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Aligulac.com changelog and feedback thread - Page 25

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 23 24 25 26 27 35 Next All
shid0x
Profile Joined July 2012
Korea (South)5014 Posts
July 15 2015 22:25 GMT
#481
SUDDENLY BYUN.
RIP MKP
GreenMash
Profile Joined August 2012
Norway1746 Posts
July 15 2015 22:55 GMT
#482
#byunageddon
I love hellbats
207aicila
Profile Joined January 2015
1237 Posts
July 16 2015 06:10 GMT
#483
It's not sudden though... look how little he's lost this year...

You know it's funny, I used to lament the death of ESV, EWM and KSL, but it seems that Korean pros simply don't give a shit anymore about online tournaments. You can see that in the turnout for Olimoleague... Can't really fault ByuN for his choices, he sees the easy money. Beat, at most, one B-tier has-been Zerg like BboongBboong for $75? Sounds like a good deal.

@PickyProtoss:

As the quote you've pasted says, we're still looking into it and trying to come up with a good solution. It's been brought up many times and ByuN is only the latest in a surprisingly long list of players who got into the top 10 by farming relatively low level opponents.

But rest assured we are still discussing it, and it's not a lack of ideas that's the problem.

As a tangent, and this is only my personal opinion, not that of the team, WCS points are fucking worthless for measuring skill. We already have our own rating, we'd probably use that for any kind of "tier" system or indeed any other means of preventing this kind of farming.
mfw people who never followed BW speak about sAviOr as if they know anything... -___-''''
TL+ Member
Grovbolle
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Denmark3825 Posts
July 16 2015 07:24 GMT
#484
On July 16 2015 04:59 PickyProtoss wrote:
Hey man, I was just wondering how Byun got number 10 in Aligulac? I thought that there would be a system which would take into consideration the opponents skill level when determining the increase to the ELO. At least the tier in which the players are playing, i.e., low tier = .3; mid tier =.6; top tier = 1. This could work as a function of WCS points administered. It would be helpful as given the recent region blocks, or at least attempts at region blocking, it would not be so skewed towards Koreans.

I've noticed your post

Do you weigh games differently?
No, I don't. Korean tournaments and players receive no special treatment. The GSL is difficult because good players play there; the players aren't good because they play in the GSL. (Huh?)...

When fitting the model (deciding which parameters to use) I also don't weigh games differently, but this is something we're looking into. Since the database contains an overwhelming majority of non-Korean games, the system will tend to adapt to the non-Korean scene. We've noticed, however, that most people using the service are interested in the Koreans. We are still working on a useful solution to this problem.

Couldn't you control for non-Korean versus Korean in your statistical model? Just create binary variable and use in ANOVA or Regression. Not weighting the system is far from ideal, nevertheless, super job! You guys are heros!

You make it sound so simple, yet it isn't.

Keep in mind the system does consider the difference in skill level when distributing points. It is a tradeoff between having the ranking adapt faster to monster performances and not allowing people to farm too many lower tier players.
Lies, damned lies and statistics: http://aligulac.com
hewo
Profile Joined March 2011
Norway119 Posts
July 16 2015 10:35 GMT
#485
We survived the ForGGeddon, we will survive Der Byuntergang aswell

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
Aligulac accomplice | Go Liquid´Snute!! | BBTV
PickyProtoss
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
Ireland74 Posts
July 17 2015 21:46 GMT
#486
On July 16 2015 15:10 207aicila wrote:
It's not sudden though... look how little he's lost this year...

You know it's funny, I used to lament the death of ESV, EWM and KSL, but it seems that Korean pros simply don't give a shit anymore about online tournaments. You can see that in the turnout for Olimoleague... Can't really fault ByuN for his choices, he sees the easy money. Beat, at most, one B-tier has-been Zerg like BboongBboong for $75? Sounds like a good deal.

@PickyProtoss:

As the quote you've pasted says, we're still looking into it and trying to come up with a good solution. It's been brought up many times and ByuN is only the latest in a surprisingly long list of players who got into the top 10 by farming relatively low level opponents.

But rest assured we are still discussing it, and it's not a lack of ideas that's the problem.

As a tangent, and this is only my personal opinion, not that of the team, WCS points are fucking worthless for measuring skill. We already have our own rating, we'd probably use that for any kind of "tier" system or indeed any other means of preventing this kind of farming.


For sure, I appreciate your efforts, in particular the inference system. Super work!
PickyProtoss
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
Ireland74 Posts
July 17 2015 21:51 GMT
#487
On July 16 2015 16:24 Grovbolle wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 16 2015 04:59 PickyProtoss wrote:
Hey man, I was just wondering how Byun got number 10 in Aligulac? I thought that there would be a system which would take into consideration the opponents skill level when determining the increase to the ELO. At least the tier in which the players are playing, i.e., low tier = .3; mid tier =.6; top tier = 1. This could work as a function of WCS points administered. It would be helpful as given the recent region blocks, or at least attempts at region blocking, it would not be so skewed towards Koreans.

I've noticed your post

Do you weigh games differently?
No, I don't. Korean tournaments and players receive no special treatment. The GSL is difficult because good players play there; the players aren't good because they play in the GSL. (Huh?)...

When fitting the model (deciding which parameters to use) I also don't weigh games differently, but this is something we're looking into. Since the database contains an overwhelming majority of non-Korean games, the system will tend to adapt to the non-Korean scene. We've noticed, however, that most people using the service are interested in the Koreans. We are still working on a useful solution to this problem.

Couldn't you control for non-Korean versus Korean in your statistical model? Just create binary variable and use in ANOVA or Regression. Not weighting the system is far from ideal, nevertheless, super job! You guys are heros!

You make it sound so simple, yet it isn't.

Keep in mind the system does consider the difference in skill level when distributing points. It is a tradeoff between having the ranking adapt faster to monster performances and not allowing people to farm too many lower tier players.


I see your point, however taking the skill level between players can be problematic, because is it the same if Life beats Dream versus Jaedong beating Stardust? Clearly life winning should be given more weight, thus, unless the relative value as compared to the peek score is computed, the absolute difference between the players does not really offer much insight. That being said, I'm sure you guys are super capable and the whole group does a great service to the community. Making sure we don't end-up with a dead game!
Die4Ever
Profile Joined August 2010
United States17750 Posts
July 17 2015 23:16 GMT
#488
I'm getting an internal server error on this page http://aligulac.com/periods/latest/
"Expert" mods4ever.com
Taari
Profile Joined May 2014
Germany138 Posts
July 18 2015 06:21 GMT
#489
Getting internal error at every page today.

By the way i wanted to submit, that Zanster joined team property a while ago.
Happy, herO, Neeb, Zest, uThermal, Welmu, Creator, VortiX, ShoWTimE
feardragon
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
United States973 Posts
July 18 2015 07:18 GMT
#490
When aligulac is broken, I feel like my Starcraft 2 player google is broken. I just sit at my computer with a blank look realizing I will probably never find the answer to my question until aligulac comes back up. =[
Ok Starcraft 2 Commentator
freeamount
Profile Joined April 2010
China202 Posts
July 18 2015 16:38 GMT
#491
On November 19 2014 00:30 Prillan wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 18 2014 10:04 edwahn wrote:
Hi guys, long time fan of this site.

I was just wondering if you had noticed that literally every single "top 5 highest ratings ever" was achieved since April 2014 under the all race section. Do you think it's really likely that the most dominating players have been seen since April 2014 this year, or is this just an uncontrolled inflation of ratings? I know that there's no point decay system here so does this contribute to this problem?

Personally I would have loved to see the most statistically dominating players across time, but the highest ratings of all time basically turns out to be who's the hottest player in recent memory. I know the HoF basically performs this function, but it's less easy to compare between players/specific periods in time this way!

Things I expected to see in highest ratings of all time
1. MVP's dominating TvT in the early days
2. MVP in general
3. Stephano's ZvP at his peak
4. MMA's TvZ during Slayers era

etc

Thanks guys and keep up the good work!

This is indeed a problem with rating inflation and it's kind of sad. It is caused by a combination of things like good players playing more games than bad players and so on. The fix we are working (slowly) on will hopefully fix some of this but I don't expect us to be able to solve this problem completely.

We do have a kind of decay, deviation decay. Each period we increase the uncertainty of the rating.

The inflation is still going on. I am wondering if there is any approach to fix this, like any normalize solution.
Shkudde
Profile Joined February 2011
Netherlands709 Posts
July 18 2015 17:32 GMT
#492
On July 16 2015 19:35 hewo wrote:
We survived the ForGGeddon, we will survive Der Byuntergang aswell

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


Please excuses the off-topicness, but this is hilarious!
$O$ | herO[jOin] | Zest hwaiting!
Prillan
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden350 Posts
July 19 2015 16:37 GMT
#493
On July 19 2015 01:38 freeamount wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 19 2014 00:30 Prillan wrote:
On November 18 2014 10:04 edwahn wrote:
Hi guys, long time fan of this site.

I was just wondering if you had noticed that literally every single "top 5 highest ratings ever" was achieved since April 2014 under the all race section. Do you think it's really likely that the most dominating players have been seen since April 2014 this year, or is this just an uncontrolled inflation of ratings? I know that there's no point decay system here so does this contribute to this problem?

Personally I would have loved to see the most statistically dominating players across time, but the highest ratings of all time basically turns out to be who's the hottest player in recent memory. I know the HoF basically performs this function, but it's less easy to compare between players/specific periods in time this way!

Things I expected to see in highest ratings of all time
1. MVP's dominating TvT in the early days
2. MVP in general
3. Stephano's ZvP at his peak
4. MMA's TvZ during Slayers era

etc

Thanks guys and keep up the good work!

This is indeed a problem with rating inflation and it's kind of sad. It is caused by a combination of things like good players playing more games than bad players and so on. The fix we are working (slowly) on will hopefully fix some of this but I don't expect us to be able to solve this problem completely.

We do have a kind of decay, deviation decay. Each period we increase the uncertainty of the rating.

The inflation is still going on. I am wondering if there is any approach to fix this, like any normalize solution.

We are aware. I haven't had any time to work on it. Hopefully that will change as soon as I get back to Sweden.
TheBB's sidekick, aligulac.com | "Reality is frequently inaccurate." - Douglas Adams
Seed
Profile Joined March 2012
Korea (South)17 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-07-22 15:55:06
July 22 2015 15:49 GMT
#494
hi. I'm seed. I didn't play this five matches. please delete this match history thanks.

07/05/2015 Seed KR P 0–1 P KR herO
07/05/2015 Seed KR P 0–1 P KR Hurricane
07/13/2015 Seed KR P 0–2 Z KR Losira

03/29/2014 Seed KR P 1–2 P KR Hunter <<
03/29/2014 Seed KR P 0–2 T KR Dragon << this matches are fakers match.
yoyo!
CtrlAltDefeat
Profile Joined November 2010
Israel106 Posts
August 08 2015 16:07 GMT
#495
Why does the site have so many issues with downtime?
Prillan
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden350 Posts
August 09 2015 08:32 GMT
#496
On August 09 2015 01:07 CtrlAltDefeat wrote:
Why does the site have so many issues with downtime?

Because we are only two main developers with very little time to work on the site. One thing we have to do is upgrade the server, which hasn't happened yet. I'm very sorry about all the downtime.
TheBB's sidekick, aligulac.com | "Reality is frequently inaccurate." - Douglas Adams
TheBB
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Switzerland5133 Posts
August 11 2015 15:02 GMT
#497
As of yesterday evening, we actually did upgrade the server. Hopefully the downtime problem will be fixed now. At least to some degree until we work out the remaining kinks. So far there haven't really been any, which is wonderful. It went a lot more smoothly than I had expected.
http://aligulac.com || Barcraft Switzerland! || Zerg best race. || Stats-poster extraordinaire.
royalroadweed
Profile Joined April 2013
United States8301 Posts
August 11 2015 15:22 GMT
#498
On November 18 2014 10:04 edwahn wrote:
Hi guys, long time fan of this site.

I was just wondering if you had noticed that literally every single "top 5 highest ratings ever" was achieved since April 2014 under the all race section. Do you think it's really likely that the most dominating players have been seen since April 2014 this year, or is this just an uncontrolled inflation of ratings? I know that there's no point decay system here so does this contribute to this problem?

Personally I would have loved to see the most statistically dominating players across time, but the highest ratings of all time basically turns out to be who's the hottest player in recent memory. I know the HoF basically performs this function, but it's less easy to compare between players/specific periods in time this way!

Things I expected to see in highest ratings of all time
1. MVP's dominating TvT in the early days
2. MVP in general
3. Stephano's ZvP at his peak
4. MMA's TvZ during Slayers era

etc

Thanks guys and keep up the good work!

The PP system effectively shows MVP overall domination imo.
"Nerfing Toss can just make them stronger"
Greenei
Profile Joined November 2011
Germany1754 Posts
August 18 2015 09:11 GMT
#499
Is there a problem with the database? I try to download it but it just gives me an old version.
IMBA IMBA IMBA IMBA IMBA IMBA
TheBB
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Switzerland5133 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-08-18 12:36:56
August 18 2015 10:56 GMT
#500
Yes, we've changed servers, but the DNS still points to the old location. The old server then gateways dynamic content to the new server, but serves static content on its own. This is harmless except for the periodically updated static content, such as the DB dump. We haven't been updating the DNS entries because we've been waiting for a domain transfer, and we underestimated somewhat how long that would take. But it's happened now so the DNS entries should update soon.

Edit: Should work now?
http://aligulac.com || Barcraft Switzerland! || Zerg best race. || Stats-poster extraordinaire.
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