EPTI call that blaming me?
MLG Winter Arena to be PPV - Page 125
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Criticism is allowed. Undue flaming is not. Take a second to think your post through before you submit. Bans will be handed out. Should go without saying, but don't link restreams here either. | ||
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Velr
Switzerland10856 Posts
I call that blaming me? | ||
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revel8
United Kingdom3022 Posts
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zomgE
498 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:06 Prochainezo wrote: Yup, this fanbase is retarded. No wonder nobody is making any money. I wonder if you could run a million dollar company getting $0 injected from such a large portion of your hardcore fanbase. Infact, I challenge you to think of one sport that doesn't rely on people happily buy entry tickets/merchandise/food and drink on site to support themselves. Until all you people realise this is the real world, and millions of dollars doesn't just grow on trees, then starcraft will never get anywhere. I'll say it again, you guys are so shortsighted it hurts. I believe it has already gotten to a point which is more than enough for me and probably there are others like me. Even less would suffice. There's too much stuff to watch as is. | ||
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provrorsbarn
Sweden766 Posts
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floor exercise
Canada5847 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:06 Prochainezo wrote: Yup, this fanbase is retarded. No wonder nobody is making any money. I wonder if you could run a million dollar company getting $0 injected from such a large portion of your hardcore fanbase. Infact, I challenge you to think of one sport that doesn't rely on people happily buy entry tickets/merchandise/food and drink on site to support themselves. Until all you people realise this is the real world, and millions of dollars doesn't just grow on trees, then starcraft will never get anywhere. I'll say it again, you guys are so shortsighted it hurts. Businesses fail all the time, rarely is it because "everyone is retarded" | ||
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bustanut
United States76 Posts
On February 15 2012 00:51 bouhko wrote: This whole argument about "$20 is nothing" is just completely dumb. This is not about the absolute cost, but about the cost relative to other similar offerings. GomTV charges for VOD access and high quality streams. They have an amazing production quality and Tastosis casting. But they still manage to have free live streams. The most important thing though is that a GSL light ticket is $14.99. This includes the amazing total of 194 very high quality matches (max 448 sets). Now, MLG is a 3 days event that won't attract the very best korean. And they charge more than the GSL for less matches. I mean, looks like people really want SC2 to become a business. One of the first rule of business is that if you charge more than a competitor you a) have a better quality of offering b) have a better quantity of offering c) are a charity. I don't think MLG has any of those. I'm not really sure how this will turn out for MLG. I hope they reconsider this decision or at least put some other offerings on the table. They should have a free low quality live stream with ads and some other offering at 5$-10$. this guy makes some pretty good points; if MLG wants to charge 20 bucks for a weekend pass, they at least need to involve more of the top-tier korean players | ||
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Xcobidoo
Sweden1871 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:06 Prochainezo wrote: Yup, this fanbase is retarded. No wonder nobody is making any money. I wonder if you could run a million dollar company getting $0 injected from such a large portion of your hardcore fanbase. Infact, I challenge you to think of one sport that doesn't rely on people happily buy entry tickets/merchandise/food and drink on site to support themselves. Until all you people realise this is the real world, and millions of dollars doesn't just grow on trees, then starcraft will never get anywhere. I'll say it again, you guys are so shortsighted it hurts. And how do you think the fanbase for sports that have been around forever were built up. By charging insane prices in their infancy? No way josé, they were built brick by brick until it could sustain itself by selling merchandise etc. Each season making their product better when people were ready to pay more. That's the way empires are built. Favoring money over growth is how a bubble is blown and a card house is stacked. | ||
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FuFighter
Germany60 Posts
Also I think it's interessting how it seems that mainly Americans are fine with the idea. I guess it's because you are used to the PPV model but in Europe it never took off and I'm glad it didn't. Why would eSports becoming mainstream imply that I have to pay for every tournament? As it has been stated before I can watch Football, Tennis, Formula 1, Olympics... pretty much every sport for free or at least just for a monthly fee I pay to recieve certain channels. I just don't like the PPV model at all. While I consider it fair to pay for a GSL season and to even gain extra features from it (vods, hq stream) I just feel ripped off whenever I have to pay just to watch one event. Since the SC2 community is very international I don't think this PPV model will be very succesfull (even in main stream sports is only seems to work in NA anyways?). So if growing eSports means the tourneys will become PPVs like UFC or Wrestling that will be it for me. I would either pay for and watch a whole season like GSL or watch free community tournaments without Proplayers. This has nothing to do with entitlement, everybody has make the decision wether they want to pay for it or not. If your answer is no you shouldn't be stigmatized as not caring for eSports, not knowing anything about "the real world" or being cheap or whatever though. | ||
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littlemozart7
69 Posts
I subscribe to the english premier league, and it cost me roughly 20 dollars a month, but i can watch it over a proper TV with HD channels, and all 10 matches each weekend are air-ed live and repeated telecast too. Each match is roughly 2 hours, in a month, i have 80hours of english premier league to watch. so MLG, dont u think that 20 dollars for 20 hours of SC2 is too much? Not to mention the difference in the number of hours provided by gomtv is more, and yet cheaper as well. | ||
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Lord_J
Kenya1085 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:05 Xcobidoo wrote: First of all sponsors don't care how much money MLG makes, only how many people are watching and how many times you see their product during the event. Less people watching = less (need for) sponsors. Sponsors do care about the demographic that's watching, though. And if 90% of that demographic is people who can't or won't spend $20 for a weekend of entertainment, then they might rightly wonder whether it's worth their money to advertise to that demographic. | ||
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Cryo1
Canada28 Posts
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shadymmj
1906 Posts
Western SC2 dies, big deal. Lucky I have money for gas, the kids, heating and school. Maybe even a pair of new shoes. Even if I could well afford to spend 20 bucks, I'm not going to spend it on something I can get for free. I could buy my girlfriend something. And that's pragmatic reasoning for you. The only issue I have is with hypocrites who pretend to support the scene and yet do the exact thing I do. C'mon folks - there's no need to lie about who you are over the internet. If there were no more SC2 streams in the future for one reason or another, hey, at least BW proleague games are streamed free of charge by our very dedicated GTR and co. Cheers guys! | ||
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Prochainezo
United Kingdom14 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:05 Xcobidoo wrote: First of all sponsors don't care how much money MLG makes, only how many people are watching and how many times you see their product during the event. Less people watching = less (need for) sponsors. Just wow, that isn't how bussiness works at all. It is a shame that I have to explain this to you all, but I feel it is my duty seeing as how uninformed you all are. You can't go to a sponsor and say we have 20,000 free stream viewers. The first question they will ask is how much money you have made. If you say $0, then they dont care. The whole reason we need to monetise it is because it is only the money that informs bussiness decision. If you cant get people to pay for $1/hour high quality content that cost you thousands of dollars to set up, then why the hell would a sponsor think anyone would be willing to spend money on their products? This is a point that has been made so many times by numerous people within the industry. It is not just my opinion. It is how it works. I wonder if you realise the harm uninformed opinions like yours do on these kind of sites. Even if you aren't buying, you should be encouraging others to do so if they can afford it. Otherwise you are helping no-one, and perhaps even doing harm. Grow up. | ||
NonY
8751 Posts
On February 15 2012 00:47 Assirra wrote: Something for nothing? People are willing to play but.there is this little thing called competition. Let's see. Here we have MLG arena, something completely new goes for 3days for 20dollar. On the other hand we have GSL, a tested and working model that goes on for 3months for 15 gsl light, 25 gsl premium. Not only it's longer, tested and works, contains better players but its way longer. Now tell me why i should even think about giving my money to MLG when i can't even see if i like it for free on a lower quality. No one ought to speak for you. As for myself, the GSL is a complete waste of money because it's at an atrocious hour. And if we're considering VOD's, well then MLG's are free and GSL's are not. Furthermore, I find the MLG Arena lineup of players more entertaining, as well as the (expected) commentators. I also like events that occur completely within one weekend, although I do prefer protracted events as a general rule. But the important fact here is that I strongly prefer having both on the scene rather than just one or the other. I also expect the Arena to have better content in the sense that I'll get to know the players better than I do with GSL. One thing that has been shown in the past year is that MLG produces more exciting and entertaining series than GSL does. GSL has a higher overall skill level and that's the only thing going for it. But in the opinion of just about everyone, MLG's skill level is high enough that it doesn't matter. And finally, I'm willing to spend some money on an interest that I deeply enjoy without having guarantees that it'll work out perfectly. If you are unwilling to try something until people with more passion and more money than you have invested in it and proven that it'll work, then that's simply one of your faults and shouldn't reflect poorly on anything or anyone but yourself. | ||
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Gtoad
United States90 Posts
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SMD
Canada627 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:10 bustanut wrote: + Show Spoiler + On February 15 2012 00:51 bouhko wrote: This whole argument about "$20 is nothing" is just completely dumb. This is not about the absolute cost, but about the cost relative to other similar offerings. GomTV charges for VOD access and high quality streams. They have an amazing production quality and Tastosis casting. But they still manage to have free live streams. The most important thing though is that a GSL light ticket is $14.99. This includes the amazing total of 194 very high quality matches (max 448 sets). Now, MLG is a 3 days event that won't attract the very best korean. And they charge more than the GSL for less matches. I mean, looks like people really want SC2 to become a business. One of the first rule of business is that if you charge more than a competitor you a) have a better quality of offering b) have a better quantity of offering c) are a charity. I don't think MLG has any of those. I'm not really sure how this will turn out for MLG. I hope they reconsider this decision or at least put some other offerings on the table. They should have a free low quality live stream with ads and some other offering at 5$-10$. this guy makes some pretty good points; if MLG wants to charge 20 bucks for a weekend pass, they at least need to involve more of the top-tier korean players They had a korean qualifier, some of the "top teir" koreans couldn't make it through that qualifier..... | ||
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xuanzue
Colombia1747 Posts
all i can say: "bad news everyone" | ||
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ShaunO
United States44 Posts
GSL is only $15 and that last way longer, and arguably better matches/casting/experience. Not to mention, does anyone remember the first MLG to have gold pass access? The customers who paid were plagued by little to no access to what they were promised due to internet problems on MLGs end. Who's to say MLG is ready to charge $20 for a PPV pass for one event? Do I want to go through the hassle of internet failures again and not getting what I paid for? I was considering paying the price in order to watch because I absolutely love MLG weekends and look forward to them, but after taking into account the facts (GSLs price is cheaper, MLG has had technical hiccups when they introduce new things), I think i am going to sit this one out and see what happens before I cough up $20 of my hard earned dollars. All that being said, I don't blame MLG here. They are on the right track, monetizing SC2 is going to happen whether we like it or not, and it will help grow the market for it. I want to see SC2 as more than just a niche market some day and I think this is a step in the right direction. So I think I would be way more likely to pay $10 for a MLG PPV. Its more affordable, reasonably priced in comparison to GSLs, and easier to forgive if there are some sort of hiccups along the way. | ||
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AmericanUmlaut
Germany2594 Posts
On February 15 2012 01:15 Prochainezo wrote: Just wow, that isn't how bussiness works at all. It is a shame that I have to explain this to you all, but I feel it is my duty seeing as how uninformed you all are. You can't go to a sponsor and say we have 20,000 free stream viewers. The first question they will ask is how much money you have made. If you say $0, then they dont care. The whole reason we need to monetise it is because it is only the money that informs bussiness decision. If you cant get people to pay for $1/hour high quality content that cost you thousands of dollars to set up, then why the hell would a sponsor think anyone would be willing to spend money on their products? This is a point that has been made so many times by numerous people within the industry. It is not just my opinion. It is how it works. I wonder if you realise the harm uninformed opinions like yours do on these kind of sites. Even if you aren't buying, you should be encouraging others to do so if they can afford it. Otherwise you are helping no-one, and perhaps even doing harm. Grow up. This is an utterly ridiculous argument. When NBC went to advertisers to sell ads for this year's Super Bowl, do you think they got a lot of rejections because none of the 110 million viewers had paid a fee for the right to watch it? When you're selling advertising space, the only really important questions are the demographics and numbers of your viewership. | ||
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Zraf
54 Posts
On February 15 2012 00:52 Prochainezo wrote: Wow so many people here don't realise they are shooting themselves in the foot. Finally after a year of hoping that Starcraft would explode as an esport, an opportunity comes along where we can prove that it can be monetised and can be a sustainable bussiness that will have real profits (and not just free stream viewers) to show to bigger sponsors and secure larger investment... and you guys can't justify $1/hour of content. What a real shame that is. MLG knew this would be an unpopular decision. But somebody has to man up and start monetising esports, and frankly if MLG can't do it, then who the hell can? I think for most people its not the unwillingness to shell out money, but the amount MLG is asking for is too much for what is being offered. | ||
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