote:

If hellions reached your mineral line you were doing something wrong already, so you should take dmg. That is why people had started walling off and before the patch especially. There wasn't really any issue with the hellions the reason for the change was that blizzard didn't want the _creep spread_ to be controlled so well by the terran which was also preventing the zerg from getting out from hellion contains. That lead into a free base for the zerg and droning up to full saturation if the T tried to go macro. The runbys were never really what bothered Blizzard, or atleast wasn't the motive for the patch, the zerg just needs to L2P if that was an issue for them.
I don't really understand why people are critizing "droning up to 70", because that was exactly what happened after the patch, assuming the T tried to go 3rd OC. If he didn't go 3rd OC ofc the zerg had to stop a little earlier, but by that time the terran was essentially pretty allin, he had to do considerable dmg.
I'd also note that the mass queen opening was already viable before the patch. It wasn't killing the hellions really, but with the amount of queens they could push abit off creep to get the creep tumors down behind them. The patch was essentially Blizzard trying to force the metagame to shift, which had terrible effects on the best MU in WoL.

On May 06 2013 02:02 FCReverie wrote:


I really don't think ZvT was ever the best matchup in WoL :/ It was basically the Terran doing the same thing every game and the Zerg being on the back foot until about 15+ minutes if the game lasted that long. You know that all these things you say about Z are true for T as well. Terran can just scv up to 70 unless the Zerg doesn't take a 3rd in which case the zerg is pretty all in anyway. You know how hard it is to do damage before lategame without going all in as Zerg? You only have melee units essentially (hydras are pretty ineffective againt terran and roach have such short range) and you are against Tanks Mines and Hellbats right now, all of which destroy units that cluster together, which happen to be small melee units. So basically we have to sit back and let you macro or wait for you to come out and attack us.

On May 06 2013 02:02 FCReverie wrote:


I really don't think ZvT was ever the best matchup in WoL :/ It was basically the Terran doing the same thing every game and the Zerg being on the back foot until about 15+ minutes if the game lasted that long. You know that all these things you say about Z are true for T as well. Terran can just scv up to 70 unless the Zerg doesn't take a 3rd in which case the zerg is pretty all in anyway. You know how hard it is to do damage before lategame without going all in as Zerg? You only have melee units essentially (hydras are pretty ineffective againt terran and roach have such short range) and you are against Tanks Mines and Hellbats right now, all of which destroy units that cluster together, which happen to be small melee units. So basically we have to sit back and let you macro or wait for you to come out and attack us.

On May 05 2013 21:02 Scoobers wrote:

Thats because Terran is all about exploiting weaknesses in the early game and the more time you play against T the more you learn how to defend those and their timings. The more time passes on the better you responses are and the more you know. Lets take a reaper opening for example: when hots got realeased every zerg would lose 2-3 drones to a single reaper and IdrA almost smashed his monitor or punched DemusliM in his face since they used to sit right next to each other. How often do you see a zerg players lose a drone to the reaper nowadays? that almost doesnt happen at all.
You guys remember how parting made him self look pathetic when he typed about the imba medevacs losing to Flash @ MLG? Havent we just seen him 2-0 flash in group B of code S? This game should be given time.

The only part of the game I personally think should be given a look at is the late game where tempest seem to be killing everything with zergs not really having an option against a composition with them. Neither terrans do have one against that too since BC just get spanked by high templars and tempest. But as I said, it all should be given time. I would still wait with buffing/nerfing for 2-3 months.

As for burrow i could agree on it being 50/50 but @ lair tech, its far too good of an ubgrade and has too much all in potential @ hatch tech and all ins is not what community nor the viewers are interested in right?

The oracle is very good in its current form, giving it a speed boost would just make PvT imba since then nothing would catch those and they already fry everything that is terran in the early game ultra fast. As an argument for buffing those Kim stated more or less that it only takes a turret. Well since you gave protoss so much cheaper of a dark shrine and oracles meaning they can go of 4 probes in 2 gases into both of those openings and get early expo every terran just has to get a turret. I always get a turret, so does Byun on his stream and so does Demuslim since against early protoss harrasment options its better to be safe than sorry.
To be honest I dont particualry understand the logic behind buffing oracle since a turret or a spore in enought to deny them. When i go for a banshee and zerg makes a spore I just deal with it that he expected it and prepared accordingly isnt it how this should work?

P.S. HotS is amazing in how it currently plays out, both MLG and Dreamhack had 130k views on stream when big matches were being played, after everything got nerfed to shizzle in WoL there was barely 30k viewers in the finals of any big tournament (provided it wasnt a ZvZ, then - 30-40% viewers)

On May 06 2013 00:51 Piledriver wrote:



Nothing wrong with that. We have to deal with your widow mine drop shit every game.

On May 04 2013 02:49 rQvicious wrote:
blizz you better; think about this carefully all i ever see are terran nerfs and protoss\zerg buffs...

already the fucking protoss planetary fortress is op; and now you wanna gaurentee at least one oracle in us "terran" players mineral lines every game..

On May 06 2013 04:54 Assirra wrote:

Welcome to the other side.
Zerg and Protoss need to deal with nonsense like ubervacs, hellbats and widow drops every time as well.

On May 06 2013 03:57 NeThZOR wrote:

Just as he said, widow mine drops are a common sight in TvP. I'd rather that Blizzard ignore the oracle for now and concentrate more on how they can nerf Terran a bit.