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Criticism is allowed. Undue flaming is not. Take a second to think your post through before you submit.
Bans will be handed out.
Should go without saying, but don't link restreams here either. |
On February 14 2012 09:42 turamn wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:40 Boblhead wrote:On February 14 2012 09:36 leecH wrote:http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/legal/videopolicy.htmlLimitation of Usage
Neither you nor the operator of any website where your Production(s) may be viewed can force a viewer to pay a "fee" to be able to view your Production(s).
Regarding Websites and "Premium Access"
We understand that many third party websites have a "free" method to see their video content, as well as a 'premium' membership service that allows for speedier viewing.
For clarity, please note that as long as the website that hosts your Production provides a free method to allow viewers to see the Production, Blizzard Entertainment will not object to your Production being hosted on that site, regardless of the site's "for pay" premium service plans. so MLG pays Blizzard a fee so they can do this? Can someone explain please? ;/ THIS, will MLG will be violating Blizzards terms, which will most likely cause a lawsuit against MLG. That being said MLG has to offer a free stream. It only worked with GOM because GOM has an official Broadcasting contract, so Arena of Legends was legit, because they have a contract with blizzard. I doubt it, since the VODs are going to be provided, albeit a week later. I imagine if that policy didn't exist, there would be zero chance there would be free vods at all. GSL can get around this by offering free low quality stream and then charging for VODS
I would also expect that MLG has an agreement with Blizzard on this sort of thing, similar to the prize pool threshold of tournaments where if you have X prize pool you must contact and get Blizzards permission to advertise and host said event.
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InB4 sundance makes some passive aggressive comment about e-sports fans ungratefulness due to our unwillingness to shell out 20 dollars and how MLG is doing this for esports and started out with nothing. I payed 20$ for an mlg SEASON pass 6 years ago. I know how all this goes.
Take it from me. Do not buy this product and the quality of service will be forced to improve to survive.
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On February 14 2012 09:43 gds wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:40 neurosx wrote:
20$ to watch crowd shots 80% of the downtime ( between ads ) ? No thankss There's no crowd this time, no live audience.
$20 to watch 80% of nothing plus ads! or shitty rock music!
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I'm not against paying for sutff, but the way the deal is made is not worth it, i mean for that amount you could get 2season of gsl.
Also, a"20 hour limit" would be scaring me, i mean i watch A LOT of starcraft, i don't want to "save up" my hours of watching to not run out of time to see the finals... this is a badly taught system.
I love mlg, and would support them with some kind of passes, but this, no
Try again.
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On February 14 2012 09:38 casualman wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:35 magnaflow wrote:
We need LoL numbers. Move over SC2, you're gonna be replaced as the main event in 2013. Losing players, losing viewers, Blizzard failed Sorry to say, but LoL will fail even harder than starcraft 2. Esports can't survive off of advertisements unless millions of people are watching; conventional sports can attain this number, but not even if all of the LoL players in the United States tuned in will they be able to actually get those numbers. Because LoL is F2P it's going to be even harder if nigh impossible to monetize >95% of the fanbase, meaning it is absolutely not viable as a monetizable esport.
That's just plainly wrong. LoL tournaments will always be subsidized by Riot because they want people to see the game, follow it passionately and stay playing. They work like a pay per month MMO except people don't pay a regular fee but instead see incentive to pay for extras in their F2P game. Saw a cool skin during a tournament? Go buy it instantly with 2 clicks (one of the few advantages of running everything on Adobe Air lol). Keep playing for 2 extra months? 4 new champions released, guess how much the RP required to buy them cost.
Blizzard should do this but I say that in every thread...
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I was going to prefer Assembly over MLG anyway (because some of my favourite players are there), and this just makes my decision much easier 
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On February 14 2012 09:33 SonOfBoxer wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:30 jinixxx123 wrote:On February 14 2012 09:27 SonOfBoxer wrote:
Well, I think I've said it before, but I'll say it again anyhow: personally, I can't find sense in paying for any tournament that isn't the GSL. Some people like to say "if you don't support them, you're killing e-sports!", but Chill himself had the perfect answer for those guys: "If you show your support by paying, you'll create a bubble" (something like that).
You see, the GSL is the best tournament in the world not because of some specific format or something like that, but because it has the best players in the world. Like one of our favorite TL Writers once wrote: "There's no such thing as hidden gosus anymore", and he is right. Nowadays, if you're good, everybody knows about you. So, why should I spend a relatively high amount of cash to see a minor tournament? Or worse: a pre-tournament?
GOM charges 20 bucks for 2 straight months of pure awesomeness, whereas foreign companies want to charge almost (or more than) that for a weekend worth of low-level games (when compared to the GSL). So, really, it makes no sense paying to watch anything but the GSL so far, unless you have cash to burn. dude cut the bullshit, very high code S players are playing in this tournament. as i said in this thread, say the fee is to much or you are not paying , dont come here with such bullshit reasons. Evidently, you are one of those who has cash to burn. And don't be so mad at me because I actually value my money. Cry all you want, but the fact remains this is a low level tournament, and that they want to charge "just 20 bucks for 20 hours of streaming" whereas I can pay 20 bucks for 2 months of the best streaming in the world. So, yeah, keep the rage coming baby cake.
LOL, low level tournament? they have some of the top players in the scene and a 26k prize pool. But yes, other tournaments are cheaper than this arena will be, however, are those other tournaments actually making money? I have no idea (other than IPL, which is losing money), but the fact that MLG isn't currently making money with all of their viewers, I would assume these other tournaments are also losing money. MLG is trying to bring money into the scene with a quality product and actually make money and really grow the scene.
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Even though $20 seems fair to a weekend long tournament with 20+ hours of entertainment mlg staff seem to forget that many ppl like myself can't spend an entire weekend watching starcraft if i get to watch 6 hours during a weekend thats already a lot. I know i would have vods and all that but watching non live sports or e-sports doesn't really work for me, also i hate having to do my usual "internet zapping" with the preoccupation of avoiding spoilers. This is why i won't buy the pass.
Overall i think this is a very bad decision and i really can't see this working out well for mlg.
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I think i would pay 10 dollars but not 20 dollars. 20 dollars is a very steep price for only a 3 day tournament
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Goodbye MLG. It was a decent run last year after a few terrible tournaments.
Not much else to say... disappointing.
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On February 14 2012 09:41 Klonere wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:40 Boblhead wrote:On February 14 2012 09:36 leecH wrote:http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/legal/videopolicy.htmlLimitation of Usage
Neither you nor the operator of any website where your Production(s) may be viewed can force a viewer to pay a "fee" to be able to view your Production(s).
Regarding Websites and "Premium Access"
We understand that many third party websites have a "free" method to see their video content, as well as a 'premium' membership service that allows for speedier viewing.
For clarity, please note that as long as the website that hosts your Production provides a free method to allow viewers to see the Production, Blizzard Entertainment will not object to your Production being hosted on that site, regardless of the site's "for pay" premium service plans. so MLG pays Blizzard a fee so they can do this? Can someone explain please? ;/ THIS, will MLG will be violating Blizzards terms, which will most likely cause a lawsuit against MLG. That being said MLG has to offer a free stream. Why didn't Blizzard take action against GOM re: the AOL, which was PPV only? Its because they work it out with Blizzard to get exceptions.
but this does not make any sense. why would blizzerd put up those rules if they make exceptions for the only ones who actually could violate it.
i dont get it.
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On February 14 2012 09:37 OldManZerg wrote:For anyone on the fence, I highly encourage you to check out their demo of the site they'll be using. It has a really cool quad-stream format that you can configure in many different ways. It's even better than what they had for Providence. http://www.majorleaguegaming.com/live/demoSounds like I might be in the minority, but I think this is a good move by MLG. $20 for flying in the best they could find, throwing them into a pit together, and delivering all of it with a slick stream interface seems like a deal to me.
Wow cool, they could've saved the money they put into this and just thought of a better tournament format that broadcasts all games(like only 16 players, or single elimination which would fit much better to the "Arena" name, you don't get a second chance if you fail in a arena.) because you can only focus on one stream anyway :p
Bigger isn't always better.
Still haven't decided if I want to pay, but comparing MLG to other offers(football in Germany for example, or GSL) and considering that Assembly has Kas and Stephano I don't think I will.
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Should have kept the first arena free, to at least show us what we're buying. Couple with the assembly competition will make this a hard sell. I will probably still buy it though, I really like the MLG brand, casters and the players attending.
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$1 for hour of watching is a bit pricey. I will not be paying this time around. My money is better spent with GOMTV. MLG you are becoming worse and worse...
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On February 14 2012 09:44 Clank wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:33 SonOfBoxer wrote:On February 14 2012 09:30 jinixxx123 wrote:On February 14 2012 09:27 SonOfBoxer wrote:
Well, I think I've said it before, but I'll say it again anyhow: personally, I can't find sense in paying for any tournament that isn't the GSL. Some people like to say "if you don't support them, you're killing e-sports!", but Chill himself had the perfect answer for those guys: "If you show your support by paying, you'll create a bubble" (something like that).
You see, the GSL is the best tournament in the world not because of some specific format or something like that, but because it has the best players in the world. Like one of our favorite TL Writers once wrote: "There's no such thing as hidden gosus anymore", and he is right. Nowadays, if you're good, everybody knows about you. So, why should I spend a relatively high amount of cash to see a minor tournament? Or worse: a pre-tournament?
GOM charges 20 bucks for 2 straight months of pure awesomeness, whereas foreign companies want to charge almost (or more than) that for a weekend worth of low-level games (when compared to the GSL). So, really, it makes no sense paying to watch anything but the GSL so far, unless you have cash to burn. dude cut the bullshit, very high code S players are playing in this tournament. as i said in this thread, say the fee is to much or you are not paying , dont come here with such bullshit reasons. Evidently, you are one of those who has cash to burn. And don't be so mad at me because I actually value my money. Cry all you want, but the fact remains this is a low level tournament, and that they want to charge "just 20 bucks for 20 hours of streaming" whereas I can pay 20 bucks for 2 months of the best streaming in the world. So, yeah, keep the rage coming baby cake. LOL, low level tournament? they have some of the top players in the scene and a 26k prize pool. But yes, other tournaments are cheaper than this arena will be, however, are those other tournaments actually making money? I have no idea (other than IPL, which is losing money), but the fact that MLG isn't currently making money with all of their viewers, I would assume these other tournaments are also losing money. MLG is trying to bring money into the scene with a quality product and actually make money and really grow the scene.
To my knowledge most of the remaining big LAN events like Assembly and Dreamhack break even overall.
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On February 14 2012 09:44 Timerly wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:38 casualman wrote:On February 14 2012 09:35 magnaflow wrote:
We need LoL numbers. Move over SC2, you're gonna be replaced as the main event in 2013. Losing players, losing viewers, Blizzard failed Sorry to say, but LoL will fail even harder than starcraft 2. Esports can't survive off of advertisements unless millions of people are watching; conventional sports can attain this number, but not even if all of the LoL players in the United States tuned in will they be able to actually get those numbers. Because LoL is F2P it's going to be even harder if nigh impossible to monetize >95% of the fanbase, meaning it is absolutely not viable as a monetizable esport. That's just plainly wrong. LoL tournaments will always be subsidized by Riot because they want people to see the game, follow it passionately and stay playing. They work like a pay per month MMO except people don't pay a regular fee but instead see incentive to pay for extras in their F2P game. Saw a cool skin during a tournament? Go buy it instantly with 2 clicks (one of the few advantages of running everything on Adobe Air lol). Keep playing for 2 extra months? 4 new champions released, guess how much the RP required to buy them cost. Blizzard should do this but I say that in every thread...
Riot subsidizing every tournament with million dollar prizepools isn't the best idea. At least, it definitely won't generate any new players into the scene, purely based off of the moba format, which is incredibly boring to watch. Playing is another thing, but watching LoL is not going to lure anyone into the game. I've played nearly 1000 games of LoL, and I can tell you it's dead last in terms of viewer entertainment.
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On February 14 2012 08:27 R1CH wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 08:20 Volrath wrote:
Thing is, 20$ is ALOT by e-sports standards for a 3 day event. Even GSL is cheaper and has waaay more content. You have to set your prices to match your market, which MLG isn't. Especially with another big event going on at the same time. This is borderline stupid to be honest. It does not matter that UFC or some other well established sport is 5 times more expensive, this is irrelevant for e-sports. The e-sports scene is not there yet and they will likely loose alot in ad revenue, much more than they will add with this new cash flow. You have to remember that GSL has no costs other than the production / stream. MLG is flying players (including a lot from Korea) to New York City and having them stay in hotels in Manhattan. That does not come cheap. Whether they will exploit the fact they have all the players in the same location or not remains to be seen, they will need to make it special enough so it doesn't look like it could have all been done from online / replays.
Then why host it in this expensive city in the first place? Not very intelligent of MLG.
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On February 14 2012 09:41 Ikuu wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 09:38 casualman wrote:On February 14 2012 09:35 magnaflow wrote:
We need LoL numbers. Move over SC2, you're gonna be replaced as the main event in 2013. Losing players, losing viewers, Blizzard failed Sorry to say, but LoL will fail even harder than starcraft 2. Esports can't survive off of advertisements unless millions of people are watching; conventional sports can attain this number, but not even if all of the LoL players in the United States tuned in will they be able to actually get those numbers. Because LoL is F2P it's going to be even harder if nigh impossible to monetize >95% of the fanbase, meaning it is absolutely not viable as a monetizable esport. I can guarentee you that LoL has made more money for Riot than SC2 has for Blizzard.
Maybe, but the point isnt to make money for blizzard. The disadvantage of a F2P game is that the people playing it are not willing to spend money, which is why they are playing a F2P game. The advantage of it is that it can gain a very large player base, because it is of course F2P. Whether LoL works or not will remain to be seen however.
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I want FXOBoss's opinion in this thread on not just this idea but also more about sustainable tournaments and what needs to happen
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On February 14 2012 09:47 Darkybald wrote:Show nested quote +On February 14 2012 08:27 R1CH wrote:On February 14 2012 08:20 Volrath wrote:
Thing is, 20$ is ALOT by e-sports standards for a 3 day event. Even GSL is cheaper and has waaay more content. You have to set your prices to match your market, which MLG isn't. Especially with another big event going on at the same time. This is borderline stupid to be honest. It does not matter that UFC or some other well established sport is 5 times more expensive, this is irrelevant for e-sports. The e-sports scene is not there yet and they will likely loose alot in ad revenue, much more than they will add with this new cash flow. You have to remember that GSL has no costs other than the production / stream. MLG is flying players (including a lot from Korea) to New York City and having them stay in hotels in Manhattan. That does not come cheap. Whether they will exploit the fact they have all the players in the same location or not remains to be seen, they will need to make it special enough so it doesn't look like it could have all been done from online / replays. Then why host it in this expensive city in the first place? Not very intelligent of MLG.
their offices and everyone is based in NYC
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EPT
