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On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....??
Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud.
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Wow, well at least he got to leave
It could have been a lot worse, glad it wasn't
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On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud.
You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world?
Hardly a rational behavior, right?
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On November 18 2012 00:31 ramask2 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:28 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:20 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:10 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:00 ramask2 wrote:On November 17 2012 22:44 ReachTheSky wrote:
I find it interesting that he contacted his banks but not the police. He is trying to tell the bank that he wasn't the one who has withdrawn the money. His problem wasn't that he's robbed, its that he now owes a lot of money to the bank. He MUST convince them that he was robbed. What happened to the thief are secondary. All the police can do is arrest the thugs (which they most likely can't) and even then they won't find the money. Talking to a foreign police force probably wasn't a attractive prospect either. The bank can do that FOR him in their investigation. Its ridiculous how some people are somehow putting the blame on Mr. Bitter. So there are (supposedly) dangerous thugs on the loose who are kidnapping tourists and it is of no concern to get them arrested? What about their future victims? It seems this story isn't entirely true when you consider nobody cares enough to alert authorities. Only contacting the bank and asking for money? Really? Seems like the first priority should be protecting the public from such dangerous gangsters... if they exist. I think you've completely misread what he wrote. He wrote that the bank puts the onus of proof of theft on Bitters. Until Bitters can prove to the bank that he was a victim of theft, the bank won't care about the thieves. Then he wrote that while going to the police directly may get the thieves arrested, it won't get the bank off his back necessarily. So what Bitters is doing is letting the bank take charge of the situation - as the bank has more resources to get police involvement. In addition, the bank has the card charge data and can coordinate with local authorities to investigate. To me, Bitters should have asked his hotel for the cops once he was free and then call the bank after. However, calling the bank first to ask for next steps is not bad either. The bank would usually advise you to make a police report anyways. I read and understood very clearly what he wrote. He wrote that not contacting police is reasonable, because "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is absurd. Arresting dangerous gansters who are kidnapping tourists is of utmost importance. The problem with trying to rationalize Mr Bitters behaviour as you are doing is that if you accept his story as true his behaviour is very irrational. This causes people to say silly things, like "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is like saying: "all a doctor can do is cure your illness". There is nothing rational about not contacting police in this case... unless he is lying. Then it makes sense. If I'm robbed, my concerns are prioritized as followed: 1.) Ensure that I'm safe. 2.) Get my money back. 3.) Ensure that the thieves aren't going to hurt me again before I go back home. 4.) Make sure they're arrested. All I'm saying is that I would have gone to the bank first because I sure as hell don't want to owe them money! And I firmly believe that a bank has more knowledge in dealing with foreign police forces and cases like this than I do!!
How does not contacting police help ensure that you're safe? How does not contacting police help you get your money back? How does not contacting police help you get home without being hurt? How does not contacting police get them arrested?
None of your priorities are helped by not contacting police. Indeed, your bank will probably suspect you of fraud when they see there is no police report yet you claim to be the victim of a crime. Avoiding police harms, not helps, your chances of reimbursement.
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Glad you are okay and hope you can still enjoy the event! I also hope we will see you cast in germany again soon, you know you are safe here  .
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On November 18 2012 00:28 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:20 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:10 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:00 ramask2 wrote:On November 17 2012 22:44 ReachTheSky wrote:
I find it interesting that he contacted his banks but not the police. He is trying to tell the bank that he wasn't the one who has withdrawn the money. His problem wasn't that he's robbed, its that he now owes a lot of money to the bank. He MUST convince them that he was robbed. What happened to the thief are secondary. All the police can do is arrest the thugs (which they most likely can't) and even then they won't find the money. Talking to a foreign police force probably wasn't a attractive prospect either. The bank can do that FOR him in their investigation. Its ridiculous how some people are somehow putting the blame on Mr. Bitter. So there are (supposedly) dangerous thugs on the loose who are kidnapping tourists and it is of no concern to get them arrested? What about their future victims? It seems this story isn't entirely true when you consider nobody cares enough to alert authorities. Only contacting the bank and asking for money? Really? Seems like the first priority should be protecting the public from such dangerous gangsters... if they exist. I think you've completely misread what he wrote. He wrote that the bank puts the onus of proof of theft on Bitters. Until Bitters can prove to the bank that he was a victim of theft, the bank won't care about the thieves. Then he wrote that while going to the police directly may get the thieves arrested, it won't get the bank off his back necessarily. So what Bitters is doing is letting the bank take charge of the situation - as the bank has more resources to get police involvement. In addition, the bank has the card charge data and can coordinate with local authorities to investigate. To me, Bitters should have asked his hotel for the cops once he was free and then call the bank after. However, calling the bank first to ask for next steps is not bad either. The bank would usually advise you to make a police report anyways. I read and understood very clearly what he wrote. He wrote that not contacting police is reasonable, because "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is absurd. Arresting dangerous gansters who are kidnapping tourists is of utmost importance. The problem with trying to rationalize Mr Bitters behaviour as you are doing is that if you accept his story as true his behaviour is very irrational. This causes people to say silly things, like "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is like saying: "all a doctor can do is cure your illness". There is nothing rational about not contacting police in this case... unless he is lying. Then it makes sense.
To put into perspective - Bitters said "I haven't contacted the cops yet because I don't know what to tell them. I don't even know where I was."
He has no information of use besides memory of some faces. He would be going into a chinese police station and telling them he was kidnapped, robbed, dropped off at his hotel - and he can't give any info. Do you believe the police will find his story very useful?
Instead he calls his bank. He tells the bank the previous transactions were thefts. They don't look normal - who spends large sums of exact figures like that? 5000rmb? Twice? Then an attempt at 10000rmb? Large round figures - if he was spending on stuff, do you think that makes sense?
The bank has the transaction logs. They have the credit card swipe ID. Even if it's falsified - they are in a better position to give the police actual information. And they are the ones to forgive Bitters the $1600 bucks. I fail to see why this does not seem intelligent and logical to you.
In addition - there is nothing that says Bitters has not gone to the police since this story. Again - he stated at the end that he didnt go "yet" because he was unsure of what to do. Why do you harp on him not going at that time so strictly?
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On November 18 2012 00:37 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:31 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:28 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:20 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:10 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:00 ramask2 wrote:On November 17 2012 22:44 ReachTheSky wrote:
I find it interesting that he contacted his banks but not the police. He is trying to tell the bank that he wasn't the one who has withdrawn the money. His problem wasn't that he's robbed, its that he now owes a lot of money to the bank. He MUST convince them that he was robbed. What happened to the thief are secondary. All the police can do is arrest the thugs (which they most likely can't) and even then they won't find the money. Talking to a foreign police force probably wasn't a attractive prospect either. The bank can do that FOR him in their investigation. Its ridiculous how some people are somehow putting the blame on Mr. Bitter. So there are (supposedly) dangerous thugs on the loose who are kidnapping tourists and it is of no concern to get them arrested? What about their future victims? It seems this story isn't entirely true when you consider nobody cares enough to alert authorities. Only contacting the bank and asking for money? Really? Seems like the first priority should be protecting the public from such dangerous gangsters... if they exist. I think you've completely misread what he wrote. He wrote that the bank puts the onus of proof of theft on Bitters. Until Bitters can prove to the bank that he was a victim of theft, the bank won't care about the thieves. Then he wrote that while going to the police directly may get the thieves arrested, it won't get the bank off his back necessarily. So what Bitters is doing is letting the bank take charge of the situation - as the bank has more resources to get police involvement. In addition, the bank has the card charge data and can coordinate with local authorities to investigate. To me, Bitters should have asked his hotel for the cops once he was free and then call the bank after. However, calling the bank first to ask for next steps is not bad either. The bank would usually advise you to make a police report anyways. I read and understood very clearly what he wrote. He wrote that not contacting police is reasonable, because "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is absurd. Arresting dangerous gansters who are kidnapping tourists is of utmost importance. The problem with trying to rationalize Mr Bitters behaviour as you are doing is that if you accept his story as true his behaviour is very irrational. This causes people to say silly things, like "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is like saying: "all a doctor can do is cure your illness". There is nothing rational about not contacting police in this case... unless he is lying. Then it makes sense. If I'm robbed, my concerns are prioritized as followed: 1.) Ensure that I'm safe. 2.) Get my money back. 3.) Ensure that the thieves aren't going to hurt me again before I go back home. 4.) Make sure they're arrested. All I'm saying is that I would have gone to the bank first because I sure as hell don't want to owe them money! And I firmly believe that a bank has more knowledge in dealing with foreign police forces and cases like this than I do!! How does not contacting police help ensure that you're safe? How does not contacting police help you get your money back? How does not contacting police help you get home without being hurt? How does not contacting police get them arrested? None of your priorities are helped by not contacting police. Indeed, your bank will probably suspect you of fraud when they see there is no police report yet you claim to be the victim of a crime. Avoiding police harms, not helps, your chances of reimbursement.
*Sigh*........... Again, I'm not AGAINST contacting the police. I'm arguing that I would have contacted the bank FIRST.
The bank WILL contact the police in their investigation. The thieves WILL be investigated.
You're trying to convince me because Mr. Bitter didn't go to the police FIRST, he's suspicious.
I'm arguing that going to the bank FIRST is rational, thus he's not suspicious.
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On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right?
Fraud and robbery are different.
There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right?
So let's examine both options.
He is telling the truth:
- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats
- The gang preys on tourists
- He didn't report this to police ... because ... ???
He is making it up:
- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes
- His peers wonder where he had been
- He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending
- Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways
Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true.
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On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself.
would someone really do that? go online just to tell lies?
User was banned for this post.
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Well, good luck to Mrbitters. His story is very suspicious though. If he's lucky, the bank will just deny his claim.
However, it is entirely possible that they will refer it to FBI, which will contact the Chinese police -- who will look into the story more closely by going to the physical address associated with the point of sale. Believe it or not, they may spend a few hours on a kidnapping/robbery or possible bank fraud case.
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On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true.
Bank fraud - especially if you are spending on prostitutes with a debit card - is not that easy to commit.
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On November 18 2012 00:40 JinDesu wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:28 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:20 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:10 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:00 ramask2 wrote:On November 17 2012 22:44 ReachTheSky wrote:
I find it interesting that he contacted his banks but not the police. He is trying to tell the bank that he wasn't the one who has withdrawn the money. His problem wasn't that he's robbed, its that he now owes a lot of money to the bank. He MUST convince them that he was robbed. What happened to the thief are secondary. All the police can do is arrest the thugs (which they most likely can't) and even then they won't find the money. Talking to a foreign police force probably wasn't a attractive prospect either. The bank can do that FOR him in their investigation. Its ridiculous how some people are somehow putting the blame on Mr. Bitter. So there are (supposedly) dangerous thugs on the loose who are kidnapping tourists and it is of no concern to get them arrested? What about their future victims? It seems this story isn't entirely true when you consider nobody cares enough to alert authorities. Only contacting the bank and asking for money? Really? Seems like the first priority should be protecting the public from such dangerous gangsters... if they exist. I think you've completely misread what he wrote. He wrote that the bank puts the onus of proof of theft on Bitters. Until Bitters can prove to the bank that he was a victim of theft, the bank won't care about the thieves. Then he wrote that while going to the police directly may get the thieves arrested, it won't get the bank off his back necessarily. So what Bitters is doing is letting the bank take charge of the situation - as the bank has more resources to get police involvement. In addition, the bank has the card charge data and can coordinate with local authorities to investigate. To me, Bitters should have asked his hotel for the cops once he was free and then call the bank after. However, calling the bank first to ask for next steps is not bad either. The bank would usually advise you to make a police report anyways. I read and understood very clearly what he wrote. He wrote that not contacting police is reasonable, because "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is absurd. Arresting dangerous gansters who are kidnapping tourists is of utmost importance. The problem with trying to rationalize Mr Bitters behaviour as you are doing is that if you accept his story as true his behaviour is very irrational. This causes people to say silly things, like "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is like saying: "all a doctor can do is cure your illness". There is nothing rational about not contacting police in this case... unless he is lying. Then it makes sense. To put into perspective - Bitters said "I haven't contacted the cops yet because I don't know what to tell them. I don't even know where I was." He has no information of use besides memory of some faces. He would be going into a chinese police station and telling them he was kidnapped, robbed, dropped off at his hotel - and he can't give any info. Do you believe the police will find his story very useful? Instead he calls his bank. He tells the bank the previous transactions were thefts. They don't look normal - who spends large sums of exact figures like that? 5000rmb? Twice? Then an attempt at 10000rmb? Large round figures - if he was spending on stuff, do you think that makes sense? The bank has the transaction logs. They have the credit card swipe ID. Even if it's falsified - they are in a better position to give the police actual information. And they are the ones to forgive Bitters the $1600 bucks. I fail to see why this does not seem intelligent and logical to you. In addition - there is nothing that says Bitters has not gone to the police since this story. Again - he stated at the end that he didnt go "yet" because he was unsure of what to do. Why do you harp on him not going at that time so strictly?
He tells them he was kidnapped and robbed. Nobody expects you to solve the crime before you report it. That is what detectives are for.
And police can go get records from a bank. Why do you think banks need to lead the investigation? Criminal investigations are typically handled by law enforcement. I believe the same is true for China.
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On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true.
Haha, just wow, how do you even come up with this? You should write novels or something, man I love the internet and you just made my day .
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On November 18 2012 00:53 JinDesu wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true. Bank fraud - especially if you are spending on prostitutes with a debit card - is not that easy to commit.
Yes, because the bank will say exactly what I have said. Why didn't he report it to the police?
I doubt he will be sucessful. Hopefully for him it doesn't blow up.
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On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true.
It's obvious to me as well. The first one is a realistic scenario that I personally have witnessed before in Beijing and Shanghai.
The second reads like a fanfiction with no facts whatsoever. Come on, you're arguing that he's trying to lend credibility to a story by posting on a message board with the only source as HIMSELF?
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i see some theories of what really happened mr.bitter. i don't especially like your game knowledge and long-hour casts, but i am giving you the benefit of the doubt, and truly believe you're a good person.
that said, i'd like it to be that all the hope we have for you to have better luck from here contributes in some way.
i personally learned a valuable lesson from your experience and will feel a lot more calm if i were ever to be in a similar situation.
looking forward to your casts with everyone else! <3
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On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true.
You can't be serious... the need for witchhunts in this community keeps dazzling me.
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On November 18 2012 01:00 Hylirion wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true. You can't be serious... the need for witchhunts in this community keeps dazzling me.
The guy's a troll. ALL of his posts ever are all in this thread, people should just stop feeding him.
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On November 18 2012 00:55 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:40 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:28 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:20 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:10 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:00 ramask2 wrote:On November 17 2012 22:44 ReachTheSky wrote:
I find it interesting that he contacted his banks but not the police. He is trying to tell the bank that he wasn't the one who has withdrawn the money. His problem wasn't that he's robbed, its that he now owes a lot of money to the bank. He MUST convince them that he was robbed. What happened to the thief are secondary. All the police can do is arrest the thugs (which they most likely can't) and even then they won't find the money. Talking to a foreign police force probably wasn't a attractive prospect either. The bank can do that FOR him in their investigation. Its ridiculous how some people are somehow putting the blame on Mr. Bitter. So there are (supposedly) dangerous thugs on the loose who are kidnapping tourists and it is of no concern to get them arrested? What about their future victims? It seems this story isn't entirely true when you consider nobody cares enough to alert authorities. Only contacting the bank and asking for money? Really? Seems like the first priority should be protecting the public from such dangerous gangsters... if they exist. I think you've completely misread what he wrote. He wrote that the bank puts the onus of proof of theft on Bitters. Until Bitters can prove to the bank that he was a victim of theft, the bank won't care about the thieves. Then he wrote that while going to the police directly may get the thieves arrested, it won't get the bank off his back necessarily. So what Bitters is doing is letting the bank take charge of the situation - as the bank has more resources to get police involvement. In addition, the bank has the card charge data and can coordinate with local authorities to investigate. To me, Bitters should have asked his hotel for the cops once he was free and then call the bank after. However, calling the bank first to ask for next steps is not bad either. The bank would usually advise you to make a police report anyways. I read and understood very clearly what he wrote. He wrote that not contacting police is reasonable, because "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is absurd. Arresting dangerous gansters who are kidnapping tourists is of utmost importance. The problem with trying to rationalize Mr Bitters behaviour as you are doing is that if you accept his story as true his behaviour is very irrational. This causes people to say silly things, like "all the police can do is arrest the thugs". That is like saying: "all a doctor can do is cure your illness". There is nothing rational about not contacting police in this case... unless he is lying. Then it makes sense. To put into perspective - Bitters said "I haven't contacted the cops yet because I don't know what to tell them. I don't even know where I was." He has no information of use besides memory of some faces. He would be going into a chinese police station and telling them he was kidnapped, robbed, dropped off at his hotel - and he can't give any info. Do you believe the police will find his story very useful? Instead he calls his bank. He tells the bank the previous transactions were thefts. They don't look normal - who spends large sums of exact figures like that? 5000rmb? Twice? Then an attempt at 10000rmb? Large round figures - if he was spending on stuff, do you think that makes sense? The bank has the transaction logs. They have the credit card swipe ID. Even if it's falsified - they are in a better position to give the police actual information. And they are the ones to forgive Bitters the $1600 bucks. I fail to see why this does not seem intelligent and logical to you. In addition - there is nothing that says Bitters has not gone to the police since this story. Again - he stated at the end that he didnt go "yet" because he was unsure of what to do. Why do you harp on him not going at that time so strictly? He tells them he was kidnapped and robbed. Nobody expects you to solve the crime before you report it. That is what detectives are for. And police can go get records from a bank. Why do you think banks need to lead the investigation? Criminal investigations are typically handled by law enforcement. I believe the same is true for China.
Go to China. Find a police station. Speak in english. Tell them you got kidnapped and robbed. Tell them you don't know who, you don't know where. Hope they have someone fluent enough in english on staff to tell their supervisors that this foreigner came in with no info. Let me know how well that goes with you.
You let the bank lead because they have more resources than you. They can access their files and give to the police directly, because they already have your approval. They can force the police to do the work. You can't, they are not your police, and regardless of your fantasies that the police has the obligation - you have no information of use to the police.
And again - how do you know for sure that he has not yet to seen the police?
On November 18 2012 00:58 gyurktle wrote:Show nested quote +On November 18 2012 00:53 JinDesu wrote:On November 18 2012 00:50 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:36 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:32 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:22 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:19 gyurktle wrote:On November 18 2012 00:12 ramask2 wrote:On November 18 2012 00:07 gyurktle wrote:
They are trying to rationalize why he wouldn't tell police without admitting that it very suspiciously looks like Mr. Bitter got drunk and spent the money willingly.. So you are saying Mr. Bitter is trying to fool the bank by posting his lies on Reddit and teamliquid.....? Why would he do that? If I'm doing something that shameful I'll be sure to keep it to myself. Most likely he would be trying to fool his peers by posting on teamliquid and reddit. I doubt his bank is reading his posts. WTF Why would he need to fool any of his peers when he's just trying to get money back.....?? Maybe they don't approve of bank fraud. You're saying that he's essentially trying to rob a bank, and then telling clues about it to both his peers and the world? Hardly a rational behavior, right? Fraud and robbery are different. There are two potential options here. Either he is telling the truth, or he is not. Right? So let's examine both options. He is telling the truth:- He was kidnapped and robbed by a gang which uses physical force and threats - The gang preys on tourists - He didn't report this to police ... because ... ??? He is making it up:- He spent money he regrets, possibly on prostitutes - His peers wonder where he had been - He makes up a story about robbery and kidnapping, deflecting embarassment over his drunken antics and potentially giving him an avenue for getting back the money he regrets spending - Posts it on the internet to try and lend it more credibility and because his peers will spread it around anyways Which makes more sense? To me it seems obvious. There's no logical explanation for police avoidance unless his story isn't entirely true. Bank fraud - especially if you are spending on prostitutes with a debit card - is not that easy to commit. Yes, because the bank will say exactly what I have said. Why didn't he report it to the police? I doubt he will be sucessful. Hopefully for him it doesn't blow up.
No - the bank will tell him to report to the police. They don't ask why. They aren't concerned with why - they want to make sure the client was robbed and is taken care of, or charge the client for wasting their time with fraud. I don't think you've dealt with a bank on such a subject before.
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EPT
