EPTNobody Plays 1v1 Ladder Anymore? - Page 56
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Gyro_SC2
Canada540 Posts
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Monkeyballs25
531 Posts
If I was a casual player, I'd be very turned off by the current state of bronze league. Loads of bad manners, cheese, portrait farmers, smurfs etc. | ||
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HuKPOWA
United States1604 Posts
On February 19 2012 18:36 Liquid`Jinro wrote: There are lots of builds that take close to 0 skill to execute but will give you free wins vs a lot of normal openings. It's stupid. Protoss allins are the worst (literally does not take any skill what so ever to execute mass gateway builds, just warpin and force field the bunkers and wait for terran to die/win depending on what build the terran picked), but terran and zerg allins aren't exactly brimming with skill requirement either. lol bias much? pretty sure six pooling with all ur drones is much easier...no...it is easier... Just b/c u dont know how to hold off protoss cheese doesn't mean you have to say it takes 0 skill :\ sad to see a pro player making such a dumb statement | ||
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Apack
Canada159 Posts
On February 19 2012 17:56 Wi)nD wrote: LOL sounds like a tipical aweseme ladder day im curious bout the 4 gates tho, wat div are you? EDIT: also** to the ppl sayint that the micro macro (multitasking) is hard and makes it less fun to play, i guess you never played bw b/c bw was alot more demanding interms of mutitasking I'm high bronze so they are pretty poorly executed and I hold them but its just annoying to have a bunch of 7 minute games | ||
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nemonic
132 Posts
On February 19 2012 18:36 Liquid`Jinro wrote: There are lots of builds that take close to 0 skill to execute but will give you free wins vs a lot of normal openings. It's stupid. Protoss allins are the worst (literally does not take any skill what so ever to execute mass gateway builds, just warpin and force field the bunkers and wait for terran to die/win depending on what build the terran picked), but terran and zerg allins aren't exactly brimming with skill requirement either. That sums it up quite well. The game doesn't reward skillful play enough. In terms of the ladder, there are too many people in Masters that can play nothing except for their standard cheese/allin in each of their three matchups. For my part, I usually seek for playing macro games. However, it's easy to lose your motivation if you get all-ined five times a row on ladder. That's usually when I stop playing the game for days, because it's just not fun anymore. Also, we still have gold minerals, close spawns on Antiga/Entombed in the ladder mappool (at least they kicked out Xelnaga). So the situation is particularly worse for laddering than for tournaments (and I usually don't play tournaments). Basically, the game has evolved from mostly one base all-ins to mostly two base all-ins in the last year. Although things are getting more balanced, I kind of fear that Blizzard will do the same mistakes with HotS again. Also it feels like there are some aspects of the game that are just funamentally bad designed, with Warpgate-Tech being the prime example. I truly hope Blizzard considers these aspects in HotS... | ||
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dizzy101
Netherlands2066 Posts
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scypio
Poland2127 Posts
Losing is not fun at all. The matchmaking system will keep you loosing a ton of games. Yeah, sometimes it kinda works out and I go on a nice winning streak. In most cases I don't and well, loosing sucks. In team games I can always blame the defeat on the other guys and that makes the stress go away. This does not work in 1v1, so I find myself drifting towards solutions like: "don't do 1v1" or "always quit after first 1v1 victory". I guess there is the option where I go and improve my sc2 skills. Well guess what: even if I do that I'll still loose games, the only thing that would be different is the league I'm in. After having to deal with a ton of stress at work I just don't feel like having to deal with it once again during my free time. I'd rather chill out, play some 4v4s, watch GSL. | ||
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UisTehSux
United States693 Posts
And the unnecessary BM that usually comes when a cheeser is beating you. I hate the feeling of being grossly involved in a long macro game and at some time in the game just PLUMMET into a loss. Or an intense micro-against-this-cheese-perfectly-or-you-lose kind of game and just hating myself for clicking the wrong unit or pushing the wrong button. I know for some this may be the beauty of the game and this competitive nature might drive others to better their game, but I would rather have a couple alcoholic beverages, go on skype, and do some team games for some laughs with my friends. | ||
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CallousCarter
United Kingdom81 Posts
I think a change to the ladder system could a lot. In its current form its fucking terrible, it fails to motivate casual or engage /hardcore players. Its obtuse, overly complex and nearly entirely devoid of significance. It's clear Blizzard put a lot of thought [ makes me so dissapointed they got it so wrong. | ||
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jameszz
United Kingdom8 Posts
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DaRkFrosT
United States407 Posts
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IMoperator
4476 Posts
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Falcons_Kaz
Canada15 Posts
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AnachronisticAnarchy
United States2957 Posts
I start up a game. I win or I lose, and my points, division rank and mmr are affected accordingly. Maaaybe I'll get promoted, but that's rare. And that's it. Nothing else happens. That's a problem. Most people I know can't play a game, doing the same exact thing over and over for negligible rewards. There is next to no reason to play both short term and long term if all you do is ladder, unless you are really competitive. Without things like automated tournaments, many, many people will stop playing sc2 because it is the same old thing, over and over. It stops feeling competitive. It doesn't feel like you're facing players, it feels like you're facing silver league, for example. You stop getting that rush. sc2 has next to no staying power because of these aspects. lans and tournaments help, because they feel like what you do there actually matters. If lans and tournaments matter, then people will ladder, but not for fun, because it just isn't fun after a certain amount of time. They will do it because they need practice and they want to be better. Their competitive spirit will be revived. We need automated tournaments or something like them to give sc2 the staying power it deserves and win back a ton of players. | ||
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Ryndika
1489 Posts
On February 20 2012 08:06 AnachronisticAnarchy wrote: I find it hard to ladder mainly because it seems like there is no fucking point to it. I start up a game. I win or I lose, and my points, division rank and mmr are affected accordingly. Maaaybe I'll get promoted, but that's rare. And that's it. Nothing else happens. That's a problem. Most people I know can't play a game, doing the same exact thing over and over for negligible rewards. There is next to no reason to play both short term and long term if all you do is ladder, unless you are really competitive. Without things like automated tournaments, many, many people will stop playing sc2 because it is the same old thing, over and over. It stops feeling competitive. It doesn't feel like you're facing players, it feels like you're facing silver league, for example. You stop getting that rush. sc2 has next to no staying power because of these aspects. lans and tournaments help, because they feel like what you do there actually matters. If lans and tournaments matter, then people will ladder, but not for fun, because it just isn't fun after a certain amount of time. They will do it because they need practice and they want to be better. Their competitive spirit will be revived. We need automated tournaments or something like them to give sc2 the staying power it deserves and win back a ton of players. This isn't like wow, you play because you enjoy that EXACT match you are in now. That match is so fun you want to play more. Fuck points and leagues lol, there will be always better and worse players, you will always be called worse or bad player AND a good player from alot lower level players. About cheese, I played 30games on new race just a second ago, countered 1 10 pool and 5 4gates (pvp). No other cheese, unless you count 1-1-1 (saw that twice or 3times). My friend who has played 30-50games in silver has encountered 6pool 0 times. I myself was really surpirsed but lack of cheese in silver. O_O e:Koth is nice social "tournament". Battle.net is horrible btw. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
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Pugwalker
50 Posts
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On February 20 2012 01:32 HuKPOWA wrote: lol bias much? pretty sure six pooling with all ur drones is much easier...no...it is easier... Just b/c u dont know how to hold off protoss cheese doesn't mean you have to say it takes 0 skill :\ sad to see a pro player making such a dumb statement Sad to see a random trying to tell a pro he's making a dumb statement... Give these guys some respect and acknowledge that they probably know a lot more about the game and what is skilled or not skilled. | ||
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nimbim
Germany986 Posts
Maybe Blizzard just gave SC2 a bad start; some of my friends for example have played SC2 for 1-2months and then dropped the game because of the horrible social features (no chat, lousy custom game system), they never came back. Back when BW came out I was often times forced to stop playing for several months or years, but I always came back to the game, even though I sucked at it and laddering (wgt etc) was too stressful. | ||
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MVega
763 Posts
On February 20 2012 17:04 SupLilSon wrote: Sad to see a random trying to tell a pro he's making a dumb statement... Give these guys some respect and acknowledge that they probably know a lot more about the game and what is skilled or not skilled. Not really it's just that in major tournaments there is a bit of an honor system. You'll see things like six pool very rarely. You very rarely see cheese and all-in builds that you'd see on the ladder. It just happens that most of these builds will easily counter some of the standard openings. It's kind of a mentality thing. In tournaments you say "Well I can do this and be safe because it's extremely unlikely that my opponent will do this." but on the ladder just about anything goes and you can't expect to use the same builds. I've often suspected this while watching GSL, later confirmed it with some of my GM friends, and now Jinro has pretty much confirmed it too. Although Jinro also rages at marauders so who knows? <3 | ||
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