EPT[Poll] How Infestor could be changed? - Page 13
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Ballistixz
United States1269 Posts
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Narw
Poland884 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:15 Tsuki.eu wrote: where is the, fungal cant hit air option tt ZvZ would need to be changed to MvM. | ||
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1st_Panzer_Div.
United States621 Posts
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Zenbrez
Canada5973 Posts
On November 09 2012 01:38 Liman wrote: I dont know how infestor should be changed but i know it needs to be done.There are many good suggestions here. PS. I love the way you guys discuss this topic.Its completely different then idiot fest on Blizz forums. The blizz forums is where discussion goes to die. How about changing the IT cost is an odd number (blizz likes to stick with multiples of 25). 50 might be too much for a IT, so why not try somewhere inbetween, 35, 40? It's not huge but it would make a difference. Say when all your energy is drained and your opponent is being very aggressive, you have to wait longer before having the energy to drop another IT. Also here are 2 things I've been thinking about for the IT. It currently received +2 attack for each attack upgrade, change it to 1. And it has the same attack speed as a marine (0.86?), bump it up a little bit. Even up to 1.0 makes a difference, especially when you spit out 30-40 of them at a time in the lategame. | ||
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D4V3Z02
Germany693 Posts
On November 09 2012 01:50 PauseBreak wrote: Zerg units are NOT weak. I'm not sure how this crap got spread around. Last time I checked, Ling/Bane/Muta was ripping games apart. Those aren't even T3 units. 200 supply ling bane muta cant even kill 200 supply bio mech, so what would happen to protoss deathball? You dont want to change fungal you want to remove zerg from the game. | ||
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Albinoswordfish
United States108 Posts
The reason it's so easy to mass Infestors is because with proper micro you can kill mid game armies from all three races by just trading energy. Over the course of the game the Infestor count is just going to spiral out of control. There is a major design flaw of the Infestor in terms of it's tech level. It is a LAIR TECH unit! No Lair tech unit no matter how much should be able to defeat a maxed Tier 3 army from any race. The Infestor is a very powerful unit, which is fine I love watching very powerful units. However I think it's way to powerful to be a Lair tech and should be moved to Hive. There is no mid game anymore for Zerg players, because why would you when you have the Infestor that kills everything. By moving Infestor's to Hive tech this will force Zerg players to spend minerals/gas instead of energy to fight in the mid game (thus reducing their strength of their Hive tech army). As of right now Lair tech units are way too weak to combat Terran and Protoss in the mid game. Alright so change Hydras to be Tier 1. Hydra's are terrible in the mid game because by the time you can get them the opponent will already have Siege Tanks/Collosus out. Move Roaches to Lair tech, increase their cost but also increase their hp/armor to be able withstand Siege Tanks and Collosus volleys. Right now Roaches are useful in the beginning of the game but once the opponent gets one of these two units they suddenly become awful. Moving Hydras to Tier 1 will allow Zerg get a high hydra count in the mid game to deal with 2-base immortal/sentry allins from Protoss. Basically I think a slight nerf to the Infestor won't really change the game significantly. And if you overnerf them Zerg will have no answer in the late game. But they're way to powerful to be used in the mid game. | ||
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Ameisenmann
Albania296 Posts
Edit: And of course the big question is, how it would affect overall performance of zergs. Changing such a vital unit might have a pretty dramatic effect after all. | ||
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KamikazeDurrrp
United States95 Posts
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JKM
Denmark419 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:03 oZe wrote: Any nerf to infestors requires a significant nerf of all terran and protoss units or a significant buff to all other zerg units. I mean compared to storm fungal is like a slight tickle. Cannot think anyone would rather have infestors with 0 energy than templars with 0 energy either. You're being silly. Don't be overdramatic about it. Looking at pure dps storm is better, but you can micro against storm why the full damage of a storm is never realized. In comparison fungal roots the enemy to the ground and is not hard to chain. Furthermore late game you got the combination of blords long range bombardement while locking units down to the ground. I don't understand people saying that zerg is too weak mid-game with infestors nerfed. Zerg has several strong timings they can use against both protoss and terran to wreck damage midgame and with hots coming in the foreseeable future zerg gets a fairly strong midgame blord. Furthermore, nerfing infestors might allow buffing hydras which I think everybody would like to see happen (outside of zerg nydus hydra allin vs protoss maybe becoming too strong). | ||
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nojok
France15846 Posts
Also make the ghost 150/150 or even 150/175 as terrans are more mineral starved than gas starved. | ||
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HeavenResign
United States702 Posts
projectile slow, not root eggs same HP and infested terrans make it 3 supply instead of two. This wasn't an option but I think no neural on mothership. It's ridiculous that ultras can't be neuraled but mothership can. All of those things combined are pretty huge nerfs to be honest. All of those things combined should probably result in a buff somewhere. | ||
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MachinimaToasty
Canada27 Posts
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D4V3Z02
Germany693 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:22 JKM wrote: You're being silly. Don't be overdramatic about it. Looking at pure dps storm is better, but you can micro against storm why the full damage of a storm is never realized. In comparison fungal roots the enemy to the ground and is not hard to chain. Furthermore late game you got the combination of blords long range bombardement while locking units down to the ground. I don't understand people saying that zerg is too weak mid-game with infestors nerfed. Zerg has several strong timings they can use against both protoss and terran to wreck damage midgame and with hots coming in the foreseeable future zerg gets a fairly strong midgame blord. Furthermore, nerfing infestors might allow buffing hydras which I think everybody would like to see happen (outside of zerg nydus hydra allin vs protoss maybe becoming too strong). Didnt he say the same as you? (You need to change more than just the infestor when you change the infestor?) | ||
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TheDwf
France19747 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:23 nojok wrote: I'd like to see how a 3 supply infestor would change the game. It would reduce the power of infestors/bl lategame without being a massive nerf. I'd also like to see their size reduce a bit so they suffer more of EMP if they're clumped, which would also make the ghost better. Also make the ghost 150/150 or even 150/175 as terrans are more mineral starved than gas starved. No thanks. Mass Ghosts is the only tiny hope in TvP lategame, don't take it from us. | ||
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Belha
Italy2850 Posts
Is pretty annoying to see the impunity of the infestor ball roaming the map without any other unit supporting them (fungal with slow will allow that impunity too). TO THE OP: Please, please add a poll about if people prefer a huge balance change on infestor for hots, based on removing the "all around" status from them, but with a rework on other Z units, or a small balance change for WoL. Thanks! | ||
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JKM
Denmark419 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:32 D4V3Z02 wrote: Didnt he say the same as you? (You need to change more than just the infestor when you change the infestor?) It's in the wording, he downplays how powerful infestors are with poor comparisons to storm (that stuff terrans has learned to deal fairly well with snipe/EMP and micro) and 0 energy HTs. Furthermore he comes into this assuming that protoss and terran has to receive a big counternerf if the infestors are nerfed. I refer to hots providing new units that might fill the gap a infestor nerf might leave and suggest making hydras more useful midgame, perhaps with a pre-hive speedboost. | ||
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tMomiji
United States1115 Posts
Or just screw the whole thing and bring back PLAYGU as so many are suggesting. | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:23 nojok wrote: I'd like to see how a 3 supply infestor would change the game. It would reduce the power of infestors/bl lategame without being a massive nerf. I'd also like to see their size reduce a bit so they suffer more of EMP if they're clumped, which would also make the ghost better. Also make the ghost 150/150 or even 150/175 as terrans are more mineral starved than gas starved. That would be a flat out mech nerf, and ghosts function super well with mech. | ||
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PauseBreak
United States270 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:21 D4V3Z02 wrote: 200 supply ling bane muta cant even kill 200 supply bio mech, so what would happen to protoss deathball? You dont want to change fungal you want to remove zerg from the game. This is false and is an opinion. Please show us all facts on your statement. | ||
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CajunMan
United States823 Posts
On November 09 2012 02:45 PauseBreak wrote: This is false and is an opinion. Please show us all facts on your statement. No this is truth Muta ling bane past mid game is trash once marines are 3-3 and tanks 1 shot lings it is useless. | ||
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