StarCraft II Brood War - Page 14

On December 27 2012 20:50 MavercK wrote:


first time i've had that complaint

the camera is more zoomed out than BW. i used to have a BW faithful camera. it's still undecided which i stick with.

On December 27 2012 16:47 Patate wrote:


Important things like the income per base and how quickly people get maxed out is a reminder that the people who worked on SC2 have never watched professional BW, or are too stupid to catch the essence of it.

And for those talking about CS or DoTA, and how players have rejected the newest game, in late 2012, the comparison with BW/SC2 cannot be done, because kespa HAS switched to SC2. It's not the players who have rejected the newest game, it's the viewers. The Last BW OSL was full, the first SC2 OSL was empty... GSL's finals can barely fill up an auditorium.

The SC2 dev team has been VERY arrogant, it took them a major community uproar (Destiny's post, etc), to ANSWER, not even ACKNOWLEDGE that there is a problem in the actual game. In one week during the uproar, they have done more to improve Battle.Net 2.0 (which is still garbage compared to what ICCup and Fish have done with the old Bnet.. except the ladder system) than in two goddamn years.. and some people still collect minerals for Blizzard, like the mindless drones they are. As soon as the two main devs of the SC2 team sit down, open youtube, and grind the fuck out of hundreds of OSL and MSL games to understand why it has become a such deep and popular game, we will continue to have godawful foreign tournaments, with 3 unwatchable matchups (pvz, pvp, zvz),

No matter how hard they will try to balance the game, if there arent:
1. WOW units, like the spider mines, reavers, lurkers.. you know, units that make the spectator gets up from his chair and hope for a jackpot hit.
2. The need to have more than 3 bases mining at the same time (too much income per base, as the OP have superbly showed the difference between the 2 games)
3. A real defender's advantage, therefore army splitting (map control BW, not map vision SC2) done by inefficient deathball movement

Without these, even with balance, the people WILL NOT come back to this game. HSC had 25k viewers for its finals, and I have not seen the 60k-70k of the late 2011. Flash vs Naniwa has made viewers tuned up, but the games DO have to be more exciting, and also have to rely more on mechanics. There are reasons why Jaedong, Flash, Bisu, Savior, July , Nada... have been "bonjwas". People can mimick strats.. not mechanical skills. SC2 has almost entirely taken out the need to exceed in mechanical skills, so the games rely more on build order wins than before (also maps are way less important, because of my 3rd point above).

SC2BW should be the new tournament play.. it's sad but true. Leave the Swarm hosts for the Blizzdrones, I want real Starcraft.

On December 27 2012 21:31 Evangelist wrote:


Ahah. No offence but the reason why all that nonsense got replaced is because there were about 50 people watching Brood War when SC2 came out and it was about as friendly to the layman as quantum mechanics. Note, this is not because it was "harder" (it wasn't) but because it was an awkward, irritating design that simply wasn't suited for modern gaming.

Like it or not, SC2 is here to stay. The fact that no one can find customs of this game despite it being around for TWO YEARS shows the level of interest in it.

Getting very tired of posts like this from people who have no idea what they are talking about.

Oh and er.. SC2's ZvZ is far more entertaining than the mass muta-fest that BW's ZvZ was. Not to mention the fact that higher tier tech was completely useless in nearly every circumstance because it was almost invariably hard countered by casters.

I've seen nearly every unit in SC2 in a pro game. That's the sign of good design.

On December 27 2012 21:42 Grettin wrote:


True! i wouldn't mind seeing Day9 doing some dailies on this or even playing it himself.

On December 27 2012 21:31 Evangelist wrote:
I've seen nearly every unit in SC2 in a pro game. That's the sign of good design.

On December 27 2012 21:31 Evangelist wrote:


Ahah. No offence but the reason why all that nonsense got replaced is because there were about 50 people watching Brood War when SC2 came out and it was about as friendly to the layman as quantum mechanics. Note, this is not because it was "harder" (it wasn't) but because it was an awkward, irritating design that simply wasn't suited for modern gaming.

Like it or not, SC2 is here to stay. The fact that no one can find customs of this game despite it being around for TWO YEARS shows the level of interest in it.

Getting very tired of posts like this from people who have no idea what they are talking about.

Oh and er.. SC2's ZvZ is far more entertaining than the mass muta-fest that BW's ZvZ was. Not to mention the fact that higher tier tech was completely useless in nearly every circumstance because it was almost invariably hard countered by casters.

I've seen nearly every unit in SC2 in a pro game. That's the sign of good design.

On December 27 2012 16:47 Patate wrote:


Important things like the income per base and how quickly people get maxed out is a reminder that the people who worked on SC2 have never watched professional BW, or are too stupid to catch the essence of it.

And for those talking about CS or DoTA, and how players have rejected the newest game, in late 2012, the comparison with BW/SC2 cannot be done, because kespa HAS switched to SC2. It's not the players who have rejected the newest game, it's the viewers. The Last BW OSL was full, the first SC2 OSL was empty... GSL's finals can barely fill up an auditorium.

The SC2 dev team has been VERY arrogant, it took them a major community uproar (Destiny's post, etc), to ANSWER, not even ACKNOWLEDGE that there is a problem in the actual game. In one week during the uproar, they have done more to improve Battle.Net 2.0 (which is still garbage compared to what ICCup and Fish have done with the old Bnet.. except the ladder system) than in two goddamn years.. and some people still collect minerals for Blizzard, like the mindless drones they are. As soon as the two main devs of the SC2 team sit down, open youtube, and grind the fuck out of hundreds of OSL and MSL games to understand why it has become a such deep and popular game, we will continue to have godawful foreign tournaments, with 3 unwatchable matchups (pvz, pvp, zvz),

No matter how hard they will try to balance the game, if there arent:
1. WOW units, like the spider mines, reavers, lurkers.. you know, units that make the spectator gets up from his chair and hope for a jackpot hit.
2. The need to have more than 3 bases mining at the same time (too much income per base, as the OP have superbly showed the difference between the 2 games)
3. A real defender's advantage, therefore army splitting (map control BW, not map vision SC2) done by inefficient deathball movement

Without these, even with balance, the people WILL NOT come back to this game. HSC had 25k viewers for its finals, and I have not seen the 60k-70k of the late 2011. Flash vs Naniwa has made viewers tuned up, but the games DO have to be more exciting, and also have to rely more on mechanics. There are reasons why Jaedong, Flash, Bisu, Savior, July , Nada... have been "bonjwas". People can mimick strats.. not mechanical skills. SC2 has almost entirely taken out the need to exceed in mechanical skills, so the games rely more on build order wins than before (also maps are way less important, because of my 3rd point above).

SC2BW should be the new tournament play.. it's sad but true. Leave the Swarm hosts for the Blizzdrones, I want real Starcraft.