EPTI do not see how terran can deal with zerg tier 3 now. Vikings just die to fungal and marauders are trash vs anything but ultras/roaches. I expect to see a lot more allins.
Patch 1.4.3 - Preview Blog - Page 104
| Forum Index > SC2 General |
Please DISCUSS the changes and the impact they will have on gameplay. Straight up whining and bitching will get you a ban, no exceptions. | ||
|
Fealthas
607 Posts
I do not see how terran can deal with zerg tier 3 now. Vikings just die to fungal and marauders are trash vs anything but ultras/roaches. I expect to see a lot more allins. | ||
|
IVIiner
United States17 Posts
Protoss here i come! | ||
|
TheRealDJ
United States124 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:00 JJH777 wrote: You know Corruptors are 150/100 minerals/gas right? They are no where near as good as vikings it is only with fungal mixed in that they can fight them. Vikings are only 25 fewer gas, and corruptors have 75 more health and 2 armor. For a corruptor without corruption to kill a viking would take slightly more than 16 seconds(125/7.6dps). A viking would take 20 seconds to kill(200/12-2 dps). Corruptor wins. | ||
|
Tulkas25
Greece292 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:02 trinxified wrote: here, I edited post: Snipe should be 25 dmg + 25 to LIGHT instead of just psionic. That way, units like Marines, Zealots, Mutalisks, Hydras etc. still weak to it. SO FUNNY because it can't even one-shot a Zergling or workers... HAHA At least it could kill larva with one shot...:S those new sniper rounds are plain crappy.I think blizzard will go with the nerf in the end but make a modification to not make snipe worthless against zealots and other low tier units.And true most psionic units are better off emped!They wanted to remove neural parasite on that other patch but they instead nerfed the range.I think that something will change for emp like many ppl proposing already!Except if blizzard completely Feels that ghosts should only be used as anticasters and also wants ppl to more actively spam nuke? I dunno. | ||
|
Zealot Lord
Hong Kong744 Posts
Anyways, the mule on gold was long time coming - I think everyone agrees its a fair change. Though I'm honestly not sure about the snipe change at this minute, guess we'll see what the PTR guys think of it. | ||
|
n0ave
180 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:04 Shantastic wrote: Care to back that up at all? Don't worry, I'll back up my statements with fact so that you don't have to  Each viking does 20 damage per hit, while each corruptor does 14 damage per hit. This means that you need around 1.12 vikings for each corruptors. Considering that vikings cost 100/75 to the corruptor's 150/100, and that build times are around the same as long as you have two reactored starports, that sounds pretty much in favor of the viking there..Hmm so vikings are 100/75? Since when xD? | ||
|
Suerte
United States117 Posts
| ||
|
CrazyF1r3f0x
United States2120 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:01 Vindicare605 wrote: Also a better idea than what Blizzard is proposing. Honestly, the +25 damage to Psionic is meaningless. I know it's meant to be like a compensation in the way that Siege Tank damage works vs armored but there honestly are so few situations where Sniping something Psionic is better than simply EMPing it that the +damage to psionic is just pointless. Well think about it this way, EMP is good when you have HT Grouped with other units (like other HT or HT+gateway, or even a group of sentry), but when it's HT by themselves you can spend 2 snipes (50 energy) to kill the Templar rather then 75 for an EMP (which takes away 100 energy), so that means that you could spend 2 snipes on a full energy HT rather than 2 emps saving yourself 100 energy, and killing the HT. Not to mention, dead HT can't make Archons. | ||
|
BGrael
Germany229 Posts
On February 11 2012 09:48 tdt wrote: Ghosts are the only way I've ever seen a terran beat it and it 50/50. Before terran discovered they had Ghosts they would just get rolled. Many marines? broods and fungel takes care of that. Think you're gonna get vikings to take out the broods? Nope. Fungel and corruptors take care of that. Thors? Don't make be laugh. They get eaten alive by broodlings. Ghosts where only counter to BL/infestor/corruptor. How about the games of DRG vs. MMA from Blizzard Cup finals I think, the last game. It was the best game I have ever seen, no ghosts, and MMA won. It was much more entertaining than what usually happens when terran gets ghosts late game: either he is killed before he gets a critical mass of ghosts or the zerg is just rolling over and dies when terran has enough ghosts together. | ||
|
hasuterrans
United States614 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:01 Vindicare605 wrote: Also a better idea than what Blizzard is proposing. Honestly, the +25 damage to Psionic is meaningless. I know it's meant to be like a compensation in the way that Siege Tank damage works vs armored but there honestly are so few situations where Sniping something Psionic is better than simply EMPing it that the +damage to psionic is just pointless. Snipe will no longer one-shot the weakest units in the game (lings, workers, marines) and +3 ghosts will do more damage with their regular attack vs mutas than snipe will. This makes the ability feel very underwhelming. Also, early ghost builds will disappear from TvT making restricting the overall matchup. These are bizarre and easily avoidable side effects. If Broodlords and Ultras are a problem maybe they should nerf snipe's damage against massive units specifically instead of biological units in general. | ||
|
Shantastic
United States435 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:03 Bagi wrote: its a known fact that zerg can switch between techs so much easier than the other races. Only in the midgame. By the late game, Terran should have enough of two different types of production facilities (as well as armory/ebay) to be able to switch around add-ons to adapt, and Protoss will have Templar Archives, Robo Bay, as well as Stargate and Fleet Beacon (at least in PvZ). At that point, the only question is whether to make Stalker/Sentry or Zealot/Templar for your late game comp. Meanwhile, Terran really doesn't need much adaptation, as beating other races late-game is more about control with any composition than switching around comps. | ||
|
NoDDiE
Poland170 Posts
maybe just remove terran if u love to nerf it so much? wonder which patch it was buffed (expect battlecruiser speed which is indeed strong buff) tvz late game = gg terran. guess i will have to stick to all-ins and expect to see a lot of whining about how cheesy i am... User was temp banned for this post. | ||
|
Shantastic
United States435 Posts
*150/75. My mistake. | ||
|
trinxified
Canada7774 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:07 Tulkas25 wrote: At least it could kill larva with one shot...:S those new sniper rounds are plain crappy.I think blizzard will go with the nerf in the end but make a modification to not make snipe worthless against zealots and other low tier units.And true most psionic units are better off emped!They wanted to remove neural parasite on that other patch but they instead nerfed the range.I think that something will change for emp like many ppl proposing already!Except if blizzard completely Feels that ghosts should only be used as anticasters and also wants ppl to more actively spam nuke? I dunno. The change I suggested should solve that problem easily. No need to restrict to PSIONIC only... Making snipe 50 dmg to LIGHT and 25 dmg to everything else BIOLOGICAL is good enough. Easy fix to the problem. At least this way, Ghosts can still kill workers in one cast... OR just restrict the 25 damage to MASSIVE units only... | ||
|
Empirimancer
Canada1024 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:02 trinxified wrote: here, I edited post: Snipe should be 25 dmg + 25 to LIGHT instead of just psionic. That way, units like Marines, Zealots, Mutalisks, Hydras etc. still weak to it. SO FUNNY because it can't even one-shot a Zergling or workers... HAHA That's a good idea, but not as good as 45 - 20 vs Massive, because if the damage bonus was against light Snipe would become worthless against ghosts and, especially, infestors. | ||
|
XiGua
Sweden3085 Posts
| ||
|
DirtyCash
Canada189 Posts
| ||
|
Gosi
Sweden9072 Posts
On February 11 2012 09:37 Shantastic wrote: If you don't like adapting to patches, I'd suggest that you play a Command & Conquer game. If you don't LOVE the fact that Blizzard cares enough to constantly think about whether something is balanced and allowing players equal opportunities to win games, StarCraft may not be right for you. EA treats C&C a lot more short-term, which is why StarCraft has been the most successful competitive e-Sport of all RTS games. Funny how you say this when Starcarft BW and the most successful competitive esport game of all times didn't get balanced patched like crazy because something was "OP" and to get "equal opprtunities". The game and it's players solved it out and created the the modern meta game. As players got better they were able to come up and execute new stuff that every race had to adapt too, it's part of the sharm of RTS. In SC2 however Blizzard patch and change things way to much and way to quickly. Instead of letting the progamers solving the issues Blizzard does it "for" them by nerfing and buffing things and pretty much tells us how to play the game. It is getting boring quickly. | ||
|
babysimba
10466 Posts
Mules getting nerfed on gold means ladder maps are getting better. Massing ghosts was pretty ridiculous before due to how easy it was to play turtle terran. Ghosts have too much survivability when paired with medivacs, and they can still attack normally and cloak too. Tank vikings still stomp broods all day anyway. Broods deathball only seems unkillable when zergs have massive air upgrades, which terrans shouldn't let the game get to that point or can choose to respond with their own air upgrades. I want to see a back and forth match-up not a turtlish game, so i will be glad that true TvZ monsters like MMA and MKP will continue to dominate anyway. Phoenixes are already muta counters, but they should be produced in the right amount and used together with stalker/cannons support to overcome their mobility issues (see genius' games). Massing pure phoenixes is just dumb and will die to muta flocks. Seems like blizzard wants to cater to those lower-skilled players. Well its not a big deal for a zerg anyway since the range upgrade is pretty high up in the tech tree. It's a joke that currently, 95% of tosses don't upgrade air upgrades when they invest so heavily in phoenixes. I doubt the range upgrade will help tosses do any better than tosses who already consistently upgrade air attack, so i'm not really concerned about this change as a zerg. | ||
|
Bagi
Germany6799 Posts
On February 11 2012 10:04 Shantastic wrote: Care to back that up at all? Don't worry, I'll back up my statements with fact so that you don't have to Each viking does 20 damage per hit, while each corruptor does 14 damage per hit. This means that you need around 1.12 vikings for each corruptors. Considering that vikings cost 100/75 to the corruptor's 150/100, and that build times are around the same as long as you have two reactored starports, that sounds pretty much in favor of the viking there..Wow, I can't believe how backwards this whole post is. You have the viking cost wrong, you dont account for the fact how much easier corruptors are for a zerg to produce yet you still try to twist it in the favor of the viking... Even when you acknowledge that it takes 1.12 vikings per corruptor (AKA corruptor wins right there and then). Hilarious. | ||
| ||
