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On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often.
I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league.
This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community.
I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes.
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About terran in HotS: Seriously, just give the terrans another new unit. It has to feel like an expantion, not a patch. Protoss and zerg are getting more units, so theres a reason for them to transfer to HotS, meanwhile terrans will stay in WoL or stop playing.
A new unit is needed for mech AA for instance. Much like the pre-beta warhound or the goliath. Thor just doesn't cut it.
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Why won't they just remove thor and introduce warhound as mini thor as it was originally planned. Thor is such boring unit with the most useless spell ever. Warhound would cost half of the thor and would have half the stats besides movements speed which would be increased a bit (siege tank speed).
That way it isnt allin unit that you can never retreat with.
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On November 08 2012 03:23 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often. I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league. This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community. I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes.
The rumor I heard doesn't contradict your view. By inhouse games I meant inhouse games within the balance / design team.
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On November 08 2012 03:30 Tomasy wrote:
Why won't they just remove thor and introduce warhound as mini thor as it was originally planned. Thor is such boring unit with the most useless spell ever. Warhound would cost half of the thor and would have half the stats besides movements speed which would be increased a bit (siege tank speed).
That way it isnt allin unit that you can never retreat with.
I would go on the same point.
Remove the Thor and put the Goliath and a balanced version of the Warhound into the game. The Goliath like in BW as the ground to air unit that specific hits large targets and the warhound as anti mech support unit. The Warhound should be a unit that you put into the mix to have a support unit against mechanical protoss/terran units but not as dominant as it was, that you mass it against everything. Then it would be ok to have some micro non-intensive units in the mix, if it's not possible to max out on them efficiantly.
This would help both mech and bio/mech compositions.
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On November 08 2012 03:35 TeeTS wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:30 Tomasy wrote:
Why won't they just remove thor and introduce warhound as mini thor as it was originally planned. Thor is such boring unit with the most useless spell ever. Warhound would cost half of the thor and would have half the stats besides movements speed which would be increased a bit (siege tank speed).
That way it isnt allin unit that you can never retreat with. I would go on the same point. Remove the Thor and put the Goliath and a balanced version of the Warhound into the game. The Goliath like in BW as the ground to air unit that specific hits large targets and the warhound as anti mech support unit. The Warhound should be a unit that you put into the mix to have a support unit against mechanical protoss/terran units but not as dominant as it was, that you mass it against everything. Then it would be ok to have some micro non-intensive units in the mix, if it's not possible to max out on them efficiantly. This would help both mech and bio/mech compositions.
I'd agree but make it the same cost and tech (or higher tech) as thor to give terran a good lategame unit....
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On November 08 2012 03:34 S_SienZ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:23 Plansix wrote:On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often. I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league. This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community. I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes. The rumor I heard doesn't contradict your view. By inhouse games I meant inhouse games within the balance / design team.
Your post does, however, imply that the DK’s and the balance team’s ability to play SC2 does how diminish their ability to understand the game, as it is in response to a post that says just that.
And, although my second statement is purely opinion, the first part of my post is factual information. People need to stop hiding behind the argument that they are better at SC2 than the Blizzard employees and therefore could design the game better. It is a terrible argument that falls apart the moment it is challenged.
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All that is left to do is protest, while still having fun: im gonna bitbybit every zerg from now on.
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On November 08 2012 03:47 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:34 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 03:23 Plansix wrote:On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often. I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league. This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community. I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes. The rumor I heard doesn't contradict your view. By inhouse games I meant inhouse games within the balance / design team. Your post does, however, imply that the DK’s and the balance team’s ability to play SC2 does how diminish their ability to understand the game, as it is in response to a post that says just that. And, although my second statement is purely opinion, the first part of my post is factual information. People need to stop hiding behind the argument that they are better at SC2 than the Blizzard employees and therefore could design the game better. It is a terrible argument that falls apart the moment it is challenged.
I agree. Luckily, Blizzard's approach to balance can be derided on the grounds that they've made some pretty awful decisions that have resulted in a stagnating metagame. Whether or not I can do better is irrelevant. I don't need to be able to design a spaceship to say that when one explodes at takeoff someone dropped the ball.
The metagame in PvZ and TvZ is frankly appalling, and their refusal to make immediate changes is disgusting, but only because they have shown in the past that they WILL make immediate changes to things they feel are a problem. Either their entire design philosophy has changed or they really think that the metagame is fine. And the latter point of view is just ridiculous.
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On November 08 2012 03:47 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:34 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 03:23 Plansix wrote:On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often. I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league. This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community. I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes. The rumor I heard doesn't contradict your view. By inhouse games I meant inhouse games within the balance / design team. Your post does, however, imply that the DK’s and the balance team’s ability to play SC2 does how diminish their ability to understand the game, as it is in response to a post that says just that. And, although my second statement is purely opinion, the first part of my post is factual information. People need to stop hiding behind the argument that they are better at SC2 than the Blizzard employees and therefore could design the game better. It is a terrible argument that falls apart the moment it is challenged.
Look at the very first post by Optik that started this chain of responses 
I'm implying that DK rarely "feels the pain" given who he usually plays with.
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On November 08 2012 03:34 S_SienZ wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:23 Plansix wrote:On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often. I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league. This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community. I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes. The rumor I heard doesn't contradict your view. By inhouse games I meant inhouse games within the balance / design team.
He used to be GM random on NA. At least in the first year or so of SC2. Last I heard or saw (I may have looked at his account; I can't remember) a couple of seasons ago he was random Master with not many games logged which is not surprising. With HotS in the works and his other roles, I don't think he'd have the time to log sufficient number of games on ladder. He used to be, and probably still is, a high level player - compared to most of the SC2 population, that is.
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They didn't say that at all -- infact, they're merely repeating what they said following the queen patch. They're going to give Terran ample opportunity to crack this metagame before resorting to the final and most extreme measure, which is patching the game.
They could change it next month for all you know, lol.
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Lol sorry for going slightly off topic, but how does Blizzard have a dev called Rock yet Browder gets all the heat for rocks? 
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On November 08 2012 07:19 S_SienZ wrote:Lol sorry for going slightly off topic, but how does Blizzard have a dev called Rock yet Browder gets all the heat for rocks?
Uh, that is browder
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On November 08 2012 07:19 S_SienZ wrote:Lol sorry for going slightly off topic, but how does Blizzard have a dev called Rock yet Browder gets all the heat for rocks?
That is Browder and he has had that for a while now. The man has a sense of humor.
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David Kim was a random Grand Masters player (or top 200 player in general) from 2010 to mid 2011.
He stopped playing SC2 (at least on his public account, dayvie#947) in mid 2011.
While he was still playing though, he was a Grand Masters on the NA server.
I'm not sure if he plays anymore (at least not on dayvie#947).
I wonder what he's been doing nowadays + I wonder if he only played on battle.net in his free time rather than has a part of his job.
On November 08 2012 07:19 S_SienZ wrote:Lol sorry for going slightly off topic, but how does Blizzard have a dev called Rock yet Browder gets all the heat for rocks?
Rock is Dustin Browder.
He's Dustin Browder by day. Rock by night.
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On November 08 2012 05:30 rd wrote:They didn't say that at all -- infact, they're merely repeating what they said following the queen patch.
That would mean waiting 2 months - so not exactly this year.
And the final effect would still be a suggested 10% raven speed buff that is retracted the moment MVP beats a zerg.
I doubt that's the answer people were hoping for.
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On November 08 2012 03:23 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2012 03:10 S_SienZ wrote:On November 08 2012 01:36 OpTiKDream wrote:
david kim seriously has to play terran at a competent level, not watch terrans. He has to feel the pain, not watch it. Maybe he only plays inhouse games? From what I heard Blizz's other employees suck so hard no one takes games of him often. I have not heard that. From my understanding, DK is reasonable at SC2, but like most people with full time jobs, does not have the time to invest always be in masters league. This should not be shocking to anyone. Most professional coaches, individual or team based, are lack even 10% the skill of the athletes they coach. The people writing the rules for any of the professional sports leagues are rarely, if ever, former or current professional athletes. People’s ability to understand the interworking and nuances of a specific subject is not, nor ever has been, directly related to their ability to perform said task. It is a poor, flawed, argument that the Blizzard staff is under qualified to balance SC2 because they are not better than the majority of the community. I said it before and I will say it again, Blizzard will not even talk about adjusting the balance of the game until after the Blizzard World Cup, which is 10 days away. People are getting exactly what they asked for a year ago, for Blizzard to be more involved, to patch with the consideration of tournaments and to wait before making balance changes.
FIrst of all David Kim is a former GM player. Prob midmaster or so right now.
Anyway, this is a commong myth. Unless you are the worlds smartest/analytical/logical person, you don't really understand the game properly unless you been in similar situations thousands of times. I've talked to al ot of players who think they understand the game because they listen to Artosis/day 9/"studies" the game etc... But in reality, they have a really superficial understanding of the game, and there are so many factors they do not think about because they have not been in the same situation in a real game.
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U don't understand why you cannot create your own name for games? Why can't the UI be like last time, simple and str8 forward. I find it too fanciful now, and nobody use it.
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EPT
