EPTthis threads makes me weep and needs to die, like all the whining in it...
Nobody Plays 1v1 Ladder Anymore? - Page 57
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honkeybeef
United States143 Posts
this threads makes me weep and needs to die, like all the whining in it... | ||
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Atoissen
Norway1737 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:21 honkeybeef wrote: Low master, played 15 games today, not 1 cheese. Back in diamond, 1/30 games cheese. SC is fun. America (Im American) has a lot of apathetic whiners and good for nothings that like life handed to them on a plate, I seriously don't know why half of the people in this thread play the game, are on TL, or post excuses why not to play a game (like not playing is a bad thing, gtfo or stfu)... TL is a place people come to grow and get better, not to whine about balance and "cheese". There is no cheese, just get better, its not the game its you that sucks. more gg more skill. this threads makes me weep and needs to die, like all the whining in it... Amen. | ||
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zefreak
United States2731 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:15 MVega wrote: Not really it's just that in major tournaments there is a bit of an honor system. You'll see things like six pool very rarely. You very rarely see cheese and all-in builds that you'd see on the ladder. It just happens that most of these builds will easily counter some of the standard openings. It's kind of a mentality thing. In tournaments you say "Well I can do this and be safe because it's extremely unlikely that my opponent will do this." but on the ladder just about anything goes and you can't expect to use the same builds. I've often suspected this while watching GSL, later confirmed it with some of my GM friends, and now Jinro has pretty much confirmed it too. Although Jinro also rages at marauders so who knows? <3 This is absolutely wrong, in high level tournaments (GSL) if there is a cheesy, abusive strategy that has a high chance of succeeding against a certain race or player, it's safe to assume it will be done. There is no honor system, and there shouldn't be. The reason you don't see constant 6 pools etc is because its usually a boX format where x > 1, and just as constant greedy play is exploitable by cheese, constant cheese is exploitable by safe, standard play. | ||
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MVega
763 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:30 zefreak wrote: This is absolutely wrong, in high level tournaments (GSL) if there is a cheesy, abusive strategy that has a high chance of succeeding against a certain race or player, it's safe to assume it will be done. There is no honor system, and there shouldn't be. The reason you don't see constant 6 pools etc is because its usually a boX format where x > 1, and just as constant greedy play is exploitable by cheese, constant cheese is exploitable by safe, standard play. Same thing different wording. If someone in the GSL really wanted to win a set they could pretty easily cheese their way to victory against quite a few of the current standard openings - They're just that vulnerable to cheese. The problem with it is that if you become known to use such strategies frequently you'll be easily thwarted. That's just part of the GSL setting. My main point however was that you really can't expect the same results on ladder as you do in a major tournament as the ladder is about as cutthroat as it gets so your "safe" openings become decidedly less so. | ||
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:15 MVega wrote: Not really it's just that in major tournaments there is a bit of an honor system. You'll see things like six pool very rarely. You very rarely see cheese and all-in builds that you'd see on the ladder. It just happens that most of these builds will easily counter some of the standard openings. It's kind of a mentality thing. In tournaments you say "Well I can do this and be safe because it's extremely unlikely that my opponent will do this." but on the ladder just about anything goes and you can't expect to use the same builds. I've often suspected this while watching GSL, later confirmed it with some of my GM friends, and now Jinro has pretty much confirmed it too. Although Jinro also rages at marauders so who knows? <3 No there isn't. You see cheese in big tournaments, the top players will use w/e build if it will win. They just know that its a huge risk because other pros are damn good at holding stuff like 6 pool. 6 pool is far away from the builds Jinro is referring to. | ||
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KULA_u
Switzerland107 Posts
On February 20 2012 01:32 HuKPOWA wrote: lol bias much? pretty sure six pooling with all ur drones is much easier...no...it is easier... Just b/c u dont know how to hold off protoss cheese doesn't mean you have to say it takes 0 skill :\ sad to see a pro player making such a dumb statement not really, to executing a good 6pool is not really that easy, because making simple mistakes/a simple wall will instantly cost you the game. protoss X-gate all-ins on the other hand don't really require too much micro. (relatively to each other of course) also it really doesn't matter wheter bad player's should advance. the problem is that bad people never get to play normal games because holing off cheese is pretty hard for low level players. and that's really a problem of game design. | ||
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TheRealFluid
United States501 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:54 KULA_u wrote: not really, to executing a good 6pool is not really that easy, because making simple mistakes/a simple wall will instantly cost you the game. protoss X-gate all-ins on the other hand don't really require too much micro. (relatively to each other of course) also it really doesn't matter wheter bad player's should advance. the problem is that bad people never get to play normal games because holing off cheese is pretty hard for low level players. and that's really a problem of game design. You are aware that cheese existed in Starcraft Brood War and even Watcraft 3 to a large extent. I cannot tell you how many times I've been cannon and tower rushed. | ||
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djtopa
United Kingdom59 Posts
To people complaining about cheeses and all-ins. I don't feel any anger when I loose to this. As I know that I am a macro player I also know that because the other player used cheese he probably is worse in a long game which is my target so I just don't bother. Watch the replay and correct your gameplay. Besides there is nothing more rewarding then defending a cheese and listen to the BM of the cheeser saying how imba your race is. The reason I think the player base is declining is because this game is hard. It drains you mentally if you play a lot. But if you want to improve it's quite rewarding. Obviously if you only want to win than it's not. Bnet 2.0 sucks though I agree  | ||
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CalmKiwi
12 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:21 honkeybeef wrote: Low master, played 15 games today, not 1 cheese. Back in diamond, 1/30 games cheese. SC is fun. America (Im American) has a lot of apathetic whiners and good for nothings that like life handed to them on a plate, I seriously don't know why half of the people in this thread play the game, are on TL, or post excuses why not to play a game (like not playing is a bad thing, gtfo or stfu)... TL is a place people come to grow and get better, not to whine about balance and "cheese". There is no cheese, just get better, its not the game its you that sucks. more gg more skill. this threads makes me weep and needs to die, like all the whining in it... Nice opinion you got there son, shame you didn't read the valid points in the thread and just whined about how people whine Makes you look like the people you dispise | ||
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Narw
Poland884 Posts
Ladder is doing its purpose - it lets you play fast games without spending too much time on finding opponent. It's nowhere perfect, but to make it seem like total crap is just disturbing. One thing i would like is having option to bo3 in ladder, thats it. | ||
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Angel[BTL]
Romania345 Posts
On February 21 2012 00:37 Narw wrote: Disgusting thread, so much moaning and whinning. 90% of problems here can be described (at least last few pages) - i cant stand playing a game in which i can and will lose aprox half of my games, other half is about complaining that you play shit opponents that all in and cheese (you play opponents that are same mmr as you so hey newsflash snowflakes, you arent so special as you think maybe?!) Ladder is doing its purpose - it lets you play fast games without spending too much time on finding opponent. It's nowhere perfect, but to make it seem like total crap is just disturbing. One thing i would like is having option to bo3 in ladder, thats it. If you play in the morning when there aren't that many, chances are that you will get the same opponent twice in a row or maybe more if you are lucky. | ||
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Aela
97 Posts
I will continue to play like 10-30games/season. | ||
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SnuggleZhenya
596 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:21 honkeybeef wrote: Low master, played 15 games today, not 1 cheese. Back in diamond, 1/30 games cheese. SC is fun. America (Im American) has a lot of apathetic whiners and good for nothings that like life handed to them on a plate, I seriously don't know why half of the people in this thread play the game, are on TL, or post excuses why not to play a game (like not playing is a bad thing, gtfo or stfu)... TL is a place people come to grow and get better, not to whine about balance and "cheese". There is no cheese, just get better, its not the game its you that sucks. more gg more skill. this threads makes me weep and needs to die, like all the whining in it... The problem is - most people don't look at video games this way. Most people that quit the ladder have no idea what Team Liquid is, or that a pro scene exists, or that anyone ever bothers talking about strategy outside playing the actual game. The people posting in this thread make up a few % of all the people who have stopped playing ladder (at the most), and most of them never bothered whining or even cared enough to tell anyone that quit the ladder. Those are the people that we should hypothetically care about (Or at least, BLIZZARD should care about), because they are the huge masses which buy the game and make money for the developer/publisher. | ||
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scDeluX
Canada1341 Posts
I still play the ladder and enjoy it. There is not much chesse/bm. NA Diamond. | ||
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Apolo
Portugal1259 Posts
2. Most people playing the game are casuals. 2.1 Main reason casuals play the game is to have some fun. 3. Team games generally are funnier to play. 4. 1v1 is too much of a "in your face" kind of gameplay which doesn't fit in casual gameplay. 5. Most people play team games. | ||
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Penecks
United States600 Posts
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sOvrn
United States678 Posts
I think I haven't played ladder in like 2-3 seasons and the only tournament I really watch is the GSL individual league. I still love watching the GSL ^__^ | ||
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yoona2012
Denmark196 Posts
On February 20 2012 20:52 djtopa wrote: I personally play more and more each season. I had ladder fear and said fuck it so I went mass gaming. Now I actually am addicted to hit the "Find Match" button, funny isn't it. To people complaining about cheeses and all-ins. I don't feel any anger when I loose to this. As I know that I am a macro player I also know that because the other player used cheese he probably is worse in a long game which is my target so I just don't bother. Watch the replay and correct your gameplay. Besides there is nothing more rewarding then defending a cheese and listen to the BM of the cheeser saying how imba your race is. The reason I think the player base is declining is because this game is hard. It drains you mentally if you play a lot. But if you want to improve it's quite rewarding. Obviously if you only want to win than it's not. Bnet 2.0 sucks though I agree Well said, I agree with mostly everything. Hardcore laddering is exhausting but also rewarding when your hard work pays off. Bnet 2.0 is a pitiful thing. Unless alot of my friends are online and I am teamladdering, bnet can feel quite lonely - especially when well mannered opponents in 1v1 ladder are quite few and far between. I would like to believe that if there were some things to do between games and an improved chat/channel system, sc2 would have far more people online. Personally I would love to see pro-streams to be incorporated into sc2 without having to alt-tab with an ingame channel chat system for the specs only, being able to see production tabs, first person view and all the other good stuff. A casual ladder system existing beside the ranked ladder system, a special ladder you can go play without worrying about points and rank, but still get matched up against similar ranked players. This ladder could be used to practice new strats, race-switches or simply warming up before you start laddering (as we all know our first game(s) of the day are horrible). Weekly scheduled blizzard tournaments would be a nice as well, perhaps with special portrait rewards? A chat-channel for bronze/silver/gold/diamond/master/gm that you autojoin when login that you can´t close (ofcourse you can minimize it). This also to combat the lonely bnet 2.0 feeling and a reward and goal to try get a better ladder league? | ||
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Sabu113
United States11075 Posts
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Mafs
Canada458 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:21 honkeybeef wrote: Low master, played 15 games today, not 1 cheese. Back in diamond, 1/30 games cheese. SC is fun. America (Im American) has a lot of apathetic whiners and good for nothings that like life handed to them on a plate, I seriously don't know why half of the people in this thread play the game, are on TL, or post excuses why not to play a game (like not playing is a bad thing, gtfo or stfu)... TL is a place people come to grow and get better, not to whine about balance and "cheese". There is no cheese, just get better, its not the game its you that sucks. more gg more skill. this threads makes me weep and needs to die, like all the whining in it... As a zerg, I only expirence cheese on ladder. ZvZ is ling bane all in wars into mutalisk. ZvP is just forge fe into 2 star or some massive gateway push with or without robo push. ZvT is pretty standard but cheese is rare in this match up. TvT I can't imagine cheese occuring. Maybe 2 port banshee is cheese but gets destroyed. TvP rarely gets cheese BO unless its 1 base. If your T you rarely see cheese on ladder. | ||
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