• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:03
CEST 18:03
KST 01:03
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence10Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch0Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups4WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments1SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia8Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues29
StarCraft 2
General
#1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Weekly Cups (Sept 8-14): herO & MaxPax split cups Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy SpeCial on The Tasteless Podcast Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
Soulkey on ASL S20 BW General Discussion ASL20 General Discussion ASL TICKET LIVE help! :D NaDa's Body
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group D [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL20] Ro16 Group C BSL 2025 Warsaw LAN + Legends Showmatch
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Borderlands 3 Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine UK Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
i'm really bored guys
Peanutsc
I <=> 9
KrillinFromwales
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 2034 users

Situation Report: August 31, 2012 by David Kim - Page 7

Forum Index > SC2 General
950 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 5 6 7 8 9 48 Next All
Plansix
Profile Blog Joined April 2011
United States60190 Posts
August 31 2012 17:16 GMT
#121
On September 01 2012 02:02 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 01:58 Plansix wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:54 Solarist wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:50 Plansix wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:44 Solarist wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:30 Plansix wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:27 TheDwf wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:24 TechNoTrance wrote:
People whine when blizz makes changes too quickly without enough testing. People whine when blizz is patient and careful about making changes with a fair amount of testing.

Standard.

People complain when Blizzard makes stupid and unnecessary changes to a good match-up. People complain when Blizzard refuses to adress the various problems created by said changes.

Fixed.


I dont agree with the TvZ was a great match up prior to the +2 queen range. I have a problem with a opening that was used on every map, every time. The only question was, "how many hellions will they build". But I guess it was nice for terrans to only have to know one build for the whole match up.


An opener that works on every map, every time? Are you talking about the 6 queen opener or what?

I hope you realise how hilariously ironic everything you just said is


But that ended pretty quickly. Now we see 4 queen builds with earlier pools coming back into style(MLG had tons of this) and we will see other styles come out as well.


Is the 6 queen opener not a stable build that can be used in every single map? Yes or no?
If you wanna use the arguement just presented then Terran used other strategies aswell, sometimes it was cloak banshee, 2 rax and other early game stuff. But i guess we shoudent use that argument, because it makes your posting fall apart even more Moving on!



From my understanding, the 6 queen opening has no ability to punish a terran if he is greedy

Fortunately enough Zergs do not need to punish Terran greed because they can rush Hive and get their ultimate armies way faster than Terrans can.


It don’t think that is how it works. Maybe in your games where you cannot handle getting a such a robust terran economy so quickly.
I have the Honor to be your Obedient Servant, P.6
TL+ Member
Zarahtra
Profile Joined May 2010
Iceland4053 Posts
August 31 2012 17:17 GMT
#122
On September 01 2012 02:13 hunts wrote:
So blizzard finally does what so many people wanted: gives the meta game a chance to settle down, gives the pros a chance to figure things out, and everyone throws a fit? It really feels like no matter what blizzard does they can't please everyone, and the displeased whiners will always be the loudest.

I'd have appreciated if they had done that prior to a horrible patch that really needs addressing(or reverting). And personally I am quite concerned that the reason they are holding their hands is that a few players(one of them playing against worse players) are doing really well while everyone else isn't.
Chaggi
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)1936 Posts
August 31 2012 17:18 GMT
#123
Cool. When it was a zerg buff, it took them a few days to put it in (completely screwing up the meta game) and took 2-3 months for them to even respond that there was possibly a problem.

When MVP/Taeja does well at like 1-2 tournaments, against inferior players on a specific map, they pull back all plans and say "let the metagame develop"

I don't even care about the buffs. I just want to be treated fairly. This is so stupid.
Swords
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
6038 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-31 17:18:44
August 31 2012 17:18 GMT
#124
On September 01 2012 02:13 hunts wrote:
So blizzard finally does what so many people wanted: gives the meta game a chance to settle down, gives the pros a chance to figure things out, and everyone throws a fit? It really feels like no matter what blizzard does they can't please everyone, and the displeased whiners will always be the loudest.

I think, to some extent, people are angry it took them this long to figure out waiting for the meta to adjust is the right thing to do. Honestly, the anger here seems to be more residual anger about the weirdness of a Zerg buff when TvZ was almost a perfectly balanced matchup.
Denzil
Profile Joined August 2010
United Kingdom4193 Posts
August 31 2012 17:19 GMT
#125
On September 01 2012 02:18 Chaggi wrote:
Cool. When it was a zerg buff, it took them a few days to put it in (completely screwing up the meta game) and took 2-3 months for them to even respond that there was possibly a problem.

When MVP/Taeja does well at like 1-2 tournaments, against inferior players on a specific map, they pull back all plans and say "let the metagame develop"

I don't even care about the buffs. I just want to be treated fairly. This is so stupid.


you dont get to be treated fairly when you've had preferable treatment for the best part of 2 years
Anna: So Sen how will you prepare for your revenge v MC? Sen: With a smile.
Chaggi
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)1936 Posts
August 31 2012 17:20 GMT
#126
On September 01 2012 02:18 Swords wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 02:13 hunts wrote:
So blizzard finally does what so many people wanted: gives the meta game a chance to settle down, gives the pros a chance to figure things out, and everyone throws a fit? It really feels like no matter what blizzard does they can't please everyone, and the displeased whiners will always be the loudest.

I think, to some extent, people are angry it took them this long to figure out waiting for the meta to adjust is the right thing to do. Honestly, the anger here seems to be more residual anger about the weirdness of a Zerg buff when TvZ was almost a perfectly balanced matchup.


I'm angry that it's instant reaction terran nerf while they go for a wait and see approach with zergs.
Sroobz
Profile Joined December 2011
United States1377 Posts
August 31 2012 17:20 GMT
#127
How come they never talked about DRG NEVER HAVING ANY PROBLEMS WITH HELLIONS PRE-PATCH? They reference Mvp for the ravens...fucking blizzard. Such a joke
Flash---Taeja---Mvp---Byun---DRG
DOUDOU
Profile Joined October 2011
Wales2940 Posts
August 31 2012 17:21 GMT
#128
just make creep recede as fast as it spreads, that's it
Feast | Grubby | Mvp | Polt | Fantasy | Last | MMA | forGG | Leenock | Soberphano | Scarlett cutiepie
Tayar
Profile Joined November 2011
United States1439 Posts
August 31 2012 17:21 GMT
#129
blizzard should always try and error on the side of making no changes and letting pros adjust/adapt/improve. I wholeheartedly agree with this decision.
nottapro
Profile Joined August 2012
202 Posts
August 31 2012 17:22 GMT
#130
I hate the raven as a terran. If you have it selected while you have your army marine/marauders selected and you try to stim, nothing happens. Its extremely frustrating. Just patching that would be hugely beneficial.
Frex
Profile Joined March 2012
Finland888 Posts
August 31 2012 17:22 GMT
#131
On September 01 2012 02:13 Denzil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 01:13 c0ldfusion wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:07 winthrop wrote:
lol. why dont give zerg players time to show full potential.
also did you notice the wcs race distribution?


You mean WCS Korea? That's mostly P though, unrelated to ZvT balance.


it's ok Terrans in Code S are almost back to their prime, soon the days of GomTvT will return


It's actually EXACTLY same race distribution as last season and I didn't see terrans domination.
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
August 31 2012 17:23 GMT
#132
On September 01 2012 02:16 Plansix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 02:02 TheDwf wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:58 Plansix wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:54 Solarist wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:50 Plansix wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:44 Solarist wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:30 Plansix wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:27 TheDwf wrote:
On September 01 2012 01:24 TechNoTrance wrote:
People whine when blizz makes changes too quickly without enough testing. People whine when blizz is patient and careful about making changes with a fair amount of testing.

Standard.

People complain when Blizzard makes stupid and unnecessary changes to a good match-up. People complain when Blizzard refuses to adress the various problems created by said changes.

Fixed.


I dont agree with the TvZ was a great match up prior to the +2 queen range. I have a problem with a opening that was used on every map, every time. The only question was, "how many hellions will they build". But I guess it was nice for terrans to only have to know one build for the whole match up.


An opener that works on every map, every time? Are you talking about the 6 queen opener or what?

I hope you realise how hilariously ironic everything you just said is


But that ended pretty quickly. Now we see 4 queen builds with earlier pools coming back into style(MLG had tons of this) and we will see other styles come out as well.


Is the 6 queen opener not a stable build that can be used in every single map? Yes or no?
If you wanna use the arguement just presented then Terran used other strategies aswell, sometimes it was cloak banshee, 2 rax and other early game stuff. But i guess we shoudent use that argument, because it makes your posting fall apart even more Moving on!



From my understanding, the 6 queen opening has no ability to punish a terran if he is greedy

Fortunately enough Zergs do not need to punish Terran greed because they can rush Hive and get their ultimate armies way faster than Terrans can.


It don’t think that is how it works. Maybe in your games where you cannot handle getting a such a robust terran economy so quickly.

Of course it is the way it works, in an even game Zergs can get BLs/Corruptors/Infestors before Terrans (or Protoss for that matter) can get their own ultimate compositions. Both Terrans and Protoss have to stall to reach said compositions.
Treehead
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
999 Posts
August 31 2012 17:23 GMT
#133
On September 01 2012 02:13 hunts wrote:
So blizzard finally does what so many people wanted: gives the meta game a chance to settle down, gives the pros a chance to figure things out, and everyone throws a fit? It really feels like no matter what blizzard does they can't please everyone, and the displeased whiners will always be the loudest.


Some people actually believe this - they probably are not posting because they're content to read the OP.

Some people actually only wanted this when it's good for their race. They're the people you're hearing the screaming from. It isn't that people just want to be angry, it's that it's different people who are angry - and that people who are happy have no real impetus to go post 27 times on a forum about how happy they are.
Chaggi
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)1936 Posts
August 31 2012 17:23 GMT
#134
On September 01 2012 02:19 Denzil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 02:18 Chaggi wrote:
Cool. When it was a zerg buff, it took them a few days to put it in (completely screwing up the meta game) and took 2-3 months for them to even respond that there was possibly a problem.

When MVP/Taeja does well at like 1-2 tournaments, against inferior players on a specific map, they pull back all plans and say "let the metagame develop"

I don't even care about the buffs. I just want to be treated fairly. This is so stupid.


you dont get to be treated fairly when you've had preferable treatment for the best part of 2 years


A swing and a miss. I feel bad that you actually don't understand. (and please, list the preferable treatment for the "better part of 2 years"). Do you mean the Thor nerf after 1 tournament? Or the Blue Flame Hellions after the MLG? Of course, it was apparently decided by Blizzard that the meta was already figured out and it was gonna be OP. Oh and it doesn't matter if Terran used to be strong, Blizzard has a duty to make a balanced game and they don't apply the same balance methods to different races.

Cool.
KrazyTrumpet
Profile Joined April 2010
United States2520 Posts
August 31 2012 17:23 GMT
#135
On September 01 2012 02:22 nottapro wrote:
I hate the raven as a terran. If you have it selected while you have your army marine/marauders selected and you try to stim, nothing happens. Its extremely frustrating. Just patching that would be hugely beneficial.


This isn't even a legit complaint...control groups completely avoid this problem.

Raven does need help, though.
www.twitch.tv/krazy Best Stream Quality NA @KClarkSC2
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
August 31 2012 17:24 GMT
#136
On September 01 2012 02:22 nottapro wrote:
I hate the raven as a terran. If you have it selected while you have your army marine/marauders selected and you try to stim, nothing happens. Its extremely frustrating. Just patching that would be hugely beneficial.

The Tab button wants some words with you.
Chaggi
Profile Joined August 2010
Korea (South)1936 Posts
August 31 2012 17:25 GMT
#137
On September 01 2012 02:20 Sroobz wrote:
How come they never talked about DRG NEVER HAVING ANY PROBLEMS WITH HELLIONS PRE-PATCH? They reference Mvp for the ravens...fucking blizzard. Such a joke


No zerg pro ever had problems with hellions. They were stupidly easy to defend against and while yes, it did force zerg to do a specific early game to defend or die, it's not like it's any different now (6 queen opening anyone?)
DidYuhim
Profile Joined September 2011
Ukraine1905 Posts
August 31 2012 17:25 GMT
#138
Yet another useless statement from Blizzard staff.

Really hope someone will wake up and fire those clowns who call themselves "Starcraft 2 game design team".
TheDwf
Profile Joined November 2011
France19747 Posts
August 31 2012 17:25 GMT
#139
On September 01 2012 02:19 Denzil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 02:18 Chaggi wrote:
Cool. When it was a zerg buff, it took them a few days to put it in (completely screwing up the meta game) and took 2-3 months for them to even respond that there was possibly a problem.

When MVP/Taeja does well at like 1-2 tournaments, against inferior players on a specific map, they pull back all plans and say "let the metagame develop"

I don't even care about the buffs. I just want to be treated fairly. This is so stupid.


you dont get to be treated fairly when you've had preferable treatment for the best part of 2 years

So Terran players should be punished now because Blizzard failed at the beginning of the game? Nice mentality.
rembrant
Profile Joined July 2012
62 Posts
August 31 2012 17:28 GMT
#140
On September 01 2012 02:16 TheDwf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 01 2012 02:13 hunts wrote:
So blizzard finally does what so many people wanted: gives the meta game a chance to settle down, gives the pros a chance to figure things out, and everyone throws a fit? It really feels like no matter what blizzard does they can't please everyone, and the displeased whiners will always be the loudest.

Love how you dismiss the part about how they should have done this way earlier, and not post-Queen buff.

So basically ur ok with what blizz is doing but ur upset it follows a buff to a race you don't play, well that's nice. :-)
Prev 1 5 6 7 8 9 48 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 17h 57m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
SpeCial 138
mcanning 121
ProTech78
JuggernautJason54
Codebar 3
UpATreeSC 2
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 34387
Bisu 3340
Horang2 3189
EffOrt 863
Light 496
Mini 479
Hyuk 436
ZerO 423
Soulkey 225
actioN 211
[ Show more ]
Soma 151
hero 143
Rush 127
Snow 100
ggaemo 87
Hyun 74
Mind 60
Sea.KH 51
Aegong 43
Free 36
PianO 33
sorry 28
ToSsGirL 28
Terrorterran 27
JYJ22
Yoon 21
scan(afreeca) 16
IntoTheRainbow 12
Sexy 11
HiyA 9
Dota 2
Gorgc7050
qojqva3030
Dendi1263
Fuzer 252
XcaliburYe179
League of Legends
Trikslyr47
Counter-Strike
ScreaM837
markeloff160
oskar156
Other Games
gofns25583
tarik_tv20967
B2W.Neo799
FrodaN453
Mlord424
Lowko380
Hui .347
RotterdaM235
byalli222
ArmadaUGS117
QueenE78
NeuroSwarm40
ZerO(Twitch)18
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• poizon28 14
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Migwel
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
StarCraft: Brood War
• FirePhoenix9
• Michael_bg 8
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV359
League of Legends
• Nemesis5426
• TFBlade423
Other Games
• Shiphtur221
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
17h 57m
Zoun vs Classic
Map Test Tournament
18h 57m
Korean StarCraft League
1d 10h
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
1d 15h
RSL Revival
1d 17h
Reynor vs Cure
BSL Open LAN 2025 - War…
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Online Event
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
[ Show More ]
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
LiuLi Cup
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-09-10
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL World Championship of Poland 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.