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On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans.
He was one round away from qualifying? Cannot be that bad, what is your post even about, lol.
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On April 22 2013 18:35 Penev wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:25 LeLfe wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. That's not Blizzard's fault on that one. Agreed. MLG did this on their own. Although I wonder if Comm was considered for a direct invite spot as the WCS China champion. How big was Blizzards' involvement in picking the non American invites?
That's what confuses me. I'd assumed that there would be some form of seeding/invite system for players who won their national championships for WCS last year, even if this year has gone with a completely different system. Makes more sense than the qualifier system they have in place now.
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MLG is so god damn incompetent its amazing.
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On April 22 2013 18:34 wptlzkwjd wrote:Show nested quote +I really don't get how there can be so many people supporting what Comm did. Unless he contacted all his potential opponents well in advance and notified them of who he was, it's incredibly unfair. He told them before he played them which is pretty much the same amount of time everybody else gets in an online bracket play. This isn't a weekly elimination bracket like in the GSL where you practice in advance. This is the "you get 5 minutes before starting the next game" type of deal.
He wasn't hiding the fact he was Comm. The amateur giving up his spot for a pro was a sick baller move and Comm making sure his opponents knew he was Comm was a very fair thing to do too. When that one guy at an MLG purposely lost to White-Ra and that allowed White-Ra to advance despite a stupid rule, he was praised as a hero. I hope this Fruitbasket guy gets treated like a hero in China.
MLG DQing Comm when he was 1 match from qualifying is a shitty move.
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On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans.
Are Chinese players playing under Kespa teams logical? No. They have similar barriers as rest of the world.
Lx and PJ were among the best foreigners ever, they were drafted by SKT T1.
During a Chinese interview after departing from SK Telecom T1, Lx said the inability to participate in intricate strategic discussions and mentoring due to language barriers was his greatest problem during his progaming life in Korea. Lx said his skilled improved drastically when he began training in the pro house and used to beat Fantasy and BeSt at a regular basis. However after a while he felt a stagnation of his progress and skill while Fantasy continued to improve due to mentoring. Lx mentioned that his skill would've progressed a lot further and would most likely stay in Korea if he had learned the Korean language.
There was and probably still is a great potential in China.
Do you expect them to go to Korea, learn Korean, qualify from Korean Code A? When even Korean progamers signed for NA?
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On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans.
Whats logical about having Koreans in a NA tournament? MLG completley fucked this qualifier up no two ways about it.
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On April 22 2013 18:35 Type|NarutO wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans. He was one round away from qualifying? Cannot be that bad, what is your post even about, lol.
basically he beat a couple of unknowns and ran into a korean who i've not heard any results from in ages, and promptly got 2-0'ed so lets stop making it sound like some kind of feat.
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Israel2209 Posts
On April 22 2013 18:35 Penev wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:25 LeLfe wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. That's not Blizzard's fault on that one. Agreed. MLG did this on their own. Although I wonder if Comm was considered for a direct invite spot as the WCS China champion. How big was Blizzards' involvement in picking the non American invites?
It is Blizzard's fault for ignoring China in this year's WCS.
It is Blizzard's fault for MLG being the one organizing this, when MLG have little to no experience with running proper online SC2 tournaments.
It is Blizzard's fault for the ridiculous time table.
It is MLG's fault for doing such a poor job at organizing this, even when the conditions they were given were not the best.
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On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans.
Chinese not= Korean.
By your logic, Moonglade should be playing in WCS Korea because he lives closer to Korea.
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On April 22 2013 18:38 Pri1230 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans. Whats logical about having Koreans in a NA tournament? MLG completley fucked this qualifier up no two ways about it.
true, i don't deny that. on the other hand a good deal of koreans seemed to have no problems signing up for the qualifiers.
the first mistake was trying to separate the global scene into 3 "equal" regions, when everybody knows they are not equal. korean sc2 is so dominant that even their master league players can wipe the floor with other regional GMs. well, this forces korean/asian players to look for opportunities elsewhere.
the second mistake was not imposing regional quotas. of course we know that no american player will get anywhere, so unless america wants to watch a bunch of koreans duking it out on their soil, it makes sense to ensure some of their players get to participate in the league.
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Sad and disappointing. GG MLG.
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It's pretty ridiculous the national WCS 2012 champions weren't all seeded into WCS 2013 in the first place. It's even more ridiculous that MLG was letting Diamond players into their bracket over WCS 2012 national champions.
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On April 22 2013 18:40 Zzoram wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans. Chinese not= Korean. By your logic, Moonglade should be playing in WCS Korea because he lives closer to Korea.
so we have 3 options:
1. have a wcs china
2. let chinese players participate in korea, their neighbouring country
3. let them play online in WCS america, and if they get through, fly them to america
which of these sounds the most workable?
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On April 22 2013 18:48 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:40 Zzoram wrote:On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans. Chinese not= Korean. By your logic, Moonglade should be playing in WCS Korea because he lives closer to Korea. so we have 3 options: 1. have a wcs china 2. let chinese players participate in korea, their neighbouring country 3. let them play online in WCS america, and if they get through, fly them to america which of these sounds the most workable?
1, with a small adjustment: Have a WCS for the SEA region. It has it's own server, why can't it have it's own league?
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On April 22 2013 18:48 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2013 18:40 Zzoram wrote:On April 22 2013 18:32 shadymmj wrote:On April 22 2013 18:22 Zzoram wrote:
It's not like Comm has a playstyle people all know so that him smurfing would've made it harder to play against him. Nobody knows how the Chinese play anyways.
They should've let him take the amateur's spot, he is the WCS China champion. Blizzard is doing a damn good job of making sure China cares as little as possible about Starcraft 2. but look, in the grand scheme of things it is probably an insignificant oversight, unless of course you are a rabid chinese fan. the wcs china champion got crushed 2-0 by thestc, there's nothing to argue about here really. how far do you think he would have gone? of course it's not good for sc2 growth in china but let's talk common sense here, is having chinese players playing in a NA tournament logical? someone needs to look at a world map, i wonder which country is right next to china? and realistically speaking if they were THAT good they'd probably be in a kespa team by now, which would be both convenient for the players and good for the fans. Chinese not= Korean. By your logic, Moonglade should be playing in WCS Korea because he lives closer to Korea. so we have 3 options: 1. have a wcs china 2. let chinese players participate in korea, their neighbouring country 3. let them play online in WCS america, and if they get through, fly them to america which of these sounds the most workable?
3 is wrong. Neither MLG nor Blizzard flies them to the U.S., they have to pay the ticket out of their own pocket (at least up to a city in the U.S.).
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Speaking for myself here, in no way representing the teams and organisations I'm involved in.
If 4 months ago they asked me; "Hey Martijn, lets see how many clusterfucks it takes to reach critical mass and severely damage sc2 as an esport." WCS is becoming what I would've come up with. The true irony here is that I would've taken more time to prepare than the organisations involved did.
Snide cynicism aside (sorry, bitter because of this missed opportunity at something great).
It looks like the MLG admins got stuck in a situation where they had to enforce rules even though they fully well realized the rules conflicted with common sense. Everyone realizes that we should have players like Comm in the tournament, I'm sure they do too. The problem is the format and tournament as a whole being prepared and organised poorly. At the point where they found this out, they were committed.
Do we know who should be held accountable for this mess? I mean, it's easy to blame ESL for WCS EU, gom/kespa for WCS KR and MLG for WCS US, but I'm sure that's not how Occam's razor works. We've had to deal with a complete lack of organisation across the board. At some point we have to conclude that they were never given enough notice.
So who at Blizzard is behind all this? Is there anyone that can actually be held accountable? When was this all thought up?
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I read this after I agreed on MLG fucking up the qulifiers. Now this is the icing on the cake, lol.
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Lol mlg. This tournament is a joke
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I'm assuming blizzard should be pretty pissed about this, yes the whole thing is rushed and mistakes were bound to happen but this is farcical, MLG making ESL look baller. The NA qualifiers have been so poorly executed, MLG has to take responsibility for it, it's hard to fuck it up so badly but they managed it. Blizzard may be Comm's Obi Wan Kenobi, hope they do the right thing, for the good of the game.
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MLG could have done this better, that's for sure 
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EPT
