EPT[Poll] How Infestor could be changed? - Page 15
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
That + stun may be enough. If not, then increase energy required for IT. | ||
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MrBitter
United States2940 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. | ||
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CCa1ss1e
Canada3231 Posts
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Thezzy
Netherlands2117 Posts
Fungal IMO is primarily deadly because it allows for an infinite chain fungal (only limit is energy) and the complete immobilization lets other Zerg units wreck total havoc. That said, I wonder if it might be a good idea if Fungal did not snare Mechanical units (at all). Biological units such as Marines, Mutas and Zealots would suffer the full effects, but units such as Vikings, Thors, Interceptors and Stalkers would only take damage without being snared. This would allow for some adjustment to an Infestor play without making it weaker across the board. | ||
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 darkness wrote: No poll to remove burrow from infestors? That + stun may be enough. If not, then increase energy required for IT. On November 09 2012 03:46 darkness wrote: No poll to remove burrow from infestors? wow.. how about we just removed the unit entirely ffs... | ||
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Homework
United States283 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: Posted this in the Blizz pro forums just yesterday: + Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. I read through this change and... I agree. The difficulty with nerfing the infestor is that it is the proper response to things like blink-stalkers, MMM, mass ling... if we nerf the infestor how does zerg deal with things like mass blink stalker? | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:56 Ballistixz wrote: wow.. how about we just removed the unit entirely ffs... Someone is butthurt? Currently, infestors are high reward little risk units. Risk? None. You just burrow and go away in most cases. | ||
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KamikazeDurrrp
United States95 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. No, no, no, no NO. Look, I respect you for all you've done Mr. Bitter but that is just wrong. We have to look at ways to make the game DYNAMIC, not increase the "coinflippish" nature that SC2 already is. All the proposed changes in this thread still wouldn't change the fact that zerg would STILL mass infestor and rely on fungal for it's utility. One can already see with HOTS tempest templar WITH the oracle (long range, aoe damage, aoe slow) is the new broodlord infestor. Increasing the range of those spell casters you listed would just make things worse. Making fungals slow or making more hard counters to infestor DOESN'T WORK. Instead we have to change the utility of fungal once and for all, and I've already listed the changes I'd like to see twice already T___T. | ||
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happyness
United States2400 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: Posted this in the Blizz pro forums just yesterday: + Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. This is good, but I think it would be better if the range on IT and Fungal were slightly reduced, making infestors slightly more vulnerable. I don't like the idea of only one unit being the counter to another unit. Also, a nerf to the infestor should be coupled with a buff to hydra by increaing its life or something along those lines | ||
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S_SienZ
1878 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: Posted this in the Blizz pro forums just yesterday: + Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. This will have terrible spill over effects in TvP. Mech will be even less viable due to increased feedback range, medivac drops are easier to defend, same with Raven / Cloaked Banshee. | ||
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Lukeeze[zR]
Switzerland6838 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: Posted this in the Blizz pro forums just yesterday: + Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. It would just increase the "vortex or neuro" syndrome, with a single (miss-) click becoming even more important than it is. I don't want to see casters play an even bigger role, at this rate the fighting units will become just meatshield for casters. It's sc2, not wc3 or some games decided by spells. On top of that, it would only increase the number of casters produced in a single game and the boring factor brought by fungal (root) would remain persistent. Plus I'm getting tired of all these units with sick ass range we're seeing in HotS, soon the siege tank will be considered a medium ranged unit T_T | ||
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zhurai
United States5660 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:56 Ballistixz wrote: wow.. how about we just removed the unit entirely ffs... that would be fine too | ||
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S_SienZ
1878 Posts
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hitpoint
United States1511 Posts
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fezvez
France3021 Posts
- Fungal growth roots on creep, slows massively otherwise (50%) - Very slight nerf to infested terrans. Eggs with same HP as infested terran looks fine to me | ||
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y0su
Finland7871 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: Posted this in the Blizz pro forums just yesterday: + Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. Probably the best "non nerf" idea I've heard! Thanks MrB :D | ||
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DidYuhim
Ukraine1905 Posts
On November 09 2012 03:46 MrBitter wrote: Posted this in the Blizz pro forums just yesterday: + Show Spoiler + Hi dudes, So the infestor has become the target of many people's whines recently. I'm not sure that this is the place to rant about it, but I wanted to get my opinions out there for people to see, and hopefully for Blizzard to comment on. While I can recognize that tournament results at the highest level have remained varied, I can't help but feel like late game Zerg play has become very face-roll and skill-less. This isn't to say that top level Zerg play isn't impressive - it is, but in certain matchups, on certain maps, and in certain cases, we see the game devolve to Zerg turtling behind spine crawlers and infestors, defending drops and harass, and slowly accumulating a critical mass of brood lord / infestor before pushing out to win the game. Yes, we were all very impressed when Rain dismantled DRG in the OSL finals, and I can recognize that it is possible for Protoss to win in the super late game against Zerg, but I can't help but to feel that Protoss has to work a lot harder at a certain point in the game to get those impressive wins. Like... a loooot harder. When we step back and look at the game, we see a lot of things that are, perhaps, too strong. Infestors. Brood lords. Spine crawlers. These things are all super powerful. As are Colossi, blink stalkers, mother ship, and tons of other Protoss stuff. The problem isn't overpowered stuff. The problem comes when you no longer have an answer to overpowered stuff. And I do feel that, at a point, infestor broodlord just snowballs out of control. I don't blame this on it being a far superior fighting army... We've seen Protoss players kill this composition in the past even without vortex. And I don't blame it on the fungal mechanic shutting down micro. I think it just boils down to points in the game where Protoss is disallowed from engaging certain aspects of the Zerg army. A zerg player has to make a mistake for Protoss to kill his infestors. A zerg player has to expose his broodlords for that army to be threatened. Incidentally, all of this also applies to Terran in some ways. Fundamentally, I think you can solve this problem with one small change to Protoss, and one small change to Terran... By buffing their anti-infestor casters. The high templar and the ghosts respectively. I think increasing the range on feedback and snipe would do wonders to bring stability, and MOBILITY back to the matchups, and I also think it would silence the masses that love to cry about the overpoweredness of certain Zerg army compositions. It's almost impossible for Protoss and Terran players to successfully feedback or snipe infestors without losing the units they commit to doing so. Often, we see Protoss players send 2-3 high templar forward to feedback, successfully kill 1-2 infestors, and lose their units, resulting in a cost-ineffective trade. I honestly feel like this happens purely because you can never reach infestors. I would like to see feedback range tested at something like range 12. Give them broodlord range, so that infestors have to be positioned underneath broods, and can be punished if left overly exposed. This will still preserve the strength of broodlord infestor, while giving Protoss a way to combat the strength of fungal. Obviously, if you're going to buff feedback, you have to buff snipe, but in this case, I think an equivalent range buff to ghosts would do wonders to ease Terran woes as well. (And for all the same reasons listed above) For me, as a player, I get very bored of the turtley games that we are continuing to see day in and day out. As a caster, I can put on a blindfold and talk an audience through a PvZ on Daybreak. And as a fan of the game, I long for mechanics that push players away from being static and immobile, and toward being aggressive and active. I would love to hear what other top players think of this change, and also to see what Blizz has to say on the matter. <3s and kudos. Thanks for reading. TLDR: Don't nerf infestor. Instead buff the range of feedback and snipe. Actually this is a really interesting way of balancing the game. Instead of nerfing units, you buff other ones. | ||
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Zenbrez
Canada5973 Posts
The only thing that'll change (as far as I'm thinking) is HT vs ghost battles. Currently I believe snipe has 0.5 longer range than feedback, and that's partly because it has a delay, whereas fedback does not. Probably worth at least testing though | ||
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S_SienZ
1878 Posts
On November 09 2012 04:19 Zenbrez wrote: The feedback/snipe idea is an interesting one. It's not like that'll have much effect on much. Hts can snipe ravens or queens more easily? Well I doubt that'll be a problem. Ghosts are going to.. snipe more zealots? marines? Not worred about that. The only thing that'll change (as far as I'm thinking) is HT vs ghost battles. Currently I believe snipe has 0.5 longer range than feedback, and that's partly because it has a delay, whereas fedback does not. Probably worth at least testing though HTs vs Medivacs? | ||
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