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On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army.
I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs.
I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts)..
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On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts)..
Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic.
Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad
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On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad
I don't want my whole army and game lost because of it, yes. In that same logic, if I hit all my emps, I don't want the toss game to be over either. Those split seconds determining the outcome of a whole game, isn't good or in fact fun gameplay.
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On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad
Edit: I was going to be a smart ass and comment on your post but I decided that it's already been clearly said and shown that there is something wrong in this match up. With all the evidence there is out there anyone must be lacking in understanding, concept or intelligence to not see it.
Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt.
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High Master / GM MMR on Europe here (currently 1122 points, no bonus pool left). Statistics from my 151 games this season:
64 Protoss = 42,4%
56 Zergs = 37,1%
31 Terrans = 20,5%
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On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Edit: I was going to be a smart ass and comment on your post but I decided that it's already been clearly said and shown that there is something wrong in this match up. With all the evidence there is out there anyone must be lacking in understanding, concept or intelligence to not see it. Enjoy your day.
Good point, there does seem to be a larger group of people that do have a lack of understanding, concept or intelligence to be to understand what is going on in the match up. I hope they have a good day as well and can get over their mental blocks with the match up.
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On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt.
Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can.
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On March 21 2012 10:14 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt. Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can.
I don't know if you've actually been reading my posts. I'm a random player.
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Played Protoss for a year, switched to terran for 5 months -> went back to playing one game as Protoss on ladder, got a Terran and without even trying just a-moved my way to victory. My macro was crap, my micro was nonexistent (I hadn't played the race in months) yet here I am beating a supposedly equally skilled Terran as me ez as fk in TvP. Protoss is too damn easy to play.
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On March 21 2012 09:38 OpticalPhonon wrote:![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/4u7dv.jpg)
Goody probably got enough of being the better mechanical player and having sick APM and multitasking just to lose to Protoss  (
Sad day.
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On March 21 2012 10:22 ZenithM wrote:Goody probably got enough of being the better mechanical player and having sick APM and multitasking just to lose to Protoss ( Sad day.
When I play terran I imagine i'm flying a fighter plane in a intensive one on one combat where every move could blow me out of the sky in a fiery blaze and destroy life as we know it.
When I play protoss I imagine a little tonka car going into a wall back and forth.
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On March 21 2012 10:17 Yosho wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:14 Plansix wrote:On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt. Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can. I don't know if you've actually been reading my posts. I'm a random player.
I have read your posts and I am fully aware that you are random, your rank and your feelings on the match up. I posted a response that felt was appropriate to the over all quality of your recent post and your treatment of most protoss players. I am surprised you expected some sort of rational, logical response attempting to argue with you. There is no arguing with a post like that. It is 100% flame bait.
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Storm damage is fine. It requires some semblance of micro generally and is stoppable.
Remove Colossi and make Carriers Micro-able. That is my vote.
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On March 21 2012 10:25 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:17 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 10:14 Plansix wrote:On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt. Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can. I don't know if you've actually been reading my posts. I'm a random player. I have read your posts and I am fully aware that you are random, your rank and your feelings on the match up. I posted a response that felt was appropriate to the over all quality of your recent post and your treatment of most protoss players. I am surprised you expected some sort of rational, logical response attempting to argue with you. There is no arguing with a post like that. It is 100% flame bait.
Edit: Ah nvm, why do I feel like I'm always trying to explain star craft 2 to bronze players when I post here >.<
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On March 21 2012 10:25 Yosho wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:22 ZenithM wrote:On March 21 2012 09:38 OpticalPhonon wrote: Goody probably got enough of being the better mechanical player and having sick APM and multitasking just to lose to Protoss ( Sad day. When I play terran I imagine i'm flying a fighter plane in a intensive one on one combat where every move could blow me out of the sky in a fiery blaze and destroy life as we know it. When I play protoss I imagine a little tonka car going into a wall back and forth.
But it's much cooler and manlier to drive the frickin' fighter plane.
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On March 21 2012 10:41 ZenithM wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:25 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 10:22 ZenithM wrote:On March 21 2012 09:38 OpticalPhonon wrote: Goody probably got enough of being the better mechanical player and having sick APM and multitasking just to lose to Protoss ( Sad day. When I play terran I imagine i'm flying a fighter plane in a intensive one on one combat where every move could blow me out of the sky in a fiery blaze and destroy life as we know it. When I play protoss I imagine a little tonka car going into a wall back and forth. But it's much cooler and manlier to drive the frickin' fighter plane.
Terran the manly race! REAL MEN PLAY TERRAN!
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On March 21 2012 10:17 Yosho wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:14 Plansix wrote:On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt. Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can. I don't know if you've actually been reading my posts. I'm a random player.
I don't think he's been reading any posts..
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On March 21 2012 10:46 SupLilSon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:17 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 10:14 Plansix wrote:On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt. Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can. I don't know if you've actually been reading my posts. I'm a random player. I don't think he's been reading any posts..
I don't think you do either. Every argument I brought to you you simply wrote off as bullshit. "PROTOSS OP" without even trying.
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On March 21 2012 10:48 Type|NarutO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 10:46 SupLilSon wrote:On March 21 2012 10:17 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 10:14 Plansix wrote:On March 21 2012 10:00 Yosho wrote:On March 21 2012 09:52 NeMeSiS3 wrote:On March 21 2012 09:46 Zarahtra wrote:On March 21 2012 08:14 Gimix wrote:On March 21 2012 07:41 Scila wrote:
The game is in a pretty poor state of balance right now, and it surprises me that so many people think that just because there's roughly 50% win ratios in every match up, everything is fine. They don't look at the fact that different races have DRASTICALLY different win % at different stages of the game, and that there are glaring problems with almost every race.
Terran has a high win ratio against zerg in the early and mid game, while in the late game the win % falls off dramatically. Terran has NO answer to Broodlord/infestor and even worse, no answer to switching between Blord/ Ultra. Even with pre-nerf ghosts, it was very difficult to deal with Infestor/T3 unless you had amazing army control like Thorzain.
Similarly in TvP, Terran has the upper hand in the mid game, but terran win ratios fall off dramatically in the late game (past 15 mins or so). Terran has NO answer to Colossus/HT/gateway deathball. Unless you have godly micro (like Korean Terrans) to come out SIGNIFICANTLY ahead after a 200/200 fight, you will probably lose. Even the Koreans are having trouble doing this now.
Then there's the fact that Terran HAS TO be played aggressive/harass-oriented versus P and Z, where as P and Z can play aggressive OR passive, which is a massive design flaw.
Furthermore, for Protoss, the only way to deal with Blord/Infestor is a gimmick that was never intended by Blizzard. Imagine if there was no Vortex...Protoss would be in the same boat as Terran is right now as soon as they reached the late game versus Zerg.
Protoss is also currently being rewarded for a very passive style of play in both matchups, but more so PvT, where they can quite safely get to 3/3 upgrades and a strong deathball.
With Zerg, the biggest issue imo is the power of Infestor/Broodlord as mentioned above, which is problematic in both TvZ and PvZ.
What Blizzard has been doing for the past few months with their "balance" patches is cover up the actual core problems and tweak things that give them those nice 50% numbers that people like. I still love to watch this game played at the highest level, but these glaring problems made it difficult to enjoy. This sums up everything pretty well. The game is very unbalanced, but everything has become so normal we don't notice it anymore. That said, a large number of problems could be fixed with 2 very simple implementations 1. Fungal should not be a snare AND do massive damage. One or the either. Given how the snare combos well with other zerg abilites I feel that should be kept and the damage greatly reduced. 2. Storm damage needs to be decreased. This is the primary problem in TvP. Essentially, a game long advantage is lost in 2 seconds because you failed to emp one of your opponents HTs. That this is even possible means TvP is essentially a pointless matchup until one final engagement.Warpin is also a fairly broken mechanic in conjuction with warp prisms. Unlike any other race's dropping mechanic, the Protoss does not need to 'sacrifice' his standing army for the potential to drop. All he needs to do is GET THE WARPPRISM INTO YOUR BASE. That's it. If this happens lategame TvP as you engage the main protoss army you lose. End of story. There is no answer to 30 zealots warping instantly into your production line even if you decimate the protoss army. I'm a terran. While I agree with both the guy you quote aswell as most of what you said, the bolded part can be turned around. If you can get all the HTs emped, the toss is screwed, which is just as stupid imo. The ghost/ht war is imo to unforgiving, bio melts to much against storms and toss melts to much without aoe/ffs. I just wish toss and zerg was more microable, because no matter how hard terran has it now, if terran keeps being so much more microable(and with it, rewards skill increase more), korean terrans will just keep getting better and better, resulting in more nerfs for the terran race, to balance the top(by this I don't mean that korean zerg and toss players are worse, just that they can't utilize their apm/micro and push themselves to the same extend as their terran counterparts).. Wait wait... You failed an emp, so instead of you being faulted for the mistake, you want the storm to be nerfed? Geeze, I can't say I agree with that kind of logic. Edit: For the spoilered quote my bad Terran pro's are switching races, Protoss dominating terrans in most recent tournaments, Win ratios dropping dramatically the further the game goes on. Terran the least represented and most APM / Micro / Multi tasking intensive race. Look at my previous posts, look at the pro terrans posts. Look at the guy under me.. JUST look. You will see that the majority of the time when you reach that sweet death ball you can count your free win and mark it as "skill" under your belt. Its a master plan by Blizzard to make all terrans switch to D3. Blizzard needs to boost those numbers somehow and terrans are the way they are going to do it. Once there are no Pro terrans to look up too and no hope, that is when they release Heart of the Swarm, filled with terran buffs to pull them right back in. Its good you are seeing this now and getting out while you can. I don't know if you've actually been reading my posts. I'm a random player. I don't think he's been reading any posts.. I don't think you do either. Every argument I brought to you you simply wrote off as bullshit. "PROTOSS OP" without even trying.
PROTOSS OP!
but that's ok because Manly Terran players will always find a way.
After all Courage is more OP than anything and everything
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