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On November 14 2011 21:43 TeeTS wrote:
EDIT: I mean it seems to me like a fuckin joke, that there are even some tournaments with a large prizepool around just for women. Which handicap is there exactly, that women shouldn't be able to compete at the same level as men at video games?
Due to social pressures, it is likely that at present the mean skill of female players is above the mean skill of male players (female gamers face more pressure to not play war games, so ones that do are on average more dedicated to it), but that there are many more male players of pro-skill (larger populations tend to have higher peaks and lower troughs in skill). Gender-equalise the social pressures and the community size and there is no reason to expect women to play at a significantly different level to men.
Think of the foreigner tournaments in BW. They usually had less-skilled players than Korean tournaments not because foreigners are inherently worse than Koreans, but because the culture surrounding competitive play gave Korean players of professional potential a more beneficial environment to train in - team houses helped players with potential find a supportive learning community, wider social acceptance increased number of players to pick from to join those houses,...
Now, in Starcraft 2, many competitions that would have been run as foreigner tournaments with Korean participation neither expected nor desired a few years ago are open to anyone. Koreans still do very well in the scene, but there is a significant enough competitve scene outside of Korea that we are seeing a significant number of top-level players from the rest of the world competing.
Hopefully, something similar will happen with female participation. If we're lucky it won't even have to wait for SC3.
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So now that there are actually a few solid female players, I'm not at all impressed with Eve 
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Ah wow, congratulations to aphrodite! I watched a little of her games against flo and I think she deserves a place on the team and a chance to grow and improve as a player. It would be really awesome if she started competing with the guys in tournaments.
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Guess now we know who rules the house.  She looks pretty badass in that photo, and Rainbow gets the pink i/o. Congrats!
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Lets say 10,000,000 males play this game worldwide
Lets say 500,000 females play
95% male and 5% female
% of females gamers is probably less important than % of hours played by females.
I'm pretty sure the % of females playing like 10hours/day or at least enough to be on the same skill lvl as pro males is way less than that, when you have so many males having huge amout of game played and stream/replay watch. Could be wrong and have nothing to prove it, but i don't think i am .
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On November 14 2011 22:56 -_-Quails wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2011 21:43 TeeTS wrote:
EDIT: I mean it seems to me like a fuckin joke, that there are even some tournaments with a large prizepool around just for women. Which handicap is there exactly, that women shouldn't be able to compete at the same level as men at video games?
Due to social pressures, it is likely that at present the mean skill of female players is above the mean skill of male players (female gamers face more pressure to not play war games, so ones that do are on average more dedicated to it), but that there are many more male players of pro-skill (larger populations tend to have higher peaks and lower troughs in skill). Gender-equalise the social pressures and the community size and there is no reason to expect women to play at a significantly different level to men. Think of the foreigner tournaments in BW. They usually had less-skilled players than Korean tournaments not because foreigners are inherently worse than Koreans, but because the culture surrounding competitive play gave Korean players of professional potential a more beneficial environment to train in - team houses helped players with potential find a supportive learning community, wider social acceptance increased number of players to pick from to join those houses,... Now, in Starcraft 2, many competitions that would have been run as foreigner tournaments with Korean participation neither expected nor desired a few years ago are open to anyone. Koreans still do very well in the scene, but there is a significant enough competitve scene outside of Korea that we are seeing a significant number of top-level players from the rest of the world competing. Hopefully, something similar will happen with female participation. If we're lucky it won't even have to wait for SC3.
Social Pressures.... In a modern family a girl will be allowed to plat video games and the games she wants. This is point may have been true in the past.
In BW there were tournaments for foreigners, cause the koreans had no interest at all to participate. If they had, I don't think anyone would keep them out. A lot of the korean isolation in BW goes back to kespa and it's totalitarian regiment. You can't compare that to the situation between males and females at gaming.
And no offensive against Aphrodite, but when i saw her playin on Rainbows Stream she showed the skill of a standard european midmaster terran. Really nothing to be excited about.
And this should be enough to get 5k $ prize money in a tourney and becoming a member of one of the worlds strongest SC2 Teams?
Sorry but this seems like some publicity action, but nothin more. And this would be nothing but pure sexism
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I love how Rainbow's the one using the pink keyboard.
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On November 14 2011 23:40 TeeTS wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2011 22:56 -_-Quails wrote:On November 14 2011 21:43 TeeTS wrote:
EDIT: I mean it seems to me like a fuckin joke, that there are even some tournaments with a large prizepool around just for women. Which handicap is there exactly, that women shouldn't be able to compete at the same level as men at video games?
Due to social pressures, it is likely that at present the mean skill of female players is above the mean skill of male players (female gamers face more pressure to not play war games, so ones that do are on average more dedicated to it), but that there are many more male players of pro-skill (larger populations tend to have higher peaks and lower troughs in skill). Gender-equalise the social pressures and the community size and there is no reason to expect women to play at a significantly different level to men. Think of the foreigner tournaments in BW. They usually had less-skilled players than Korean tournaments not because foreigners are inherently worse than Koreans, but because the culture surrounding competitive play gave Korean players of professional potential a more beneficial environment to train in - team houses helped players with potential find a supportive learning community, wider social acceptance increased number of players to pick from to join those houses,... Now, in Starcraft 2, many competitions that would have been run as foreigner tournaments with Korean participation neither expected nor desired a few years ago are open to anyone. Koreans still do very well in the scene, but there is a significant enough competitve scene outside of Korea that we are seeing a significant number of top-level players from the rest of the world competing. Hopefully, something similar will happen with female participation. If we're lucky it won't even have to wait for SC3. Social Pressures.... In a modern family a girl will be allowed to plat video games and the games she wants. This is point may have been true in the past. In BW there were tournaments for foreigners, cause the koreans had no interest at all to participate. If they had, I don't think anyone would keep them out. A lot of the korean isolation in BW goes back to kespa and it's totalitarian regiment. You can't compare that to the situation between males and females at gaming. And no offensive against Aphrodite, but when i saw her playin on Rainbows Stream she showed the skill of a standard european midmaster terran. Really nothing to be excited about. And this should be enough to get 5k $ prize money in a tourney and becoming a member of one of the worlds strongest SC2 Teams? Sorry but this seems like some publicity action, but nothin more. And this would be nothing but pure sexism
I can get being people objecting about startale signing her but I don't get why so many people have issues with prize money in a tournament.
Also I think this has much less to do with sexism as it has to do with her being rainbows girlfriend. Not neccasarily better but there is a difference.
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For the whole debate here on "girls or guys best gamers" it is not an uncommon fact that men are biologicly more designed to specialize at something, while women generally do well at many things.
Not to say a girl couldn't become the best sc2 player, it just is less likely since men are designed to be able to have tremendous focus at single tasks.
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On November 14 2011 23:40 TeeTS wrote:Show nested quote +On November 14 2011 22:56 -_-Quails wrote:On November 14 2011 21:43 TeeTS wrote:
EDIT: I mean it seems to me like a fuckin joke, that there are even some tournaments with a large prizepool around just for women. Which handicap is there exactly, that women shouldn't be able to compete at the same level as men at video games?
Due to social pressures, it is likely that at present the mean skill of female players is above the mean skill of male players (female gamers face more pressure to not play war games, so ones that do are on average more dedicated to it), but that there are many more male players of pro-skill (larger populations tend to have higher peaks and lower troughs in skill). Gender-equalise the social pressures and the community size and there is no reason to expect women to play at a significantly different level to men. Think of the foreigner tournaments in BW. They usually had less-skilled players than Korean tournaments not because foreigners are inherently worse than Koreans, but because the culture surrounding competitive play gave Korean players of professional potential a more beneficial environment to train in - team houses helped players with potential find a supportive learning community, wider social acceptance increased number of players to pick from to join those houses,... Now, in Starcraft 2, many competitions that would have been run as foreigner tournaments with Korean participation neither expected nor desired a few years ago are open to anyone. Koreans still do very well in the scene, but there is a significant enough competitve scene outside of Korea that we are seeing a significant number of top-level players from the rest of the world competing. Hopefully, something similar will happen with female participation. If we're lucky it won't even have to wait for SC3. Social Pressures.... In a modern family a girl will be allowed to plat video games and the games she wants. This is point may have been true in the past. In BW there were tournaments for foreigners, cause the koreans had no interest at all to participate. If they had, I don't think anyone would keep them out. A lot of the korean isolation in BW goes back to kespa and it's totalitarian regiment. You can't compare that to the situation between males and females at gaming. And no offensive against Aphrodite, but when i saw her playin on Rainbows Stream she showed the skill of a standard european midmaster terran. Really nothing to be excited about. And this should be enough to get 5k $ prize money in a tourney and becoming a member of one of the worlds strongest SC2 Teams? Sorry but this seems like some publicity action, but nothin more. And this would be nothing but pure sexism
You haven't watched her play. Her macro is way better than a "midmaster" terran I'm sorry
Edit: I'm not saying she is a spectacular sc2 player(yet) but she showed that she's legit KR masters, and that's already better than "Eu midmasters"
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nice to see more female pro players since i am sure that this is another important factor for eSports to become mainstream
i also think shes quite good since she played quite nice from what i saw of her in the zowie tourney (she obviously has to go a long way still but...)
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Oh wow.... so much jealousy and sexism in this thread. I'm pretty sure females are more than capable at competing on the same level as males but it's a simple fact that the SC2 gamer population is disproportionately male. This game isn't a sport where physicality divides the athletes - it's a computer game where time, dedication, and a certain amount of talent directly correlates to results. Some of you seriously believe that females are inferior to males at SC2, it's just laughable. If there were more females playing this game then I'm sure we'd see more of them on par with the guys. Take into consideration as well: does a girl really want to practice in a tiny house full of dudes?
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Congratulations to you Aphrodite, your play at zowie divine was stellar.
I really hope a female gamer will make it through the eye of the needle and compete with the best, it makes for a fantastic storyline, like Kat in the FPS world.
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Take into consideration as well: does a girl really want to practice in a tiny house full of dudes?
I would be ok to practice in a tiny house full of girls.
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Awsome!!! a girl, can't wait till see all-kills IM!!!XD
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Hopefully she's actually good enough to be a pro. Girls getting on pro teams to look pretty is stupid, girls actually being competitive should be encouraged.
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This is pretty cool. I'm interested to see how she performs in a mainstream tournement. If she keeps a strick practice regiment I don't see why she can't be really good.
Also, the fact that she is Rainbow's girlfriends = me </3
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I need to start dating a pro so I can join a team, and be apart of all the events
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EPT
