|
On October 31 2011 23:58 Archvil3 wrote:
Why argue BW vs SC2?
It doesnt matter lol. It wont change anything. The transition is going to happen and it is likely to happen as early as HoTS release, maybe even before that. Die Hard BW fans cannot stop with that with their opinions.
So the BW fans wont transition with their players cause they dont like the game? Wow what a loss. It's okay, we only wanted the players in the first place.
If the BW fans don't like SC2, then what reason do the top BW players have to transition? May as well just call it quits and move on with your life instead of switching to something lesser (both in terms of difficulty and local popularity).
|
On October 31 2011 22:27 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 22:23 hitthat wrote:On October 31 2011 22:03 maybenexttime wrote:
I meant tournaments boycotting blizzard. Standing up and saying "we won't use your game unless you include LAN". Uhh, dont you think it's quite naive and childish? KeSPA stood up, China stood up. It's possible. The organisations behind the large events would have to be unanimous, though.
I don't think Blizzard actually gives a shit at all, they're raking in tons of money and they will lose more on LAN because less people will buy it then they will make on tourneys. Blizzard is not going to back down they will just laugh and eventually they will live without LAN
|
On October 31 2011 23:27 shadymmj wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 11:31 rightstuff wrote:
I don't think that I'm out of line in suggesting that TRUE esports fans would be willing to watch SC2 and allow BW to retire if it were to become a spectator sport worthy of its heritage. In its current state of balance, metagame, skill level, and map design it does not equal BW in terms of pure entertainment in my opinion. However, the surest way to improve that situation is to educate new fans (and hard headed vets) in the potential that could be realized if SC2 develops into something as amazing as BW.
There are fans out there with the desire and drive to carry this new game forward, but everyone should know what sort of standard we should hold to Blizzard and the Starcraft community. Please, please, PLEASE think positively and do not fall into the internet trap of blind criticism over helping to realize potential growth. If we can't agree to promote the advancement of esports over stagnation and instead choose to continue down this path, we need to be honest with ourselves and stop using the word FAN.
"E-sports" is a joke. TL was not an "e-sports" site for a long time. In fact, as it says right at the top, TL is a STARCRAFT PROGAMING site. That people considered BW to be a sport in kr is, well, a technicality. It was for discussion about the game, how to play the game, which players were good at the game, and how we could watch and support them. There was no onus on community members to promote the game to a wider audience, or in other words be pro-growth. What BW supporters essentially want is to make the we loved game better. SC2 did not deliver that game. We complain in the hope that someone out there will be listening. I believe that if the game is refined for competitive play to a high degree, viewership will naturally rise as a result. But the priority lies with the GAME. The GAME makes the competition, not vice-versa. If the game is shit, we have the right to say so. Most of the new people in this site have the opposite mindset. They think that if enough people watch the game online, it will magically transform into the best competitive RTS ever. But history will tell you otherwise. All they want nowadays is to have more people watch SC2 and strangely enough, even promote inane online games (LoL?)...and contribute to the mass appeal of these dumbed-down crowd pleasers. Focus on the game first.
But viewership is naturally rising. And more and more tournaments are happening all over the world with larger prize pools. Hundreds of people get together to watch big tournaments like MLG in bars all over the world. So this means that the game is refined for competitive play to a high degree according to your post right?
|
On November 01 2011 00:04 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 00:01 ambra wrote:On October 31 2011 23:52 Zzoram wrote:
I just want to see players like Flash and Jaedong play against MVP and Nestea to see if they can translate their sick BW skills to SC2. well some of them eventually will regardless of what the haters think. As someone who plays and enjoys watching professional matches for fun, I just think "the more, the better" and all this "startcraft 2 is for noobs and kids" and "broodwar is for nostalgic tryhards" shitstorm makes me vomit... every gamer and everyone with a passion for starcraft should be happy about how the things are developing instead of investing time hating. You're not making any sense. If I don't like how Sc2 turned out, why should I support this? ...
you should not care and support brood war as much as you want
|
On October 31 2011 23:35 shadymmj wrote:
In what way is it? My opinion is BW is a better competitive game than SC2, and I accept (and respectfully disagree with) opinions to contrary.
But what I cannot accept or respect is the idea of "LOLLL MORE N MORE PEOPLE WATCH SC2 = GOOD!!! THAT WILL MAKE IT THE BEST COMPETITIVE RTS EVAR!!!"
Seems like if I hold an event called shady's backyard SC2 tournament offering free beers to the winner, people will just blindly support it for no reason at all.
Yeah! How dare they be positive about it!?
|
On November 01 2011 00:06 Xenocryst wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 22:27 maybenexttime wrote:On October 31 2011 22:23 hitthat wrote:On October 31 2011 22:03 maybenexttime wrote:
I meant tournaments boycotting blizzard. Standing up and saying "we won't use your game unless you include LAN". Uhh, dont you think it's quite naive and childish? KeSPA stood up, China stood up. It's possible. The organisations behind the large events would have to be unanimous, though. I don't think Blizzard actually gives a shit at all, they're raking in tons of money and they will lose more on LAN because less people will buy it then they will make on tourneys. Blizzard is not going to back down they will just laugh and eventually they will live without LAN
They are slowly destroying their reputation, and they've been riding on it for the past several years. Their games are not that much better than the competition anymore and their support for the games is questionable. That'll bite them in the ass sooner or later, hopefully.
|
ahhh! all those pros playing!! im so excited
|
On November 01 2011 00:04 Zzoram wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 00:03 PlosionCornu wrote:On November 01 2011 00:00 Zzoram wrote:On October 31 2011 23:58 Archvil3 wrote:
Why argue BW vs SC2?
It doesnt matter lol. It wont change anything. The transition is going to happen and it is likely to happen as early as HoTS release, maybe even before that. Die Hard BW fans cannot stop with that with their opinions.
So the BW fans wont transition with their players cause they dont like the game? Wow what a loss. It's okay, we only wanted the players in the first place. Hopefully the fan girls follow the BW pros. That's the biggest thing lacking in the SC2 scene. The crowds are 99% guys unlike the BW crowds that can be >50% girls. Initially they will follow their idols. But if the show isn't entertaining they will quit I fear. SC2 is entertaining, and has only been getting moreso lately as the level of play has been rising. People watched Boxer in life jackets play 1 base 80apm Terran at midnight in the early days of Broodwar. SC2 is already years ahead of that.
It won't be truly entertaining unless FBH switches over with all of his ceremonial goodness.
|
On October 31 2011 23:30 Toppp wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 23:27 shadymmj wrote:On October 31 2011 11:31 rightstuff wrote:
I don't think that I'm out of line in suggesting that TRUE esports fans would be willing to watch SC2 and allow BW to retire if it were to become a spectator sport worthy of its heritage. In its current state of balance, metagame, skill level, and map design it does not equal BW in terms of pure entertainment in my opinion. However, the surest way to improve that situation is to educate new fans (and hard headed vets) in the potential that could be realized if SC2 develops into something as amazing as BW.
There are fans out there with the desire and drive to carry this new game forward, but everyone should know what sort of standard we should hold to Blizzard and the Starcraft community. Please, please, PLEASE think positively and do not fall into the internet trap of blind criticism over helping to realize potential growth. If we can't agree to promote the advancement of esports over stagnation and instead choose to continue down this path, we need to be honest with ourselves and stop using the word FAN.
"E-sports" is a joke. TL was not an "e-sports" site for a long time. In fact, as it says right at the top, TL is a STARCRAFT PROGAMING site. That people considered BW to be a sport in kr is, well, a technicality. It was for discussion about the game, how to play the game, which players were good at the game, and how we could watch and support them. There was no onus on community members to promote the game to a wider audience, or in other words be pro-growth. What BW supporters essentially want is to make the we loved game better. SC2 did not deliver that game. We complain in the hope that someone out there will be listening. I believe that if the game is refined for competitive play to a high degree, viewership will naturally rise as a result. But the priority lies with the GAME. The GAME makes the competition, not vice-versa. If the game is shit, we have the right to say so. Most of the new people in this site have the opposite mindset. They think that if enough people watch the game online, it will magically transform into the best competitive RTS ever. But history will tell you otherwise. All they want nowadays is to have more people watch SC2 and strangely enough, even promote inane online games (LoL?)...and contribute to the mass appeal of these dumbed-down crowd pleasers. Focus on the game first. Lol, what a elitist opinion. Grow the fuck up.
Much as you want him to be wrong he is right, its all about the money and Blizz is going to do what gives them money. They won't give a shit if people watch BW
|
well, while I was happy they were going to start, I didnt realise that many had already.... Going to be much quicker the I thought!!!
|
On November 01 2011 00:05 Toadvine wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 23:58 Archvil3 wrote:
Why argue BW vs SC2?
It doesnt matter lol. It wont change anything. The transition is going to happen and it is likely to happen as early as HoTS release, maybe even before that. Die Hard BW fans cannot stop with that with their opinions.
So the BW fans wont transition with their players cause they dont like the game? Wow what a loss. It's okay, we only wanted the players in the first place. If the BW fans don't like SC2, then what reason do the top BW players have to transition? May as well just call it quits and move on with your life instead of switching to something lesser (both in terms of difficulty and local popularity).
Yep, indeed. Just move on and dont look back.
The rest of us will be looking at some awesome SC2 games between Flashdong and friends. We will have a good time doing so. It is going to be great and I look forward to it. I hope it is going to live up to the hype they get.
|
On October 31 2011 23:58 Archvil3 wrote:
Why argue BW vs SC2?
It doesnt matter lol. It wont change anything. The transition is going to happen and it is likely to happen as early as HoTS release, maybe even before that. Die Hard BW fans cannot stop with that with their opinions.
So the BW fans wont transition with their players cause they dont like the game? Wow what a loss. It's okay, we only wanted the players in the first place.
I don't know any "die hard bw fan" but I do know a lot of BW haters like yourself
|
On November 01 2011 00:06 Logros wrote:Show nested quote +On October 31 2011 23:27 shadymmj wrote:On October 31 2011 11:31 rightstuff wrote:
I don't think that I'm out of line in suggesting that TRUE esports fans would be willing to watch SC2 and allow BW to retire if it were to become a spectator sport worthy of its heritage. In its current state of balance, metagame, skill level, and map design it does not equal BW in terms of pure entertainment in my opinion. However, the surest way to improve that situation is to educate new fans (and hard headed vets) in the potential that could be realized if SC2 develops into something as amazing as BW.
There are fans out there with the desire and drive to carry this new game forward, but everyone should know what sort of standard we should hold to Blizzard and the Starcraft community. Please, please, PLEASE think positively and do not fall into the internet trap of blind criticism over helping to realize potential growth. If we can't agree to promote the advancement of esports over stagnation and instead choose to continue down this path, we need to be honest with ourselves and stop using the word FAN.
"E-sports" is a joke. TL was not an "e-sports" site for a long time. In fact, as it says right at the top, TL is a STARCRAFT PROGAMING site. That people considered BW to be a sport in kr is, well, a technicality. It was for discussion about the game, how to play the game, which players were good at the game, and how we could watch and support them. There was no onus on community members to promote the game to a wider audience, or in other words be pro-growth. What BW supporters essentially want is to make the we loved game better. SC2 did not deliver that game. We complain in the hope that someone out there will be listening. I believe that if the game is refined for competitive play to a high degree, viewership will naturally rise as a result. But the priority lies with the GAME. The GAME makes the competition, not vice-versa. If the game is shit, we have the right to say so. Most of the new people in this site have the opposite mindset. They think that if enough people watch the game online, it will magically transform into the best competitive RTS ever. But history will tell you otherwise. All they want nowadays is to have more people watch SC2 and strangely enough, even promote inane online games (LoL?)...and contribute to the mass appeal of these dumbed-down crowd pleasers. Focus on the game first. But viewership is naturally rising. And more and more tournaments are happening all over the world with larger prize pools. Hundreds of people get together to watch big tournaments like MLG in bars all over the world. So this means that the game is refined for competitive play to a high degree according to your post right?
and budweiser is the most popular beer worldwide, damn it must be great beer, right?
|
Man what a sweet list of players.
I didn't expect the transition to happen like this actually. Was thinking they would just continue to trickle over. A retiring player here, a B-teamer there, until eventually there wasn't enough of a player base for BW to keep making sense in Korea.
But a large group of them like that moving over? It won't be long before the rest have to follow suite.
|
On November 01 2011 00:09 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 00:06 Xenocryst wrote:On October 31 2011 22:27 maybenexttime wrote:On October 31 2011 22:23 hitthat wrote:On October 31 2011 22:03 maybenexttime wrote:
I meant tournaments boycotting blizzard. Standing up and saying "we won't use your game unless you include LAN". Uhh, dont you think it's quite naive and childish? KeSPA stood up, China stood up. It's possible. The organisations behind the large events would have to be unanimous, though. I don't think Blizzard actually gives a shit at all, they're raking in tons of money and they will lose more on LAN because less people will buy it then they will make on tourneys. Blizzard is not going to back down they will just laugh and eventually they will live without LAN They are slowly destroying their reputation, and they've been riding on it for the past several years. Their games are not that much better than the competition anymore and their support for the games is questionable. That'll bite them in the ass sooner or later, hopefully.
Not including LAN is not a huge issue there games are quite a bit better than the competition and every gaming company is run by scumbags these days thats why games cost 60$ and you have to register a key code. They're all greedy and they don't care about the consumer just the dollars in there pocket
|
On November 01 2011 00:09 Weedk wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 00:04 Zzoram wrote:On November 01 2011 00:03 PlosionCornu wrote:On November 01 2011 00:00 Zzoram wrote:On October 31 2011 23:58 Archvil3 wrote:
Why argue BW vs SC2?
It doesnt matter lol. It wont change anything. The transition is going to happen and it is likely to happen as early as HoTS release, maybe even before that. Die Hard BW fans cannot stop with that with their opinions.
So the BW fans wont transition with their players cause they dont like the game? Wow what a loss. It's okay, we only wanted the players in the first place. Hopefully the fan girls follow the BW pros. That's the biggest thing lacking in the SC2 scene. The crowds are 99% guys unlike the BW crowds that can be >50% girls. Initially they will follow their idols. But if the show isn't entertaining they will quit I fear. SC2 is entertaining, and has only been getting moreso lately as the level of play has been rising. People watched Boxer in life jackets play 1 base 80apm Terran at midnight in the early days of Broodwar. SC2 is already years ahead of that. It won't be truly entertaining unless FBH switches over with all of his ceremonial goodness.
FBH is a monk now. I don't expect any more ceremonies from him. 
On November 01 2011 00:10 Archvil3 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 00:05 Toadvine wrote:On October 31 2011 23:58 Archvil3 wrote:
Why argue BW vs SC2?
It doesnt matter lol. It wont change anything. The transition is going to happen and it is likely to happen as early as HoTS release, maybe even before that. Die Hard BW fans cannot stop with that with their opinions.
So the BW fans wont transition with their players cause they dont like the game? Wow what a loss. It's okay, we only wanted the players in the first place. If the BW fans don't like SC2, then what reason do the top BW players have to transition? May as well just call it quits and move on with your life instead of switching to something lesser (both in terms of difficulty and local popularity). Yep, indeed. Just move on and dont look back. The rest of us will be looking at some awesome SC2 games between Flashdong and friends. We will have a good time doing so. It is going to be great and I look forward to it. I hope it is going to live up to the hype they get.
And I hope you don't get to see any of that and that BW stays strong in Korea and outlives SC2 there. ;]
|
|
|
Any good zerg practicing over from BW really gives me something to look forward to. 2012 is going to be a fucking sick year for SC2.
|
On November 01 2011 00:11 Xenocryst wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2011 00:09 maybenexttime wrote:On November 01 2011 00:06 Xenocryst wrote:On October 31 2011 22:27 maybenexttime wrote:On October 31 2011 22:23 hitthat wrote:On October 31 2011 22:03 maybenexttime wrote:
I meant tournaments boycotting blizzard. Standing up and saying "we won't use your game unless you include LAN". Uhh, dont you think it's quite naive and childish? KeSPA stood up, China stood up. It's possible. The organisations behind the large events would have to be unanimous, though. I don't think Blizzard actually gives a shit at all, they're raking in tons of money and they will lose more on LAN because less people will buy it then they will make on tourneys. Blizzard is not going to back down they will just laugh and eventually they will live without LAN They are slowly destroying their reputation, and they've been riding on it for the past several years. Their games are not that much better than the competition anymore and their support for the games is questionable. That'll bite them in the ass sooner or later, hopefully. Not including LAN is not a huge issue there games are quite a bit better than the competition and every gaming company is run by scumbags these days thats why games cost 60$ and you have to register a key code. They're all greedy and they don't care about the consumer just the dollars in there pocket
I can't understand this "companies are greedy" attitude.
Blizzard can't include LAN because, if they do, all these lazy kids just pirate the fvck out of their games.
It's been proven again and again and again. They deserve to make money for delivering an entertaining game.
$60 for hundreds/thousands of hours of gameplay? Steal.
|
wow midas is already top100 on KR ladder after a few weeks of practice...and he is just a second tier player in bw...cant imagine how the otehres will do..
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
