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On March 26 2013 03:30 MCXD wrote:
With such a unanimously negative response from (mostly korean, albeit) commentators, media figures and players... I guess everyone should enjoy the time we have left.
April 4th, the day the Korean scene died ??
I feel like I'm having a stroke, reading all this dumb hyperbole.
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On March 26 2013 03:37 Bagi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 03:30 MCXD wrote:
With such a unanimously negative response from (mostly korean, albeit) commentators, media figures and players... I guess everyone should enjoy the time we have left.
April 4th, the day the Korean scene died ?? I feel like I'm having a stroke, reading all this dumb hyperbole.
hahaha while i agree with your post, that was hyperbole too bro.
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On March 26 2013 03:36 Schelim wrote:
for people saying they wouldn't want to watch a league without Koreans: don't watch it then. i get why people might not want to watch those, and that's fine. doesn't mean they can't or shouldn't exist.
at the same time, a GSL-like league in EU or NA could help a lot in improving foreigners' skill levels overall. given sufficient prize money to make it worthwhile, teams would probably be willing to invest in proper training facilities, coaching etc and players would also be more motivated considering they'd be given a realistic chance of actually winning a highly prestigious tournament. Additionally, players might decide to go to Korea for a few months, train there, then go back and take all the foreign money, which in turn would increase skill levels and competition yet again.
Imagine (completely random fantasy scenario) NASL announces they will from now on be an offline GSL-style league which takes place at their studios. Teams all over NA set up team houses around the NASL studios (no idea where they are tbh) and start training hardcore, probably also across teams as people tend to be friends with each other in the scene. This alone creates a practice environment that is much closer to Seoul than anything we have outside of Korea right now. EG looks at the situation, realize they have ten times the money of everyone else and wanna make even more and send Demuslim, Idra, Huk and Suppy to Korea to practice there for three months. They come back pimped out on Korean skill, wipe the floor with everybody in the league and other teams start doing the same.
wouldn't that be awesome?
That would most certainly be awesome, but I don't see how teams are going to afford a dramatic expansion like setting up a teamhouse in the face of something as contractionary as regional lockouts. Unless some third party comes in (Blizz), it is not as though NA teams (and more importantly, their sponsors) are going to suddenly feel the desire to spend a bunch of money come such news.
Then again, this is all speculation. We'll have to wait and see.
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On March 26 2013 03:40 farvacola wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 03:36 Schelim wrote:
for people saying they wouldn't want to watch a league without Koreans: don't watch it then. i get why people might not want to watch those, and that's fine. doesn't mean they can't or shouldn't exist.
at the same time, a GSL-like league in EU or NA could help a lot in improving foreigners' skill levels overall. given sufficient prize money to make it worthwhile, teams would probably be willing to invest in proper training facilities, coaching etc and players would also be more motivated considering they'd be given a realistic chance of actually winning a highly prestigious tournament. Additionally, players might decide to go to Korea for a few months, train there, then go back and take all the foreign money, which in turn would increase skill levels and competition yet again.
Imagine (completely random fantasy scenario) NASL announces they will from now on be an offline GSL-style league which takes place at their studios. Teams all over NA set up team houses around the NASL studios (no idea where they are tbh) and start training hardcore, probably also across teams as people tend to be friends with each other in the scene. This alone creates a practice environment that is much closer to Seoul than anything we have outside of Korea right now. EG looks at the situation, realize they have ten times the money of everyone else and wanna make even more and send Demuslim, Idra, Huk and Suppy to Korea to practice there for three months. They come back pimped out on Korean skill, wipe the floor with everybody in the league and other teams start doing the same.
wouldn't that be awesome? That would most certainly be awesome, but I don't see how teams are going to afford a dramatic expansion like setting up a teamhouse in the face of something as contractionary as regional lockouts. Unless some third party comes in (Blizz), it is not as though NA teams (and more importantly, their sponsors) are going to suddenly feel the desire to spend a bunch of money come such news. Then again, this is all speculation. We'll have to wait and see.
esports isn't sports...there is no fan base, player base, infrastructure, $$$ to support leagues all over the world like baseball, basketball, football, etc. hence, all that is focused in korea. having a sc2 league in europe or NA would be perfectly fine, but it'll be looked at like the k-league and korean scene is like premier league. (football comparison)
i guess its better to have something than nothing?
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On March 26 2013 03:41 jinorazi wrote:
esports isn't sports...there is no fan base, player base, infrastructure, $$$ to support leagues all over the world like baseball, basketball, football, etc. hence, all that is focused in korea. having a sc2 league in europe or NA would be perfectly fine, but it'll looked at like the k-league and korean scene is like premier league. (football comparison)
i guess its better to have something than nothing?
Football is few hounders years old. It started by kicking around insides from a COW. There is time to move things around.
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A foregin tournament without koreans isn't worth watching this will kill MLG and DH if this is true.
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A merger of Kespa/GOM where IM, FXO, Startale, Prime etc.. join Pro League and GSL becomes the only solo league would be a very good thing for viewers.
It might suck for teams like Axiom/Acer or the GSTL casters but viewers definitely benefit from this consolidation.
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If the future of SC2 competition is the WCS model, I will for sure lose interest. For me, the most interesting part of WCS was the Korean championship, after that the quality dropped significantly, and I couldn't even force myself to sit through the world finals.
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On March 26 2013 03:45 Aeroplaneoverthesea wrote:
A merger of Kespa/GOM where IM, FXO, Startale, Prime etc.. join Pro League and GSL becomes the only solo league would be a very good thing for viewers.
It might suck for teams like Axiom/Acer or the GSTL casters but viewers definitely benefit from this consolidation.
Yes. I totally agree.
People judge things too quickly. Watching LG-IM play vs SKT1 or KT Rolster is ONLY choice, really.
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On March 26 2013 03:46 sitromit wrote:
If the future of SC2 competition is the WCS model, I will for sure lose interest. For me, the most interesting part of WCS was the Korean championship, after that the quality dropped significantly, and I couldn't even force myself to sit through the world finals.
lol WCS Europe was pretty fucking awesome, so I don't know whatchoo talkin bout.
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On March 26 2013 03:44 MHT wrote:
A foregin tournament without koreans isn't worth watching this will kill MLG and DH if this is true.
Care to give me odds on that? I will take that bet any day of the week. SC2 being killed at DH and MGL because Koreans didn’t show up is super funny. We were watching before the Koreans even knew they existed. Why do you think they started showing up?
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Sounds like SC2 has completely failed in Korea
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On March 26 2013 03:46 sitromit wrote:
If the future of SC2 competition is the WCS model, I will for sure lose interest. For me, the most interesting part of WCS was the Korean championship, after that the quality dropped significantly, and I couldn't even force myself to sit through the world finals.
Surely the answer is just to rip off the football model?
There should be regular domestic league play like Pro League (personally I think the team model works best but individual like NASL can work too).
And at the same time once a month or so we should have big weekend LAN's like MLG where everyone from all scenes goes to play.
At the same time there's no reason the best players from NA/EU/SEA can't go to Korea to play GSL from time to time much like players from all over the world go to play in La Liga, EPL, Bundesliga, Serie A etc...
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I am all for the speculated changes to be honest.
The individual and teamleagues in Korea merging? love it
More regional based play? I'm not against that although it will bring a lot of problems.
The thing is, it is insanely hard for any1 too actually become a professional gamer, even if they are already in high GM. You are basically quitting ur current life for a very unsure future. The general opinion of the community is that that is the risk you have to take. But how can we expect E-sports to grow into something bigger with that attitude.
Look at Riot and their own league, every single player in that league gets a yearly salary of $20,000. No matter what team they are on or how well they perform. That's just the base salary of playing in it. That is something you can aspire and work towards. You can tell your parents and ur friends, look I am actually making this money by playing videogames. Thats an insane difference compared to the +/- 15? professional foreign starcraft players for who I would say becoming a professional gamer was a good choice.
If lesser Koreans in foreign tournaments and a more structured tournament system would mean a bit lesser quality but in the end a much bigger scene I'm all for it.
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On March 26 2013 03:44 MHT wrote:
A foregin tournament without koreans isn't worth watching this will kill MLG and DH if this is true.
DH and MLG did fine before the koreans came and, will survive if they dont return
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Fenrax
United States5018 Posts
On March 26 2013 03:54 hidetoaizen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 03:44 MHT wrote:
A foregin tournament without koreans isn't worth watching this will kill MLG and DH if this is true. DH and MLG did fine before the koreans came and, will survive if they dont return
Times have changed since then. By now everybody knows that from a competitive aspect tournaments without Koreans are very low level.
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On March 26 2013 03:36 Schelim wrote:
for people saying they wouldn't want to watch a league without Koreans: don't watch it then. i get why people might not want to watch those, and that's fine. doesn't mean they can't or shouldn't exist.
at the same time, a GSL-like league in EU or NA could help a lot in improving foreigners' skill levels overall. given sufficient prize money to make it worthwhile, teams would probably be willing to invest in proper training facilities, coaching etc and players would also be more motivated considering they'd be given a realistic chance of actually winning a highly prestigious tournament. Additionally, players might decide to go to Korea for a few months, train there, then go back and take all the foreign money, which in turn would increase skill levels and competition yet again.
Imagine (completely random fantasy scenario) NASL announces they will from now on be an offline GSL-style league which takes place at their studios. Teams all over NA set up team houses around the NASL studios (no idea where they are tbh) and start training hardcore, probably also across teams as people tend to be friends with each other in the scene. This alone creates a practice environment that is much closer to Seoul than anything we have outside of Korea right now. EG looks at the situation, realize they have ten times the money of everyone else and wanna make even more and send Demuslim, Idra, Huk and Suppy to Korea to practice there for three months. They come back pimped out on Korean skill, wipe the floor with everybody in the league and other teams start doing the same.
wouldn't that be awesome?
For some people but not me. I get that people want to see their hometown heroes battle it out without the evil Koreans spoiling their fun. But this is a ridiculous amount of resources to dedicate to something that might not even work and get viewers.
I'll draw comparisons to the professional basketball world. I think it should be GSL is to the NBA as NASL is to the CBA(Chinese Basketball Association). The majority of Chinese basketball fans follow the NBA not the CBA because it is the highest level of play but there are still CBA fans. The CBA is poor compared to the NBA as it should be. No way should the NASL have as many resources as the GSL because it's not the highest level of play.
I want Blizzard supporting the scene where the best players in the world are.
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Excited for this news to come public, I think a lot of people will be really hyped about it.
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On March 26 2013 03:48 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 03:44 MHT wrote:
A foregin tournament without koreans isn't worth watching this will kill MLG and DH if this is true. Care to give me odds on that? I will take that bet any day of the week. SC2 being killed at DH and MGL because Koreans didn’t show up is super funny. We were watching before the Koreans even knew they existed. Why do you think they started showing up?
Different times, back then no one knew the skill difference between the scenes and foreigners had way more fame then the koreans. Now its different, we know they are way better and its them we turn to when we want to see skill. Koreans aren't unknown anymore, they are superstars. NA scene in particular wont be able to sustain there's just no way, I mean you get Vibe vs Scarlett at best, not to mention Terrans won't have anything to watch!
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On March 26 2013 03:57 Fenrax wrote:Show nested quote +On March 26 2013 03:54 hidetoaizen wrote:On March 26 2013 03:44 MHT wrote:
A foregin tournament without koreans isn't worth watching this will kill MLG and DH if this is true. DH and MLG did fine before the koreans came and, will survive if they dont return Times have changed since then. By now everybody knows that from a competitive aspect tournaments without Koreans are very low level.
No, they haven’t, people just claim they have. People know that LoL players in Asia are better than NA, but people turn in by to the turn of 80K every day for the LCS for all three regions. DH and MLG would do fine without Korean players.
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EPT
