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On April 08 2013 00:09 HuKPOWA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 08:26 FXOdesRow wrote:
Make players have to relocate and go live in NA/EU to compete and that solves the problem . Why should they have the opportunity to compete risk free ?
EDIT: Grammar wtf LOL lets just say i'd rather watch to good koreans duke it out than you vs some random NA player so that you can feel good about yourself. Koreans bring competition...if you don't think you will ever beat koreans stop trying to play SC2 competitively. Put in as many hours as they do, then maybe when you're at their level you can complain that koreans make this game terrible coming to NA. I say bring all the koreans over to show the foreigners how to play and actually work hard to achieve a tourney win instead of working off high salary workout sessions. So please stop complaining CatZ...i mean Desrow
If you want to watch koreans watch "WCS Korea", by splitting them up between all 3 regions you actually make GSL weaker because less people compete there. Explain to me why I should be watching people who neither live nor are American (mostly Koreans) in WCS America, the American league.
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On April 08 2013 01:34 FirstGear wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 00:09 HuKPOWA wrote:On April 07 2013 08:26 FXOdesRow wrote:
Make players have to relocate and go live in NA/EU to compete and that solves the problem . Why should they have the opportunity to compete risk free ?
EDIT: Grammar wtf LOL lets just say i'd rather watch to good koreans duke it out than you vs some random NA player so that you can feel good about yourself. Koreans bring competition...if you don't think you will ever beat koreans stop trying to play SC2 competitively. Put in as many hours as they do, then maybe when you're at their level you can complain that koreans make this game terrible coming to NA. I say bring all the koreans over to show the foreigners how to play and actually work hard to achieve a tourney win instead of working off high salary workout sessions. So please stop complaining CatZ...i mean Desrow If you want to watch koreans watch "WCS Korea", by splitting them up between all 3 regions you actually make GSL weaker because less people compete there. Explain to me why I should be watching people who neither live nor are American (mostly Koreans) in WCS America, the American league.
I completely agree. People should have to live in the region in order to participate in the league.
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On April 08 2013 01:34 FirstGear wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 00:09 HuKPOWA wrote:On April 07 2013 08:26 FXOdesRow wrote:
Make players have to relocate and go live in NA/EU to compete and that solves the problem . Why should they have the opportunity to compete risk free ?
EDIT: Grammar wtf LOL lets just say i'd rather watch to good koreans duke it out than you vs some random NA player so that you can feel good about yourself. Koreans bring competition...if you don't think you will ever beat koreans stop trying to play SC2 competitively. Put in as many hours as they do, then maybe when you're at their level you can complain that koreans make this game terrible coming to NA. I say bring all the koreans over to show the foreigners how to play and actually work hard to achieve a tourney win instead of working off high salary workout sessions. So please stop complaining CatZ...i mean Desrow If you want to watch koreans watch "WCS Korea", by splitting them up between all 3 regions you actually make GSL weaker because less people compete there. Explain to me why I should be watching people who neither live nor are American (mostly Koreans) in WCS America, the American league.
This is my biggest fear in all of this: that GSL gets weakened by losing up&coming players or old veterans who are in Code B right now to other regions, therebey damaging its reputation 
A drawn out offline event or the requirement of residency on the continent should alleviate this problem.
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On April 08 2013 00:09 HuKPOWA wrote:Show nested quote +On April 07 2013 08:26 FXOdesRow wrote:
Make players have to relocate and go live in NA/EU to compete and that solves the problem . Why should they have the opportunity to compete risk free ?
EDIT: Grammar wtf LOL lets just say i'd rather watch to good koreans duke it out than you vs some random NA player so that you can feel good about yourself. Koreans bring competition...if you don't think you will ever beat koreans stop trying to play SC2 competitively. Put in as many hours as they do, then maybe when you're at their level you can complain that koreans make this game terrible coming to NA. I say bring all the koreans over to show the foreigners how to play and actually work hard to achieve a tourney win instead of working off high salary workout sessions. So please stop complaining CatZ...i mean Desrow
sometimes SC community can be so toxic.
Somehow LoL players manage to enjoy watching Voyboy despite him not being a korean. Somehow in BW, before all the "elephant" hipsters we managed to enjoy watching foreign events, and TSL even barred koreans from participating.
Does NA scene have players whose skill is way beyond that of the viewers and is worth of admiration? Yea. So why cant you enjoy it?
Riot realized that making the events regional will allow the countries where esports in its infancy(or everywhere outside of korea/china/taiwan) to grow. It's good that Blizzard are finally realizing the obvious too.
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On April 08 2013 02:08 1Dhalism wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 00:09 HuKPOWA wrote:On April 07 2013 08:26 FXOdesRow wrote:
Make players have to relocate and go live in NA/EU to compete and that solves the problem . Why should they have the opportunity to compete risk free ?
EDIT: Grammar wtf LOL lets just say i'd rather watch to good koreans duke it out than you vs some random NA player so that you can feel good about yourself. Koreans bring competition...if you don't think you will ever beat koreans stop trying to play SC2 competitively. Put in as many hours as they do, then maybe when you're at their level you can complain that koreans make this game terrible coming to NA. I say bring all the koreans over to show the foreigners how to play and actually work hard to achieve a tourney win instead of working off high salary workout sessions. So please stop complaining CatZ...i mean Desrow sometimes SC community can be so toxic. Somehow LoL players manage to enjoy watching Voyboy despite him not being a korean. Somehow in BW, before all the "elephant" hipsters we managed to enjoy watching foreign events, and TSL even barred koreans from participating. Does NA scene have players whose skill is way beyond that of the viewers and is worth of admiration? Yea. So why cant you enjoy it? Riot realized that making the events regional will allow the countries where esports in its infancy(or everywhere outside of korea/china/taiwan) to grow. It's good that Blizzard are finally realizing the obvious too.
have you seen LoL reddit lately? They have been waiting for OGN The Champions to start, because they couldn't stand to watch the passive and boring foreigner games in LCS. Sounds familiar? The HC community (most of the people on TL, on /r/starcraft are like that) they want to watch the best matches. I am not sure who WCS is aimed at, but LCS is aimed at causals who are satisfied watching Voyboy...
EDIT: Not saying watching Voyboy is bad, I was watching his stream just yesterday. Same for Grubby stream, SaSe, Naniwa... it's just, they don't tend to create games as good as koreans, that's all.
I would actually be OK with complete lock, I don't care too much, really - I will be watching SPL and GSL anyways..
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My main concern still is why the hell did they choose ESL over Dreamhack ?? WCS EU final was awesome, while ESL production is bad (beside IEM Katowice, Poland is great). German crowd always look so sleepy and annoyed :-/
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On April 08 2013 02:24 Ammanas wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 02:08 1Dhalism wrote:On April 08 2013 00:09 HuKPOWA wrote:On April 07 2013 08:26 FXOdesRow wrote:
Make players have to relocate and go live in NA/EU to compete and that solves the problem . Why should they have the opportunity to compete risk free ?
EDIT: Grammar wtf LOL lets just say i'd rather watch to good koreans duke it out than you vs some random NA player so that you can feel good about yourself. Koreans bring competition...if you don't think you will ever beat koreans stop trying to play SC2 competitively. Put in as many hours as they do, then maybe when you're at their level you can complain that koreans make this game terrible coming to NA. I say bring all the koreans over to show the foreigners how to play and actually work hard to achieve a tourney win instead of working off high salary workout sessions. So please stop complaining CatZ...i mean Desrow sometimes SC community can be so toxic. Somehow LoL players manage to enjoy watching Voyboy despite him not being a korean. Somehow in BW, before all the "elephant" hipsters we managed to enjoy watching foreign events, and TSL even barred koreans from participating. Does NA scene have players whose skill is way beyond that of the viewers and is worth of admiration? Yea. So why cant you enjoy it? Riot realized that making the events regional will allow the countries where esports in its infancy(or everywhere outside of korea/china/taiwan) to grow. It's good that Blizzard are finally realizing the obvious too. have you seen LoL reddit lately? They have been waiting for OGN The Champions to start, because they couldn't stand to watch the passive and boring foreigner games in LCS. Sounds familiar? The HC community (most of the people on TL, on /r/starcraft are like that) they want to watch the best matches. I am not sure who WCS is aimed at, but LCS is aimed at causals who are satisfied watching Voyboy...
A few and far between of true hardcores(those who actually understand why the games are good and not just say so to be cool) can watch the korean leg. But those won't claim they want koreans outside of koreans, because that would just dilute the player pool and give us shit one sided games.
Now if you want to dispute fairness, that's a different discussion alltogether that has some merit. however i am willing to ignore taht aspect alltogether in favor of boosting esports growth outside of asia.
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On April 08 2013 02:37 Gevna wrote:
My main concern still is why the hell did they choose ESL over Dreamhack ?? WCS EU final was awesome, while ESL production is bad (beside IEM Katowice, Poland is great). German crowd always look so sleepy and annoyed :-/
ESL have better connections.
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What they should do is rank every tournament there is by region and give points to players that participate in whatever tournament there is. Imagine if a foreign plays code A, wins a few rounds even if he doesn't make it to code S, he gets X points, plus a few GSTL games etc. and rank him in the korean region. In this time he also went to a MLG and NASL and got some NA points and since he was european he alsowent to a ESL and DH.
3 months latter it's time for WCS finals and he is ranked in 3 regions but he can only participate in the one that is he ranked with more points, this system would rank every major tournament and would be valid for everyone including Koreans.
It would be almost like a Tennis system, it could be a good thing. Players could compete in every tournament he and his team chooses and have a shot at every WCS. It would be hard to earn a spot in every region finals. By ranking smaller tournaments you would benefit the local NA and EU players that compete more in those regions and that would make sure it wasn't just Koreans and we could get the Korean vs the World feeling.
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Bleh I'm starting to think more and more not requiring residency makes this a total mess.
If they had just required you to be a resident of the area for the majority of the time while playing in the season this whole thing would have been much neater. I missed the argument before that koreans trying abroad greatly diminishes the allure of GSL/OSL in the first place which is kind of sad. I still guess most koreans will play in korea for sponsor / ping reasons but it would just be a bit sad to see the korean EG-TL players for example play in other leagues because it's such an easier qualification.
Ironically the creation of this one super tournament may actually be a bit unfair and greatly diminish the value of the true champion that was GSL before.
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On April 08 2013 02:56 StarVe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 02:37 Gevna wrote:
My main concern still is why the hell did they choose ESL over Dreamhack ?? WCS EU final was awesome, while ESL production is bad (beside IEM Katowice, Poland is great). German crowd always look so sleepy and annoyed :-/ ESL have better connections.
Or maybe they are better at handling online tournaments.
WCS won't be all about the LANs.
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On April 08 2013 02:56 StarVe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 02:37 Gevna wrote:
My main concern still is why the hell did they choose ESL over Dreamhack ?? WCS EU final was awesome, while ESL production is bad (beside IEM Katowice, Poland is great). German crowd always look so sleepy and annoyed :-/ ESL have better connections.
ESL might also have been more open to it, due to the fact they run a league type format anyway, whereas DH is based on events now and then.
Just because A might be better than B doesn't mean A will necessarily want to do it. DH is a "computer festival" first, tournament/competition second.
ESL is an e-sports league first.
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Mike Morhaime tweeted to Huk and Idra that he will get them answers regarding this issue "ASAP".
Code "A" starts in less than 5 days.
This kind of issue should not be handled by the Blizzard CEO.
He needs an eSports manager guy to handle this for him.
The fact that Morhaime has settle this so close to the start of Code "A" is a failure on the part of Blizzard employees.
It'll be interesting to see how they alter their "esports division" management structure after this debacle is resolved.
If there are going to be 3 WCS NA events does this mean we'll have 3 MLGs before the 2013 BlizzCon?
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On April 08 2013 06:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Mike Morhaime tweeted to Huk and Idra that he will get them answers regarding this issue "ASAP".
Code "A" starts in less than 5 days.
This kind of issue should not be handled by the Blizzard CEO.
He needs an eSports manager guy to handle this for him.
The fact that Morhaime has settle this so close to the start of Code "A" is a failure on the part of Blizzard employees.
It'll be interesting to see how they alter their "esports division" management structure after this debacle is resolved.
If there are going to be 3 WCS NA events does this mean we'll have 3 MLGs before the 2013 BlizzCon?
Of course this isn't "handled" by Morhaime, HuK tweeted him and he's doing damage control via twitter, he's not literally messaging people and compiling info...
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This is so half-hearted and amateurishly done it hurts my brain. Not only having current code S (from WoL) gain an advantage out of the blue, but the lack of information surrounding everything. When you suddenly change the format of some of the biggest tournaments in SC2 I don't understand how there isn't a PDF file or something containing all dates, rules etc released simultaneously. Not to mention it should be done further in advance than 10 days or whatever, when they are fully aware that teams and players operate on more than one continent. It is down right unprofessional and not fair to the players and the teams that basically make SC2 eSports what it is.
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On April 08 2013 06:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
If there are going to be 3 WCS NA events does this mean we'll have 3 MLGs before the 2013 BlizzCon?
I don't believe the WCS NA events are at MLGs, just that MLG handle all the production.
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jesus.. i keep talking about releasing my GPS ranking system to the public.. if i was not so busy with other eSports stuff.. I would have time for it.. hmm.. may just have to pay someone to put together a nice info graphic with full details.
the GPS ranking system uses a relative points system based on your finish at an event. Points should always be awarded for players no matter their finish at an event and a raw total of points should never determine the 'best' players. Points should be based on how many events you attend and your finish at each. Years ago I created this ranking system to address the issues of rewarding points that were really based on how many events you could attend.. not how well you did at each of the events you attended.
stop talking John and just freak'n do it!
/end rant.
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On April 08 2013 06:55 StarVe wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 06:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
Mike Morhaime tweeted to Huk and Idra that he will get them answers regarding this issue "ASAP".
Code "A" starts in less than 5 days.
This kind of issue should not be handled by the Blizzard CEO.
He needs an eSports manager guy to handle this for him.
The fact that Morhaime has settle this so close to the start of Code "A" is a failure on the part of Blizzard employees.
It'll be interesting to see how they alter their "esports division" management structure after this debacle is resolved.
If there are going to be 3 WCS NA events does this mean we'll have 3 MLGs before the 2013 BlizzCon? Of course this isn't "handled" by Morhaime, HuK tweeted him and he's doing damage control via twitter, he's not literally messaging people and compiling info...
just being interviewed by GameSpot and PCGamer
and then flying korea and making ambiguous announcements.
and then stating on twitter he is "working to get you more details"
there are plenty of "spokespersons" for every division of Blizzard constantly doing "damage control". where is the eSports guy?
ya you're right , Mike has nothing to do with this.
On April 08 2013 07:10 alvadr wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 06:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
If there are going to be 3 WCS NA events does this mean we'll have 3 MLGs before the 2013 BlizzCon? I don't believe the WCS NA events are at MLGs, just that MLG handle all the production.
is there a source for this answer ?
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On April 08 2013 03:57 Lonyo wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 02:56 StarVe wrote:On April 08 2013 02:37 Gevna wrote:
My main concern still is why the hell did they choose ESL over Dreamhack ?? WCS EU final was awesome, while ESL production is bad (beside IEM Katowice, Poland is great). German crowd always look so sleepy and annoyed :-/ ESL have better connections. ESL might also have been more open to it, due to the fact they run a league type format anyway, whereas DH is based on events now and then. Just because A might be better than B doesn't mean A will necessarily want to do it. DH is a "computer festival" first, tournament/competition second. ESL is an e-sports league first.
I know close to nothing about LoL, but isn't the LCS handled by ESL ? If that's the case, it could be an opportunity for Blizzard to get their game more exposed to the huge LoL community.
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On April 08 2013 07:19 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On April 08 2013 07:10 alvadr wrote:On April 08 2013 06:37 JimmyJRaynor wrote:
If there are going to be 3 WCS NA events does this mean we'll have 3 MLGs before the 2013 BlizzCon? I don't believe the WCS NA events are at MLGs, just that MLG handle all the production. is there a source for this answer ?
No events are allowed to run while WCS is going on. Having an MLG during the big final event kinda defeats the purpose of that rule.
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EPT
