• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 02:00
CEST 08:00
KST 15:00
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments0[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence2Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon9[ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Ascent10Maestros of the Game: Week 1/Play-in Preview12
Community News
WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments0SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia7Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues29LiuLi Cup - September 2025 Tournaments3Weekly Cups (August 25-31): Clem's Last Straw?39
StarCraft 2
General
Team TLMC #5 - Finalists & Open Tournaments Weekly Cups (Sept 1-7): MaxPax rebounds & Clem saga continues #1: Maru - Greatest Players of All Time Team Liquid Map Contest #21 - Presented by Monster Energy Classic Games #3: Rogue vs Serral at BlizzCon
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game—$20k event w/ live finals in Paris RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series WardiTV TL Team Map Contest #5 Tournaments Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament SC4ALL $6,000 Open LAN in Philadelphia
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 491 Night Drive Mutation # 490 Masters of Midnight Mutation # 489 Bannable Offense Mutation # 488 What Goes Around
Brood War
General
Playing StarCraft as 2 people on the same network [ASL20] Ro16 Preview Pt2: Turbulence ASL20 General Discussion Pros React To: SoulKey's 5-Peat Challenge BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[ASL20] Ro16 Group C [IPSL] ISPL Season 1 Winter Qualis and Info! Is there English video for group selection for ASL [ASL20] Ro16 Group B
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Borderlands 3 Nintendo Switch Thread Path of Exile General RTS Discussion Thread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion LiquidDota to reintegrate into TL.net
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Hire the best professional and forensic experts US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread The Big Programming Thread
Fan Clubs
The Happy Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread High temperatures on bridge(s)
TL Community
BarCraft in Tokyo Japan for ASL Season5 Final The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Personality of a Spender…
TrAiDoS
A very expensive lesson on ma…
Garnet
hello world
radishsoup
Lemme tell you a thing o…
JoinTheRain
RTS Design in Hypercoven
a11
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1318 users

The Foreigner Dilemma - Page 4

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 13 14 15 Next All
Bswhunter
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Australia954 Posts
January 25 2012 11:30 GMT
#61
wat.
no u see peopel can still break into the scene, its just easier than like a year ago.
you wont get like, a massive burst of popularity, but say im like good n shit, playing on US server, i see say, destiny on ladder.
we have a good game, im like yo, lets play 2v2's.
then we play 2v2's im on his skype talking n shit. if im intresting enough then some of the people on his stream will come and watch mine or something, idk.

(not that that's gunna happen, im a diamond lvl sea player lol)
Stop browsing and do whatever it is you're supposed to do. TL will still be here when you get back
desRow
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
Canada2654 Posts
January 25 2012 11:31 GMT
#62
Good article, one of the reason I'm in Korea and plan to stay here until I stop playing. And it will become a lot worse once BW teams switch.
http://twitch.tv/desrowfighting http://twitter.com/desrowfighting http://facebook.com/desrowfighting
Soma.bokforlag
Profile Joined February 2011
Sweden448 Posts
January 25 2012 11:33 GMT
#63
On January 25 2012 20:29 LaLuSh wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 25 2012 20:19 Soma.bokforlag wrote:
seriously, can someone help me find the numbers the entire thread is based upon!?! nowhere can i find that the european and american servers has as few players as the korean!!

HELP!!

im starting to think that this entire thread is based on a LIE


http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=298240

OP's numbers might still be correct since there is no Season 5 data aside from sc2ranks.



yes, but all the numbers i can find on sc2ranks indicate that the difference is pretty much as big now as it was during s4
kevint
Profile Joined January 2011
Denmark42 Posts
January 25 2012 11:39 GMT
#64
I agree with this but i think that there is also quite a large difrence between european tournaments and american tournaments because there are far more open tournaments in europe with alot of really good players that sign up for them.
redDuke
Profile Joined March 2011
Australia207 Posts
January 25 2012 11:43 GMT
#65
On January 25 2012 19:06 Omar91 wrote:
I for one stop playing because TvP is so fucking retarded, Collosus-Chargelots-Storm-FF made me rage quit the game, I was high diamond.


micro?

Yeah I kinda get annoyed that non-korean teams are picking up koreans coz I'd love to see truly great non-korean teams start to form by taking in and training up promising talent, and keeping those who are alrealy great and trying to propel them higher.
vile | FXO | Liquid | EG | coL
Ewic
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada121 Posts
January 25 2012 11:44 GMT
#66
I really take what you said to heart because the situation you described is exactly where I'm at.

I've finally hit GM, I've taken games off notable names on ladder... But who's going to watch my stream? What team would want me (and pay)? Nobody.

One thing that REALLY upsets me is one of the few ways I could be making money playing this game is through something like Playhem... I have been to the semi's before, and quarters many times... But who takes the crown away? The same Koreans (Revival, Golden, Rainbow, Illusion) etc... Like seriously... I would be a lot more motivated to play if the chances of me actually winning anything were improved by removing said players.

/rant...
GrandMaster Terran
cydial
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States750 Posts
January 25 2012 11:46 GMT
#67
On January 25 2012 19:10 iky43210 wrote:
There's also another big difference between pro in Korea and NA.

Teams in NA pick up players only if they can get the viewers (stated by incontrol).

Teams in Korea pick up players if they are good or have potential

Its sad


Players like ailuJ are perfect examples of this.

MapleLeafSirup
Profile Joined July 2009
Germany950 Posts
January 25 2012 11:51 GMT
#68
Great post, I agree with most of it
This should definitely be taken into consideration for tournament organizers
Bippzy
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States1466 Posts
January 25 2012 11:52 GMT
#69
On January 25 2012 20:31 desRow wrote:
Good article, one of the reason I'm in Korea and plan to stay here until I stop playing. And it will become a lot worse once BW teams switch.


I didn't know you were in korea :D

But yeah i guess my comment would be if i were trying to go pro id take the violet route and plan to play everyday and compete in tournies everyday, with the goal being to improve to win tournies....making a name for myself hopefully? Idk
LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK LEENOCK
slmw
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Finland233 Posts
January 25 2012 11:53 GMT
#70
I took the same data from each three servers, added dates from patches and this is what i got:
[image loading]

What did we do differently?
Here's the data:
+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
edzwoo
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States469 Posts
January 25 2012 11:53 GMT
#71
As esports gets more popular in the west and becomes more accepted, foreigners will eventually catch up to the Koreans. It might take a while, but remember that Korea has a 10 year head start when it comes to accepting Starcraft and playing it for a living.

So yeah there might be a period where foreigners are sparse, but new talents are going to come up as SC2 becomes more popular and accepted.
dapierow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Serbia1316 Posts
January 25 2012 11:53 GMT
#72
On January 25 2012 20:44 Ewic wrote:
I really take what you said to heart because the situation you described is exactly where I'm at.

I've finally hit GM, I've taken games off notable names on ladder... But who's going to watch my stream? What team would want me (and pay)? Nobody.

One thing that REALLY upsets me is one of the few ways I could be making money playing this game is through something like Playhem... I have been to the semi's before, and quarters many times... But who takes the crown away? The same Koreans (Revival, Golden, Rainbow, Illusion) etc... Like seriously... I would be a lot more motivated to play if the chances of me actually winning anything were improved by removing said players.

/rant...


You find it upsetting that players who are better than you are winning the tournaments you do play in? If you went to Mlg and lost would you find it upsetting that the same people are always reaching the top 4, top 8, top 16, top 32? would you be more motivated to play if your chances of winning were improved by removing said players?
Eat.Sleep.Starcraft 2
Alexj
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Ukraine440 Posts
January 25 2012 11:54 GMT
#73
There are many wrong assumptions in the OP, but also some good points.

Too many people bash on events that don't have highest level Koreans in them. The events that help foreign players to get noticed are very important, but many forum/reddit posters are obnoxiosly vocal about how they don't care about "lesser" players. Shut the fuck up already.

By the way, in Russia/CIS soon there will be a big online league for all skill levels (Sc2tv.ru Non-stop Games league), they have a structure similar to GSL, except they have more tiers -- from Code S, Code A, Code B all the way to Code F. I think this is exactly what OP asks for.
More GGs, more skill
NightOfTheDead
Profile Joined August 2009
Lithuania1711 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-25 11:56:39
January 25 2012 11:55 GMT
#74
On January 25 2012 20:44 Ewic wrote:
But who takes the crown away? The same Koreans (Revival, Golden, Rainbow, Illusion) etc... Like seriously... I would be a lot more motivated to play if the chances of me actually winning anything were improved by removing said players.



They should be removed because they play better? Isnt that the way the competition should work?
Remove all South America and Europe players from football World cup, so that African or any other national team could win it.
Ewic
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada121 Posts
January 25 2012 11:59 GMT
#75
@ dapierow & NightOfTheDead - I'm echoing what the OP is saying - tournaments are being won by the same people over and over again and there is little room for up-and-coming players to be noticed or win anything. I think you would understand when you devote as much time into this game I have and haven't received $1 for it.
GrandMaster Terran
Nihilnovi
Profile Joined May 2010
Sweden696 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-01-25 12:02:02
January 25 2012 12:00 GMT
#76
For me personally, I'm just tired of doing the same thing over and over I guess, there is little to no variety in a SC2 game at high masters in EU, everyone does the same ~5 builds because, well, there are no other viable builds. I went from playing hundreds of games season 1 to just a few last season and none this so far, and It's piss easy to stay in masters for me even though I don't play at all, that tells me that the foreign scene is really really really bad and empty compared to the korean.

On January 25 2012 20:59 Ewic wrote:
@ dapierow & NightOfTheDead - I'm echoing what the OP is saying - tournaments are being won by the same people over and over again and there is little room for up-and-coming players to be noticed or win anything. I think you would understand when you devote as much time into this game I have and haven't received $1 for it.


In response to this, I think it's a matter of that there are no new players. SC2 has a very small player base and for 2012 it's all set in terms of e-sports viewership but I really do wonder if it will be around for 2013 unless HotS turns out to be amazing
XRaDiiX
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Canada1730 Posts
January 25 2012 12:02 GMT
#77
Would this explain why Masters is harder this season.
Never GG MKP | IdrA
dapierow
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Serbia1316 Posts
January 25 2012 12:08 GMT
#78
On January 25 2012 20:59 Ewic wrote:
@ dapierow & NightOfTheDead - I'm echoing what the OP is saying - tournaments are being won by the same people over and over again and there is little room for up-and-coming players to be noticed or win anything. I think you would understand when you devote as much time into this game I have and haven't received $1 for it.


I'm sorry but that is an absurd statement... imagine your a pretty good basketball or football player and you tell someone Ive devoted so much time into this game and I haven't received $1 for it.
Eat.Sleep.Starcraft 2
Aela
Profile Joined January 2012
97 Posts
January 25 2012 12:09 GMT
#79
All people I know stopped playing. There is just no reason to ladder if you know you will never make money with it.
Gheed
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States972 Posts
January 25 2012 12:12 GMT
#80
On January 25 2012 21:09 Aela wrote:
All people I know stopped playing. There is just no reason to ladder if you know you will never make money with it.


Whenever someone posts something like this it just makes me sad. The reason people play is to have fun, goddamn.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 13 14 15 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4h 1m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 156
ROOTCatZ 74
ProTech73
trigger 14
StarCraft: Brood War
PianO 1383
Leta 323
sSak 43
Noble 40
Icarus 6
League of Legends
JimRising 675
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K544
semphis_72
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King78
Other Games
C9.Mang0325
Maynarde155
XaKoH 113
ViBE92
NeuroSwarm86
Organizations
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH292
• practicex 19
• Sammyuel 19
• IndyKCrew
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• sooper7s
• Kozan
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 4
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1374
• Lourlo962
• HappyZerGling110
Upcoming Events
Afreeca Starleague
4h 1m
Snow vs Sharp
Jaedong vs Mini
Wardi Open
5h 1m
OSC
18h 1m
Sparkling Tuna Cup
1d 4h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 4h
Light vs Speed
Larva vs Soma
PiGosaur Monday
1d 18h
LiuLi Cup
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Maru vs Reynor
Cure vs TriGGeR
The PondCast
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
Zoun vs Classic
[ Show More ]
Korean StarCraft League
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
[BSL 2025] Weekly
5 days
BSL Team Wars
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Online Event
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL 20 Team Wars
Chzzk MurlocKing SC1 vs SC2 Cup #2
HCC Europe

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Points
ASL Season 20
CSL 2025 AUTUMN (S18)
LASL Season 20
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1

Upcoming

2025 Chongqing Offline CUP
BSL Polish World Championship 2025
IPSL Winter 2025-26
BSL Season 21
SC4ALL: Brood War
BSL 21 Team A
Stellar Fest
SC4ALL: StarCraft II
EC S1
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.